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Hi, not sure of my current army due to me being away from it at the moment but how about...

CCS-Chimera
(Regimental advisers)

Veterans (Foot)
3 snipers

Veterans (Valkyrie)
Flamers

Veterans (Valkyrie)
Melta/flame

Mortar team

Lascannon team

Priest

Basilisk

ADL

Small squad of stormtroopers.

All of that for roughly 1500 points, Say You run the vet and HWT squads towards an objective with the CCS in the chimera and basilisk giving covering fire, by turn 2 at least Valkyrie comes on and starts pie plating any men giving you trouble, by turn 3 the the second will be on doing the same. If worse comes to worse the stormtroops can deepstrike and provide cover to an ailing unit. Using this tactic i think you can take/contest pretty much any objective on the board. I'm temped to add a deathstrike or another basilisk also.

 Paradigm wrote:

Mavnas wrote:
So how do people feel about special weapons teams with sniper rifles? 36pts for 6 guys who can sit on a backfield objective and still make a token effort at plinking away at some high T target.

Not bad if you have the points to get rid of. Worst case scenario a unit will shoot at them, and that's a turn not shooting at a different (more valuable) target. Best case scenario, they score and objective and 3VPs, and maybe even hurt/pin something.

It's also worth noting that, apart from bare henchmen, I think that's the cheapest scoring unit in the game, which may count for something. I've found small, empty henchmen squads useful as they just get ignored, so maybe this is the IG's equivalent.

3 wracks for DE is 30 pts, t4 and FnP. But yea sws snipers are cheap scoring, though I don't think my lists will have room for such a useless unit. Yea its 36 pts, but I don't remember the last list I built where I even had more then 5 pts laying around anf if I did I'd want something better. 36 "extra" points is a lot of useful things.

Anybody thinking about say using cheap low point infantry defending artillery...

and then deep striking an entire stormtrooper platoon into their backfield as the closed in on our entrenched lines?

 Comrade wrote:
Anybody thinking about say using cheap low point infantry defending artillery...

and then deep striking an entire stormtrooper platoon into their backfield as the closed in on our entrenched lines?

Yea, a hellhound with an auger array and a platoon with 10 specials precision DS'ing can be VERY effective. Especially when that tempestor prime orders his squad to gain plasma precision shots .

I had a thought about the deathblob and I think Yarrick makes it beyond disgusting.

Yarrick
5 Infantry Squads: 5 Meltaguns, 5 Poweraxes, Krak Grenades
2 Priests
lvl 2 Primaris Psyker
Azrael

Everyone knows the Azrael blob but the orders that yarrick gives means you don't have to babysit the blob with a command squad and allows you to use the best orders like precision shot or ignore cover. The priest, in CC, allows re-rolls of those 4+ invuls which is just dirty. With Prescience for the primaris, and the hymns from the priests, in combat the unit is re-rolling all hits, wounds, and saves. Nasty.

I think this setup

 obsidiankatana wrote:

screaming flayers wrote:

since the russ is a heavy vehicle and can always fire all weapons at full ballistic skill does potms even help a russ?

There are cases being made for POTMS overriding Ordnance for a Battle Tank / Demolisher. Not that many people take those variants these days.

a couple of things - one - those are the ones i have, is that a mistake?

i thought heavy vehicles are not affected by ordnance

screaming flayers wrote:
a couple of things - one - those are the ones i have, is that a mistake?

i thought heavy vehicles are not affected by ordnance

Yes, you have made a mistake. Being a heavy vehicle doesn't do anything about ordnance. It just makes the tank always shoot as if it were stationary. Ordnance restricts all other weapons to only snap shots whether the vehicle moved or not so heavy doesn't help. This is why you sometimes see IG players complaining about ordnance Russes being less useful and complaining about the loss of the old Lumbering Behemoth.

Did Scions lose/not have access to the Vendetta in their Tempustus Book?

Or is it a choice?

I noticed in the AM/IG you can't run Vets in Vendetta's anymore as the vet squad starts at 10, so if you want Scions in Vendettas you can only do so with AM/IG codex taking up Elite/FA choices?

 Uriels_Flame wrote:
Did Scions lose/not have access to the Vendetta in their Tempustus Book?

Or is it a choice?

I noticed in the AM/IG you can't run Vets in Vendetta's anymore as the vet squad starts at 10, so if you want Scions in Vendettas you can only do so with AM/IG codex taking up Elite/FA choices?

Pretty much. I mean there is nothing stopping you from taking vets in a valkyrie instead, but now they can't fit in a vendetta. Honestly Scions could have used the vendetta, as an army list it is pretty much useless outside of allies because it has no firepower. While I suppose there is no inherent issue with such a thing (I assume it was meant to be used with allies from the start), they still should have access to vendettas, both because of fluff (why not give the elite of the AM some mobile heavy fire support?) and because it makes them better allies beyond suicide meltas which anyone can do.

buddha wrote:I had a thought about the deathblob and I think Yarrick makes it beyond disgusting.

Yarrick
5 Infantry Squads: 5 Meltaguns, 5 Poweraxes, Krak Grenades
2 Priests
lvl 2 Primaris Psyker
Azrael

Everyone knows the Azrael blob but the orders that yarrick gives means you don't have to babysit the blob with a command squad and allows you to use the best orders like precision shot or ignore cover. The priest, in CC, allows re-rolls of those 4+ invuls which is just dirty. With Prescience for the primaris, and the hymns from the priests, in combat the unit is re-rolling all hits, wounds, and saves. Nasty.

I think this setup

I would trade the primaris psykers for inquisition ones. If you put Yarrick with the primaris psykers then the first perils Yarrick executes the primaris.

Found a codex that had fallen out the back of a truck today.

Fiddling around with stuff, here's a foot-slogger list I made:

Company Command Squad (Yarrick, Las Cannon, 2xPlasma Guns)
Platoon Command Squad (Las Cannon, Grenade Launcher)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Platoon Command Squad (Las Cannon, Grenade Launcher)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Platoon Command Squad (Las Cannon, Grenade Launcher)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Primaris Psyker (Psyker Level 2)
Primaris Psyker (Psyker Level 2)
Primaris Psyker (Psyker Level 2)
Aegis Defense Line (Quad Gun)

1500 Points

I originally had 3 priests instead of Yarrick. Replacing him would give me 70 more points to play around with. Dunno.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
Found a codex that had fallen out the back of a truck today.

Fiddling around with stuff, here's a foot-slogger list I made:

Company Command Squad (Yarrick, Las Cannon, 2xPlasma Guns)
Platoon Command Squad (Las Cannon, Grenade Launcher)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Platoon Command Squad (Las Cannon, Grenade Launcher)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Platoon Command Squad (Las Cannon, Grenade Launcher)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Infantry Squad (Las Cannon, Plasma Gun)
Primaris Psyker (Psyker Level 2)
Primaris Psyker (Psyker Level 2)
Primaris Psyker (Psyker Level 2)
Aegis Defense Line (Quad Gun)

1500 Points

I originally had 3 priests instead of Yarrick. Replacing him would give me 70 more points to play around with. Dunno.

It would be 70 pts you'd immediately need to put into a CCS though, I don't see a second HQ in there.

Edit: Derp, I'm apparently blind.

 rabidguineapig wrote:

It would be 70 pts you'd immediately need to put into a CCS though, I don't see a second HQ in there.

I'm not following.

There's already a CCS. Removing Yarrick would leave the CCS, being the mandatory HQ.

Don't need a second HQ below 2000pts.

The list looks a little boring if anything, though probably effective enough. Its certainly a good amount of psychically buffed lascannon shots to wade through, not even considering the orders being thrown around.

Oh my bad, not sure how I missed that. You'd be good to go then, I literally looked over that twice and didn't even see the CCS. Too early here haha...

With how good senior orders are, it only makes sense for Imperial Guard to always have their HQ slots maxed out.

Hi,I'm thinking about getting some Guard allies for my Space Wolves, could someone tell me if I could ally in priests, enginseers etc.? I'm not sure how this would work as allies, if they only take up no HQ slot if they're the primary detachment or something like this. I'd appreciate it if someone could tell me

 tau tse tung wrote:
Hi, not sure of my current army due to me being away from it at the moment but how about...

CCS-Chimera
(Regimental advisers)

Veterans (Foot)
3 snipers

Veterans (Valkyrie)
Flamers

Veterans (Valkyrie)
Melta/flame

Mortar team

Lascannon team

Priest

Basilisk

ADL

Small squad of stormtroopers.

All of that for roughly 1500 points, Say You run the vet and HWT squads towards an objective with the CCS in the chimera and basilisk giving covering fire, by turn 2 at least Valkyrie comes on and starts pie plating any men giving you trouble, by turn 3 the the second will be on doing the same. If worse comes to worse the stormtroops can deepstrike and provide cover to an ailing unit. Using this tactic i think you can take/contest pretty much any objective on the board. I'm temped to add a deathstrike or another basilisk also.

You need an Infantry platoon (requiring a PCS and 2 Infantry Squads) to take the Heavy Weapon Teams. That being said, I think they'd be better off traded for something else anyway. The Mortars are sadly terrible. I haven't played an army like this, but it feels light on power, even for 1500. I think the CCS and Basilisk are going to get picked out early, then you're going to have some problems. There's really no such thing as covering fire in 40k as it is right now. The only way to limit your enemy's killing power (barring a few psychic powers) is killing them. Units that advance have to be really tough or in large number. I'm not sure why you're wanting to advance with the Heavy Weapons anyway. I'd gear your non-Valkryie units towards stationary, protective, firepower roles. The Veterans in Valks should be your primary takers of objectives not near your deployment zone.

Buttons wrote:

 Uriels_Flame wrote:
Did Scions lose/not have access to the Vendetta in their Tempustus Book?

Or is it a choice?

I noticed in the AM/IG you can't run Vets in Vendetta's anymore as the vet squad starts at 10, so if you want Scions in Vendettas you can only do so with AM/IG codex taking up Elite/FA choices?

Pretty much. I mean there is nothing stopping you from taking vets in a valkyrie instead, but now they can't fit in a vendetta. Honestly Scions could have used the vendetta, as an army list it is pretty much useless outside of allies because it has no firepower. While I suppose there is no inherent issue with such a thing (I assume it was meant to be used with allies from the start), they still should have access to vendettas, both because of fluff (why not give the elite of the AM some mobile heavy fire support?) and because it makes them better allies beyond suicide meltas which anyone can do.

Well crap - there goes my Jakero/Scion list....

Swapped out Yarrick for the Priests again, used those points to buy moar plasma and vox's for errybody.

 Blacksails wrote:

The list looks a little boring if anything, though probably effective enough. Its certainly a good amount of psychically buffed lascannon shots to wade through, not even considering the orders being thrown around.

Oh, I agree. This list is dry as hell, lol. I would never run it outside of a tournament or to shut up a cocky player.It seems pretty dirty though. At rapid-fire range, all three platoons firing while prescienced is putting 42 wounds on MEQ or 33 on TEQ a turn.

To start a new point of discussion:

I really like Sentinels, and the decreased cost of armored sentinels suddenly makes them pretty interesting. There's a catch, though. Leman Russ tanks also went down in price, and they have a gun for everything. Examples follow:

3 Autocannon Sentinels: 135 points, average of 3 hits
LR Exterminator: 130 points, average of 3 hits

3 Plasma Cannon Sentinels: 150 points, 3 plasma cannonshots
LR Executioner: 140 points (I think), 3 plasma cannon shots

3 Lascannon Sentinels: 150 points, 3 lascannon shots
LR Vanquiser with hull Lascannon: 145 points, 2 shots, but one is much more likely to penetrate

3 Heavy Flamer Sentinels: 120 points, 3 templates
LR Eradicator: 120 points, 1 large blast, massively better range

3 Multilaser Sentinels: 120 points, 9 S6 shots
LR Punisher: 140 points, 20 S5 shots

Furthermore, Leman Russes have a huge armor advantage, a hull weapon, and the chance to buy cheap sponsons. The Sentinels have a little going for them, but it's mostly small-ball stuff:
-More total hull points (countered by lower armor)
-More vehicles (can't smoke the whole group with a lucky hit)
-Easier to get cover
-Less vulnerable in close combat
-Fast Attack choice vs. Heavy Support

So really the main reason I'm seeing to use them is if you're Heavy Support choices are filled and you want some extra firepower. This isn't necessarily a bad reason. I could imagine an army with a lot of artillery that wanted some durable, mobile direct firepower. That means Sentinels. I suppose you can also scale down with them. Single Sentinels can tarpit certain units pretty well and still provide some useful, expendable firepower.

I feel a little like I've been baited and switched.

Scout sentinels can scout* as well.


* Crap. I THINK they can scout still. No codex at work.

Scout sentinels can still scout, yes. But they're AV10 in the front, so marines/dire avengers/guardians/anybody really can very easily destroy them without even having to try. Given the repricing of the Armoured Sentinel, I think it's clearly superior now.

RE: Executioners. They are 155pts, so slightly more expensive than the 3 Plasma Sentinels, but the Execution also has at least a heavy bolter, with the option to upgrade it's firepower a lot.

I really want to like Sentinels; they are cool models and AT-ST's have been awesome as long as I can remember. However, whenever I write a list, they end up on the chopping block. I can't really justify cutting a Leman Russ for them, so they sit on the sidelines.

Sents are definitely worth considering.

Scouts with Lascannons certainly still have a place, as they always did, with moving in from the side and hitting side armour. Use autocannons if tight on points or expecting to face AV12 or lower side armour. You could also run something similar with HF ScoutSents in an anti-infantry/objective-clearing role.

Armoured Sents are also probably best with Lascannons, 6HP and AV12 across 3 models is pretty durable once in cover. They're shooting from T1, and outrange. Any shots that hit them aren't hitting your Russes or Chimeras, so it's a win-win. They also have some ability to tarpit units.

Thanks for the correction on the Executioners. I didn't have my book with me. I'm not going to say Scouts Sentinels shouldn't be used, but I have a problem with they're frailty. More importantly for this line of thought, they're really not worth comparing to Leman Russes because they have pretty distinct abilities. Armored Sentinels much less so.

I guess the Lascannon armed variety is really more interesting. It's not necessarily a better tank hunter than a Vanquisher, but it brings an extra shot for the points, which is better against a variety of targets at long range. I also am not convinced it's worth it, but Hunter-Killers are another way to take advantage of Sentinels. Use them for a 6 heavy weapon alpha strike, with just the lascannons in subsequent turns.

I wish I could give my Sentinels multi-meltas like the Elysians. That would be a cool Armored Sentinel role.

Sentinels can charge right? AV12 into a unit without crack grenades and you should be able to tie them up. Heck even with grenades, they're rolling for 6s, one attack per model.

I can see armored sentinels getting some time in. Especially as a reasonably durable lascannon platform.

Ugh. Its a tough call though.

Biophysical wrote:Thanks for the correction on the Executioners. I didn't have my book with me. I'm not going to say Scouts Sentinels shouldn't be used, but I have a problem with they're frailty. More importantly for this line of thought, they're really not worth comparing to Leman Russes because they have pretty distinct abilities. Armored Sentinels much less so.

I guess the Lascannon armed variety is really more interesting. It's not necessarily a better tank hunter than a Vanquisher, but it brings an extra shot for the points, which is better against a variety of targets at long range. I also am not convinced it's worth it, but Hunter-Killers are another way to take advantage of Sentinels. Use them for a 6 heavy weapon alpha strike, with just the lascannons in subsequent turns.

I wish I could give my Sentinels multi-meltas like the Elysians. That would be a cool Armored Sentinel role.

The general idea with Scouts is to take LC+Hunter-Killer, and outflank into side armour. 3 Lascannons and 3 hunter-killers will probably net you your points back or close, if you pick a juicy enough target. Yes, they're getting blasted next turn, but even then that's shots not hitting more useful units.

Mavnas wrote:Sentinels can charge right? AV12 into a unit without crack grenades and you should be able to tie them up. Heck even with grenades, they're rolling for 6s, one attack per model.

Against units that can't hurt them, they can choose to fall back, so it's a case of picking something that can hurt them potentially (and therefore can't auto-run) but that won't kill them for a few turns. But yes, the general idea is sound.

So this is what I’m thinking of running for ATC (Foot Guard 2000 pts)

CCS-MoO,Astropath,AutoCannon Team
CCS-MoO,Astropath,AutoCannon Team
Relic of Preferred Enemy

2x Primaris ML2
1x Primaris ML1
3x Priests

Coteaz
Xenos Inq ML1, psychotroke, rad, servo skulls x3
ADL w/LasCannon

PCS 4x Sniper Rifles, Bolter
PCS 4x Sniper Rifles, Bolter

(Priest/Primaris)IS Plasmagun/Power Axe
IS Plasmagun/Power Axe

(Priest/Primaris)IS Plasmagun/Power Axe
IS Plasmagun/Power Axe

(Coteaz) IS Plasmagun/LasCannon
IS Plasmagun/LasCannon
IS Plasmagun/LasCannon

(Priest/Inquisitor Xenos) Conscripts x 41

So here’s my dilemma, do I go with :

A) 3x HWT Lascannons with a Commisar in each to support
This gives me twin linked, ignore cover/monster hunter on a leadership 9
B) 2x Manticores
This gives me 2 twin linked Manticores

Both would have preferred enemy since I would place them close to my CCS I’m thinking the Manticores would pack more punch, while the LasCannons with ignore cover could scalpel necessary vehicles/units?

Hammer vs. Sword I guess

Has anyone used the Wyvern yet? Is it any good or worth taking? I've done a few test rolls and I cant seem to wound anything with it. Am I right in thinking that Eradicator or even another artillery would do its job better?

Zengu wrote:
Has anyone used the Wyvern yet? Is it any good or worth taking? I've done a few test rolls and I cant seem to wound anything with it. Am I right in thinking that Eradicator or even another artillery would do its job better?

Im about to try it tonight. I mean for 60 points, its better than 3 mortars (which are more expensive) but remember for your tests it has rerolls to wound.

I do not expect wonders. The only time I can see it being good is against a unit which has a cover save thats better than its armour save. But yea id like to know how people have done with the unit in an actual battle. If not ill come back in 9 or so hours and let you know.