Ork rumours - First post updated 20th June

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**Delevarius**

morganfreeman wrote:
Delevarius wrote:
I like the idea of moar Lobbas
its still the best gun imo
though the kustom mega-kannon is great vs heavy infantry, i wont deny that, but it has a bit of a shorter range and it does have "Gets Hot"
The Traktor while being insane vs flyers and FMC, and even does well against skimmers, is more of a Meta choice
Kannonz are still underwhelming imo, though being able to field them in groups of 5 makes them a lot better I guess,but being AP 3 rules them out as an AT gun, and more of a Anti Infantry role, in which the lobbas are better

Kannonz are underwhelming until you realize that they're 18 points.

A strength 8 ap 3 shot with 4 wounds, toughness 7, and a 3+ save for 18 points? Yes please. That same gun is able to fire as a blast to thin out mid-level hordes?! Count me in!

They're not the best guns in the world, but they're cheap as absolute dirt for what they do and how tough they are.

Lobbas are 18 points as well and they outperform the kannon both in range and killing power
The only thing they cant do is pen vehicles, but with the new vehicle dmg chart kannonz are not as good as they were in that area aswell

**44Ronin**

Greyhound wrote:
44Ronin wrote:

Lootas cannot penetrate AV14. So your opinion is irrelevant.

smasha can't penetrate AV14 97.22% of the time so I don't think it's much better.

You don't understand sequential probabilities very well.

**MajorWesJanson**

Delevarius wrote:

Lobbas are 18 points as well and they outperform the kannon both in range and killing power
The only thing they cant do is pen vehicles, but with the new vehicle dmg chart kannonz are not as good as they were in that area aswell

Assuming they don't change. With the new Smasha kannon, it seems likely that the zzap gun at least will change, so the Kannon and Lobba may change as well.

**easysauce**

deffrekka wrote:
Sniper rifles could be the only problem with these big guns, as a pinning test at ld 5 will make them loose there shots for a turn of its the blast weapons or hitting on 6's with the others

sniper rifles and barrage no longer pin stuff!

**Perfect Organism**

Delevarius wrote:
Lobbas are 18 points as well and they outperform the kannon both in range and killing power
The only thing they cant do is pen vehicles, but with the new vehicle dmg chart kannonz are not as good as they were in that area aswell

Kannons are still the most efficient way of glancing vehicles to death.

**Jidmah**

Perfect Organism wrote:
Koppo wrote:
How does "gets hot" work with artillery? Does it wound the gun?

Consensus seems to be that it fries the crew member firing it. At least that was the case in 6th edition.

Artillery rules say that a crew member is firing the weapon, not the artillery piece. Get's Hot! rules say the firing model gets the wound. Considering how is both a better gun and it fries gretchin more often, I'd say it's strictly better than a zzap gun

44Ronin wrote:
Greyhound wrote:
44Ronin wrote:

Lootas cannot penetrate AV14. So your opinion is irrelevant.

smasha can't penetrate AV14 97.22% of the time so I don't think it's much better.

You don't understand sequential probabilities very well.

Chance of rolling less than 10 on 2d6 for a penetration strength of 14 or less is 91.66%. He probably had S3 in mind (like witchblades have) which would be 97.22%, so no reason to insult him.

**ClockworkZion**

Jidmah wrote:
Chance of rolling less than 10 on 2d6 for a penetration strength of 14 or less is 91.66%. He probably had S3 in mind (like witchblades have) which would be 97.22%, so no reason to insult him.

Um...the Smasha is S: D6+4 and only rolls 1D6 for pen:

**mrfantastical**

Smasha gun is basically a S4 melta gun..... Meh.

Still doesn't give Greenskins a reliable way of dealing with AV 14 at range.

**Leerjawise**

ClockworkZion wrote:
Jidmah wrote:
Chance of rolling less than 10 on 2d6 for a penetration strength of 14 or less is 91.66%. He probably had S3 in mind (like witchblades have) which would be 97.22%, so no reason to insult him.

Um...the Smasha is S: D6+4 and only rolls 1D6 for pen:

In other words, 2d6+4, so you need 10 on 2d6 to glance av14. Which is what he said

**PhillyT**

So what is the price on the big guns? I see two separate prices over and over. Is it $38?

**Accolade**

PhillyT wrote:
So what is the price on the big guns? I see two separate prices over and over. Is it $38?

It's $46. $38 was referenced by a rumor from the Grot website, but the White Dwarf confirmed the Mekgunz at $46.

**SJM**

Big $$$ for little points!

**nkelsch**

We haven't seen a 'big gunz' kit yet? Just 'mek gunz'

**Accolade**

I'd be very surprised if they were separate kits. Now, I may have missed something, but I think Mekgunz have replaced Big Gunz, since they are pretty much the same concept with a more copyright-able name.

**Rubs**

nkelsch wrote:
We haven't seen a 'big gunz' kit yet? Just 'mek gunz'

I believe the big gunz are being rolled into the mek gunz. It's all one platform now, you pick what upgrades you want for them.

**matphat**

Not crazy about the Mek Gunz design in general. The rules are kind of all over the place as well. I'll likely just keep running my scratch built Kannons and Lobbas as they still seem to be the most reliable. Also, the price point, much like the Naught, is officially out of my range.

Looks like Warmachine will be getting the bulk of my hobby money this year which sucks because I really wanted to be gaga over this release since it is my home army.

**Lord Scythican**

For those needing some cheap alternatives for extra bases for the gunz, try looking at the trukk kit. Minus the gunz i was able to make three with one trukk

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/images-14732-15364_Custom%20Ork%20Big%20Gunz.html

**pretre**

Dr. Delorean wrote:
For those of you (and myself!) who find the cost of the Big Gunz prohibitive (who wouldn't, that's ~$335 dollary-doos for a full battery), please refer to the spoilered image below.

This guy (I emphasise that these are -not mine-) made these three kannons out of a single trukk kit, some airhose nozzles from a hardware store, and some .22 shell casings. I don't particular see the shell casings as being essential, some basic tubing would probably work too.

He recommended to me that the combination of the above with some basic spark plugs would result in some fine looking Tractor Kannons (putting the plugs in place of the airhose nozzles).

Works out to be a damn sight cheaper than the kit, you should be able to get 3 done for about $5-$10 more than buying the big gun kit retail. Also, you shouldn't get into trouble for converting them, since they're predominantly a GW kit anyway.

This is not really news (as a couple others have said). Every ork player I know kitbashes half their army.

I figure most people will buy 1-2 of the Mek Gunz kits and then use a box or two of gretchen, toys, their bits box, their old big guns models and other kits to make the other 13 models they need.

**ClockworkZion**

Leerjawise wrote:
ClockworkZion wrote:
Jidmah wrote:
Chance of rolling less than 10 on 2d6 for a penetration strength of 14 or less is 91.66%. He probably had S3 in mind (like witchblades have) which would be 97.22%, so no reason to insult him.

Um...the Smasha is S: D6+4 and only rolls 1D6 for pen:

In other words, 2d6+4, so you need 10 on 2d6 to glance av14. Which is what he said

Except that misses a step. Pick target, roll strength, roll to hit, roll pen. Your chances of doing anything to a Land Raider are worse than just the 2d6+4.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Accolade wrote:
I'd be very surprised if they were separate kits. Now, I may have missed something, but I think Mekgunz have replaced Big Gunz, since they are pretty much the same concept with a more copyright-able name.

The Mek Gunz kit only makes the new gunz according to the WD.

**Accolade**

No, I get that Clockwork. What I'm saying is there won't be a Big Gunz unit in the new Ork codex. It will have been replaced with the Mekgunz which are, to all extent and purposes, the *new* Big Gunz.

**ClockworkZion**

Accolade wrote:
No, I get that Clockwork. What I'm saying is there won't be a Big Gunz unit in the new Ork codex. It will have been replaced with the Mekgunz which are, to all extent and purposes, the *new* Big Gunz.

Yes and no. The unit is replaced by Mek Gunz, but the models will still be useful:

**Goliath**

44Ronin wrote:
Greyhound wrote:
44Ronin wrote:

Lootas cannot penetrate AV14. So your opinion is irrelevant.

smasha can't penetrate AV14 97.22% of the time so I don't think it's much better.

You don't understand sequential probabilities very well.

Except for that part where he's right...

for the d6+4 to penetrate, you need the (D6+4)+D6 > 14, so 2D6+4 > 14, so 2D6 > 10, which has three results out of 36 available, so a 1 in 12 chance.

1/12 * probability to hit (2/6 for most orks) = 0.0277 = 2.7% chance of penetrating with any single shot of a smasha gun.

This means that 97.2% of the time the smasha gun will not be penetrating AV14.

Admittedly, he should have used a probability to hit of 1/2, which would mean you were doing nothing 95.8% of the time, but purely in regards to his knowledge of sequential probability, you are incorrect.

**Accolade**

Oh most certainly. I'm going to take my old metal Big Gunz, replace the little wheels with Trukk tires, and upgrade them with FW Kilkannons to give them a bit more of a robust feel to match the Mekgunz

**Orock**

46 bucks for one. Its like GW hates money. I thought I was paranoid to price the meganobz at 3 for 60. Now I bet it will be 2 for 60. or 3 for 88 like the centurions. You can keep the "extra bits" gw, I have plenty of those. Guess kromlech is getting my money.

**pretre**

Orock wrote:
You can keep the "extra bits" gw, I have plenty of those.

Nice try, fake ork player. No true ork would ever turn down bits.

**ClockworkZion**

pretre wrote:
Orock wrote:
You can keep the "extra bits" gw, I have plenty of those.

Nice try, fake ork player. No true ork would ever turn down bits.

I'm not even an Ork player (yet, I'm working on it

) and I don't turn down bits. Sometimes all the extra bits you get are the best part of a kit!

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Orock wrote:
46 bucks for one. Its like GW hates money.

I don't think they "hate money", but there is something definitely driving prices that we can't see. Since the way prices have jumped on new kits since they started using that smaller tooling for making their molds I'm wondering if that has driven up the cost of the molds, and in turn the product's cost. It's just speculation but it correlates well.

**SJM**

If I want Mek gunz, I may buy one kit then turn it into 3 gunz somehow.

**nkelsch**

Ok, makes sense now that I see the unit entry.

I am really curious what comes on the sprue... I also worry about 'rules' and 'LOS' issues in regards to small vs large big guns.

**pretre**

SJM wrote:
If I want Mek gunz, I may buy one kit then turn it into 3 gunz somehow.

I think that's the plan for pretty much everyone.

**ClockworkZion**

pretre wrote:
SJM wrote:
If I want Mek gunz, I may buy one kit then turn it into 3 gunz somehow.

I think that's the plan for pretty much everyone.

That or buy the kit and magnetize all the options. You know, the other go-to for people looking to get the most out of kits for the money.