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What are people's thoughts on Kurov's Aquila? I like the rules, preferred enemy to a tank line would be rad. But 60 points seems a tad expensive.

 Ir0njack wrote:
So, I know it might not be practical but I was thinking hellhound with auger array and deepstriking in flamers to roast the survivors? Mostly for those units camped out in buildings whete the wyvetn cant get to them.

I had an idea on that; Augur array, deep strike troops, then do the shoot+run order to spread the troops out and no invite pie plate to kill,em all come your opponent's turn sounds a good tactics to me.

Ha! I didnt even think of the order part! Drive over to a building, DS in, clear building, order, run in and use now free cover! Jex your brillant! I'm totally trying this against the wife's DE tomorrow.

On a side note,Its a shame that the hydra wont be seeing much table time. I have hands on the kit and its almost so easy to switch the weapons that you dont need magnets.

I think for the Hellhound Auger to deepstrike meltas or plasmas. I mean, you've already got the Inferno cannon right there. I hadn't thought of the shoot+run order for deep strikers. That is really nice for them. You've also got the potential to deep strike close, double tap, and then bug out a bit to make counterassaults more difficult. Even fire, then scuttle behind terrain. FRSRF is probably only really good for larger Scion squads, but isn't bad. I could really see the Split Fire order being useful, it's potentially a way to shut down a couple of tanks with one meltagun going one way and another going somewhere else. A quartet of precision special weapons from the Scion Command Squad could be cool also.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Shoot + run is also great for anybody to contest (or score) an objective. Blast the troops on the objective, run to contest or secure it.

this may be a more "You make the call question/insight"

Deathstrike Missle Launchers + Techniseer "PoTMS"

as I read the rules, Power of the machine spirit reads "The vehicle can fire one more weapon at full BS than normally permitted"

If that is the case first turn I'm dropping 3x 10" Str 10, AP 1 pie plates that ignore cover....

I think the game is thoroughly broken now.

I'm assuming the Techpriest can "Awaken the Machine" while he's embarked in a Chimera. So you give this Chimera an Augur Erray, stick the techpriest in there to continually heal it and give it a couple heavy bolter servitors for cheap additional shots to throw out. You now are buffing your Tanks while giving a mid field deep strike locator beacon equivalent that heals its self.

I've also been thinking about different ways to use Mech-Vets, and I'm wondering if there's an assault role in there.

10 vets, Sgt with power axe and pistol, Heavy Flamer + 2 flamers, 6 shotguns, carapace armor: 110
Priest: 25
Commissar w/ Power Axe: 40
Chimera: 65
Total: 240

So you flat out turn 1, move and get out turn 2, hitting a nearby enemy with 3 flame templates and a bunch of buckshot. Turn 3 you move out and start smoking objective sitters. You're not that scary to, say, Khorne berserkers, but you will beat up an awful lot of stuff, and you score.

Biophysical wrote:
I've also been thinking about different ways to use Mech-Vets, and I'm wondering if there's an assault role in there.

10 vets, Sgt with power axe and pistol, Heavy Flamer + 2 flamers, 6 shotguns, carapace armor: 110
Priest: 25
Commissar w/ Power Axe: 40
Chimera: 65
Total: 240

So you flat out turn 1, move and get out turn 2, hitting a nearby enemy with 3 flame templates and a bunch of buckshot. Turn 3 you move out and start smoking objective sitters. You're not that scary to, say, Khorne berserkers, but you will beat up an awful lot of stuff, and you score.

Meh.

10 Vets, 3 plasma guns, Chimera, Carapace, Priest with Plasma Gun - 225 pts

Doesn't have a confused role, puts out an insane amount of high strength AP2. That's the only way I'd use a Priest, mostly because LD8 can be a complete pain with pinning/25% casualty checks and lose you games, and having that extra firepower is always nice.

That said, I'd maybe field max 2 of the above unit, and in conjuction with an LR group for LOS blocking cover.

I was under the impression the priest could only take a plasma pistol or two, not a plasma gun.

Wait a second... Is it just me or is pask punisher w/ an enginseer just absolutely a disgusting amount of killing power?

Nah the priest can take a autogun or a plasmagun. I'm defiantly gonna run a unit of those vets but I want to try out foot guard more. Gonna have to kitbash me a straken to fit with my Knightworlders. So with PoTMS in, Could it be worth it to put lascannons on the vanilla LRBT? And if we have them babysitting the Russes, servitors with HB or PC? The full four, or just two for the heavy weapons?

 Mr.Omega wrote:

Biophysical wrote:
I've also been thinking about different ways to use Mech-Vets, and I'm wondering if there's an assault role in there.

10 vets, Sgt with power axe and pistol, Heavy Flamer + 2 flamers, 6 shotguns, carapace armor: 110
Priest: 25
Commissar w/ Power Axe: 40
Chimera: 65
Total: 240

So you flat out turn 1, move and get out turn 2, hitting a nearby enemy with 3 flame templates and a bunch of buckshot. Turn 3 you move out and start smoking objective sitters. You're not that scary to, say, Khorne berserkers, but you will beat up an awful lot of stuff, and you score.

Meh.

10 Vets, 3 plasma guns, Chimera, Carapace, Priest with Plasma Gun - 225 pts

Doesn't have a confused role, puts out an insane amount of high strength AP2. That's the only way I'd use a Priest, mostly because LD8 can be a complete pain with pinning/25% casualty checks and lose you games, and having that extra firepower is always nice.

That said, I'd maybe field max 2 of the above unit, and in conjuction with an LR group for LOS blocking cover.

Well, that's the build I suggest on the first page of the thread, and I agree that it's better overall, but sometimes assault can be a useful capability to have.

 Las wrote:
Wait a second... Is it just me or is pask punisher w/ an enginseer just absolutely a disgusting amount of killing power?

Nope, its pretty good. Someone has already managed to bisect a Land Raider with it, but I think that was with the favor of the dice gods. Also word will get around fast about The Pasknisher and it'll more than likely become a fire magnet. But all those shot used on him will not be used on the other guardsmen so..

 Ir0njack wrote:

 Las wrote:
Wait a second... Is it just me or is pask punisher w/ an enginseer just absolutely a disgusting amount of killing power?

Nope, its pretty good. Someone has already managed to bisect a Land Raider with it, but I think that was with the favor of the dice gods. Also word will get around fast about The Pasknisher and it'll more than likely become a fire magnet. But all those shot used on him will not be used on the other guardsmen so..

Good luck to all them's that try to shoot up that 14 AV front armor on turn one. With the hull points in 6th ed, people even have trouble with my chimeras, until they get their bolters on that juicy side armor that is.

 RegulusBlack wrote:
this may be a more "You make the call question/insight"

Deathstrike Missle Launchers + Techniseer "PoTMS"

as I read the rules, Power of the machine spirit reads "The vehicle can fire one more weapon at full BS than normally permitted"

If that is the case first turn I'm dropping 3x 10" Str 10, AP 1 pie plates that ignore cover....

I think the game is thoroughly broken now.

PoTMS doesn't increase the number of times a weapon can fire, only that an additional weapon on a vehicle may fire at full BS rather than snap shooting. So, for example, a Land Raider moves at combat speed, which usually would mean it can only fire one weapon at full BS, with PoTMS it can fire two weapons at full BS and the other weapons must snap fire.

I don't have the AM codex at hand, but I'm pretty sure you can't snap shoot deathstrike missiles turn one, not just because its a blast, but because you can't fire it turn one anyway (unless that's changed).

PoTMS doesn't increase the number of times a weapon can fire, only that an additional weapon on a vehicle may fire at full BS rather than snap shooting. So, for example, a Land Raider moves at combat speed, which usually would mean it can only fire one weapon at full BS, with PoTMS it can fire two weapons at full BS and the other weapons must snap fire.

I don't have the AM codex at hand, but I'm pretty sure you can't snap shoot deathstrike missiles turn one, not just because its a blast, but because you can't fire it turn one anyway (unless that's changed).

You're correct, Deathstrike still can't fire first turn and if PotMS only means you can't snapfire then as far as I'm aware there can be no turn one deathstrike shenanigans.

 Ir0njack wrote:
So, I know it might not be practical but I was thinking hellhound with auger array and deepstriking in flamers to roast the survivors? Mostly for those units camped out in buildings whete the wyvetn cant get to them.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Hollismason wrote:
What are the rules for Psykers they have to be attached to a squad?

The Primaris is a independent character so he can join units, but if you stick him with a commisar dont be suprised if he gets blammed. While the wyrdvanes are a unit unto themselves.

So he's a straight up IC? Does he take up a FOC, or is that another unit that is 0-3.

Basically what's the rules etc.. for Psykers , cause if he's IC... and has access to Divination?

So is it confirmed that Vet Sargeants get access to special weapons?

Because if so, that'd be 5 plasmaguns in a squad, including a priest.

Holy crap, if your warlord is a tank commander he gets three Really REALLY good warlord traits to pick from....Also he is pask(because why the hell not)

D3 units outflank

A unit of leman russes gets prefered enemy

or no morale tests for 25% within 12

That is pretty huge

Also that one piece of wargear that allows you to re-roll leadership tests(so you know, orders.....yea)

I am not seeing anything that prevents you from issuing the same order multiple times(so creed is gonna be more of a monster)

Lord commissars are meh now that they dont use leadership for orders anymore.

Priests are legit with that built in zealot, great for blobs(except against other blobs with all that precision shot).

Primaris lots of Prescience Easily. Cheap level 2 as well for two shots at some of the best powers in the game(4+ invul, full bs overwatch, etc) for IG.

Not sure who I would realistically use POTMS on. Still they are cheap. Maybe run a few in one unit of servitors(so they all get the buffs) and run them behind a leman russ squadron or something?

Scions platoons with the IG orders are interesting. Really depends on if you want the ally slot for something else or not.

Not a fan of the chimera, especially compared to the taurox(then again I am used to razorback/rhino chassis)

IG has access to so much divination as an easy without eating up slots that it seems like a no brainer as allies for things like knights. Also basically all of your barrage weapons are now twinlinked....Sweet jesus for all those ordanance batteries. Imagine the damage from three twin-linked basilisks. OR a manticore....jesus tank armies are gonna be ssscccaaarrryyyy. Also solves the gets hot problem on plasma variants.

Fan of bullgryns with the upgraded shield. Not only will they be big enough to give everything a save(like leman russes, throw camo on them and now they have a 3+, or behind an aegis for a 2+). Also a really powerful counter assault unit. Combine with straken for str 8 on the charge....hot stuff

Creed is looking pretty decent. Have not run the points on a lot of these units yet.

I like Yarrik for his Eternal warrior but also being an IC that can issue two orders. So he can join a blob squad and then issue them orders that they are taking on leadership 10. Throw the psykers in there and they are also testing on leadership 10 for their powers. Pretty solid IMO

The Aquila looks pretty good, not worth 60 pts and being tied to a command squad imo. But basically getting to re-roll orders might be nice. However at that point you might as well get Creed who has built in re-roll orders

Also the wording says detachment for the supplemental characters. Which means I can get three primaris psykers with a IG allied detachment.....legit

Thats all for now, but I am seeing so much potential in this book

That and also, 4 melta guns in the Tempestus Command squad deep striking to hit vehicles. Or just dropping out of Gunships to make it a bit more safe.

With so much divination spam I don't think I'll be using a DA ally detachment anymore. I lose the power field generator but who cares when I have primaris psykers probably dishing out 4+ saves anyway.

Funny thought, not sure how they work yet, but have a unit of psykers rolling biomancy with a priest and a commissar running around assaulting things.

I'm also starting to warm up to the Taurox Prime. Frailty aside it seems like it might be a decent vehicle to spam for it heavy weapons.

Why can Chimeras fire at 4 different targets per turn?

Why can guard get potentially 6 Presciences up per turn?
Why does the aforementioned 6 presciences only cost 330 points?

why?

I don't know whether to fap or cry.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 l0k1 wrote:
With so much divination spam I don't think I'll be using a DA ally detachment anymore. I lose the power field generator but who cares when I have primaris psykers probably didhing out 4+ saves anyway.

Funny thought, not sure how they work yet, but have a unit of psykers rolling biomancy with a priest and commissar running around assaulting things.

I'm also starting to warm up to the Taurox Prime. Frailty aside it seems like it might be a decent vehicle to spam for it heavy weapons.

Do you mean wyrdvanes?

They get one warp power.

Ok, I didn't know if they got extra powers or something. Thanks.

 l0k1 wrote:
Ok, I didn't know if they got extra powers or something. Thanks.

Just have a look at how their Brotherhood of Psykers rule is written - see it says they have ML1? They basically count as one psyker for generating psychic powers.

Also I was looking at conscripts.....They might be a great answer to flying monstrous creatures.

150 points gets you 50

Get in triple tap range from order(throwing a commisar or inq in there)

150 shots 25 hits

4 wounds against t6 and 8 wounds against t5 and a grounding check.

They also make great bubble wrap. You can literally fill the board with so many bodies they cant get in melta or assault range.

Decline a challenge until you want to fail with leadership guys. Or hell get the item that allows you to choose to pass or fail for 25 points.

I think they would make great allies to an Imperial Knights army

3x knights

2x div inq with 3x servo skulls each

Tank commander with plasma and second executioner with plasma

Primaris psyker

2x 25 conscripts, or one x 50.

Got a solid body of dudes to throw your ICs in. All are testing on ld 10 for their powers. Got three shots at 4+ invul. Otherwise three presciences (which would be legit on two of the knights and one on the executioner squad)

Servo skulls to reduce scatter all over the place, especially if you go first.

 Leth wrote:
Also I was looking at conscripts.....They might be a great answer to flying monstrous creatures.

150 points gets you 50

Get in triple tap range from order(throwing a commisar or inq in there)

150 shots 25 hits

4 wounds against t6 and 8 wounds against t5 and a grounding check.

They also make great bubble wrap. You can literally fill the board with so many bodies they cant get in melta or assault range.

Decline a challenge until you want to fail with leadership guys. Or hell get the item that allows you to choose to pass or fail for 25 points.

I think they would make great allies to an Imperial Knights army

3x knights

2x div inq with 3x servo skulls each

Tank commander with plasma and second executioner with plasma

Primaris psyker

2x 25 conscripts, or one x 50.

Got a solid body of dudes to throw your ICs in. All are testing on ld 10 for their powers. Got three shots at 4+ invul. Otherwise three presciences (which would be legit on two of the knights and one on the executioner squad)

Servo skulls to reduce scatter all over the place, especially if you go first.

Lasguns are S3 buddy, you hit T5 and 6 on 6's.

Plus who the gak wants to move 50 infantry, plus all the other stuff you have? That would take FOREVER.

 Scipio Africanus wrote:

 l0k1 wrote:
Ok, I didn't know if they got extra powers or something. Thanks.

Just have a look at how their Brotherhood of Psykers rule is written - see it says they have ML1? They basically count as one psyker for generating psychic powers.

They might have added some sneaky special rule that gave them extra mastery lvls. Had to check. Lol :p

 Leth wrote:
Holy crap, if your warlord is a tank commander he gets three Really REALLY good warlord traits to pick from....Also he is pask(because why the hell not)

D3 units outflank

A unit of leman russes gets prefered enemy

or no morale tests for 25% within 12

That is pretty huge

Also that one piece of wargear that allows you to re-roll leadership tests(so you know, orders.....yea)

I am not seeing anything that prevents you from issuing the same order multiple times(so creed is gonna be more of a monster)

Lord commissars are meh now that they dont use leadership for orders anymore.

Priests are legit with that built in zealot, great for blobs(except against other blobs with all that precision shot).

Primaris lots of Prescience Easily. Cheap level 2 as well for two shots at some of the best powers in the game(4+ invul, full bs overwatch, etc) for IG.

Not sure who I would realistically use POTMS on. Still they are cheap. Maybe run a few in one unit of servitors(so they all get the buffs) and run them behind a leman russ squadron or something?

Scions platoons with the IG orders are interesting. Really depends on if you want the ally slot for something else or not.

Not a fan of the chimera, especially compared to the taurox(then again I am used to razorback/rhino chassis)

IG has access to so much divination as an easy without eating up slots that it seems like a no brainer as allies for things like knights. Also basically all of your barrage weapons are now twinlinked....Sweet jesus for all those ordanance batteries. Imagine the damage from three twin-linked basilisks. OR a manticore....jesus tank armies are gonna be ssscccaaarrryyyy. Also solves the gets hot problem on plasma variants.

Fan of bullgryns with the upgraded shield. Not only will they be big enough to give everything a save(like leman russes, throw camo on them and now they have a 3+, or behind an aegis for a 2+). Also a really powerful counter assault unit. Combine with straken for str 8 on the charge....hot stuff

Creed is looking pretty decent. Have not run the points on a lot of these units yet.

I like Yarrik for his Eternal warrior but also being an IC that can issue two orders. So he can join a blob squad and then issue them orders that they are taking on leadership 10. Throw the psykers in there and they are also testing on leadership 10 for their powers. Pretty solid IMO

The Aquila looks pretty good, not worth 60 pts and being tied to a command squad imo. But basically getting to re-roll orders might be nice. However at that point you might as well get Creed who has built in re-roll orders

Also the wording says detachment for the supplemental characters. Which means I can get three primaris psykers with a IG allied detachment.....legit

Thats all for now, but I am seeing so much potential in this book

Bullgryns+ Leman Russ Tanks + Allied Dark Angel Land Speeder Shroud?

2+ cover saves on Leman Russ Tanks, consistently. Hmm.

Has anyone noticed that a pask punisher is now one of if not the best anti tank in the game?

With PotMS you can even have the pask punisher cannon fire at a tank and have the HB and the other punishers in the unit fire at infantry. You can even TL the unit for 50 pts.

The chimera fire ports is actually a buff against FMC lists. You now can target 3 FMC a turn with a single chimera to force more grounding checks. You can also buff a single unit to do so.

The new orders are huge. Vox didn't get better but now getting an order off reliably became both harder (lord commissar doesn't give his Ld to all units within range for orders) and much more important as the orders are vastly more powerful.

All the major list types took huge leaps toward becoming more viable and more interesting.

Infantry gained the damage potential to actually matter through orders and powers.

Mechanized cost about the same overall but gained more grounding chances, psychic powers, tank commanders, and PotMS. They even gained their own orders.

Even aircav, though it became more expensive, the actual contents of the planes became much better and more damaging. The units to put down on the board for first turn also got much better.

I am even seeing where ogryn in a priest + primaris star could be really interesting.