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I'm asking because out of most of the codex it seems the most in need of an updating like the rest.
I'm also thinking of picking up some orks and was wondering if it was worth starting them or to just pick up a newer more updated army+rules.
Are orks still able to hold their own against all the latest armies and their new rules? Am I right in saying they lack anti-aircraft? after all the codex was out before the game was invaded from the skies or at least at the very start.

The ork codex is old. But honestly it has aged very well with the new rule book

It is very outdated... It is ok though because orks are next up for a new dex so buy away! I would suggest just starting out with some boys and painting them up until the new dex comes this summer.

Yes, it was written for the edition before the previous edition, so it's inevitably a bit dated. That said, it has held up very well considering.

Orks don't really need anti-air, because their ranged anti-tank units generally bring such volume of fire to compensate for their terrible BS that snap-shots aren't too much of a drawback.

They have been given an OK flyer in the form of the Dakkajet and a Super Heavy Walker with fairly decent rules, so they aren't really lacking anything that recent codexes have had.

Lots of their units are sub-par at the moment, but by using the right allies and fortifications, their best stuff is still pretty competitive.

In my experience, battlewagons are the most important unit in the book; they make otherwise fragile shooting units both tough and mobile. The main obstacle to building a good ork list is running out of heavy support slots (the second biggest is running out of HQ slots).

 AtomicEngineer wrote:
I'm asking because out of most of the codex it seems the most in need of an updating like the rest.
I'm also thinking of picking up some orks and was wondering if it was worth starting them or to just pick up a newer more updated army+rules.
Are orks still able to hold their own against all the latest armies and their new rules? Am I right in saying they lack anti-aircraft? after all the codex was out before the game was invaded from the skies or at least at the very start.

1) Start assembling and paint a ork army it takes allot of time as you allways want boyz it's the backbone to our army and has allways been so long orks exist.
2) Fully depend on the ork army you play but people generally dont make TAC list to face a greentide WAAAAAAAAAAAGH!
3)We have lootas masses of dakka, We have dakkajet more DAKKA! and hitting at 3's! (with flyboss dat is) and then there's the quad gun you can allways buy.

4)
just as a excuse to link this.

Easily the best-aged codex. Still totally viable.

It aged well, but the newest cheesiest armies will walk you off the table most nights. Just the way it is. We don't get twin-linked everything, with 93 psyker powers to reroll misses and wounds and blow bubblegum kisses. However, burying people in a pile of green bodies sure is satisfying. Especially if you happen to get a mega-killy melee unit into the middle of that sweet sweet tau gunline. The look on that guys face as you run over his little castle in the corner because he was too busy shooting some grots.

From what I've seen, it's still a fairly decent codex, despite its age. I've seen it hold its ground against some newer codices, but it would be foolish to try to take on any of the higher tier armies with it.

It really is starting to show its age though, and is in desperate need for an update. But I think that has more to do with the sheer power of newer codices rather than a weakness on the Orks' part.

Yes, make an ork army. They are fun.

Yes, the codex is dated, but they can still, in the right hands, defeat any army out there.

They really are not so lacking in the AA department, as grots manning a quad gun are still decent. A dakkajet (or two) will still take out pretty much any flyer commonly used in the game. Make sure you go second, if you can. You will probably only get one shot at it. Lootas are also good AA.

The vehicles are incredibly fun to build, convert, and paint.

All this, plus they are just very humorous and enjoyable to play overall.

Sounds like a good army to me.

Its a little dated and it really shows if you try and get into a shootout with some of the newer books out there. But if you're willing to trade off that dakka for some good ole fashion krumpin you can give Tau and eldar a decent run for their money if you bring enough trucks and wagons. Either way we get a new book in a few months and it will have more crazy random stuff that will win you games or lose them. In the end who really cares, we're orks. We're just here for a good fight, win or lose.

I like orks. Its very old and still very good.

I feel like if I was an Ork player, I would have a similar standpoint that I do to my Dark Eldar - sure we are old, not necessarily the strongest race, but I would not want to risk a new codex. Things that aren't op that make Orks work, will inevitably be nerfed to make room for what they deem as "new options". Which will likely be some sort of monstrous ork like fallout's Super Mutant Behemoth, and a vehicle. Probably not a great trade for points increase on tank bustaz and lootas.

This won't definitely happen, but its a very strong possibility. Sure Ork's are even older than DE, but I've learnt that when I have a good thing, to be happy with it. Very satisfied with DE dex and I hope the refrain from changing too much come the next dex, hope the same for my Orky bros.

Ork Codex is rumoured to be the next after Imperial Guard.

And the rumours are likely pretty accurate. Best of luck to all da boyz out there.

Chaos Legionnaire wrote:Yes, make an ork army. They are fun.

Yes, the codex is dated, but they can still, in the right hands, defeat any army out there.

I disagree. Orks really have three glaring weaknesses. As you pointed out correctly, fliers are not one of them.
However, orks really struggle with monstrous creatures, flying or not as we don't have any units to counter them, and tar-pitting isn't always an option.
Second, orks have no way of combating psykers. Anything but boyz is very vulnerable to all kinds of maledictions and and strong units with the right blessings just murder their way straight through anything orky. Our only psyker is a fun, but useless model.
Third, orks lack the reach to hurt anything that endangers their entire strategy. Lootaz were the sole exception to this (and thus became staples in every ork army), however they aren't strong enough to do meaningful damage to armies built from the newest generation of codices.

All these need to be fixed in order to "defeat any army out there" again. The codex was incredibly well written, as it allowed for multiple competitive armies all through 5th and a huge range of working tier 2 armies. The the huge amounts of nerfs in sixth, combined with the raised power level of 6th edition codices finally broke its back. There is literally no reliable way to beat well build and well played Eldar, Tau, Daemon or Space Marine armies. And I'm not even talking about self-allies or lords of war. The stompa stops being an awesome super-heavy when the IoM shoots your with double turbo-lasers.

SHUPPET wrote:I feel like if I was an Ork player, I would have a similar standpoint that I do to my Dark Eldar - sure we are old, not necessarily the strongest race, but I would not want to risk a new codex. Things that aren't op that make Orks work, will inevitably be nerfed to make room for what they deem as "new options". Which will likely be some sort of monstrous ork like fallout's Super Mutant Behemoth, and a vehicle. Probably not a great trade for points increase on tank bustaz and lootas.

This won't definitely happen, but its a very strong possibility. Sure Ork's are even older than DE, but I've learnt that when I have a good thing, to be happy with it. Very satisfied with DE dex and I hope the refrain from changing too much come the next dex, hope the same for my Orky bros.

Orks don't work. There are there are no more than six choices in the codex that I'd call good. Half the codex is completely unplayable except for fluff reasons. The only thing that keeps orks afloat at all is the extreme efficiency of boyz, everything else is just picking the least sucky option. It really can't get much worse. DE and Orks really are in no way comparable in that regard.

1 unit of 3 lobbas w/ ammmo runts and extra gunners are cheap (120ish points) and can snipe out important figures.

BWs area must, Nob bikers used to rock and roll, now they just get rolled.

 FeindusMaximus wrote:
1 unit of 3 lobbas w/ ammmo runts and extra gunners are cheap (120ish points) and can snipe out important figures.

Assuming you don't scatter, successfully wound and the opponent fails both LoS! and their save.

They're fairly good if you play a good list, but not the easiest army around to use.

 Jidmah wrote:

Chaos Legionnaire wrote:Yes, make an ork army. They are fun.

Yes, the codex is dated, but they can still, in the right hands, defeat any army out there.

I disagree. Orks really have three glaring weaknesses. As you pointed out correctly, fliers are not one of them.
However, orks really struggle with monstrous creatures, flying or not as we don't have any units to counter them, and tar-pitting isn't always an option.
Second, orks have no way of combating psykers. Anything but boyz is very vulnerable to all kinds of maledictions and and strong units with the right blessings just murder their way straight through anything orky. Our only psyker is a fun, but useless model.
Third, orks lack the reach to hurt anything that endangers their entire strategy. Lootaz were the sole exception to this (and thus became staples in every ork army), however they aren't strong enough to do meaningful damage to armies built from the newest generation of codices.

All these need to be fixed in order to "defeat any army out there" again. The codex was incredibly well written, as it allowed for multiple competitive armies all through 5th and a huge range of working tier 2 armies. The the huge amounts of nerfs in sixth, combined with the raised power level of 6th edition codices finally broke its back. There is literally no reliable way to beat well build and well played Eldar, Tau, Daemon or Space Marine armies. And I'm not even talking about self-allies or lords of war. The stompa stops being an awesome super-heavy when the IoM shoots your with double turbo-lasers.

SHUPPET wrote:I feel like if I was an Ork player, I would have a similar standpoint that I do to my Dark Eldar - sure we are old, not necessarily the strongest race, but I would not want to risk a new codex. Things that aren't op that make Orks work, will inevitably be nerfed to make room for what they deem as "new options". Which will likely be some sort of monstrous ork like fallout's Super Mutant Behemoth, and a vehicle. Probably not a great trade for points increase on tank bustaz and lootas.

This won't definitely happen, but its a very strong possibility. Sure Ork's are even older than DE, but I've learnt that when I have a good thing, to be happy with it. Very satisfied with DE dex and I hope the refrain from changing too much come the next dex, hope the same for my Orky bros.

Orks don't work. There are there are no more than six choices in the codex that I'd call good. Half the codex is completely unplayable except for fluff reasons. The only thing that keeps orks afloat at all is the extreme efficiency of boyz, everything else is just picking the least sucky option. It really can't get much worse. DE and Orks really are in no way comparable in that regard.

I'll admit I'm quite uneducated on the ways of the Orks other than playing against the commonly fielded units (even the most balanced of dex's have commonly fielded units), and what I've heard from Ork players in my local. You are probably accurate. If this is the case then they definitely need a fix you p.

I was able to do pretty well with my Orks for a long time. The codex held up for a long time not OP but not hurting either. 6th hurt a bit with changes to cover saves reducing most things to 5+ that hurt but we could deal with it. The KFF got faq'd not to include squads of vehicles like kanz we could deal and it was no long 4+ on vehicles. Ok things are starting to hurt pretty bad but we can deal there are other options. Then Tau came with ignores cover not reducing cover marker lignts ouch ouch ouch things are not looking good any more. Eldar comes along with 4+ cover on vehicles my mek is jealous now and they reduce pens to glances ok now my mek has a serpent pinned above his bunk oh they get twin link and ignore cover now my big mek is writing penthouse with letters about them.

Short answer the changes to cover saves and all the ingores cover weapons out now combined with being outgunned really aged the Ork dex in the last 6 months finally breaking it's back but it had a good long run.

However they can still do good against marines even though it's a new dex.
Just my opinion on it.

I don't know.
I never have trouble with monstrous creatures or psykers.
But maybe I'm doing it wrong.

Or your opponents are

To identify a psyker as a problem isn't all that easy - after all, it's the unit with the blessing murdering you, which might not contain the psyker itself.

We're still quite viable even vs top-tier armies.

Battlewagonz are one of the best assault transports in game. Combined with KFF mek you can get a cheap front-av14 wall wtih constant 5+ cover and enormous transport capacity. I've won quite some games vs tau gunlines that everyone dislikes so much. Yep, they can stop a wagon per turn but there come another 2 loaded with boyz or meganobz. You need to protect the sides though cause av12 won't hold for long.

Nob bikers with bikerboss are also quite potent. Even more so than in the previous edition.

Lobbas - compared to other armie's artillery units they've got mediocre damage output but can get 3 rerolls becoming rather accurate and can be made super-tough - a load of t7 wounds for 3 pts each. If u've got free heavy support slots - take them without doubt. They'll be super handy vs any infantry. Be it pathfinders, tau gunline, ig blobs or any other infantry.

Lootas - our primary ranged support option. Still quite good. However, i find that ig or tau allies will be better cause they have the same firepower but more durability for the same pointcost.

Shootaboyz - best unit to ride a battlewagon and for cheap footslogging. If u're riding a bw - take a pk nob with bosspole and probably eavy armor, if u're footslogging - nob's not mandatory. Alwayz take bigshootas. Don't forget that you can place one on nob and he's not loosing anything but gaining precision shots and u're not loosing a shoota on boy.

It's a pity that pure greentide and massed walkers don't work. But that's more of a ruleset problem rather than codex one.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
From my gaming experience, orks are still quite capable. Hope we won't loose much with the new dex. Rumours tell that all da boyz are getting 6+ fnp.

Going to agree with a good portion of what Jidmah said.

HQ: Our only psyker, the weird boy, might as well not exist. He has 0 gear options, so is stuck at a t-shirt save. His powers are mostly unreliable at best, with 1 of them targeting his own unit in the first place.

Elite: Might as well just say "Lootas" and be done. Burna Boyz might sometimes see the table as a rolling flamer wagon, but that's more an exception. Nobz pretty much only see the table as troops. Speaking of...

Troops: Our one shining spot. Boyz are just so good for their cost. If you want to start an Ork army, you can't go wrong painting up loads and loads of boyz. Shootas are generally preferred right now, but slugga/choppa boyz are rumored to be getting buffed. I doubt it'll replace shootas, but always worth a try.

Fast Attack: Meh. Buggies/Trakks are way too flimsy for their cost. Dakkajets are cool, but killing infantry isn't exactly an issue for orks. Deffkoptas took a bit of a hit by not being able to charge first turn but are still popular. Stormboyz may see a revival in the new book, but that's just rumors.

Heavy: AKA: Battlewagons, the section. Big Gunz units are making a resurgence thanks to Lobbas being Barrage, but Battlewagons are still pretty much where it's at. I expect Deffrollas will get supremely nerfed in the new book, but that's just me being pessimistic.

Orks are still fun, but they are definitely not very good any more. I've found that you might as well use fluff and fun options, as against the top lists you don't have a chance anyway. Tau and Eldar just put so many strong anti-Ork shots downfield that there is no realistic chance of surviving them. Sad times. Saying that, the codex is pure gold in terms of the viability it had in 5th, the variety it possesses, and the character that the models, fluff and rules all exude. I'm hoping for big things from the next codex, like Stormboy point reductions and the Big Meks to be improved. The happy thing is that the book is now so weak that we can only go up!

@Jidmah: That is very true.

Bassline wrote:
The ork codex is old. But honestly it has aged very well with the new rule book

I agree with Bassline.

It certainly needs new models, gadgets, and gizmos, but 120 boys are still pretty effective!

Yeah, gotta say Jidmah nailed it.

I still held an ounce of faith in the book until I put it up against Belakor. Hallucination can flat out remove a unit from the game each turn, so your 800 point Nob Biker deathstar is worthless and theres nothing you can do about it. Let alone the other, less ridiculous psykers out there.

Orks can still compete at a top level at low points (1000) and quite possibly in double force org and/or "no allies" situations, but otherwise not a chance

I've had very good success with my orks vs. a highly competitive local scene. Eldar, Tau, Taudar, Demons, Necrons. I'm not winning tournaments, but I'm winning games and giving every list a real run for it's money which is a testament to how well the codex has aged and how extremely well written it was.

Many of the "old standard" ork lists just don't work any more though, so you have to be flexible. You're also able to ally with some top-tier armies, which can help at higher point values.

For me, the core of my ork army has moved away from boyz to nobs. I still have boys, but I don't build the army around them. Nob units with a like-armed warboss that makes the unit scoring are the key.

Nob bikes w/ warboss on bike
maganobs w/ mega-armored warboss (in battlewagon)

other units I rely on...
Battlewagon w/ 10-man Aard boy shoota squad
Battlewagons in general w/ deffrolla
dakka jets
10-man grot squads
grot artillery
lootas behind aegis wall (still worth-while for 50 pts)

I frequently ally with Necrons wich can make for some very nice synergistic combinations.


The army that gves me consistent problems is Chaos Demons. Anything else I feel I can compete with (though I might not win... I'll give them a heck of a fight). Keep in mind that all ork transports are rented for 1 or 2 turns at best. Given the strength of most weaponry, even battlewagons are easy to pen & if penned are more likely to explode than any other result. That's why Iv'e gone to Aard boyz... they survive the explosion.

I feel like most of the codex's for 6E are good. So I think orks will be no different. PLayers like to bitch. about everything. But I cant identify a single codex outside of Blood Angels that is "suffering" in 6E. I really can't.

Even Tyranids, as maligned as they are, are picking up speed as people start to understand them better.