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 .Mikes. wrote:

 adamsouza wrote:


$50 for 2 Rulebooks

Where was this mentioned? FWIR Ronnie said $50 for one in the announcement video fdrom last week, or did I hear wrong?

For the hardback + the pocket edition.

 .Mikes. wrote:

 adamsouza wrote:


$50 for 2 Rulebooks

Where was this mentioned? FWIR Ronnie said $50 for one in the announcement video fdrom last week, or did I hear wrong?

I can't watch the video for the next few hours http://www.youtube.com/embed/J_6ngCHsKm8

Pretty sure he said $50 for 2, which sounds about right price wise. $50 for 1 rulebook seems a bit steep for Mantic.

If I'm wrong I apologize, but that is what I remembered. We'll find out tommorow in any case.

It was for the hardcover full-book (fiction, art, rules, lists, etc) and softcover rules-only versions.

 adamsouza wrote:

 Alex C wrote:
I'm having a derp moment and can't find where the Rulebook pledge price was stated. I know it had the hardback and mini rulebook in the pledge, but how much was it again?

$50 for 2 Rulebooks

$100 for 1 Rulebook and an Army

Slight correction - the "2 rulebooks" are the hardback with full background and expanded material, plus the softback which is just rules + army lists. The larger pledges will have both books included.

E: also I think the $50 pledge might be a "gamers package" with a full set of dice, wound markers, disordered/wavering tokens, spell effects, line of sight template etc.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
Stupid question for fans/players...

Does it at all feel weird that (as is my understanding) you never remove models from units as damage/wounds are suffered?

Watching friends play KoW Version 1, it was always the only pet-peeve I had that just seemed so strange... The 40k guy in me likes removing dead bodies from attacks... its a silly thing, but it feels like something is "happening" when going through that motion.

It's actually a fairly common practice for a lot of historical games, especially at smaller scales or when you have large ranks of identically armed troops. A lot of games use a 'wound tracker' type mechanic, even seen some where you sub out the standing troops for 'casualty markers' which are wounded, diorama style miniatures.

The key point for this is that you need a way of tracking the reduction in fighting capability/morale of the fighting unit, and there are different ways of representing the same thing.

A bit off topic but the Puggimer (or however he spells it) guy on the Mantic forums ran the gencon L2P KoW events and he had made some really neat damage trackers for the regiments out of what appeared to be old/liberated mageknight/heroclix base things, thought that was pretty handy. If Mantic makes an official version I'll have to buy it, otherwise i'll have to look for some cheap 'clix/etc for the same purpose.

I picked up some stuff from warbases to achive the same thing.

Wooden casualty dials. Space ontop to place a dead or wounded model. Great way to use some of the dead and wounded guys you get on certain sprues.

Here is an example of them. Not mine though



Same guys I get my Sabol/movement trays from.

I think the casulity markers are bout 60p each.

Ooh, that reminds me of something that would be great to get on the succubus sprues: a reclining succubus. All you'd need to do is paint some blood on her top leg and perhaps give her one of the angrier looking heads and it would work well for a Wounds counter.

Those casualty markers are sweet. I'm torn between trying to implement them into my trays themselves or to just get something like that/heroclix bases.

I have seen someone who made trays with intergrated dials but no idea who they were.

 TwilightSparkles wrote:
I tend to think magical items wrecked warhammer as some items were carried by anything that could, they ceased to be special or have much meaning story wise.
Anyhow I'll be interested to see what incentive is offered to start an army with this is KS.

I'm not talking about crazy stuff. I don't like those either. I'm talking about the 5-15 point stuff that adds a little flavour or individuality to a unit, or represents a unit champion instead of a character model with godlike stats.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 AlexHolker wrote:
Ooh, that reminds me of something that would be great to get on the succubus sprues: a reclining succubus. All you'd need to do is paint some blood on her top leg and perhaps give her one of the angrier looking heads and it would work well for a Wounds counter.

I think Hasslefree has us covered if Mantic don't do something of the like.

Oh, there's the discussion on the kickstarter. Probably shouldn't have bumped the old thread with the info ; p

Hm?

I posted in the generic "Mantic fantasy thread" and wondered why there was no discussion about the KoW kickstarter in it. But it stands to reason that it has its own thread. So I brainfarted ; p

I have to admit, I'm a bit jazzed to pledge my dollar. Here's part one of a little ballad that's been going through my head waiting for this kickstarter.

Sitting there alone, F5 button waiting.
"The campaign is a go." "Are you sure?"
Dakka's not convinced but the Mantic Blog
has the evidence.
No need to abort.
The countdown starts.

Watching in a trance, the fans are certain.
No stretch goals left to chance. All is working.
Trying to relax at his computer
"Add on a piece of pie," jokes Backer Tom.
The count goes on.

4, 3, 2, 1.
Goals before us,
funding, falling,
Kicktraq worthless,
pledging, pledging more.


More to come. How does this diddy end, again? It's almost as if Backer Tom is an allegory for addiction.
It's like Mantic just has to give me a reason, just a little bit's enough. Just a second, my credit's not broken just bent and I can learn to pledge again.

 Daedleh wrote:


Slight correction - the "2 rulebooks" are the hardback with full background and expanded material, plus the softback which is just rules + army lists. The larger pledges will have both books included.

E: also I think the $50 pledge might be a "gamers package" with a full set of dice, wound markers, disordered/wavering tokens, spell effects, line of sight template etc.

Thinking about it, this could be a really clever move by Mantic. The KoW rules have got a good reputation online, but I still think people are turned off by 'print-your-own' pdfs, and from some reports it's been hard to get hold of some of the KoW printed materials recently. A book(s) only pledge, with a selection of accessories to help play, at a really competitive price (certainly compared to other major-brand mass fantasy battle rulebooks) might hoover up a lot of people that have heard good things, but otherwise sat on the fence for whatever reason.

Not sure I personally want any more models (got about 3000pts of Undead to paint) but it's good the option is there for anyone new.

Anyway, just checked and today's assembly finishes just before this starts, so should have just enough time to get back to the office and hitting F5.

See that you are getting ready to take to the stage again Bob..

I'm sure this will be a journey for all of us, most of the previous Mantic KS threads have been tremendous fun, hopefully this one too!

Daedleh wrote:It'll have been a 3 year edition by the time the book gets released, which is a bit shorter than the original plan. There has been a noticeable drop in attendance at Kings of War events this year and after gathering feedback it's become apparent that the balance issues (heavy cavalry, Obsidian Golems, Drakons, Elohi, artillery in general) are the reason for it...
Second edition allows us to directly address the communities concerns as well as improve the game in general. It is a bit faster than originally planned, but it's the right thing to do. The rules will still be free to download and I believe that there's a softback with all the rules & army lists planned if anyone doesn't want to buy a new hardback.

Nicely said. A couple of things that put me off KoW* were the premeasured heavy cavalry, and no leadership role for skirmishing-CC-monster 'heroes'. (That, and the GW apron string of a 125x100mm footprint for orc regiments or whatnot, but that's a wee thing.)

*I mean, besides the awful, awful models.

 Fenriswulf wrote:
Daedleh -

Are they looking into the fact that no one finds taking standards for units worthwhile? All the lists I see have people not bothering to take them. Seemed strange to me, as it's almost a must-include in other game systems.

By 'other game systems' do you mean Warhammer and... uh... Warhammer? Most games I've seen auto-include unit banners by not bothering about them. TBH that's another point: I'd rather Mantic didn't bother about them either. They and musicians are like another GW throwback: a layer of crunch, with minimal, self-cancelling effects, that doesn't quite fit with the streamlined theme of KoW. They're a bit pointless.

One other game I've seen with unit standard options is Mayhem. (I can see myself going in on the KS for the new KoW book, but it's rules will need a decent shakeup to pull me away from that) But there, standards contribute to the overall leadership/action points pool at the start of a turn. They boost lower leadership armies and have a much more important role than a point of combat resolution.

Actually, you know, dropping the need for banners and musicians entirely is something I could completely get behind for units. That way you can model them if you wish, otherwise you can leave them behind. The Army Standard Bearers could stay around for their bonus', but the unit ones could become merely decorative. I really like that idea.

 Fenriswulf wrote:
Actually, you know, dropping the need for banners and musicians entirely is something I could completely get behind for units. That way you can model them if you wish, otherwise you can leave them behind. The Army Standard Bearers could stay around for their bonus', but the unit ones could become merely decorative. I really like that idea.

I wouldn't mind this. As I use other companies models I can't always find command options for my preferred units. Sure, nothing stops me from just saying "these guys have standards and/or trumpets", but I much prefer having them represented on the board. Scrapping command models in units solves this for me. With emphasis on "me"

So, about two hours remaining then. Hopefully I'll be home from work by then.

 edlowe wrote:
Molochs from the openday (courtesy of the mantic forum)

Spoiler:

GW called from the '90's; they want their style back.

Who's the sculptor?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 AlexHolker wrote:
I still think the Molochs are the weak point in the Abyssals line. Pot-bellies and legs half as long as they should be don't look very good.

You'd think they'd have learned a lesson.

Looks like it's time to strap in and get ready for another ride...

I will not get carried away. I will not get carried away. I will not get carried away. I will not get carried away.

Especially after that DS mayhem...

Just getting the rulebooks; there's some awesome looking Infinity buildings that need some attention and money, soon.

I will not get carried away. I will not get carried away. I will not get carried away...

 Fenriswulf wrote:
Actually, you know, dropping the need for banners and musicians entirely is something I could completely get behind for units. That way you can model them if you wish, otherwise you can leave them behind. The Army Standard Bearers could stay around for their bonus', but the unit ones could become merely decorative. I really like that idea.

I think there's a decent number of people who could get behind that idea.........

It's been raised a couple of times on the Mantic forum, and I've supported it each time.

Standards and musicians are just something more to forget in a game. Especially musicians as you tend to forget about them looking at the back of your units for the majority of the game.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
Stupid question for fans/players...

Does it at all feel weird that (as is my understanding) you never remove models from units as damage/wounds are suffered?

Watching friends play KoW Version 1, it was always the only pet-peeve I had that just seemed so strange... The 40k guy in me likes removing dead bodies from attacks... its a silly thing, but it feels like something is "happening" when going through that motion.

Warhammer Fantasy, and to an extent 40K, are unusual in that they're large or mass battle games that concentrate on individual casualty removal. A couple of historical successors to the defunct Warhammer Ancient Battles keep casualty removal, and I think there are a couple of other fantasy games that do the same, like the old Fantasy Warriors and Reaper's Warlord [citation needed], but I could rattle off a list as long as my arm of big unit-block games that take away whole units, or at least large parts of them.

Yep, it's definitely my preference for fixing Standards & Musicians. We'd still have the magic artefacts that give the same effect, so I wouldn't see the problem.

 Fenriswulf wrote:
Actually, you know, dropping the need for banners and musicians entirely is something I could completely get behind for units. That way you can model them if you wish, otherwise you can leave them behind. The Army Standard Bearers could stay around for their bonus', but the unit ones could become merely decorative. I really like that idea.

I don't think I made it clear in my first post, but yes: I agree. There's a cottage industry out there for printed historical regimental standards and the like and they look really impressive, but I'm not sure if there's many historical games that actually have rules for them. Not in the few I've read, anyway. They act as set dressing and (appropriately) unit recognition; and like I say, I guess it's assumed everyone has them, and that the cancelling effect causes them to be ignored or they're subtly woven into overall effectiveness. (I assume the former)

 Fenriswulf wrote:
Actually, you know, dropping the need for banners and musicians entirely is something I could completely get behind for units. That way you can model them if you wish, otherwise you can leave them behind. The Army Standard Bearers could stay around for their bonus', but the unit ones could become merely decorative. I really like that idea.

Yeah, you know, I'd just accepted them and not thought about it like that, but it makes perfect sense.

5 mins to go. Camping with this link (tabletop games sorted by newest).