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 Envihon wrote:
What is the verdict of whether a Comms Relay can be taken by itself because I don't like to take Fortifications but I would take a Comms Relay.

Is the Comms Relay a unit or fortification all by itself? I'm pretty sure it isn't.

 undertow wrote:

 Envihon wrote:
What is the verdict of whether a Comms Relay can be taken by itself because I don't like to take Fortifications but I would take a Comms Relay.

Is the Comms Relay a unit or fortification all by itself? I'm pretty sure it isn't.

Used to be able to do this with "battlefield debris" and just place it for free as terrain.

 Grey Templar wrote:

 WrentheFaceless wrote:

Kyck24 wrote:
Quick question. If my lib generates cleansing flame psychic power and is attached to a purifier squad can i still use two cleansing flames for that squad?

No, a unit can only manifest a power once.

Correct, but the answer to his question is yes.

The Librarion and Purifiers are separate "psychic units". They can each cast their own copy of a power.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

tSygna wrote:


If that's how you play then the squad has 5 warp charges since Purifiers are ML2.

That is how it works. The squad is a ML2 psyker, and the librarian is a ML3 psyker. For a total of 5 charges from that unit.

Its not take the highest or anything.

Its still a giant rules argument, since the Librarian is an IC, hes considered part of the unit for all intents and purposes. its now one unit. People figure that to mean "no" a librarian can not manifest and the squad cant manifest it both at the same time.

Though my shop leans more towards the BAO rules.

 ductvader wrote:

 undertow wrote:

 Envihon wrote:
What is the verdict of whether a Comms Relay can be taken by itself because I don't like to take Fortifications but I would take a Comms Relay.

Is the Comms Relay a unit or fortification all by itself? I'm pretty sure it isn't.

Used to be able to do this with "battlefield debris" and just place it for free as terrain.

Well that wouldn't work in a tournament, and I'd call it a dick move on general principle.

the cheapest way to get a Comms Relay is still the ADL. Although for only 5 pts more you can get an AV14 Bunker instead and still get the Comms relay.

 WrentheFaceless wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:

 WrentheFaceless wrote:

Kyck24 wrote:
Quick question. If my lib generates cleansing flame psychic power and is attached to a purifier squad can i still use two cleansing flames for that squad?

No, a unit can only manifest a power once.

Correct, but the answer to his question is yes.

The Librarion and Purifiers are separate "psychic units". They can each cast their own copy of a power.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

tSygna wrote:


If that's how you play then the squad has 5 warp charges since Purifiers are ML2.

That is how it works. The squad is a ML2 psyker, and the librarian is a ML3 psyker. For a total of 5 charges from that unit.

Its not take the highest or anything.

Its still a giant rules argument, since the Librarian is an IC, hes considered part of the unit for all intents and purposes. its now one unit. People figure that to mean "no" a librarian can not manifest and the squad cant manifest it both at the same time.

Though my shop leans more towards the BAO rules.

So how many Warp Charges are produced from that Squad?

5 man purifiers and lvl 3 libby? 5

We dont play that the Libby's charges magically disapear when he leaves a unit

A unit is a culmination of however many squads are inside it.

A unit can be composed of 1 to infinite number of squads.

That is false, there is no such thing as a "squad"

 undertow wrote:

 Envihon wrote:
What is the verdict of whether a Comms Relay can be taken by itself because I don't like to take Fortifications but I would take a Comms Relay.

Is the Comms Relay a unit or fortification all by itself? I'm pretty sure it isn't.

From Stronghold Assault "battlefield debris can be purchased as part of a fortification or as a fortification themselves", I would read this to mean that you can just pay the 20 points for the comms relay and deploy it. it will use up your fortification slot but...

This was already discussed thoroughly in YMDC. No, you can't take the relay by itself. Posting from phone, so can't link to that thread right now.

Sonsoftherock wrote:

 undertow wrote:

 Envihon wrote:
What is the verdict of whether a Comms Relay can be taken by itself because I don't like to take Fortifications but I would take a Comms Relay.

Is the Comms Relay a unit or fortification all by itself? I'm pretty sure it isn't.

From Stronghold Assault "battlefield debris can be purchased as part of a fortification or as a fortification themselves", I would read this to mean that you can just pay the 20 points for the comms relay and deploy it. it will use up your fortification slot but...

As Grey Templar said, good luck trying to use this in a tournament, and it's a questionable move any any case.

There was a YMDC thread that actually achieved consensus on this subject:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/615342.page

For those too lazy to click through, everyone eventually agreed that you cannot take a Comms Relay by itself.

 jy2 wrote:
I'm trying to get my paladins to work. Any idea on how best to run a GK army with them?

Well despite this unit going against everything I say is needed to be Meta Contendable...

Analyzing their strengths
-2 wounds
-apothecary
-2 special weapons
-teleport
-2+ armor
-5++

The best way to utilize them would be in...

1. A deepstrike List
or
2. A Gate List where you attach a librarian to each unit of paladins get gate and jump them over the field burning down units or getting in rear armor to shoot down vehicles

How many units?
Maximum number of Paladin squads that I would utilize... 2 units of 5... in addition to 1 terminator squad.
Gong above 3 is just really just too much. You want to get allies and 2 paladin squads as is... will suck up quite a bit of your points as you pay around 300ish+ points per 5 man unit. and that's not including the terminator squad coming in around 200... and that is without taking up an HQ choice either...

They would certainly need back-up of some kind in some mannerism.

Idealistically I personally would go along the lines of allying space marines and take up 2 drop pod marine units with plasma/meltas/gravs etc... and a unit of 10 sternguard combat suqaded inside of a drop pod as well. Finally a storm talon support and with that deepstrike everything utilizing the new special rules for deepstrike with GK and all the drop pods from SM and alpha strike your opponent so hard that they wouldn't be able to recover...

I was making a sample list... but I just didn't care for it... the 2 5 man paladin squads alone take up like 600 points not including a libby for 165 and a terminator for about 200... that's like 1000pts and I just can't believe that those 1000points come anywhere close in comparison to 1000points for the standard Draigostar with 2x Knight Base... Really you have to ask yourself is 2 paladin squads worth the trade for draigo and 2 dreadknights? and say you were to keep draigo base and just add 2 5 man paladin units... I can't support the idea that those 2 units will make back their points even if they do deepstrike in the beginning of the game... their is just too much high str low ap weapons to being roling around being only T4 and with no invisibility support... I just can't...

G.L. with creating a list utilizing 10 paladins though... your going to need some...

Question on teleport homers. Only terminator armour units and personal teleporter units can take advantage of it. So im wondering if i have a librarian in termi armour attached to a purifier squad and i teleport them across the board onto a teleport homer does the entire squad not scatter because the librarian is in termi armour and can utilize the homer or do i scatter?

Kyck24 wrote:
Question on teleport homers. Only terminator armour units and personal teleporter units can take advantage of it. So im wondering if i have a librarian in termi armour attached to a purifier squad and i teleport them across the board onto a teleport homer does the entire squad not scatter because the librarian is in termi armour and can utilize the homer or do i scatter?

It's questionable if Teleport Homer works with Gate of Infinity in general, but in this case it definitely does not work because of the wording in Teleport Homer. "Friendly units compsed entirely of models in Terminator armour and/or models with a personal teleporter do not scatter..."

So since Purifiers are in the unit and they don't have Terminator armour or teleporters, then teleport homer does not work on them.

 BoomWolf wrote:
And it lets your purifiers to sit somewhere safe for the first turn too, it might not be a bad idea.

Worst case scenario, it becomes a retreat location for you. (though you might want to keep something there to prevent enemy from taking it to himself?)

Purifiers should be able to use cleansing flame, an absolutely devastating power.
Not sure if the sit somewhere safe they could ever use it.

"First turn" is a pair of keywords there mate, yaknow-that 50% that they won't get to act first.

 BoomWolf wrote:
"First turn" is a pair of keywords there mate, yaknow-that 50% that they won't get to act first.

Well, if they need to hoof around the board, they might go nowhere.

That's why you have an escape hatch, so they can disembark somewhere far away and get rather far in a single movement action.

 BoomWolf wrote:
That's why you have an escape hatch, so they can disembark somewhere far away and get rather far in a single movement action.

That's a good idea.
I'd always give the Purifers a transport.

Yeah, the escape hatch was something that could help. Smart opponents will know what's coming very quickly, but it does give a decent measure of board control.

You can disembark 18" away from your deployment line that way with 2 combat squads, and nova up to 9", giving you a very scary 27" bubble around your fortification that's a "hot zone" (quite literally).

Another option is to just dump your 2 mandatory servitors from codex: SW in there to unlock droppods. At least they get to man the 2 heavy bolter you can shoot forwards that way? (not sure if both can mount in the same building though, need to look that up). They can also man the comms relay you put on top. At least you'll get something out of the HBs of the bastion too.

I was thinking along these lines for a 2000pts amry

Grey Knights - Nemesis Strike Force
LoW: Kaldor Draigo - (245pts)
No Slot: Techmarine - Conversion beamer - (110pts)
HQ: Librarian - ML3, Cuirass of Sacrifice, Daemon hammer - (160pts)
Elites: Purifier Squad (5 man) - 2x Psilencer, Rhino - (180pts)
Troops: Terminator Squad (10 man) - 2x Psycannon, 1x Falchion, 1x Halberd, Justicar with Warding Stave - (381pts)
Heavy Support: 2x Nemesis Dreadknight - 2x (Heavy Incinerator, Heavy Psycannon, Nemesis greatsword and power fist, Personal teleporter) - (450pts)

Allied detachment - Space Marines: Iron Knights (Iron Hands Chapter Tactics)
HQ: Librarian - ML2 - (90pts)
Troops: Scout Squad (5 man) - Missile Launcher, 4x Sniper Rifle, Camo Cloaks, Teleport Homer - (94pts)
Heavy Support: Centurion Devastator Squad (3 man) - Missile Launcher, Omniscope, 3x Twin-linked Lascannon - (290pts)
2000 pts total

My idea is to put the GK techie in the Centurion squad along with their libby, hopefully roll invisability, and blast anything with a hint of armor on it.
The Snipers use the old infiltrate+homing beacon to let the GK libby, the GKT's and Draigo DS where I want them in the first turn. Also they'll try to be useful after that and pick of chars and such with those boomsticks.
I'll Combat Squad (Errata p3) the GKT's with 5 + Draigo to Gate and wreck havoc where needed, and keep 5 with 2x psycannons with the GK libby as boom boom vortex of Doooooom squad.
The Dread Knights... well, they'll DS too, although they wont benefit from the Homing Beacon (since they're not termies?), and they'll probably have fun with the psycannons + incinerator + teleporter.
Finally, the Purifiers in the poor ol' Rhino. Either Draigo, the Centurions, or the 2 Dread Knights keep most of the attention away from them, and they can happily roll away and be useful somewhere with Purifying Flame and/or the Psilencers; or, they get instablasted by a soddy 5 man tactical unit with a missile launcher... hopefully not.

I know Draigo is heavy pointwise, but he is a pure monster in CC with that Titanblade of his, and with a sure Gate to go where he's needed and be successful killing stuff when he comes out, it'll give a lot of goldstars in my book.
Optionally I could go with another GK libby ML3 (145pts) + Techmarine with conversion beamer (110pts) if I know there'll be heavy mechanized stuff.

Thoughts, tacos and pointers anyone?

Question, why are you referencing an outdated Errata for combat squads when our book has the most up to date version of that rule?

Edit: on an only slightly related note, I snagged an Aquila Strongpoint for 50% off.

That was just because it says the same thing as our codex, but is avaliable as a link on the interweb for easy access.

Vayashi wrote:
I was thinking along these lines for a 2000pts amry

Grey Knights - Nemesis Strike Force
LoW: Kaldor Draigo - (245pts)
No Slot: Techmarine - Conversion beamer - (110pts)
HQ: Librarian - ML3, Cuirass of Sacrifice, Daemon hammer - (160pts)
Elites: Purifier Squad (5 man) - 2x Psilencer, Rhino - (180pts)
Troops: Terminator Squad (10 man) - 2x Psycannon, 1x Falchion, 1x Halberd, Justicar with Warding Stave - (381pts)
Heavy Support: 2x Nemesis Dreadknight - 2x (Heavy Incinerator, Heavy Psycannon, Nemesis greatsword and power fist, Personal teleporter) - (450pts)

Allied detachment - Space Marines: Iron Knights (Iron Hands Chapter Tactics)
HQ: Librarian - ML2 - (90pts)
Troops: Scout Squad (5 man) - Missile Launcher, 4x Sniper Rifle, Camo Cloaks, Teleport Homer - (94pts)
Heavy Support: Centurion Devastator Squad (3 man) - Missile Launcher, Omniscope, 3x Twin-linked Lascannon - (290pts)
2000 pts total

My idea is to put the GK techie in the Centurion squad along with their libby, hopefully roll invisability, and blast anything with a hint of armor on it.
The Snipers use the old infiltrate+homing beacon to let the GK libby, the GKT's and Draigo DS where I want them in the first turn. Also they'll try to be useful after that and pick of chars and such with those boomsticks.
I'll Combat Squad (Errata p3) the GKT's with 5 + Draigo to Gate and wreck havoc where needed, and keep 5 with 2x psycannons with the GK libby as boom boom vortex of Doooooom squad.
The Dread Knights... well, they'll DS too, although they wont benefit from the Homing Beacon (since they're not termies?), and they'll probably have fun with the psycannons + incinerator + teleporter.
Finally, the Purifiers in the poor ol' Rhino. Either Draigo, the Centurions, or the 2 Dread Knights keep most of the attention away from them, and they can happily roll away and be useful somewhere with Purifying Flame and/or the Psilencers; or, they get instablasted by a soddy 5 man tactical unit with a missile launcher... hopefully not.

I know Draigo is heavy pointwise, but he is a pure monster in CC with that Titanblade of his, and with a sure Gate to go where he's needed and be successful killing stuff when he comes out, it'll give a lot of goldstars in my book.
Optionally I could go with another GK libby ML3 (145pts) + Techmarine with conversion beamer (110pts) if I know there'll be heavy mechanized stuff

The army lacks numbers.
In first turn, I'd shoot down your Rhino so that the Purifiers will have to a walk.
Moreover, the Centurions hoof around the board.
In this way, I just need to concentrate on Draigo and 5 Termies using GOI and two NDK's.
At this point level, the enemy should have enough fire power or cc capability to decimate them quickly.

No no, this army can work like a charm. Numbers aren't an issue if you ask me.

Just a few more adjustment. IF you are allowed to use FW, swap the librarian to Severin Loth (who gets to choose his spells) from the red scorpion chapter.

Maybe dump the techmarine to upgrade to that guy. If not, dump him to spice up your centurion group and run draigo with him. GoI, 2 dreadknights and 10 terminators coming in should be enough threat saturation.

It'll still be win big-Lose big depending on your matchup though.

I can see the points of the Centurions slogging around, maybe switch the techmarine and purifier squad for a Stormraven for the Centurions and Terminator Captain with Lightning claws to add too the GKTs with Draigo and ML3 libby, making a sledge force of it.

I do have another setup with more numbers, but that one depends a bit too much on the spell rolls.

The Magic Army 2000 pts, 2 detachments of NSF
LoW: Kaldor Draigo
HQ: 2x Librarian - ML3, Daemon hammer, 1x Cuirass of Sacrifice on the Warlord
Elites: Purifier Squad (10 man) - 4x Incinerator, Melta bombs
Troops: Terminator Squad (10 man) - 2x Incinerator, 4x Falchions, 3x Halberd, Justicar with Warding Stave, Melta bombs
Heavy Support: 2x Nemesis Dreadknight - 2x (Heavy Incinerator, Heavy Psycannon, Nemesis greatsword and power fist, Personal teleporter)

HQ: Librarian - ML3, Warding Stave
Troops: Terminator Squad (5 man) - 1x Psycannon, Justicar with Warding Stave, Melta bombs

This is 17 warpcharges before the roll, and 3x ML3 librarians to pound out the result, along with Draigo to wreck just about anything with the 10 man GKT squad of flailing swords and incinerators.
Too bad it really needs GoI and Vortex of Doom so the libbys can jump around with the purifiers and actually be useful.

Thing is I really can't stand the thought of bringing out the same square box of setup that everyone else is using, not because it's OP awesome, but simple because our codex is so damn barren.
And no, there'll be no Inquisitor with a unit full of space-monkeys with lascannons in my rooster.

No Vayashi the Centurions are attached to Draigo for that fast GoI.

Lets them teleport out of melee if necessary, lets them reposition anywhere essentially. Just give them Grav-guns instead and your set with a mobile deathstar.

That is an awfully expensive GoI though, especially when Draigo will loose his CC with them. Wouldn't it be better to use the libbys for that, and hopefully get one of them with GoI. If none of them get it, then Draigo is the option ofc

That's one way of handeling it.

Draigo as a support character to that unit isn't supercrazy though. He also does a mighty fine job of tanking the incoming heavy hits. Draigo along with a source for invis makes that unit nigh unstoppable to all but a culexus assassin.

I am about to enter a 1500 point local tournament and I came up with three different lists using what I have: Grey Knights, Imperial Fists and an Imperial Knight. I just wanted to see what everyone thought was the best use of units with 1500:

The First List combines all three elements:
Grey Knights:
HQ:
Librarian, ML3, Storm Bolter

Troops:
5 Terminators, Psycannon, 4 Halberds, 1 Hammer

Lord of War:
Kaldor Draigo

Imperial Fists - Sentinels of Terra:
HQ:
Librarian, ML2, Bolter

Troops:
5 Tactical Marines, Meltagun
Drop Pod

Heavy Support:
3 Centurions, 3 Grav Cannons with Hurricane Bolters

Imperial Knight Errant

My list consisting of just Grey Knights and Imperial Fists, exchanges out the Imperial Knight to get a Nemsis Dreadknight with a Personal Telelporter, Heavy Psycannon, Heavy Incinerator and a Nemesis Greatsword and adds in a 5 Interceptor Squad with a psycannon with Halberds. It also adds 5 more Tactical Marines to the Imperial Fist Tactical squad.

My last list is just Grey Knights and the Imperial Knight.

Grey Knights
HQ:
Librarian, ML3, Storm Bolter

Troops:
10 Terminators, 2 Psycannons, 8 Halberds, 2Hammers
5 GKSS, 4 Halberds, Incinerator

Heavy Support:
Nemesis Dreadknight, Personal Teleport, Heavy Incinerator, Heavy Psycannon, Nemesis Greatsword
Nemesis Dreadknight, Personal Teleport, Heavy Incinerator, Heavy Psycannon, Nemesis Greatsword

Imperial Knight Errant

I am really all the fence on this one and looking for some general opinions. I feel like trying to cram all three elements into a 1500 list is the weakest of them all but I can't decide with I want to ally my GK with Imperial Fists or with the Imperial Knight. What do you guys think?