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Having read through the new Assassin Data Slate, there were some changes.

Vindicare got Better. Better Range, Clearer Rules.

Callidus got Balanced, better melee, new template, nerf and buff to Poly, better Rules.

Eversor got Balanced, New melee, New Rules,

Culexus got Better, Better Effect against Psykers, new Melee, Clear rules.

All Assassins got buffed and took a nurf in War-gear and Stat-line, cost remained mostly the same.

Over all Buff to Assassins in general.

From what I've read the culexus is pretty ridic now, huge hate on psykers, with decent damage output and some defensive capabilities to boot

Wasn't the vindicator nerfed? It is worse at blowing up tanks and it was the only thing it was good for. The LoS! buff isn't much when marines test on 9-10 anyway, so pass on avarge and he more or less the same at killing dudes without the character rule.

LOS is passed on a dice roll. so a -2 on a sgt is now 6 while on a IC it is 4+

Look Out, Sir! is rolled on a D6. What does 9-10 have to do with that?
I'm pretty okay with the 'No Escape'-rule as it changes the core rules instead of just ignoring them.

Vindicare is nerfed in the way that he doesn't destroy the Inv-Wargear and that you can still take a Look Out, Sir! against his attacks.
He is buffed because they doubled his range.
That changes him from a "Lol, I want that overpowered model" to "Nice unit, perhaps I should add him to my list".

I don't think the Vindicare was nerfed at all.

Ignores cover is huge. Jinking vehciles, and perhaps more importantly, special weapons teams like havocs and devastators who hide in ruins and such will suddenly be easy targets. Imagine killing one 35 point marine every turn who has a lascannon, or something like that.

Then theres also unit obstruction, at 72" you will often be firing at something that is partially blocked by another unit of troops. This usually grants a 5+ cover save, but no more!

Also the doubled range is HUGE, as is the additional wound. This guy is much, much more survivable.

Yes, his anti-armor is not as good as before, but you will see him firing more shots per game and he will be even better than before at killing characters and special weapons guys.

ICs on the other hand are not something you generally will want to waste his shots on.

 changerofways wrote:
I don't think the Vindicare was nerfed at all.

Ignores cover is huge. Jinking vehciles, and perhaps more importantly, special weapons teams like havocs and devastators who hide in ruins and such will suddenly be easy targets. Imagine killing one 35 point marine every turn who has a lascannon, or something like that.

Then theres also unit obstruction, at 72" you will often be firing at something that is partially blocked by another unit of troops. This usually grants a 5+ cover save, but no more!

Also the doubled range is HUGE, as is the additional wound. This guy is much, much more survivable.

Yes, his anti-armor is not as good as before, but you will see him firing more shots per game and he will be even better than before at killing characters and special weapons guys.

ICs on the other hand are not something you generally will want to waste his shots on.

Unless of course they have low Inv saves, or no saves at all.

That Warboss in the Mob is now rather good pickin's.

Yea, the new assassins aren't that great. I see the Vindicare as a massive nerf; I'd rather have a statistical average of always penning a Land Raider with a 1/3 chance of explosion than now. He was a GK staple, outside of Dreadknights, for popping Av14.

Most of them are still just T4, 4++ save dudes meaning one errant krak or lascannon and your special snowflake is deleted. The Eversor is comically bad, IMO.

Vindicare got better range but all of his other abilities were nerfed a bit.

But you could snipe away that Missile Launcher before he even gets close

 PhillyT wrote:
Vindicare got better range but all of his other abilities were nerfed a bit.

A bit? No longer has a higher than statistical average to pen Av14, no long breaks wargear, no longer automatically bypasses all LoS! rolls, Guns are Ap2 vs. Ap1, Hell rounds do only one wound...

He gained ignores cover, a wound, and the ability to only be wounded by Grav weapons on a 6+. Otherwise he went up by 5 pts and still is a lascannon shot away from being the pink mist.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kangodo wrote:
But you could snipe away that Missile Launcher before he even gets close

Dunno about you, but my Vindicares rarely lived past the first turn. If I went first, I usually got an exploded vehicle or stripped Invuln on a target worth more his points. Then it was usually splatter theater.

What would have made him amazing would have been "Move-Shoot-Move".

Doubling his range is huge. How often did a vindicare survive a game really? One las cannon or missile getting through his save and poof. Now stow him all the way in the back of the deployment zone and he is good to go.

 TheKbob wrote:
a statistical average of always penning a Land Raider

That's not quite how averages work.

 PhillyT wrote:
Doubling his range is huge. How often did a vindicare survive a game really? One las cannon or missile getting through his save and poof. Now stow him all the way in the back of the deployment zone and he is good to go.

That and the fact that the other assassins gained Infiltrate as well, meaning they can actually get in range now.

I'm glad to hear that it isn't just a copy-paste of the old rules. I'm pleasantly surprised.

I like the new assassin rules. They've all gotten their nerfs and buffs, some of which I like and some I'm not so sure about. I do like the fact that they're all better defined at their roles.

The vindicare is great for taking out special/heavy weapons from squads and killing squad leaders.

The callidus is the bane of elite units that are packing 2+ saves.

The eversor is a one-man army who can go toe-to-toe with a horde of bugs or orks and come out on top.

The culexus is the ultimate badass who hard counters psykers.

For their price, they seem really good, but not overly so.

I'm already planning some conversions for the assassins. Since all my armies are orky, I'll be converting them from nobs. That way my 'orkperatives' won't look out of place next to my green tide or converted knight army.

Speaking of knights, running one or more vindicares alongside a pure knight force seems dirty. Take out your opponent's special weapons so he has nothing to kill your knights with... GG!

 PhillyT wrote:
Vindicare got better range but all of his other abilities were nerfed a bit.

The BS 8 hurts a bit, especially if you roll 1s like no tomorrow.

Quick question, is a single assassin an entire formation? Or can you take 1-3 in a slot?

 TheSilo wrote:
Quick question, is a single assassin an entire formation? Or can you take 1-3 in a slot?

You can take 1 as a detachment, and there is a formation with one of each.

But as there is no limit to number of detachments, you can have as many assassins you like, right? In fact, you can have an army composed entirely of assassins.

 Crimson wrote:
But as there is no limit to number of detachments, you can have as many assassins you like, right? I fact, you can have an army composed entirely of assassins.

Imagine 2k worth of vindicare assassins all hiding on the backfield sniping your guys gakless...

 TheKbob wrote:

 PhillyT wrote:
Vindicare got better range but all of his other abilities were nerfed a bit.

A bit? No longer has a higher than statistical average to pen Av14, no long breaks wargear, no longer automatically bypasses all LoS! rolls, Guns are Ap2 vs. Ap1, Hell rounds do only one wound...

He gained ignores cover, a wound, and the ability to only be wounded by Grav weapons on a 6+. Otherwise he went up by 5 pts and still is a lascannon shot away from being the pink mist.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kangodo wrote:
But you could snipe away that Missile Launcher before he even gets close

Dunno about you, but my Vindicares rarely lived past the first turn. If I went first, I usually got an exploded vehicle or stripped Invuln on a target worth more his points. Then it was usually splatter theater.

What would have made him amazing would have been "Move-Shoot-Move".

The nerf to Turbo-Penetrators was expected because it was always used against vehicles and was good. Everyone seems to forget that it also dealt 2 wounds instead of 1. If it was used more for anti-Hero it might not have been considered to powerful.
Breaking Wargear was something people hated. I liked it having used him. He's still the sole model in the game capable of ignoring Invulnerable Saves. At the time of the last update only he and Necrons with Warscythes did that.
Nerf expected.
AP2 was expected. When last updated AP1 gave +1 on the damage table and AP2 gave nothing. Now AP2 gives what AP1 used to. D Weapons also had +1damage in 5th Ed and when they got updated for 6th they lost that part because all D weapons were at least AP2.

Ignores Cover? Massive Bonus. No saves at all vs Shield Breaker.
Grav wounds on 6? Bonus.
3 wounds? Bonus
Doubled range? Great bonus.

I see it as a huge buff to Vindicare overall, especially as I will never fail to at least glance a rhino again. -.-' And breaking wargear was hated by many, so I'm fine seeing it go.

The rest of the assassins have me excited to actually use them. I love them, but have only used the Vindicare since the rules were meh for the rest with no charging on DS arrival.

Yeah, to be honest, there is really good balance between the four of them now. They did a great job giving each a very specific role and making them internally competitive.

They are also not over powered. None are automatic takes.

I'm actually looking forward to my Dark Eldar Archons having their shadow fields ignored and instantly dying turn 1 from a badass sniper.

 Barrywise wrote:
I'm actually looking forward to my Dark Eldar Archons having their shadow fields ignored and instantly dying turn 1 from a badass sniper.

I'm looking forward tobseeing an Archon go toe to toe with a Callidus. It just seems badass in my head.

The Culexus got pretty insane. Stick him on a transport (like an empty drop pod) and sick him on a psyker.

Played against a Grey Knights army with a Vindicare Assasin this afternoon. It definitely got BUFFED - with Ignores Cover, AP2, the 72" range and the option to either ignore invul saves, do D3 wounds, or wound on a 2+, it was killing something on every turn. It stripped two wounds off of my Bike Chapter Master with the shield eternal (no saves of any kind!), and easily immobilized a Land Raider, all while being way down in his back field (too far for me to be able to effectively engage it). Scary, and difficult to deal with.

The other assassins seem to have been buffed as well. The Culexus needed a buff badly, and seems like a fairly serviceable and interesting model.

Not being able to join ICs is a pretty big nerf bat - it means they can't ride around in a Land Raider with an IC, so you're going to have to infiltrate just to get them within range to threaten the enemies. But the other changes to the assassins seems to be very positive.

My friend who plays Grey Knights is pretty down on the new GK codex, but he's very happy with the Assassins dataslate.

Or get drop pods from sw. And stick them in it

Tactical_Genius wrote:

 TheKbob wrote:
a statistical average of always penning a Land Raider

That's not quite how averages work.

4d6 averages 14.