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I didnt think that was directly at you.

But it is a submissive handwave "If you disagree you are part of the problem" I think if these people where really caring about the enviroment then why not give that 500k to the reserve itself?

Whilst I don't personally like the idea of posing with dead animals you've shot, I also don't particularly care if others do it given all the reasons d-usa has already pointed out.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 easysauce wrote:

OFC all the do nothing spend nothing types will disagree,

So, Insult those who disagree with them. How do you know they are "Do nothing Spend Nothing" Types?
If they disagree they must be nobodies who do nothing but get mad and type. Nopes its not like I dont give to thee WWF or things like that.

not trying to insult you, if you actually DO contribute $ or time, then you are not a do nothing are you?

even someone who donates, if they are critizising these hunts, is ignorant of the benificial nature of them.

they generarate revenue to protect the species, while at the same time controlling which animals are actually hunted,

the fact of the matter is that far more is gained from this practice then is lost.

if "altruism" was enough to fund these alone, then we wouldnt have had this problem in the first place, but it just doesnt work like that, its an unavoidable fact that you will get much more funding if you offer something in exchange then if you just wait with your hands out.

your hearts in the right place though, we all care about preserving our natural heritage.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 easysauce wrote:

OFC all the do nothing spend nothing types will disagree,

So, Insult those who disagree with them. How do you know they are "Do nothing Spend Nothing" Types?
If they disagree they must be nobodies who do nothing but get mad and type. Nopes its not like I dont give to thee WWF or things like that.

Considering you were judging people in your opening post it is hardly fitting for you to be offended.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 easysauce wrote:

OFC all the do nothing spend nothing types will disagree,

So, Insult those who disagree with them. How do you know they are "Do nothing Spend Nothing" Types?
If they disagree they must be nobodies who do nothing but get mad and type. Nopes its not like I dont give to thee WWF or things like that.

Most facebook outragers are "do nothing, spend nothing" types.

FWIW:

-- The elephant wasn't killed. It was hunted, dosed, tagged and tracked, allowed to recuperate, and released.
-- Meat from all of the killed animals was given to local villages that used it for food.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 d-usa wrote:


Considering you were judging people in your opening post it is hardly fitting for you to be offended.

Touche.

Im not offended. I just hate the dimissive handwave of "If you cant do anything, then you cant have an opinion" which is what that statement boils down to. What if they really cant? Like no money? My Cousin and me are huge Enviromentalists. I give my tips every week to WWF, but she has 4 kids so she cant do that. Does that mean she cant have an opinion that disagrees?

they are entitled to their opinion,

that does not make it an educated one however,

and if that opinion is not fully thought out and dismisses out of hand the benifits of the situation, then that opinion might be dismissed out of hand itself. Especially when there is so much hate aimed towards these hunters despite their actions being positive ones (not saying you or anyone you know is hating on anyone)

props to you for giving though! very rare to see non hunters actually donate!

well I only give my tips because 15$ isnt a whole lot so I might as well give to someone who an use it.
Stupid Beer Drinkers. They never tip.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
well I only give my tips because 15$ isnt a whole lot so I might as well give to someone who an use it.
Stupid Beer Drinkers. They never tip.

I dunno. I have a few friends that bartend at breweries in Cincinnati and they'd disagree to the tune of $200-$300 on a slow night.

 cincydooley wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
well I only give my tips because 15$ isnt a whole lot so I might as well give to someone who an use it.
Stupid Beer Drinkers. They never tip.

I dunno. I have a few friends that bartend at breweries in Cincinnati and they'd disagree to the tune of $200-$300 on a slow night.

Once you've had enough drinks you can't add up a proper 15%, so you just dig your hand into your wallet and slap down whatever comes out on the counter then hope it's enough. Anybody else have that problem? Just me?

 cincydooley wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
well I only give my tips because 15$ isnt a whole lot so I might as well give to someone who an use it.
Stupid Beer Drinkers. They never tip.

I dunno. I have a few friends that bartend at breweries in Cincinnati and they'd disagree to the tune of $200-$300 on a slow night.

Maybe its the Area, It isnt a Bar. It is beer at a water Park.

 dementedwombat wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
well I only give my tips because 15$ isnt a whole lot so I might as well give to someone who an use it.
Stupid Beer Drinkers. They never tip.

I dunno. I have a few friends that bartend at breweries in Cincinnati and they'd disagree to the tune of $200-$300 on a slow night.

Once you've had enough drinks you can't add up a proper 15%, so you just dig your hand into your wallet and slap down whatever comes out on the counter then hope it's enough. Anybody else have that problem? Just me?

I tip $1 for a beer or straight bourbon. $2-$3 for a cocktail, depending on the complexity.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
well I only give my tips because 15$ isnt a whole lot so I might as well give to someone who an use it.
Stupid Beer Drinkers. They never tip.

And here is the crux of the issue.

Your $15 is definitely good, but its not very much.

On the other hand, $100,000 for someone to have a chance to bag an animal you will have to destroy anyway will definitely do some major good.


If you sell a dozen lion tags every five years, at half a million each, you'll have a steady income and be able to keep the population healthy. Younger animals will be able to fill the void left by the aging adults and you will maintain a healthy population. And have the money to do it.

The animals will die anyway, either by being culled or from natural causes. Might as we'll make you some money along the way.

I believe also that they occasionally have to kill alpha lions that are threatening to take over a pack because they end up killing all the others save for a few breeding females.

I think that's a NatGeo nugget....

 Grey Templar wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
well I only give my tips because 15$ isnt a whole lot so I might as well give to someone who an use it.
Stupid Beer Drinkers. They never tip.

And here is the crux of the issue.

Your $15 is definitely good, but its not very much.

On the other hand, $100,000 for someone to have a chance to bag an animal you will have to destroy anyway will definitely do some major good.


If you sell a dozen lion tags every five years, at half a million each, you'll have a steady income and be able to keep the population healthy. Younger animals will be able to fill the void left by the aging adults and you will maintain a healthy population. And have the money to do it.

The animals will die anyway, either by being culled or from natural causes. Might as we'll make you some money along the way.

I guess it just comes down to the fact that people who give altuistically will never meet the type of money those who do it for greedy or selfish purposes do.

I'd do some skeet shooting with her anyday, and I ain't talking guns

 cincydooley wrote:
I believe also that they occasionally have to kill alpha lions that are threatening to take over a pack because they end up killing all the others save for a few breeding females.

I think that's a NatGeo nugget....

That was pretty much the scenario for the Rhino Hunt Auction they did earlier this year I think.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

I guess it just comes down to the fact that people who give altuistically will never meet the type of money those who do it for greedy or selfish purposes do.

Many will argue there is no such thing as altruism...

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

I guess it just comes down to the fact that people who give altuistically will never meet the type of money those who do it for greedy or selfish purposes do.

Yes, because no one gives large amounts of money altruistically.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
well I only give my tips because 15$ isnt a whole lot so I might as well give to someone who an use it.
Stupid Beer Drinkers. They never tip.

And here is the crux of the issue.

Your $15 is definitely good, but its not very much.

On the other hand, $100,000 for someone to have a chance to bag an animal you will have to destroy anyway will definitely do some major good.


If you sell a dozen lion tags every five years, at half a million each, you'll have a steady income and be able to keep the population healthy. Younger animals will be able to fill the void left by the aging adults and you will maintain a healthy population. And have the money to do it.

The animals will die anyway, either by being culled or from natural causes. Might as we'll make you some money along the way.

I guess it just comes down to the fact that people who give altuistically will never meet the type of money those who do it for greedy or selfish purposes do.

So hunters are greedy and selfish now? That's a new one.

 d-usa wrote:

Happy the photo safari made you an expert in wildlife management and conservation. I've been on a military base before, where do I apply for Secretary of Defense?

I never claimed to be an expert, or requested a job in the field. However, I do donate to conservation programs, read the literature, and attend a couple of lectures each year.

Like I said previously, I understand the economics involved in selling these licenses. I understand that it raises needed funds for the conservation of the species. That said, I still think those people who feel the need to kill these animals are scum. The fact that some good comes of their scumminess is some consolation, but they're still scum.

 KingCracker wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
well I only give my tips because 15$ isnt a whole lot so I might as well give to someone who an use it.
Stupid Beer Drinkers. They never tip.

And here is the crux of the issue.

Your $15 is definitely good, but its not very much.

On the other hand, $100,000 for someone to have a chance to bag an animal you will have to destroy anyway will definitely do some major good.


If you sell a dozen lion tags every five years, at half a million each, you'll have a steady income and be able to keep the population healthy. Younger animals will be able to fill the void left by the aging adults and you will maintain a healthy population. And have the money to do it.

The animals will die anyway, either by being culled or from natural causes. Might as we'll make you some money along the way.

I guess it just comes down to the fact that people who give altuistically will never meet the type of money those who do it for greedy or selfish purposes do.

So hunters are greedy and selfish now? That's a new one.

Ok, Let e rephrase to something else. I guess the money given for nothing will always be dwarfed by those who give money for something they can have/experiance/use
I dont hate hunting(Its one my bucket list atleast once) But I do not like hunting endangered animals like that.

 KingCracker wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
well I only give my tips because 15$ isnt a whole lot so I might as well give to someone who an use it.
Stupid Beer Drinkers. They never tip.

And here is the crux of the issue.

Your $15 is definitely good, but its not very much.

On the other hand, $100,000 for someone to have a chance to bag an animal you will have to destroy anyway will definitely do some major good.


If you sell a dozen lion tags every five years, at half a million each, you'll have a steady income and be able to keep the population healthy. Younger animals will be able to fill the void left by the aging adults and you will maintain a healthy population. And have the money to do it.

The animals will die anyway, either by being culled or from natural causes. Might as we'll make you some money along the way.

I guess it just comes down to the fact that people who give altruistically will never meet the type of money those who do it for greedy or selfish purposes do.

So hunters are greedy and selfish now? That's a new one.

I could agree that hunters that poach an elephant, chop it to pieces, and cut of the tusks to make ~$3,500 are greedy.

But somebody paying $38,500 to hunt an elephant? That doesn't sound greedy to me...

Within the context of this thread "hunters are selfish and greedy" is perfectly fine for defining a person who has enough money to protect these animals but uses it to kill them instead.

 Redbeard wrote:
They don't need to put them to sleep at all. Would you believe that eco-systems existed before humans showed up to manage them.

I suggested "putting them to sleep" as a benefit of the doubt as if it was truly a greater part of the process of conservation to kill these animals. Despite how ass backwards that seems.

So basically as originally thought it's just a bs marketing exercise claiming conservation?

 Redbeard wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

Happy the photo safari made you an expert in wildlife management and conservation. I've been on a military base before, where do I apply for Secretary of Defense?

I never claimed to be an expert, or requested a job in the field. However, I do donate to conservation programs, read the literature, and attend a couple of lectures each year.

Like I said previously, I understand the economics involved in selling these licenses. I understand that it raises needed funds for the conservation of the species. That said, I still think those people who feel the need to kill these animals are scum. The fact that some good comes of their scumminess is some consolation, but they're still scum.

I agree, Hunting animals that are near extinction is just wrong.
Y'know, I stand by my original Statement, yes it is greedy. IF they truly cared for the enviroment, then give the money and expect nothing but a warm fuzzy feeling inside. The fact that you disquise killing an animal as conservation is sickening

I see it as pragmatic.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 Redbeard wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

Happy the photo safari made you an expert in wildlife management and conservation. I've been on a military base before, where do I apply for Secretary of Defense?

I never claimed to be an expert, or requested a job in the field. However, I do donate to conservation programs, read the literature, and attend a couple of lectures each year.

Like I said previously, I understand the economics involved in selling these licenses. I understand that it raises needed funds for the conservation of the species. That said, I still think those people who feel the need to kill these animals are scum. The fact that some good comes of their scumminess is some consolation, but they're still scum.

I agree, Hunting animals that are near extinction is just wrong.
Y'know, I stand by my original Statement, yes it is greedy. IF they truly cared for the enviroment, then give the money and expect nothing but a warm fuzzy feeling inside. The fact that you disquise killing an animal as conservation is sickening

And people would just write checks to the Girl Scouts and say "no thanks, I don't need those cookies, I have a warm fuzzy feeling that is better than any Thin Mint could ever be".

Im pretty sure Thin Mints are not an endangered species.
And I do know people who donote to Boy/Girl Scouts

I'm sorry...which of the animals were endangered again?