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For those in the know, what is the difference between 30k and 40k?

As for a boxed set, that is highly unlikely. At the same time, releasing a box set like that at a reasonable price reflects GW's primary competitive advantage: GW has the talent and size to release high quality plastics at a lower price than any opposition.

So a box set of Marines would be something which no other game company could match.

30k has lost tech, different squad organization and a different flavor.

Oh, and the Marines don't have ATSKNF.

Am I the only person that doesn't get the massive excitement over this?

- The Pre-Heresy miniatures have been available for years now from Forgeworld and they're not significantly more expensive than GW plastics in most places. Newflash: These new miniatures are not going to significantly cheaper either, and the chances are they will be bumped up in price.
- 'Plastic'? The word is heralded as though it's the panacea for everything. Honestly, if working with resin and converting is too much for you, switch to board games or lego. The only real advantage I can see to this is if you have a moral disagreement with superglue.
- Hasn't the 'cool' period for Pre-Heresy long since passed? It had such a buzz 5-6 years ago when a load of imaginative modellers started splicing up plastic kits and 3rd party parts on those enigmatic TCG pictures. Now, the books have been going on so long that I half expect the story to end with The Emperor and Horus rolling around fighting on a desert island, Horus turns into some kind of angry black cloud and then it turns out they were dead all along. The 'limited edition' hardbacks, wrapped in leather made from Chinese people or whatever, are so expensive that the fact that they can be sold at all can be used single-handedly as an argument that the global recession has ended.

I feel just like when Armageddon was first released and the general comment was "OMFG HOW INCREDIBLE OMG WHAT HAVE THEY DONE", as though our understand of the physical laws of reality and been re-written, and no-one actually seemed to be see was that all GW had done was tell everyone to do what I had been doing since about the age of 9 - "put all of your miniatures down on the table at once, the points system is only there for guidance" OMG I can feel reality rending in half. What a joke.

Honestly, I think it shows how flat releases have been over previous years that something like this can get hearts all aflutter.

So the current rumors for 2015 releases are a lineup of:

1) End Times Khorne (Nex weeks in March)
2) AdMech: (Mid April to May)
3) HH Boxed Set (After middle of May)

Is that the general consensus?

If this pans out to be true, they are gonna make a LOT of money.

I wonder what is planned for between the Khorne releases and AdMech. Any solid rumors??

The excitement is largely in the easier availability of plastics through your local hobby shop mixed with the fact that GW taking over the core of the casting from FW means other things can get focus.

Also, no the buzz of excitement hasn't worn off. FW is only halfway through the series and we have plenty more to see in the series. There is also room to supplement some of the codexes (Orks, Eldar, Dark Eldar, maybe IG to represent PDFs the Marines fought against to bring planets into the Imperium) with Heresy era supplements or alternate lists to allow you to play some Crusade era battles.

There is plenty of cow left to milk on this still.

 Pacific wrote:
Am I the only person that doesn't get the massive excitement over this?

- The Pre-Heresy miniatures have been available for years now from Forgeworld and they're not significantly more expensive than GW plastics in most places. Newflash: These new miniatures are not going to significantly cheaper either, and the chances are they will be bumped up in price.
- 'Plastic'? The word is heralded as though it's the panacea for everything. Honestly, if working with resin and converting is too much for you, switch to board games or lego. The only real advantage I can see to this is if you have a moral disagreement with superglue.
- Hasn't the 'cool' period for Pre-Heresy long since passed? It had such a buzz 5-6 years ago when a load of imaginative modellers started splicing up plastic kits and 3rd party parts on those enigmatic TCG pictures. Now, the books have been going on so long that I half expect the story to end with The Emperor and Horus rolling around fighting on a desert island, Horus turns into some kind of angry black cloud and then it turns out they were dead all along. The 'limited edition' hardbacks, wrapped in leather made from Chinese people or whatever, are so expensive that the fact that they can be sold at all can be used single-handedly as an argument that the global recession has ended.

I feel just like when Armageddon was first released and the general comment was "OMFG HOW INCREDIBLE OMG WHAT HAVE THEY DONE", as though our understand of the physical laws of reality and been re-written, and no-one actually seemed to be see was that all GW had done was tell everyone to do what I had been doing since about the age of 9 - "put all of your miniatures down on the table at once, the points system is only there for guidance" OMG I can feel reality rending in half. What a joke.

Honestly, I think it shows how flat releases have been over previous years that something like this can get hearts all aflutter.

Right there with ya, man.
I think the excitement is for people having difficulty acquiring FW products stateside due to the prohibitively high shipping costs. You're right- the FW resin models aren't significantly more expensive than plastic stuff, but throwing a $30-50 extra charge for shipping sucks. Not everyone is going to drop near $400 to qualify for free shipping.

Additionally, now FLGS retailers will have it; not even they carried the FW stuff unless they paid cost and then marked it up.

For me, I'm lukewarm about this: I already own a lot of FW stuff, and actually prefer working with the resin they produce. Aesthetically, a lot of the line Marine units aren't anything special. I prefer the HH era tanks and Primarchs.

Full disclosure: I have bought every HH big book. They are awesome. Disposable income is cool.

 Pacific wrote:
- The Pre-Heresy miniatures have been available for years now from Forgeworld and they're not significantly more expensive than GW plastics in most places. Newflash: These new miniatures are not going to significantly cheaper either, and the chances are they will be bumped up in price.

Except a basic 10 man tactical squad is $40 from GW and is nearly $90 from FW for a Heresy era unit. The basic 5-man squad from FW doesn't include any weapons for the unit either. That's a pretty significant price difference.

 Hive City Dweller wrote:
So the current rumors for 2015 releases are a lineup of:

1) End Times Khorne (Nex weeks in March)
2) AdMech: (Mid April to May)
3) HH Boxed Set (After middle of May)

Is that the general consensus?

If this pans out to be true, they are gonna make a LOT of money.

I wonder what is planned for between the Khorne releases and AdMech. Any solid rumors??

HH Box set has been said to NOT be a May release by both Lords of Wargaming and Hastings. We need to stop saying May for it's release already.

 ClockworkZion wrote:
HH Box set has been said to NOT be a May release by both Lords of Wargaming and Hastings. We need to stop saying May for it's release already.

So... end of May then?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:
HH Box set has been said to NOT be a May release by both Lords of Wargaming and Hastings. We need to stop saying May for it's release already.

So... end of May then?

Easy there Seinfeld, we might not be able to contain our gut busting laughter after that one.

Seriously though, "not in May" keeps getting ignored for whatever source claimed May and I'm just getting tired of seeing it crawl from the grave it keeps being thrown into.

SadPanda already said this:

Sad Panda wrote:
People should listen to Lords of Wargaming regarding the timing, and I don't think May was part of the original Harry & Hastings rumor.

Not sure who added "May" to the rumor, but that is wrong. I am not even sure if a release-date has been set, but I'd guess 6+ months easily. Some of the other things briefly mentioned by H&H are positively mid-2016 at best.

So more likely to be August at the earliest (just in time for all the people coming back from summer holiday and the like). AKA about the right time for when GW does a lot of it's big releases.

 Whumbachumba wrote:

 Pacific wrote:
- The Pre-Heresy miniatures have been available for years now from Forgeworld and they're not significantly more expensive than GW plastics in most places. Newflash: These new miniatures are not going to significantly cheaper either, and the chances are they will be bumped up in price.

Except a basic 10 man tactical squad is $40 from GW and is nearly $90 from FW for a Heresy era unit. The basic 5-man squad from FW doesn't include any weapons for the unit either. That's a pretty significant price difference.

Yep, more than double the cost is not a minor thing, and that's before shipping!
Further, the kit still has far fewer options that a plastic kit would likely have. Finally, by the time you figure in shipping costs and the ability to get around 20% off of regular GW product, you're looking at FW costing 3 times what a standard marine squad costs!

Even with the inevitable price bump for the new kit, you're still looking at a more than 50% savings over FW.

As for working with resin vs plastic, I mostly agree with you, but not working with a material whose dust is potentially hazardous is an issue not to be overlooked.

 Pacific wrote:
Am I the only person that doesn't get the massive excitement over this?

- The Pre-Heresy miniatures have been available for years now from Forgeworld and they're not significantly more expensive than GW plastics in most places. Newflash: These new miniatures are not going to significantly cheaper either, and the chances are they will be bumped up in price.
- 'Plastic'? The word is heralded as though it's the panacea for everything. Honestly, if working with resin and converting is too much for you, switch to board games or lego. The only real advantage I can see to this is if you have a moral disagreement with superglue.
- Hasn't the 'cool' period for Pre-Heresy long since passed? It had such a buzz 5-6 years ago when a load of imaginative modellers started splicing up plastic kits and 3rd party parts on those enigmatic TCG pictures. Now, the books have been going on so long that I half expect the story to end with The Emperor and Horus rolling around fighting on a desert island, Horus turns into some kind of angry black cloud and then it turns out they were dead all along. The 'limited edition' hardbacks, wrapped in leather made from Chinese people or whatever, are so expensive that the fact that they can be sold at all can be used single-handedly as an argument that the global recession has ended.

I feel just like when Armageddon was first released and the general comment was "OMFG HOW INCREDIBLE OMG WHAT HAVE THEY DONE", as though our understand of the physical laws of reality and been re-written, and no-one actually seemed to be see was that all GW had done was tell everyone to do what I had been doing since about the age of 9 - "put all of your miniatures down on the table at once, the points system is only there for guidance" OMG I can feel reality rending in half. What a joke.

Honestly, I think it shows how flat releases have been over previous years that something like this can get hearts all aflutter.

I agree with all of that. Heresy. More space marines on space marines except with the smallest of cosmetic differences. Yawn. Ship sailed long ago.

 Whumbachumba wrote:

 Pacific wrote:
- The Pre-Heresy miniatures have been available for years now from Forgeworld and they're not significantly more expensive than GW plastics in most places. Newflash: These new miniatures are not going to significantly cheaper either, and the chances are they will be bumped up in price.

Except a basic 10 man tactical squad is $40 from GW and is nearly $90 from FW for a Heresy era unit. The basic 5-man squad from FW doesn't include any weapons for the unit either. That's a pretty significant price difference.

Ah, in that case I certainly take that point back - hadn't realised the FW sets were that expensive!

 Pacific wrote:

 Whumbachumba wrote:

 Pacific wrote:
- The Pre-Heresy miniatures have been available for years now from Forgeworld and they're not significantly more expensive than GW plastics in most places. Newflash: These new miniatures are not going to significantly cheaper either, and the chances are they will be bumped up in price.

Except a basic 10 man tactical squad is $40 from GW and is nearly $90 from FW for a Heresy era unit. The basic 5-man squad from FW doesn't include any weapons for the unit either. That's a pretty significant price difference.

Ah, in that case I certainly take that point back - hadn't realised the FW sets were that expensive!

for a few years it was like 1.50 per pound, but now that the pound is back up to $2 it made forge world pretty expensive Once again. A plastic option is sorely missed by people who started fw armies when fw was cheaper thanks to a weak pound.

A lot of people who were starting hh armies around here have found themselves putting the breaks on that idea.

Personally I'd rather it just be marine on marine. The game plays more balanced when every army uses the same basic lists with mostly minor rule alterations to differentiate them. The moment they add xenos to make people happy moment there will be broke eldar/necron armies ruining the balance.

 Pacific wrote:
Am I the only person that doesn't get the massive excitement over this?

- The Pre-Heresy miniatures have been available for years now from Forgeworld and they're not significantly more expensive than GW plastics in most places. Newflash: These new miniatures are not going to significantly cheaper either, and the chances are they will be bumped up in price.
- 'Plastic'? The word is heralded as though it's the panacea for everything. Honestly, if working with resin and converting is too much for you, switch to board games or lego. The only real advantage I can see to this is if you have a moral disagreement with superglue.
- Hasn't the 'cool' period for Pre-Heresy long since passed? It had such a buzz 5-6 years ago when a load of imaginative modellers started splicing up plastic kits and 3rd party parts on those enigmatic TCG pictures. Now, the books have been going on so long that I half expect the story to end with The Emperor and Horus rolling around fighting on a desert island, Horus turns into some kind of angry black cloud and then it turns out they were dead all along. The 'limited edition' hardbacks, wrapped in leather made from Chinese people or whatever, are so expensive that the fact that they can be sold at all can be used single-handedly as an argument that the global recession has ended.

I feel just like when Armageddon was first released and the general comment was "OMFG HOW INCREDIBLE OMG WHAT HAVE THEY DONE", as though our understand of the physical laws of reality and been re-written, and no-one actually seemed to be see was that all GW had done was tell everyone to do what I had been doing since about the age of 9 - "put all of your miniatures down on the table at once, the points system is only there for guidance" OMG I can feel reality rending in half. What a joke.

Honestly, I think it shows how flat releases have been over previous years that something like this can get hearts all aflutter.

Sorry dude, I just had to LOL at this entire post. No offense but you must be a Xenos player.

30k is superior to 40k in nearly every way, and I sincerly hope that they don't start adding Xenos rules to the system. You can't rely on out Riptiding or out waveserpenting your opponent. 30k is a tactical game, because everyone for the most part has access to the same units and wargear. Sure the legions have some unique rules and a few unique special characters, but their own special rules don't break the game, because the other legions have rules of their own to balance things out. You can't just show up to a Heresy tournament with 5 Waveserpents or 15 wraiths and expect to place in the top 10.

As far as popularity, I will say this. The Horus Heresy Weekender which is in Nottingham England sold out within days of the tickets going on sale. 300 tickets gone in a matter of days. Hell last year I even flew across the Atlantic from Michigan to attend. Adepticon, the largest con in the US has been running Heresy events and their 1850 tournament has been getting bigger and bigger each year.

As far as the quality all I got is this...



The large expensive books are quite possibly the most incredible gaming resources I have ever seen. Background and fluff for multiple legions, as well as the Adeptus Mechanicus and Imperial Army. Rules for immaculate campaigns and dozens of special units and characters including primarchs. If you have a problem spending a little more on the full HH books, buy the Crusade army list Red book. Seriously its no more expensive that GW's assembly line codices. Pick up the Isstvan campaign book for the price of another codex and get the rules for dozens more named characters and units, along with the rules to run your own legion.

Seriously the Space Marine Codex and Sentinels of Terra was over 80 bucks, for a hundred bucks you get two books with close to 100 entries for basic units, super heavies, named characters, and special units. It is absolutely worth it.

If they were to come out with the basic armour marks 2-4 in plastic as well as basic contemptors and some Cataphractii the Horus Heresy would explode and Forgeworld would probably double their business. They could switch their production lines over from tons and tons of basic infantry to more special units, awesome vehicles and characters.

It makes perfect sense, because the most expensive component of a Horus heresy army is the front line troops, I know several guys who would start legion armies if they were a little cheaper.

As said above a ten man tactical squad in Mk III with bolters would be close to 90 bucks, its 40 for a ten man tactical in plastic. Oh yea in 30k you can have 20 man tactical squads.

Read Galaxy in Flames and Flight of the Eisenstein and you will understand why people love the Heresy.

valace2 wrote:
30k is superior to 40k in nearly every way, and I sincerly hope that they don't start adding Xenos rules to the system.

I disagree with this. The game could certainly benefit from adding in Crusade era Eldar, Dark Eldar and Orks (I mean who doesn't want HUGE Orks?), not to mention any other race they wanted to give a spotlight to (I know the game is human centric, but it doesn't stop me from wanting to see more aliens in the game. GW has shown us interesting ideas and I'm game for more).

valace2 wrote:
You can't rely on out Riptiding or out waveserpenting your opponent.

Tau don't exist in 30k. And the Wave Serpent is in need of fixing, but that doesn't mean the Eldar don't deserve a Supplement at least to let them get into the 30k spirit.

valace2 wrote:
30k is a tactical game, because everyone for the most part has access to the same units and wargear.

Mechanicum and Solar Auxilla are already breaking the mold (not to mention you can run an army of Titans and I'd argue the Knight codex fits into 30k just fine too), adding in a couple of the established Xeno races we know where around at the time won't hurt, at least as long as the rules are done correctly.

valace2 wrote:
Read Galaxy in Flames and Flight of the Eisenstein and you will understand why people love the Heresy.

ONLY read those two books or else you'll see why the novels aren't given that much respect.

Not trying to bag on them, I mean I love me some Crusade/Heresy era stuff but some of the books are AWFUL.

Horus Rising, False Gods, Betrayer, and the First heretic were all very good as well.

Having read some HH novels, and acknowledging this can be a matter of opinions, I will say in terms of quality they're hit and miss. Some pretty decent ones (nothing extraordinary) and some pretty awful others.

"- 'Plastic'? The word is heralded as though it's the panacea for everything. Honestly, if working with resin and converting is too much for you, switch to board games or lego. The only real advantage I can see to this is if you have a moral disagreement with superglue. "

Lost all credibility once you said this.

One of the problems with this hobby isn't the balance of Codexes, isn't the old or new miniatures, isn't the supplements that some races get and others don't..

No, it's people acting like they own the hobby and anyone that doesn't like it their way can get off the train.

Chill out. Nobody is forcing you to buy anything, and if other people get some happiness out of stuff that doesn't make you happy? You're just going to have to deal with that bub.

On that note, plastic is superior. Not only is it easier to work with for a wider range of hobbyists (from novice to expert) but it goes together faster and is cheaper for GW to produce in the long run. Not to mention plastic kits that GW makes are rife with options, whereas Forgeworld kits are very... what you see is what you get.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

valace2 wrote:
30k is a tactical game, because everyone for the most part has access to the same units and wargear.

Mechanicum and Solar Auxilla are already breaking the mold (not to mention you can run an army of Titans and I'd argue the Knight codex fits into 30k just fine too), adding in a couple of the established Xeno races we know where around at the time won't hurt, at least as long as the rules are done correctly.

The 40K Knight codex is unnecessary, as the Knight list in HH4: Conquest basically shows you what GW could have done if their design team had two braincells to rub together.

I wonder if the models in this box set will be usable in the Inquisition boxed game that came out last year?

Oh wait

 Brother SRM wrote:
I wonder if the models in this box set will be usable in the Inquisition boxed game that came out last year?

Oh wait

I think GWs head of marketing definitively stated that all imaginary boxed sets would be cross-compatible in his last pod-cast.

A board games with 30K blood angels against the aliens from murder would be cool .

But if it is a new board game i still would be interested in the mini's

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

valace2 wrote:
30k is a tactical game, because everyone for the most part has access to the same units and wargear.

Mechanicum and Solar Auxilla are already breaking the mold (not to mention you can run an army of Titans and I'd argue the Knight codex fits into 30k just fine too), adding in a couple of the established Xeno races we know where around at the time won't hurt, at least as long as the rules are done correctly.

The 40K Knight codex is unnecessary, as the Knight list in HH4: Conquest basically shows you what GW could have done if their design team had two braincells to rub together.

Good point about Conquest, ad hominen attacks aside. The Knight codex isn't bad, the only real issue I see with it is the Adamantium Lance formation. Could it have been better? Sure. But launching a new product line with an allies codex and a single kit (that FW both built off of and then later built their own different bodied variant of), but for the limited scope release it was I think it was done correctly. I look forward to the eventual update to the codex where they add more Knight variants, but for what it is (a codex that basically broke ground and eventually led to FW's variants), I'll take it.

Also "I don't like this" really isn't grounds for insulting the intellegence of others. I don't care if people don't like things, I just feel it's a step too far to insult people you just because you don't like things.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 plastictrees wrote:
I think GWs head of marketing definitively stated that all imaginary boxed sets would be cross-compatible in his last pod-cast.

Yeah, we don't really need the trolling. Can we keep on topic with the actual rumors instead of the made up nonsense please?

 Pacific wrote:
- 'Plastic'? The word is heralded as though it's the panacea for everything. Honestly, if working with resin and converting is too much for you, switch to board games or lego. The only real advantage I can see to this is if you have a moral disagreement with superglue.

Plastic is superior because it is relatively rare to find warping, bubbles, or other production defects in the model. It also cuts, shaves, and files easier for cleaner conversion work. Resin shrinks at different rates when cooling in the mold, leading to inconsistent shape of the final product. This is why larger Forge World models have so much trouble fitting together properly. You may or may not like them but Glottkin, Thanquol, and those new Khorn Berserker models all fit together exactly as they're supposed to without needing a lot of work by the modeller. Show me a large FW model that does that. I've said it before and I'll say it again, friends don't let friends buy Storm Eagles.

As for glue, Testers master modeller cement is easier to work with than super glue which often requires an accelerant like Zip Kick to work. Depending on the resin (warmahordes' PVC stuff) it can have trouble holding even with an accelerant. Epoxy glue is often used for large resin models and that requires a lot of prep work with mixing, cups, stirring straws, etc. just for the glue alone. Compare that to the clean, quick, and permanent nature of plastic cement and you'll see why people like it better.

I've never plastic glued myself to a model.

Super glue on the other hand....

So yeah, plastic all the way.

Also never Zip Kick your hand when it has glue on it by accident.

 ClockworkZion wrote:



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 plastictrees wrote:
I think GWs head of marketing definitively stated that all imaginary boxed sets would be cross-compatible in his last pod-cast.

Yeah, we don't really need the trolling. Can we keep on topic with the actual rumors instead of the made up nonsense please?

Haha. Very sorry to interrupt the guessing what GW are going to do, debates about Knights in 30k, the merits of plastic over resin, and glue tips. We'll be right back on track now I'm sure.

I'd love to have a pre-heresy plastic kit for Space Marines.

The Heresy era has always been my favorite part of the 40K setting.

If this is legit, and I hope it is, maybe we can later on get a plastic kit for the Land Raider Proteus as well.

ClockworkZion wrote:Yeah, we don't really need the trolling. Can we keep on topic with the actual rumors instead of the made up nonsense please?

Wait, this entire thread is about a generic plastic Horus Heresy boxed set that's half the price of existing boxed sets.

Which part of this thread isn't about made up nonsense?