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 Vineheart01 wrote:
BS3 is not bad. Its a 50% hit chance. Kinda blows on a single shot but given that the shot is a S8 AP3 Skyfire shot that automatically immobilizes on hit its fair. The ability only affects fliers and FMC but the strength is enough to hurt ground things in the end.....problem is skyfire instead of a special rule so snappage time!

Not sure if i'll bring any though. Unless thats our only viable AA that is, which i hope not. Bring a battery of those theyre going to get focus fired like hell - and big guns arent really hard to kill, they just take dedication you usually dont want to put towards them because they arent worth it. Traktor guns WOULD be worth the attention lol.

Traktor guns are the least of your enemies worries when the rest of your lines consist of::

3 battlewagons, with meganobz, warboss, big mek with kff, burna boyz, and regular boyz in them spread around
lootas, lootas everywhere
nobz on bikes
kan walls for days.

Orks are too killey up close to focus your firepower trying to remove 30 T7 wounds.

Why not just use the FW Grot Tanks? You get 4 and the Mek Gun is such a 'little' gun and uses grots anyway, so you really might as well make the switch.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
BS3 is not bad. Its a 50% hit chance. Kinda blows on a single shot but given that the shot is a S8 AP3 Skyfire shot that automatically immobilizes on hit its fair. The ability only affects fliers and FMC but the strength is enough to hurt ground things in the end.....problem is skyfire instead of a special rule so snappage time!

Not sure if i'll bring any though. Unless thats our only viable AA that is, which i hope not. Bring a battery of those theyre going to get focus fired like hell - and big guns arent really hard to kill, they just take dedication you usually dont want to put towards them because they arent worth it. Traktor guns WOULD be worth the attention lol.

Well you could use a unit of three kustom mega blastas and only one traktor

That's a bad idea, blast weapons can't snap fire, so they do literally nothing when the traktor is shooting fliers. Better use bunch of cheap kannons instead.

Rakdosgobo wrote:
Why not just use the FW Grot Tanks? You get 4 and the Mek Gun is such a 'little' gun and uses grots anyway, so you really might as well make the switch.

What book are the Grot Tank stats in ?

I've been pondering buying and scratchbuilding some

The most recent ones can be found in Imperial Armour: Apocalypse. Make sure you get the 2013 version, as there like five books with similar, if not identical names.

KMK's are a small blast. Putting them with a traktor would be the worst point-sink this unit can do lol. Either the traktor is firing snaps, or firing solo.

Buncha normal Kannons on the other hand would work, or Zzap guns, as theyre cheaper and have solid shots so they can snapfire.

Are these guns the first models you end up paying more than a dollar per point?

They are certainly the lest efficient in terms of the dollar/point ratio.

 Nightlord1987 wrote:
Looks like the teeny tiny Ork warbuggies might be usable here. Just yank off the dwarf orks inside, and bolt on a spare Big Gunz bit instead of the pointless twin-linked big shoota.

We're orks. I have no doubt that every gun can be manufactured somehow.

By George you're right! I wasn't sure I wanted to mangle my few plastic Warbuggies, but I do have a bunch of the old metal ones, and I doubt I'll ever get around to actually assembling the old 2nd edition Orks I have as a 2nd edition Ork army (I have too many other projects). Some of them already have plasma cannons (kustom mega-blasta), and IIRC the main platform has a hole in the back that looks like you could hook it up to something to be dragged. It's a perfect platform.


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 adamsouza wrote:

Rakdosgobo wrote:
Why not just use the FW Grot Tanks? You get 4 and the Mek Gun is such a 'little' gun and uses grots anyway, so you really might as well make the switch.

What book are the Grot Tank stats in ?

I've been pondering buying and scratchbuilding some

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/d/Dred_Mob.pdf

Look under Fast Attack. Though note that they're Elites in an Ork army that includes a Big Mek.

Thanks Eric!!! That was jsut what I was looking for.

Models cost money to manufacture you know. Its not like because its so cheap on the tabletop, the plastic and gak suddenly becomes cheaper too.

That said, GW overcharges on everything, so they should show a little common sense here.

These guns look fun. I'll certainly buy one, then kit-bash a couple more.

At least the GW pricing is healthier than ever for the third-party companies like Kromlech.

The shokk attack gun price is what flabbergasts me.

Hell, the Kromlech MANZ might actually be cheaper than the plastics when they come out, which would be funny for resin vs. plastic.

I fear it will just encourage thrid party companies to charge more.

Why? I mean, sure there could be some select donkey-caves, but when the company that allows them to exist is automatically making their prices more competitive by charging more and more, which has traditionally been the stepping stone for small companies, seems like work is being done for them if they stay priced as they are and just advertise.

When you take the cost of crew into account, GW are still cheaper than the competition.

I haven't figured out any way to get acceptable looking grot crew for under £2.00 each, so there's at least £12 'worth' of models in the box before you even count the gun.

Perhaps you could lower your standards of what constitutes "acceptable looking." They're grotz, they go squish just as good even if they're holding guns instead of equipment.

I could, but I get a lot of satisfaction out of the building and painting elements of the hobby and I'd rather not compromise those for the sake of having a slightly cheaper unit to play with.

I just ordered a bunch of Gnoblar bits, which I think should work OK as crew once I've swapped a few heads and exchanged weapons for tools.

i dont even see a difference in quality between the GW plastic ones and the FW grots/gretchin. Only difference i can actually tell without studying the model is what theyre carrying, which can easily be modified with a blob of greenstuff and a saw if you really want him carrying a shell instead of an oversized pea shooter lol

 Vineheart01 wrote:
i dont even see a difference in quality between the GW plastic ones and the FW grots/gretchin. Only difference i can actually tell without studying the model is what theyre carrying, which can easily be modified with a blob of greenstuff and a saw if you really want him carrying a shell instead of an oversized pea shooter lol

What they are carrying is exactly the issue. They are obviously infantry, not gun crew.

Half the grots in the gretchin box are in poses which make them unsuitable for converting easily, with guns held across their bodies. The others often need replacement hands and new equipment, which increases the cost to the point that just buying the FW crew looks like the easier option.

Even the forgeworld big gunz are cheaper...

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/Orks/ORK_VEHICLES/ORK-KILL-KANNON.html

Except the plastic kit gives you a wheeled gun carriage, three more crew than the FW gun and three spare guns. Once you've added the cost of wheels to the FW kit, you're already around the same price as the plastic kit. And then you have to scratch-build a carriage, which is half the effort of just scratch building the entire gun.

Kromlech guns and crew are even more expensive, although at least they come with a carriage. Kromlech guns with FW crew are slightly cheaper than the GW plastic kit, but give you no spare parts and require two mail-order deliveries rather than just popping in to your local GW.

I'm not saying that the GW kit is a bargain by any means. It's far too expensive for me to justify buying several to make a battery. I'm only planning to buy one because I can then loot the bits and kitbash them into a whole battery of mega-kannons. But it isn't any more expensive than the alternatives.

Just finished my first Kustom Mega-kannon with two crew.

I can never make plasticard constructions that clean. Well done! Definitely qualifies as a bigger than average kannon

 Perfect Organism wrote:
Except the plastic kit gives you a wheeled gun carriage, three more crew than the FW gun and three spare guns. Once you've added the cost of wheels to the FW kit, you're already around the same price as the plastic kit. And then you have to scratch-build a carriage, which is half the effort of just scratch building the entire gun.

Kromlech guns and crew are even more expensive, although at least they come with a carriage. Kromlech guns with FW crew are slightly cheaper than the GW plastic kit, but give you no spare parts and require two mail-order deliveries rather than just popping in to your local GW.

I'm not saying that the GW kit is a bargain by any means. It's far too expensive for me to justify buying several to make a battery. I'm only planning to buy one because I can then loot the bits and kitbash them into a whole battery of mega-kannons. But it isn't any more expensive than the alternatives.

Well that is a fresh perspective, instead of the hate and escapegoat lookings to GW, you think on solutions and make them possible, neither i am approving the price of the new kit, but to be a little fair we have to wacht that they are using new and more expensive techniques to create this new models that excel on detail and materials, several of the new kits are very flexibles on customization and, on the hobby side they seem fair: a nice model to paint and put on the exhibition shelf, and as a collector you only want one or two to have some variety. of course the situation change on the game side but even we have solution and options like comvertions and scracht built

I totally want to field two batteries of five mek guns each, but with that kind of money I could:
1) buy a 1750 point Black Templar army
2) buy a warmachine army and rulebook for myself and a friend
3) have a professional painter finish my entire army
4) buy every single game sold on steam during the next sale
5) make a 6 day trip to Spain
6) buy one of those coffee machines that grinds the coffee beans itself
7) watch 10 movies with another person (including popcorn and drinks)
etc...

That's how ridiculously stupid expensive they are.

Also, for all of you who are talking about scratch building them, or using the old Kannons (And I'm among you, because I'm in the middle of scratch building 9 of them), keep in mind, if you are going to tourneys, or playing competitive in your local store, that you could conceivably be accused of "Modeling to Advantage" with your significantly smaller kannons. The new Mek Gunz appear to be at least twice the size of the previous gunz, and my scratch built kannons are almost exactly the size of the old GW kannons.

Old model rule allows the use of the old kannons as long as they are the legit models, unless they removed that rule which i doubt (was kinda tucked away at the beginning of the book so kinda hard to spot). All you had to do was rebase them, and far as i can tell theres still no base.

Custom ones, yea you might need to rebuild them. Thats why i want to buy one both so i can say "This is the official one in all its coolness" and build the rest to scale.
Glad i never finished my custom kannons yet. Going to re-steal their wheels and barrels so i can build a larger chassis to house them.

EDIT: They got rid of that rule.....are you serious? i cant find anything talking about old models.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Old model rule allows the use of the old kannons as long as they are the legit models, unless they removed that rule which i doubt (was kinda tucked away at the beginning of the book so kinda hard to spot). All you had to do was rebase them, and far as i can tell theres still no base.

Custom ones, yea you might need to rebuild them. Thats why i want to buy one both so i can say "This is the official one in all its coolness" and build the rest to scale.
Glad i never finished my custom kannons yet. Going to re-steal their wheels and barrels so i can build a larger chassis to house them.

EDIT: They got rid of that rule.....are you serious? i cant find anything talking about old models.

Not surprising. I wouldn't have put it past them to slip the rule in that you MUST play with GW models only.

I think they look decent as models, and have really good rules that feel orky, and actually do stuff!

great AA on the tractors, that is some niiiiiiice stuf to have in a meta where not only is WS spam THE army to beat, but now people are taking more air power to counter knights and super heavies.

price wize, for the size of the kits its not THAT bad... I am hard pressed to find a box at GW that is 50$+, so its par for the course, and they need to keep the lights on.