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darkcloak wrote:
Indulge me for a moment.


Also, what about the Warboss? I got him in a trade through the swap shop and at first I didn't like him, but now I just wanna clomp him around the table. He weighs like 5lbs I swear! How does he fare in the new codex as he is? He's armed with an Attack Squig, a Combi Burna and a Bosspole it looks like.

He should have at least a power claw. Generally speaking a Warboss should either be wearing Mega Armour, or be on a bike.

Yeah thats the issue with the old metal boss sadly. You can convert him into a MANz boss with some plasticard and various orky platy bits fairly easily so he'll retain that weight factor you like, but the only other option of warbosses that work is on a bike and GL with that lol. I have the old metal boss with big choppa, i actually broke my tools trying to get that loincloth thingy off his pants so he could sit on a bike lol

What's the consensus on which boyz are better to run in trukks, slugga or shoota? Need to know considering I'm thinking of buying 100 boyz of either or for my mass trukk list.

 Spartan089 wrote:
What's the consensus on which boyz are better to run in trukks, slugga or shoota? Need to know considering I'm thinking of buying 100 boyz of either or for my mass trukk list.

Depends on what you plan for them to do. If I take Trukk Boyz, It's to put pressure on my opponent by threatening them with CC. So, I'll take them all with Slugga/Choppas with Nob/Klaw/Bosspole. Especially now with the Shoota tax, it keeps the squad cheap, but it is still threatening with 4 attacks per Boy on the charge, and of course the unsavory Klaw headed their way too.

If you plan on using them as just a pesky bullet platform, then go ahead and load up with Shootas and scoot about. Just don't expect the Trukk to keep them very safe. Shootas best serve in a BW so they have something sturdy to keep them going, and you can bring up to 20 Shootas instead of only a meager 12 (11 if you bring a Nob to keep them in line). But, this can be a major point sink due to BW costs and their odd shape, meaning you have to be perfect with positioning the Wagon to get the best armor protection possible, or that easy to hit side arc will mess your day up.

I find that low units such as those in trukks tend to favor sluggachoppa even in 6th. Now with the price hike on shootas, even more so. And the run + charge on waaagh and reroll 1 die on charge.

Bigger thought with trukks is what else are you bringing. If the trukks are your main force, youre wasting your time. I have fairly good luck, before the 7th changes btw as i havent even touched my orks since 7th, getting my trukks across the table in 1 turn when i have something thats a lot more dangerous looking and/or durable thats in the way....namely bikers or stormboyz.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
I find that low units such as those in trukks tend to favor sluggachoppa even in 6th. Now with the price hike on shootas, even more so. And the run + charge on waaagh and reroll 1 die on charge.

Bigger thought with trukks is what else are you bringing. If the trukks are your main force, youre wasting your time. I have fairly good luck, before the 7th changes btw as i havent even touched my orks since 7th, getting my trukks across the table in 1 turn when i have something thats a lot more dangerous looking and/or durable thats in the way....namely bikers or stormboyz.

In my games thus far, even before 7th, and the few 7th I've played, Trukks are such a viable distraction from the rest of my force, so in that respect, they are simply amazing, even if they still pop to a mild breeze. I only own 4 of them sadly, wish I had at least one more. With those running up 2 feet in a turn, it really FORCES your opponent to respond, depending on their own lists of course.

I still sport Kanz as often as I can. I do love the buggers. So any shots not going for them is a bonus, same goes with my biker units, while my other foot bound Boyz follow up to camp objectives. If they ignore the Trukks in favor of Kanz or Bikes, then thats a promised CC on my following turn, allowing me to tangle up a shooty unit for a turn, and POSSIBLY kill it too if Gork & Mork favor my dice and curse my opponents.

Even with the tweaks, I feel Trukks are still such a staple (At least, for me anyway). It's no BW spam, thats for sure, but it still makes your opponent question their turn...waste a round of shooting trying to pop those Trukks, or hit the scarier stuff out back?

And with my Morkanaught (Aka, Steve) on the way, my Trukks should get even more survival if they choose to try to glance the Naught to death (IF they can with the KFF, Riggers, and Mek(s) inside)

 Vineheart01 wrote:
I find that low units such as those in trukks tend to favor sluggachoppa even in 6th. Now with the price hike on shootas, even more so. And the run + charge on waaagh and reroll 1 die on charge.

Bigger thought with trukks is what else are you bringing. If the trukks are your main force, youre wasting your time. I have fairly good luck, before the 7th changes btw as i havent even touched my orks since 7th, getting my trukks across the table in 1 turn when i have something thats a lot more dangerous looking and/or durable thats in the way....namely bikers or stormboyz.

Right now I'm think my list will look something like this for 2000pts range

1 battle wagon with Boss and mega Nobz
2 trukks with 5 Burnas each
6 trukks with boyz
15 war buggies
3 looted wagons

 Spartan089 wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
I find that low units such as those in trukks tend to favor sluggachoppa even in 6th. Now with the price hike on shootas, even more so. And the run + charge on waaagh and reroll 1 die on charge.

Bigger thought with trukks is what else are you bringing. If the trukks are your main force, youre wasting your time. I have fairly good luck, before the 7th changes btw as i havent even touched my orks since 7th, getting my trukks across the table in 1 turn when i have something thats a lot more dangerous looking and/or durable thats in the way....namely bikers or stormboyz.

Right now I'm think my list will look something like this for 2000pts range

1 battle wagon with Bois and mega Nobz
2 trukks with 5 Burnas each
6 trukks with boyz
15 war buggies
3 looted wagons

You can't mingle Mega Nobz and Boys in one wagon, as they can't be part of the same unit. Unless you meant 1 wagon with Boyz, and a different wagon for Mega Nobz?

Do wrecking balls hit on a 5+ now?

Trucks seem scary if orks get the first turn, less so if they get blown up by an alpha strike.

If an opponent goes first with agun line the only thing I can think of is to reserve all of the trucks and go to ground with t7 grot artillery.

Melevolence wrote:

 Spartan089 wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
I find that low units such as those in trukks tend to favor sluggachoppa even in 6th. Now with the price hike on shootas, even more so. And the run + charge on waaagh and reroll 1 die on charge.

Bigger thought with trukks is what else are you bringing. If the trukks are your main force, youre wasting your time. I have fairly good luck, before the 7th changes btw as i havent even touched my orks since 7th, getting my trukks across the table in 1 turn when i have something thats a lot more dangerous looking and/or durable thats in the way....namely bikers or stormboyz.

Right now I'm think my list will look something like this for 2000pts range

1 battle wagon with Bois and mega Nobz
2 trukks with 5 Burnas each
6 trukks with boyz
15 war buggies
3 looted wagons

You can't mingle Mega Nobz and Boys in one wagon, as they can't be part of the same unit. Unless you meant 1 wagon with Boyz, and a different wagon for Mega Nobz?

it was supposed to be boss* damn auto correct.

 Spartan089 wrote:

Melevolence wrote:

 Spartan089 wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
I find that low units such as those in trukks tend to favor sluggachoppa even in 6th. Now with the price hike on shootas, even more so. And the run + charge on waaagh and reroll 1 die on charge.

Bigger thought with trukks is what else are you bringing. If the trukks are your main force, youre wasting your time. I have fairly good luck, before the 7th changes btw as i havent even touched my orks since 7th, getting my trukks across the table in 1 turn when i have something thats a lot more dangerous looking and/or durable thats in the way....namely bikers or stormboyz.

Right now I'm think my list will look something like this for 2000pts range

1 battle wagon with Bois and mega Nobz
2 trukks with 5 Burnas each
6 trukks with boyz
15 war buggies
3 looted wagons

You can't mingle Mega Nobz and Boys in one wagon, as they can't be part of the same unit. Unless you meant 1 wagon with Boyz, and a different wagon for Mega Nobz?

it was supposed to be boss* damn auto correct.

XD No worries brah! Just be careful with the Megaboss, as he will Slow & Purposeful the entire squad as well, so if the Wagon pops, they might be in some trouble XD

 Spartan089 wrote:
What's the consensus on which boyz are better to run in trukks, slugga or shoota? Need to know considering I'm thinking of buying 100 boyz of either or for my mass trukk list.

I am not sure on any vehicles any more they all seem like death traps with the new mob rule. Trukk blows up lose half your boys, take a pinning check and if you fail lose more boys, now you lost over 25% take another ld test if you fail lose even more boys hopefully they don't have allot of models that cause fear or moral tests. Seems like there is a chance you might kill more of your own models than you opponent =P . Maybe if you take a gak ton of trukks or BW's. I need some more games to tell for sure but I am thinking of bikes and stormboyz for sure then you might force your opponent to shoot at them instead of your vehicles for a turn or two.

I made up a quick 2000pt list based around a Stormboy/Trukk rush. Hopefully there is enough fast movers in there to split the opponents fire and let a bit get through. Big gunz are in support to crack tanks, flyers and any heavy hitters you don;t want your boyz getting tangled up with.



Thoughts?

pepe5454 wrote:

 Spartan089 wrote:
What's the consensus on which boyz are better to run in trukks, slugga or shoota? Need to know considering I'm thinking of buying 100 boyz of either or for my mass trukk list.

I am not sure on any vehicles any more they all seem like death traps with the new mob rule. Trukk blows up lose half your boys, take a pinning check and if you fail lose more boys, now you lost over 25% take another ld test if you fail lose even more boys hopefully they don't have allot of models that cause fear or moral tests. Seems like there is a chance you might kill more of your own models than you opponent =P . Maybe if you take a gak ton of trukks or BW's. I need some more games to tell for sure but I am thinking of bikes and stormboyz for sure then you might force your opponent to shoot at them instead of your vehicles for a turn or two.

It always seems worse on paper and when our minds make up the worst case scenarios possible in order to justify that something is bad. Trukks are still worth taking. With Ramshackle giving us a chance at least not to lose any guys, we can still make out good. Also, with Ard Armor, you can shrug off those explosion hits fairly easily. Nob with Bosspole should keep them in line, again shrugging off hits with Ard Armor.

Even if you don't use armor, and your opponent focuses on your dirt cheap trukk, thats less shots aimed at your important things. And that, I'm OK with. Every shot not fired at my Kanz, or soon to arrive Naught, the better. Leave my Big Gunz alone like a fool, and take out my Trukks like a silly man. Trukks, in my bottom line, are threat saturation, and cheap ways to keep fire off everything else, as my opponent knows they can't shoot if those Boyz tie them up. Even one turn of no shooting will hurt them. Any turn my large blobs of angry Boyz get of free running with no casualties is good in my book.

I wouldn't bother with Storm Boyz unless you got Zag to get them to deep strike. Thats how you REALLY get them to focus fire on them, Otherwise, they will just pie plate you before you even get to lift off.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Killbles wrote:
I made up a quick 2000pt list based around a Stormboy/Trukk rush. Hopefully there is enough fast movers in there to split the opponents fire and let a bit get through. Big gunz are in support to crack tanks, flyers and any heavy hitters you don;t want your boyz getting tangled up with.

Spoiler:

Hq
Warboss
Warbike
Power Klaw
Da Finkin' Cap
120

Painboy
Warbike
75

Troops
12 Boyz
Nob w/ Power Klaw and Bosspole
Trukk
142

12 Boyz
Nob w/ Power Klaw and Bosspole
Trukk
142

12 Boyz
Nob w/ Power Klaw and Bosspole
Trukk
142

12 Boyz
Nob w/ Power Klaw and Bosspole
Trukk
142

Fast Attack
30 Storm boyz
Nob w/ Power Klaw and boss pole
310

30 Storm boyz
Nob w/ Power Klaw and boss pole
310

8 Bikes
Nob w/ Power Klaw and boss pole
184

Heavy Support
5 Smasha Gunz
5 Extra Krew
5 Ammo runtz
180

4 Kustom Mega Kannons
8 Extra crew
142

3 Traktor Kannonz
3 Ammo runtz
3 Extra Krew
108

Thoughts?

Traktor Kannonz will be dead weight unless you know your opponent is bringing some fliers. I'd only take a couple of them, since I believe they have Skyfire, and will only be able to snapshot things on the ground. Maybe 2 Traktors and replace the third with a different Gun for a little extra wham.

Skyfire things can still target Skimmers wi'out penalties though, right?

So you'll be okay unless your opponent doesn't take any flyers or skimmers.

Melevolence wrote:
Traktor Kannonz will be dead weight unless you know your opponent is bringing some fliers. I'd only take a couple of them, since I believe they have Skyfire, and will only be able to snapshot things on the ground. Maybe 2 Traktors and replace the third with a different Gun for a little extra wham.

Flyers, FMC & skimmers. This consists of a lot of strong consistent choices among a lot of armies I'd say it's a very easy bet that something they are designed to kill will be on the board.

If not the unit was cheap and not a major loss worse case you can throw them up the front of your army and have some T7 screening wounds.

 Madcat87 wrote:

Melevolence wrote:
Traktor Kannonz will be dead weight unless you know your opponent is bringing some fliers. I'd only take a couple of them, since I believe they have Skyfire, and will only be able to snapshot things on the ground. Maybe 2 Traktors and replace the third with a different Gun for a little extra wham.

Flyers, FMC & skimmers. This consists of a lot of strong consistent choices among a lot of armies I'd say it's a very easy bet that something they are designed to kill will be on the board.

If not the unit was cheap and not a major loss worse case you can throw them up the front of your army and have some T7 screening wounds.

I suppose that true enough as well. Suppose it depends on how well you know your opponents really as well. Example, our local Necron player is notorious for his Doom Scythes. So, anytime I play him, I'll be bringing Trakktors.

Something that occured to me as I'm looking through the codex, the following units/models don't have stikk bombs:

Painboy
Weirdboy
Mad dok
Gretchin
deffkoptas
warbikes
Mek Gunz


The mad dok has a powerfist; Deffkoptas, warbikes & Mek Gunz aren't getting into vehicles any time soon and gretching are well... gretchin. So the painboy and weird boy are the only two models suffering from a lack stikkbombs, so why the feth does the codex still have the option of a stikkbomb chukka for vehicles? It is a literally useless upgrade for 95% of the codex. Granted it wasn't that useful last codex but at least it could have been used in some way now it's just a trap for newbies to fall into.

Seen quite a few times that people are saying Killkannon has no transport tax. It has the same 8 model capacity tax as it used to, reducing capacity to 12. Pg 79 of the codex.

So what if you combine the Ghazzy supplement FoC & Ally the Ork codex FoC.... Could you then take multiple relics per army per model?

One from the Ghazzy Supplement & one from the normal codex.



Nevermind... The answer is no

Been reading the codex all night. from what I can tell, it is harder to use Painboyz now that they are an HQ. I used to run 2 painboyz, one in Nob bikerz and one in regular nob unit now they just don't seem to justify the cost.

So far it is looking like all we really got is more expensive shoota boyz.

I guess stacking Meks with KFF's is a good thing. I do also think the Weirdboyz may be viable now. I may have to buy some Nurgle demons for summoning.

I am trying to find ways to make the Morkanaut useful, but am having trouble justifying the cost.

I have never played MegaNobz, but putting them into a vehicle and pointing them at something to destroy might be fun.

Jury is still out for me, I am really looking at the clear cut advantages that Orks got and there doesn't seem to be anything major.

Just finished a Quartermaster template for the new book. I've added in the Looted Wagon and left out LoW and special characters. Please let me know of any errors.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ajav6vbh4fgit08/Orks%20%287th%20Ed%29.qmtemplate

The link is to drop box needs opening with QM. Edit to fix Warbiker costs and adds Painboy wargear.

Firstly, Apologies if this has already been discussed.

I've been looking through the main codex and I'm a bit confused about why Ghaz is a Lord of War. He actually seems weaker than before without his invulnerable, +2A headbutt and guaranteed 6" waagh...

The only reason I could see why he might be Lord of War was the Ork warband formation that lets you waagh every turn... With a 2+ invul on waagh, this might actually make Ghaz worthwhile....

The issue is that I can't see how Ghaz can be taken with this formation. The formation specifically requires a generic Warboss who is also the Warlord for waagh to be called every turn. Ghaz doesn't HAVE to be warlord, but he only gets the 2+ invul if he is warlord...

Am I missing something here? Ghaz can't do endless 2+ invul, can he? I haven't seen the Ghaz supplement so not sure if there are shenanigans that allow this in there.

Trukk results

1 unit of 12 Trukk Boyz w/ Nob w/ PK+BP
72+30+10+25+5
142

If a unit shoots a krak missile at this Trukk, 66% chance to hit, 66% chance to pen 83% chance to bypass ramshackle = 36%
chance to cause explodes result = 16%
6% chance per missile to cause an explodes result / per Long Fang pack = 29%

If a unit shoots a Lascannon at this Trukk, 66% chance to hit, 83% chance to pen 83% chance to bypass ramshackle = 45%
chance to cause explodes result = 33%
15% chance per Las to cause an explodes result / per Devasator squad = 60%

Explodes result causes S4 AP- hits * 12 squad members = 6 wounds * .83 for 6+ armor save = 4.98 unsaved wounds. 12/5=41%
Pinning Test 42% chance to fail leadership test, .55% chance for Breaking Heads result = D6/3.5 S4 hits average * .5 for T * .83 for 6+ armor = .42*.55*3.5*.5*.83 = .33 wounds avg
Chance to fail Pinning Test w/ bosspole = .42*.45 = 18.9% chance for squad to become pinned

41% casualties lost to explosion triggers leadership test on average.
Leadership Test 42% chance to fail morale test, .33% chance for Breaking Heads result = D6/3.5 S4 hits average * .5 for T * .5 for 6+ armor = .42*.55*3.5*.5*.83 = .33 wounds avg
Chance to fail Pinning Test w/ bosspole = .42*.45 = 18.9% chance for squad to fail morale test, break and run.

Avg results from a squad of Long Fangs shooting at a Trukk w/ 12 Boyz:
29% chance of explodes result * 5.66 wounds * 18.9% chance to pin * 18.9% chance to fail morale test= 1.64 unsaved wounds average, 5.5% chance to pin, 5.5% chance to fail leadership

Avg results from a squad of Devastators w/ Lascannons shooting at a Trukk w/ 12 Boyz;
60% chance of explodes result * 5.66 wounds * 18.9% chance to pin * 18.9% chance to fail morale test = 3.396 wounds, 11.34% chance to pin, 11.34% chance to fail morale test

===================================================

1 unit of 'ard boyz in Trukk w/ Nob with PK + BP
120+30+10+25+5
190

If a unit shoots a krak missile at this Trukk, 66% chance to hit, 66% chance to pen 83% chance to bypass ramshackle = 36%
chance to cause explodes result = 16%
6% chance per missile to cause an explodes result / per Long Fang pack = 29%

If a unit shoots a Lascannon at this Trukk, 66% chance to hit, 83% chance to pen 83% chance to bypass ramshackle = 45%
chance to cause explodes result = 33%
15% chance per Las to cause an explodes result / per Devasator squad = 60%

Explodes result causes S4 AP- hits * 12 squad members = 6 wounds * .5 for 4+ armor save = 3 unsaved wounds. 12/3=25%
Pinning Test 42% chance to fail leadership test, .55% chance for Breaking Heads result = D6/3.5 S4 hits average * .5 for T * .5for 4+ armor = .42*.55*3.5*.5*.5 = .20 wounds avg
Chance to fail Pinning Test w/ bosspole = .42*.45 = 18.9% chance for squad to become pinned

25% casualties lost to explosion triggers leadership test on average.
Leadership Test 42% chance to fail morale test, .33% chance for Breaking Heads result = D6/3.5 S4 hits average * .5 for T * .5for 4+ armor = .42*.33*3.5*.5*.5 = .20 wounds avg
Chance to fail Pinning Test w/ bosspole = .42*.45 = 18.9% chance for squad to fail morale test, break and run.

Avg results from a squad of Long Fangs shooting at a Trukk w/ 12 'ard Boyz:
29% chance of explodes result * 3.4 wounds * 18.9% chance to pin * 18.9% chance to fail morale test= .6 unsaved wounds average, 5.5% chance to pin, 5.5% chance to fail leadership

Avg results from a squad of Devastators w/ Lascannons shooting at a Trukk w/ 12 'Ard Boyz;
60% chance of explodes result * 3.4 wounds * 18.9% chance to pin * 18.9% chance to fail morale test = 2.04 wounds, 11.34% chance to pin, 11.34% chance to fail morale test

coolmandool wrote:
Am I missing something here?

Yes. The Stampede rule is a command benefit of the Formation Warboss only. You can include Thrakka as a LoW, but, if you make him your Warlord, he does not gain access to the Formation Command Traits. Also, he only gains his 2+ invul when he calls is Waaagh!, so no permanent 2+ invul.

The stikkbomb chukka says 'the vehicle is armed with stikkbombs' as well, so at least you get another shooting attack out of it, pathetic as it may be.

Looks like 'eavy armour is rather necessary for trukk riders.

Hey, here's a weird question... can Big Gunz run?

Because I'm here thinking, you know, those are big honkin' models. They have wheels, so I know they can move. The unit has a Toughness of 7.

Paradoxically as it seems, if you take them with just the free weapon, they could be rolled in front of your army as a screen, protecting the more fragile boyz behind them. Heck, place 'em base to base and you can't even shoot through the unit at all, while spreading them out gives the 5+ cover save.

Weird concept, but.

I see absolutely nothing preventing artillery from running in 7th edition.

At 18 points for two grots and a gun, it actually seems more efficient than using gretchin for cover, although you probably want some method of ensuring they don't run away... I've got a terrible notion that Mad Dok Grotsnik might just be the best way to do that. He can't give FNP to the crew for most shots, but he can grant it to the guns as far as I can tell.

Just got the codex. Could some one talk me off of the ledge. I'm seeing an over arching NERF to my army. 8000 points painted! Ready to go! I have a brand new codex and a tourney TODAY 750 pt doubles. Thinking of leaving the boys at home.

Fie on:
-Mob Rule
-Deff Rolla Nerf
-Loota class switch
-Shootas more expensive (WTF, GW?)
-Goobernaut
-Killa Kan Nerf and more expensive
-KFF Nerf. I would rather have the old one.
-Waagh jet Nerf

Horay for:
-Pain Boss
-'Ere We Go
-Warlord Traits
-Restoring Waagh (overdue)
-Mek IC
-Stampede (big tax to get it though)
-Gifts of Gork

Show me the path dakka. You're my only hope.

The sheer fact that big guns are not straight up denied shooting if they move is kinda interesting. Vast majority of them wont fire anyway since theyre blasts firing snapshots. But we are one of the few armies that can confer "relentless" to a random unit through SnP. Previously the only unit that could benefit from that were Lootas and they didnt need to move....ever...now Mek Gunz can benefit and unless youre using Lobbas or another 48" gun, moving up once or twice might be important and make or break your army's killin power.

Stikbombs have and always will be pointless. Unless they gave orks a static I3 so we could at least attack before the gunline armies that do not like melee (ig, tau, necrons) which would make SENSE....stikkbombs literally means jack squat lol. I never bought that stikkbomb chukka before, never will this codex either.

Not even going to take boarding planks except on a BW. 15pts is WAY steep to slap on a trukk lol