Looted Power Armour

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**BrianDavion**

Wyzilla wrote:
Furyou Miko wrote:
Wyzilla wrote:
Furyou Miko wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
SOB armor is also of clearly lighter construction then astartes armor.

All the protective ability, none of the extraneous drivel.

No, it quite clearly isn't. The abdomen is completely unarmored on sisters, and their power armor is thinner in such areas as the pauldrons.

Not to mention their bolters and other weapons are cut-down and smaller versions compared to Astartes gear. Without the augmented strength, humans can't wield weapons like bolters, astartes power fists, or probably the pauldrons.

However even with augmented strength, Astartes struggle to move in their armor if the power is cut.

I am not fighting you over this again. The codex clearly states that the armour provides the same protection. The codex clearly states that their wargear is just as effective, in absolute terms, with that of the Astartes in every way, except for specifically noting that Sororitas power armour does not have the same life support capabilities.

You are still wrong.

Except the lore doesn't support you at all given that Sisters get utterly massecred by things Astartes would normally survive, or indeed be massecred by Astartes despite supposedly having the same quality armor (especially Flesh Tearers). Basing it all off game mechanic abstractions is both asinine and silly when the TT cannot properly represent anything, the armor is visibly thinner on sisters, their entire torso is unarmored by ceramite, and other sources such as FFG clearly state it being weaker, which makes sense given that the Sisters have watered down tech in the power armor and weapon deparment (especially power weapons).

So no, you've never actually had any evidence, and rather have always just been clinging to a single line and game mechanic in one series of books where multiple other sources contradict it. When something is contradicted multiple times, and there is only one point of evidence you're relying on, it's far more likely that your "evidence" is simply an outlier and an exception to the rule, not the actual rule itself.

Not to mention that given how Sisters power armor is skin-tight, it is already immediately inferior as it would protect far less against concussive force, and they don't have augmented bodies either. A heavy bolter shell fired at the chest would probably instantly kill the Sister form the kinetic energy alone while an Astartes would probably be able to walk that hit off given the thickness of Space Marine PA.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Furyou Miko wrote:
Your opinion doesn't count because you think Space Marines can walk through lava.

Actually, they have, and I can probably pull up quotes on the subject as well from the Tome of Fire series.

And no, IIRC that image is of a Canoness, this is just a normal Sister from FFG.

Spoiler:

And it's not like it's FFG's invention, this here is from either the 4th or 5th Edition if I remember correctly.

Spoiler:

Note again the corset is not made of ceramite like the above or lower pieces. This appears to be a modern depiction trend of the Sisters, and it doesn't make much sense considering that doesn't look to be any more protective than Bridgadine armor from the 14th Century.

in fairness even if their armor is equal the Sisters give up some HUUUUGE edges to the Marines. the Marines are biologicly simply tougher. with all their space marine enhancements

**dusara217**

Ashiraya wrote:
It's from Dark Heresy: Ascension, so it's canon. Pages 143-144

Ignatus pattern power armours are all fine examples of Mechanicus artisans. Each of them are individuality crafted only for representatives of the Holy Inquisition. Of course not as durable as Adeptus Astartes power armours, the Ignatus-pattern is far better design than those sold to nobles, rogue traders and other agents of the Imperium. Like every other power armour variant, Ignatus too is made of thick ceramite armour plates and incorporated electro-muscles so the user can even use the power armour in the first place. The optional helmet protects the wearer from toxic gasses and allows the wearer to breathe underwater and even survive in vacuum as long as suit has power. The helmet has photo-visors so the user can see in the dark and an automatically closing visor renders blind-grenades useless against the wearer. It is also possible to use a backpack for the suit which acts as external power-source. With this power-backpack the wearer can use his armour for five continuous days in battle conditions.
Because the Inquisition often has to deal with Ruinous Powers and other heretical forces, Ignatus suits are commonly inlaid with hexagrammic wards.

So the Ignatus Armour essentially has a micro power source that doesn't give it nearly the amount of operating time that a backpack would.

**BrianDavion**

the ability to operate for prolonged periods of time in the field isn't a feature on ALL PA no. but it's a feature on ALL Space Marine armor

**Furyou Miko**

Oh, it's Dark Heresy fluff... Dark Heresy, where Sisters use civilian bolters, can sometimes even fight ORKS (gasp!) and fire laser beams from their eyes.

Pfft.

**BrianDavion**

Furyou Miko wrote:
Oh, it's Dark Heresy fluff... Dark Heresy, where Sisters use civilian bolters, can sometimes even fight ORKS (gasp!) and fire laser beams from their eyes.

Pfft.

actually dark heresy notes they have their own specific pattern of bolter.

**Furyou Miko**

It still calls it a civilian model, to differentiate it from real - which is to say Space Marine - models.

Historically, by every non-DH source, Sisters use Godwyn De'az pattern bolters, a slightly longer-barelled variant on the Godwyn pattern used by Space Marines.

**Co'tor Shas**

Yeah, DH, and FFG in general are pretty good, but they are pretty much always on the losing side of conflicting canon. It also brought us Deathwatch, something I really hate to use in fluff discusious, bolter porn through and through.

**Keep**

the text is canon, the artwork is not because it obviously conflicts with what is written. And if there is one thing that is the most inconsistent in 40k, its the artwork. It's not the first time artwork does not match with what is written

**Psienesis**

... it's from a third-party company. Nothing in an FFG publication is "canon", because 40K doesn't have a canon.

**Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl**

dusara217 wrote:
Can somebody please explain to me why Sisters of Battle all get Artificer level crftmanship on their armour when Artificer armour takes centuries to produce? Makes no fething sense that their armour is as effective as SM Power Armour

I can. The Ecclesiarchy is likely the most powerful, wealthy and influential of all the Imperial organizations. Sometime they have 3 or even more members among the High Lords of Terra. They build kilometers high statue for the fun.

Spoiler:

Artificer-level craftsmanship takes centuries to produce, and will cost 1/10 of the total production of a whole world to build? I will order a few more thousands of them just to be sure then, I would not like to have a shortage of them if they take so long to produce!

**Furyou Miko**

Seems like dusara, like so many here, is too blinded by SM-fanboyism to ever listen to reason and accept that the Sisters are actually just as awesome as Marines, if not more so, because they do all that stuff (such as fighting off daemonic incursions as per Codex: Grey Knights, 7e) while still being human...

**Co'tor Shas**

And aren't still a relatively small force? Sort of like special forces or something? It's not like equipping the guard. And many sisters are not going to die in battle because of the armour. There would be few actual purchases needed, mostly repair. The sisters represent some of the best warriors in un-augmented humans around IMO.

**Furyou Miko**

Yep. According to the only official numbers we have from GW, Space Marines actually outnumber Sisters... although the number of Sisters has increased since 2nd edition (I think the 6th edition rulebook places them at about 900,000 rather than the 160,000 of the 2e codex), it's still not gotten that much bigger in absolute terms. For reference, there are 1,000,000 Space Marines.

**Co'tor Shas**

Yeah, so quite easy to equip for something like the eccelarcitythingimabob.

**Furyou Miko**

Ecclesiarchy. Kind of like Eccleston, but more curvy.

**Co'tor Shas**

Every time I start spelling one of these things, I get to point where I just go "screw it".

**Ashiraya**

Furyou Miko wrote:
Seems like dusara, like so many here, is too blinded by SM-fanboyism to ever listen to reason and accept that the Sisters are actually just as awesome as Marines, if not more so, because they do all that stuff (such as fighting off daemonic incursions as per Codex: Grey Knights, 7e) while still being human...

Well, your SoB fangirlism balances it quite well I'd say. (:

**Furyou Miko**

Mine is backed up by studio fluff, what's your excuse?

**Ashiraya**

Mine does not rely on making up rules for canon priority to function.

**Co'tor Shas**

Umm, this thread has nothing to do with rules for sisters...

**Furyou Miko**

No, but Sisters are the go-to example for non-Astartes-power-armour, so the conversation is relevant... aside from attempts to put us down because how dare we impugn on Space Marine territory. :/

**Co'tor Shas**

No, that was a response to Ashiraya silly.

**dusara217**

Furyou Miko wrote:
Seems like dusara, like so many here, is too blinded by SM-fanboyism to ever listen to reason and accept that the Sisters are actually just as awesome as Marines, if not more so, because they do all that stuff (such as fighting off daemonic incursions as per Codex: Grey Knights, 7e) while still being human...

No, I just don't see how the Ecclesiarchy could requisition gear of that quality, since the only faction outside of Space Marines that can build armour like that (the Mechanicum) disagrees on certain points of doctrine and this has led to them being on bad terms.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Furyou Miko wrote:
Mine is backed up by studio fluff, what's your excuse?

Mine is backed up by logic. The Space Marines can barely keep their hands on a couple thousand Artificer suits, and they' literally considered to be the Emperor's Angels and thus get the best of everything. How can you actually think that I'd believe that Sisters could keep their hands on over 900,000 suits of Artificer Armour?

**Co'tor Shas**

I'd just say that they are a different pattern (obviously). In fact they may be all from a SoB only pattern of which they already had most of from the original sisters. It's not like they buy 100 new suits a day.

And "civilian" power armour is defiantly has less of the unneeded bulk of SMPA.

**dusara217**

Co'tor Shas wrote:
And aren't still a relatively small force? Sort of like special forces or something? It's not like equipping the guard. And many sisters are not going to die in battle because of the armour. There would be few actual purchases needed, mostly repair. The sisters represent some of the best warriors in un-augmented humans around IMO.

Space Marines have been around for 10k years and have been building Artificer Armour themselves the whole while. And yet, most Space Marine Chapters can barely field more than five Artificer Armour Suits. You actually expect me to believe that the Ecclesiarchy is going to be able to get 900k Suits of armour that take CENTURIES to build? Plus, SoB numbers have been growing nonstop since the Terran Crusade, so each SoB would have to be waiting for their Armour to be completed before being able to engage in combat. They would have to be waiting for decades.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Co'tor Shas wrote:
I'd just say that they are a different pattern (obviously). In fact they may be all from a SoB only pattern of which they already had most of from the original sisters. It's not like they buy 100 new suits a day.

And "civilian" power armour is defiantly has less of the unneeded bulk of SMPA.

The unneeded bulk of SMPA gives increased protection due to more Ceramite being on the armour and making it thicker and more difficult to penetrate

**Co'tor Shas**

I'm talking about stuff like paulroooons. Just some normal shoulder plates would be better.

**Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl**

dusara217 wrote:
No, I just don't see how the Ecclesiarchy could requisition gear of that quality, since the only faction outside of Space Marines that can build armour like that (the Mechanicum) disagrees on certain points of doctrine and this has led to them being on bad terms.

Tell me: who is the single most powerful organization of the whole Imperium?
Hint: it starts with High, and finish by Terra.
The Sisters were founded by the guy that had basically filled that council by his sock puppets. Including, yes, the Grand Master of the Officio Assassinorum. He made the master of the freaking assassins his dog. That is just how powerful he got. And you wonder how they could get artificer-armor grade armors?

The Ecclesiarchy and the Mechanicus might not be best buddies, but the Mechanicus need resources and the Ecclesiarchy is filthy rich.

dusara217 wrote:
The Space Marines can barely keep their hands on a couple thousand Artificer suits, and they' literally considered to be the Emperor's Angels and thus get the best of everything.

I am sorry that discovering it is not the case hurts your feelings

.

**Ashiraya**

Since you are so certain of your case, I am sure you have plenty of sources specifically asserting that SoB have greater access to AA than Astartes do.

**dusara217**

Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
dusara217 wrote:
No, I just don't see how the Ecclesiarchy could requisition gear of that quality, since the only faction outside of Space Marines that can build armour like that (the Mechanicum) disagrees on certain points of doctrine and this has led to them being on bad terms.

Tell me: who is the single most powerful organization of the whole Imperium?
Hint: it starts with High, and finish by Terra.
The Sisters were founded by the guy that had basically filled that council by his sock puppets. Including, yes, the Grand Master of the Officio Assassinorum. He made the master of the freaking assassins his dog. That is just how powerful he got. And you wonder how they could get artificer-armor grade armors?

The Ecclesiarchy and the Mechanicus might not be best buddies, but the Mechanicus need resources and the Ecclesiarchy is filthy rich.

dusara217 wrote:
The Space Marines can barely keep their hands on a couple thousand Artificer suits, and they' literally considered to be the Emperor's Angels and thus get the best of everything.

I am sorry that discovering it is not the case hurts your feelings .

Ok, now, a few things:
1.) I have not had my feelings hurt in years. Most of the things people get offended over are quite trivial and I consider it quite silly to get offended at all. It's why I don't care about being political correct, and when I hear people insulting me I only really care because then we get to have a fun contest of colorful insults where I inevitably come out on top with my hilariously strange insults.
2.) It's not a matter of how power or wealth, it's a matter of supply. There simply are not enough Artificer Suits in the IoM to outfit the SoB with them - the cost alone would be such that entire Sectors would be left bereft of defense and would fall. And Vandire only had a few hundred Daughters of the Emperor at best, not 900k, so no, that doesn't work.

**Mr Morden**

Vandire only had a few hundred Daughters of the Emperor at best

nope when Vadire finally fell :

the Brides of the Emperor, who numbered some 10,000 fighters by this time

Codex Sisters of Battle, p13.

also this direct quote from the current Codex

Clad in ceramite power armour, they carry an awesome array of weaponry with which to vanquish their enemies; the incredible wealth of the Ecclesiarchy ensures that they are equipped with the best wargear the Imperium has to offer.

note ; "Best wargear" - does that sound like civilian qulaity equipment?

Alos same form offical current Codex

Constructed from thick ceramite plates, the power armour worn by the Adepta Sororitas is based upon the same archaic systems as that worn by the brethren of the Adeptus Astartes. It provides the same degree of armoured protection,

Pretty much case closed as regards the level of protection that is offered :