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As a dark angels player I decided to mull over my codex and come up with a self made errata of what I think could be done to the da codex to make them more competitive in 6th edition without going overboard into the land of broken things and op megabuilds

So here I go and feel free to discuss and offer suggestions of your own ill try and explain each change as I go:

Hq:

Asmodai:

Veterans can now be taken as troops choices if he is your warlord.

I feel asmodai and chaplains in general are overlooked as hq's in every sm army. This makes him look more tempting; If only just. And it would also make veterans be more eye-catching

Troops

Scouts

May take a rocket launcher with krakk or frag missile 10points

May no longer take flakk missles

Not like they were using them anyway.

Fast attack:

Assault marines

If a squad numbers less than six models and they remove their jump packs they may take a razorback as a dedicated transport for a reduced cost 20 pts

This is simply adding options to assault marines

Nephilim jet fighter:

Avenger mega bolter is now stock
Reduce points cost by 15 points
May switch megabolter for twin linked lascannon (free)

This makes the nephilim more appealing without reducing the price to the point where it becomes a no brainer

Dark talon

Reduce cost by 10pts

Again more tempting to take one

Edit:

Belial:

Belial May no longer take a thunder hammer from the melee weapons list

Toughness value improved by 1

I want to give deathwing users some thinking to do beyond slapping a th/ss on him and calling it an evening

Company master:

Reduce cost by 5 points

Makes him more viable as an hq for low point games

Chaplain:

Reduce cost by 10 points

See company master

Azreal:

May only be taken in armies valued over 1499points

This looks like a nerf but it is actually a buff. I feel azreal becomes more useful with high point armies than 1450

Fast attack:

Land speeder dark shroud

Unit type changed to elite

This is for fluff purposes. Dark shrouds are precious and rare relics of the chapter. Their hardly expendable like normal land speeders are. This change reflects that

Heavy support

Devestator squad

Increase base point cost by 20 points

The base four devestators marines all get a heavy bolter free with additional bolters being 10 points per additional devestator marine

This makes the devestator squad look a little more appetizing as a base unit instead of the points sink it is now. Currently 5 man squads cost 70 + 40 for a basic loadout meaning 4 hb devestators cost more than a predator ac/hb. This makes it more reasonable

Ranged weapon profiles:

Black sword missle

Ordinance 1, one use only, blast

Again this helps the nephilim out

There I'm done

Tac Marines with heavy bolters have +1BS over Scouts, their guns should be more expensive. As for the Nephilim all it really needs is S7 on the mega-bolter, you do that and it's a fine plane.

My thoughts:

I like what you suggest with Asmodai, taking veteran squads as troops would probably be more fluff that competitive, but I see nothing wrong with that.

I think lowering HB to 8 pts is good, it should also apply to MS and flakk upgrade should be reduced (across the board for all armies).

The nephelim jet fighter would still be vastly over priced at 165 points.

Comparing to a IG vendetta, has BS3 but 3 twin-linked LC (yes thrice the weapon power) for merely 110 points (i think) and of top of that, is a 10 man transport!!! I think that flyer is greatly under-priced.
Comparing to the vanilla SM stormtalon gunship is 110 without upgrades.

So here is what I think the Nephilim should be like:
Cost: 135 points
2 twin-linked LC
May add one of the following:
- 6 Blacksword missiles, str 8 ap 3..........................15 pts
- 4 Skyespear missiles, str 7, savant lock, ap 2.... 15 pts
- Avenger megabolter...................................................10 pts

This makes it possible to kit out your flyer for expert anti-tank, anti-flier or anti-infantry, or just skip the upgrades for a balanced anti-flier/tank duty.

flodihn wrote:
My thoughts:

I like what you suggest with Asmodai, taking veteran squads as troops would probably be more fluff that competitive, but I see nothing wrong with that.

I think lowering HB to 8 pts is good, it should also apply to MS and flakk upgrade should be reduced (across the board for all armies).

The nephelim jet fighter would still be vastly over priced at 165 points.

Comparing to a IG vendetta, has BS3 but 3 twin-linked LC (yes thrice the weapon power) for merely 110 points (i think) and of top of that, is a 10 man transport!!! I think that flyer is greatly under-priced.
Comparing to the vanilla SM stormtalon gunship is 110 without upgrades.

So here is what I think the Nephilim should be like:
Cost: 135 points
2 twin-linked LC
May add one of the following:
- 6 Blacksword missiles, str 8 ap 3..........................15 pts
- 4 Skyespear missiles, str 7, savant lock, ap 2.... 15 pts
- Avenger megabolter...................................................10 pts

This makes it possible to kit out your flyer for expert anti-tank, anti-flier or anti-infantry, or just skip the upgrades for a balanced anti-flier/tank duty.

in the New ig codex a vendetta is 170 now and it only carries six. So it's actually a lot more reasonable than you think. Also the nephilim has a free tl hb.

 ionusx wrote:

in the New ig codex a vendetta is 170 now and it only carries six. So it's actually a lot more reasonable than you think. Also the nephilim has a free tl hb.

Is it good GW understood how OP that was and are about to fix it (and hopefully they will fix the rest of the whole flier situation).

flodihn wrote:

 ionusx wrote:

in the New ig codex a vendetta is 170 now and it only carries six. So it's actually a lot more reasonable than you think. Also the nephilim has a free tl hb.

Is it good GW understood how OP that was and are about to fix it (and hopefully they will fix the rest of the whole flier situation).

yeah but now pask and master of munitions became borderline broken. Pask can now insta kill barebones teq's from his trusty leman russ and it's now even cheaper to dakka spam with guard.

All they really trade was one powerful unit for another set of two less broken ones.

Anyway what do you think of my updated errata?

Not to mention the problem of giving everyone up and Ignores Cover (someone didn't learn their lesson from Markerlights) in the new Orders.

Missile launchers with flakk are expensive because they're at least somewhat effective against absolutely every target in the game, if you want to drop the price I'd suggest swapping Flakk for one of the existing profiles instead of taking it on top of the other two. Regardless of what else you do to the Nephilim the mega-bolter really needs to be S7 for it to be an effective air-to-air vehicle.

 AnomanderRake wrote:
Not to mention the problem of giving everyone up and Ignores Cover (someone didn't learn their lesson from Markerlights) in the new Orders.

Missile launchers with flakk are expensive because they're at least somewhat effective against absolutely every target in the game, if you want to drop the price I'd suggest swapping Flakk for one of the existing profiles instead of taking it on top of the other two. Regardless of what else you do to the Nephilim the mega-bolter really needs to be S7 for it to be an effective air-to-air vehicle.

I'm trying to also add needs in this errata. Codec er's aren't always buffs and I felt this took out a silly option. On a unit that wouldn't probably ever get flakk missles unless you were trying to stuff points into an army list over 1250. Right now da is one of their two introductory armies. And so nobody is super expective for da players to be seasoned players. On top of that their scouts.. Their flimsy back liners and points fillers. If you want my opinion you would be stupid giving flakk missles to anyone that wasn't a devestator or a tactical marine.

Finally the nephilim is a better air to ground target fluff wise. And it only goes air to air if it's needed. Making the blackstorm missles a tiny pieplate let's you break up blobs and units trying to create a new defensive position if they've been broken. The avenger is ment to assist with that too. They tl lc is ment to assist the missile in popping light tanks.

Ill dwell on it more but I think it's fine as is

 AnomanderRake wrote:
Tac Marines with heavy bolters have +1BS over Scouts, their guns should be more expensive. As for the Nephilim all it really needs is S7 on the mega-bolter, you do that and it's a fine plane.

The other Avenger mega-bolter has the exact same stats, but it has AP3. Making it Ap3 would be more in keeping with the Avenger Strike Fighter.

I think a good fix for the Nephilim would be to not only give those missiles concussive, but also give Nephy shrouded the turn after they're fired, to represent the huge plumes of black smoke that those missiles purportedly fire.

 ionusx wrote:

 AnomanderRake wrote:
Not to mention the problem of giving everyone up and Ignores Cover (someone didn't learn their lesson from Markerlights) in the new Orders.

Missile launchers with flakk are expensive because they're at least somewhat effective against absolutely every target in the game, if you want to drop the price I'd suggest swapping Flakk for one of the existing profiles instead of taking it on top of the other two. Regardless of what else you do to the Nephilim the mega-bolter really needs to be S7 for it to be an effective air-to-air vehicle.

I'm trying to also add needs in this errata. Codec er's aren't always buffs and I felt this took out a silly option. On a unit that wouldn't probably ever get flakk missles unless you were trying to stuff points into an army list over 1250. Right now da is one of their two introductory armies. And so nobody is super expective for da players to be seasoned players. On top of that their scouts.. Their flimsy back liners and points fillers. If you want my opinion you would be stupid giving flakk missles to anyone that wasn't a devestator or a tactical marine.

Finally the nephilim is a better air to ground target fluff wise. And it only goes air to air if it's needed. Making the blackstorm missles a tiny pieplate let's you break up blobs and units trying to create a new defensive position if they've been broken. The avenger is ment to assist with that too. They tl lc is ment to assist the missile in popping light tanks.

Ill dwell on it more but I think it's fine as is

Every other missile launcher, even the Eldar one, gets Flakk missiles even if GW doesn't seem to realize that they're grotesquely over-costed.

Removing them from Scouts seems like change for the sake of it.

Also, please use proper grammar, whenever I see "u" in place of "you" I have to fight the urge to stop reading and click out.

Overall your changes seem to actually make the DAs worse in some places and give very tepid fixes in others.

The Dark Angels are still going to be an all ravenwing/guard allies all the time game in competitive play.

Also your points reductions for terminally overcosted units are snigger inducingly tiny.

And your change to Belial just makes an already bad character even worse. +1 toughness, woohoo. Except not because he already costs a bundle and unlocks one of the worst builds in the game so you may as well want to kill something with him.

No seriously, Deathwing is atrocious, tied with Mono-khorne and only sitting above Synapseless Tyranids.

As for the fliers; even with their tepid points costs I wouldn't take them because they're so lacking in killing power. I'd rather just ally in an Avenger strike fighter or some Vendettas and call it a day.

The Assault marines are still terrible because you've changed none of the reasons that Assault Marines and Raptors generally are bad buys.

All your changes have done is...

Actually your changes change nothing as I was using Ravenwing with Mortis dreads and IG Allies in serious games anyway.

 ionusx wrote:

 AnomanderRake wrote:
Not to mention the problem of giving everyone up and Ignores Cover (someone didn't learn their lesson from Markerlights) in the new Orders.

Missile launchers with flakk are expensive because they're at least somewhat effective against absolutely every target in the game, if you want to drop the price I'd suggest swapping Flakk for one of the existing profiles instead of taking it on top of the other two. Regardless of what else you do to the Nephilim the mega-bolter really needs to be S7 for it to be an effective air-to-air vehicle.

I'm trying to also add needs in this errata. Codec er's aren't always buffs and I felt this took out a silly option. On a unit that wouldn't probably ever get flakk missles unless you were trying to stuff points into an army list over 1250. Right now da is one of their two introductory armies. And so nobody is super expective for da players to be seasoned players. On top of that their scouts.. Their flimsy back liners and points fillers. If you want my opinion you would be stupid giving flakk missles to anyone that wasn't a devestator or a tactical marine.

Finally the nephilim is a better air to ground target fluff wise. And it only goes air to air if it's needed. Making the blackstorm missles a tiny pieplate let's you break up blobs and units trying to create a new defensive position if they've been broken. The avenger is ment to assist with that too. They tl lc is ment to assist the missile in popping light tanks.

Ill dwell on it more but I think it's fine as is

I'm confused. You're saying make the native air-to-air plane, which already sucks at air-to-air, even worse at air-to-air in order to make it better at air-to-ground because fluffwise it's more of an air-to-ground unit? I thought we were trying to fix the DA here, not create yet another Codex that's unplayable until you bring in Guard allies?