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rollawaythestone wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

It uses plural language when describing the powers. MC's can fire two weapons a turn. Granted, it doesn't say explicitly that it can fire two a turn - but it's not unreasonable to think it can.

Henker-Kind wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

models armed with powers of the ctan as a range weapon in their shooting phase [..] each time a model uses powers of the ctan choose a model as normal

That's... a very loose interpretation imo. Using plural might just be talking about separate turns. And it's only listed once in their profile. If any other MC had a weapon listed once in their profile, it could only fire it once per turn, not like they could fire Transdimensional Thunderbolt twice in the last edition.

 RivenSkull wrote:
They're too expensive to take multiple anyway. Grabbing one or two Crytpeks for the +1 to RP is going to be normal, but we're no longer going to see 5 Crypteks and several Lords. Which sucks for people who have multiples of them :\

Yeah, I'm sitting on 15 Cryptek conversions and 7 Lord conversions

Hmmmm, I am thinking they would make awesome counts as lychguard (lords) and praetorians (crypteks).

 RivenSkull wrote:
They're too expensive to take multiple anyway. Grabbing one or two Crytpeks for the +1 to RP is going to be normal, but we're no longer going to see 5 Crypteks and several Lords. Which sucks for people who have multiples of them :\

Yeah, I'm sitting on 15 Cryptek conversions and 7 Lord conversions

there is alway apoc or ubound or whatnot

Running a bunch in Royal Courts could still be fun if you wanted to do a "crapton of powerful characters" style army.

Requizen wrote:

rollawaythestone wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

It uses plural language when describing the powers. MC's can fire two weapons a turn. Granted, it doesn't say explicitly that it can fire two a turn - but it's not unreasonable to think it can.

Henker-Kind wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

models armed with powers of the ctan as a range weapon in their shooting phase [..] each time a model uses powers of the ctan choose a model as normal

That's... a very loose interpretation imo. Using plural might just be talking about separate turns. And it's only listed once in their profile. If any other MC had a weapon listed once in their profile, it could only fire it once per turn, not like they could fire Transdimensional Thunderbolt twice in the last edition.

He's not taking it loosely though. It says they can use it in place of a rnaged attack and MC's get 2 standard. Unless it specifically says they can't I'd say they have more fuel in the tank to argue for it then against it.

Requizen wrote:

rollawaythestone wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

It uses plural language when describing the powers. MC's can fire two weapons a turn. Granted, it doesn't say explicitly that it can fire two a turn - but it's not unreasonable to think it can.

Henker-Kind wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

models armed with powers of the ctan as a range weapon in their shooting phase [..] each time a model uses powers of the ctan choose a model as normal

That's... a very loose interpretation imo. Using plural might just be talking about separate turns. And it's only listed once in their profile. If any other MC had a weapon listed once in their profile, it could only fire it once per turn, not like they could fire Transdimensional Thunderbolt twice in the last edition.

So we need a little rules debate but I think RAW is on my side. (Faq maybe)

C'Tan can't shoot multiple powers since each power translates into the same ranged weapon with different profiles, and albeit you can shoot with 2 different ranged weapons at the same target (given the MC status), you can't use the same weapon TWICE

 RivenSkull wrote:
They're too expensive to take multiple anyway. Grabbing one or two Crytpeks for the +1 to RP is going to be normal, but we're no longer going to see 5 Crypteks and several Lords. Which sucks for people who have multiples of them :\

Yeah, I'm sitting on 15 Cryptek conversions and 7 Lord conversions

You can always take a Royal Court formation attached to a normal CAD so if you REALLY want extras you can still get some.

 Red Corsair wrote:

Necrons look awesome, I am glad they will play differently.

I think my biggest gripe is that much of the odd abilities and gear are gone. They feel much more generic than what got me into Necrons with the 3rd edition codex, which makes me feel like I'm less likely to enjoy playing them.

It is indeed only listed once, but its a special profile weapon with unique rules. In fact, I think the proper interpretation of the Powers is that they are best treated as six different weapons each C'tan is armed with. That's what the language seems to suggest.

KurtAngle2 wrote:
C'Tan can't shoot multiple powers since each power translates into the same ranged weapon with different profiles, and albeit you can shoot with 2 different ranged weapons at the same target (given the MC status), you can't use the same weapon TWICE

Not sure I agree, its a list of 6 different ranged powers all with different profiles. I can see your stance now though as well.

 Red Corsair wrote:

Requizen wrote:

rollawaythestone wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

It uses plural language when describing the powers. MC's can fire two weapons a turn. Granted, it doesn't say explicitly that it can fire two a turn - but it's not unreasonable to think it can.

Henker-Kind wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

models armed with powers of the ctan as a range weapon in their shooting phase [..] each time a model uses powers of the ctan choose a model as normal

That's... a very loose interpretation imo. Using plural might just be talking about separate turns. And it's only listed once in their profile. If any other MC had a weapon listed once in their profile, it could only fire it once per turn, not like they could fire Transdimensional Thunderbolt twice in the last edition.

He's not taking it loosely though. It says they can use it in place of a rnaged attack and MC's get 2 standard. Unless it specifically says they can't I'd say they have more fuel in the tank to argue for it then against it.

actually it says "it can use them as A ranged weapon".

KurtAngle2 wrote:
C'Tan can't shoot multiple powers since each power translates into the same ranged weapon with different profiles, and albeit you can shoot with 2 different ranged weapons at the same target (given the MC status), you can't use the same weapon TWICE

-interesting

Red Corsair wrote:

Requizen wrote:

rollawaythestone wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

It uses plural language when describing the powers. MC's can fire two weapons a turn. Granted, it doesn't say explicitly that it can fire two a turn - but it's not unreasonable to think it can.

Henker-Kind wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

models armed with powers of the ctan as a range weapon in their shooting phase [..] each time a model uses powers of the ctan choose a model as normal

That's... a very loose interpretation imo. Using plural might just be talking about separate turns. And it's only listed once in their profile. If any other MC had a weapon listed once in their profile, it could only fire it once per turn, not like they could fire Transdimensional Thunderbolt twice in the last edition.

He's not taking it loosely though. It says they can use it in place of a rnaged attack and MC's get 2 standard. Unless it specifically says they can't I'd say they have more fuel in the tank to argue for it then against it.

KurtAngle2 wrote:C'Tan can't shoot multiple powers since each power translates into the same ranged weapon with different profiles, and albeit you can shoot with 2 different ranged weapons at the same target (given the MC status), you can't use the same weapon TWICE

This is what I'm trying to say.

C'Tan have one gun named "Powers of the C'Tan" I know it's not really a "gun", but it is a shooting power, so it's the same. When you shoot it, it has a random profile. You can't shoot the same "gun" twice in the same turn.

I don't know how you would interpret that any differently.

 RivenSkull wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:

Necrons look awesome, I am glad they will play differently.

I think my biggest gripe is that much of the odd abilities and gear are gone. They feel much more generic than what got me into Necrons with the 3rd edition codex, which makes me feel like I'm less likely to enjoy playing them.

Hey I feel your pain man. I am just used to it by now since they gutted all my special gear from space wolves and dark eldar. Heck I can only take a venom blade on two unit leaders out of the book now

No wolf tooth necklaces or talismans....

It stinks at first but it really does clean up the game.

powers of the C'tan is wargear

KurtAngle2 wrote:
C'Tan can't shoot multiple powers since each power translates into the same ranged weapon with different profiles, and albeit you can shoot with 2 different ranged weapons at the same target (given the MC status), you can't use the same weapon TWICE

The language suggests that they are six separate weapons, though - just organized under a single heading. In fact they even have six different weapon profiles.

Its not crystal clear, but I would think they fire two.

 Sasori wrote:
The one unit I expected to get Nerfed, Wraiths, got a huge buff...


So far, things are looking REALLY good.

They're absurdly good. One really has to wonder what on earth they were thinking writing the rules for them, other than maybe "sell lots of Wraiths". I suspect wraith spam may be the new autopilot-to-win Necron build for the next few years here.

 Henker-Kind wrote:
powers of the C'tan is wargear

So is Staff of Light. So is Gauss Flayer. So is Tesla Carbine. "Wargear" is "Guns and Armor".

 Red Corsair wrote:
You never admitted to being premature, and I don't expect you will.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
^ Heh

Regarding the C'tan, I'm still holding out hope for the duel-profiles before I declare total doom n' gloom. It's possible that GW integrated the alternate-attack after accounting for the fact that there's a wide variety targets out there that require specific kinds of attacks to deal with.

But, we'll see.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
It's pretty scary either way tbh, as the dude earlier pointed out. If the powers are completely random then the model isn't very good- if the powers can be manually selected somehow, I.E. through wargear, than it's godly and pretty cray for ~250 points. A re-roll would probably be the best middle-ground. Missed opportunity with the god-shackled there, imo.

It'll be very interesting to see what GW does.

 BlaxicanX wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:
If its appropriately costed I wouldn't have a problem with it.

A dreadnought being costed so that it matches its fluff would be nearing super-heavy/titan costs. Why in God's name would you want that?

So what's your problem with random powers if they're supported by the fluff?

My problem is with poor game mechanics. I don't care if a poor game mechanic is fluffy or not, it's still a poor game mechanic. And yes, I'm aware that the powers could be revealed to be Please don't bypass the language filter like this. Reds8n awesome- doesn't really change my point.

How many times do you intend on being wrong in a single day? Are you trying to break a record?

 Vaktathi wrote:

 Sasori wrote:
The one unit I expected to get Nerfed, Wraiths, got a huge buff...


So far, things are looking REALLY good.

They're absurdly good. One really has to wonder what on earth they were thinking writing the rules for them, other than maybe "sell lots of Wraiths". I suspect wraith spam may be the new autopilot-to-win Necron build for the next few years here.

Or at the least, we'll just have what we have now. Wraith-wing has always been one of the most powerful builds. Jy2's croissant-spam/wraithwing hybrid in particular has taken him really far.

A damn shame about not being able to put Lynchguard in a ghost-ark, though. I don't see them getting much competitive use if they have to foot-slog. They're not even a decent counter-charge unit since wraiths are so much better.

Requizen wrote:

Red Corsair wrote:

Requizen wrote:

rollawaythestone wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

It uses plural language when describing the powers. MC's can fire two weapons a turn. Granted, it doesn't say explicitly that it can fire two a turn - but it's not unreasonable to think it can.

Henker-Kind wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

models armed with powers of the ctan as a range weapon in their shooting phase [..] each time a model uses powers of the ctan choose a model as normal

That's... a very loose interpretation imo. Using plural might just be talking about separate turns. And it's only listed once in their profile. If any other MC had a weapon listed once in their profile, it could only fire it once per turn, not like they could fire Transdimensional Thunderbolt twice in the last edition.

He's not taking it loosely though. It says they can use it in place of a rnaged attack and MC's get 2 standard. Unless it specifically says they can't I'd say they have more fuel in the tank to argue for it then against it.

KurtAngle2 wrote:C'Tan can't shoot multiple powers since each power translates into the same ranged weapon with different profiles, and albeit you can shoot with 2 different ranged weapons at the same target (given the MC status), you can't use the same weapon TWICE

This is what I'm trying to say.

C'Tan have one gun named "Powers of the C'Tan" I know it's not really a "gun", but it is a shooting power, so it's the same. When you shoot it, it has a random profile. You can't shoot the same "gun" twice in the same turn.

I don't know how you would interpret that any differently.

But you have a good point. Think you are right.

rollawaythestone wrote:

KurtAngle2 wrote:
C'Tan can't shoot multiple powers since each power translates into the same ranged weapon with different profiles, and albeit you can shoot with 2 different ranged weapons at the same target (given the MC status), you can't use the same weapon TWICE

The language suggests that they are six separate weapons, though - just organized under a single heading. In fact they even have six different weapon profiles.

Its not crystal clear, but I would think they fire two.

Yea I am leaning toward them getting two a turn.

I forsee MANY C'tan and wraiths springing up in lists.

 Red Corsair wrote:

rollawaythestone wrote:

KurtAngle2 wrote:
C'Tan can't shoot multiple powers since each power translates into the same ranged weapon with different profiles, and albeit you can shoot with 2 different ranged weapons at the same target (given the MC status), you can't use the same weapon TWICE

The language suggests that they are six separate weapons, though - just organized under a single heading. In fact they even have six different weapon profiles.

Its not crystal clear, but I would think they fire two.

Yea I am leaning toward them getting two a turn.

I forsee MANY C'tan and wraiths springing up in lists.

FAQ I guess or debate :/

So IF (and I still don't entirely agree with it) they get 2 per turn, what happens if you roll the same Power twice? If you're counting each power as its own weapon, it can't be fired twice. Would you reroll it? Or would it just fail? Or would you fire it twice anyway?

 Red Corsair wrote:

 RivenSkull wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:

Necrons look awesome, I am glad they will play differently.

I think my biggest gripe is that much of the odd abilities and gear are gone. They feel much more generic than what got me into Necrons with the 3rd edition codex, which makes me feel like I'm less likely to enjoy playing them.

Hey I feel your pain man. I am just used to it by now since they gutted all my special gear from space wolves and dark eldar. Heck I can only take a venom blade on two unit leaders out of the book now

No wolf tooth necklaces or talismans....

It stinks at first but it really does clean up the game.

Yeah. Some of the changes to make the stuff more streamlined, like the new RP, make sense game wise. The removal of some of the abilities and gear just takes away from the "Robot Zombie Technology Masters" That I loved.

And I had these really awesome RP counters too :



We'll see the fluff when the codex hits the Bay, and whether I stay in the game or not.

Requizen wrote:

rollawaythestone wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

It uses plural language when describing the powers. MC's can fire two weapons a turn. Granted, it doesn't say explicitly that it can fire two a turn - but it's not unreasonable to think it can.

Henker-Kind wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

models armed with powers of the ctan as a range weapon in their shooting phase [..] each time a model uses powers of the ctan choose a model as normal

That's... a very loose interpretation imo. Using plural might just be talking about separate turns. And it's only listed once in their profile. If any other MC had a weapon listed once in their profile, it could only fire it once per turn, not like they could fire Transdimensional Thunderbolt twice in the last edition.

I have to agree, if it lists just "Powers of the C'Tan" on the profile, then that is one shooting attack.

Requizen wrote:
So IF (and I still don't entirely agree with it) they get 2 per turn, what happens if you roll the same Power twice? If you're counting each power as its own weapon, it can't be fired twice. Would you reroll it? Or would it just fail? Or would you fire it twice anyway?

 SilverDevilfish wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:

Requizen wrote:

rollawaythestone wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

It uses plural language when describing the powers. MC's can fire two weapons a turn. Granted, it doesn't say explicitly that it can fire two a turn - but it's not unreasonable to think it can.

Henker-Kind wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Henker-Kind wrote:
C'tans can shoot twice! (I think: http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874)

Where do you see it say that?

models armed with powers of the ctan as a range weapon in their shooting phase [..] each time a model uses powers of the ctan choose a model as normal

That's... a very loose interpretation imo. Using plural might just be talking about separate turns. And it's only listed once in their profile. If any other MC had a weapon listed once in their profile, it could only fire it once per turn, not like they could fire Transdimensional Thunderbolt twice in the last edition.

He's not taking it loosely though. It says they can use it in place of a rnaged attack and MC's get 2 standard. Unless it specifically says they can't I'd say they have more fuel in the tank to argue for it then against it.

actually it says "it can use them as A ranged weapon".

And guess what? C'tans have only a single "Powers of the C'tan" in the profile, and that counters as a "special" ranged weapon.

Clear enough my friend

So erm, any actual new models besides the Overlord and those tokens?

 RivenSkull wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:

 RivenSkull wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:

Necrons look awesome, I am glad they will play differently.

I think my biggest gripe is that much of the odd abilities and gear are gone. They feel much more generic than what got me into Necrons with the 3rd edition codex, which makes me feel like I'm less likely to enjoy playing them.

Hey I feel your pain man. I am just used to it by now since they gutted all my special gear from space wolves and dark eldar. Heck I can only take a venom blade on two unit leaders out of the book now

No wolf tooth necklaces or talismans....

It stinks at first but it really does clean up the game.

Yeah. Some of the changes to make the stuff more streamlined, like the new RP, make sense game wise. The removal of some of the abilities and gear just takes away from the "Robot Zombie Technology Masters" That I loved.

And I had these really awesome RP counters too :



We'll see the fluff when the codex hits the Bay, and whether I stay in the game or not.

best counters ever!