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 Alpharius wrote:
The details of the Horus Heresy, revealed...

Rules for Primarchs...

And now plastic Horus Heresy models AND a game from GW?!?

This truly is...The End Times!

Actually, 40K is the End Times. 30K/Horus Heresy is 'The Beginning of the End Times'.

Yeah well, I meant IRL guy!

Actually actually, 40k means we're halfway to the end times, it'll take another 10k years before the prophesy is fulfilled.

Also, FW and BL have been covering every minor detail of the HH at an excruciatingly slow pace for years now! In any case, it'll be nice to see some of the older marks concentrated in one box in plastic. I don't, however, relish the idea of *yet* another contemptor dreadnought being released.

I thought it meant when emperors light goes out finally.

Weeeeelllllll, if the Visions of War is to be believed, the Adeptus Custodes will be getting one at the very least.

 warboss wrote:
In any case, it'll be nice to see some of the older marks concentrated in one box in plastic. I don't, however, relish the idea of *yet* another contemptor dreadnought being released.

More Mk II, Mk III and Mk IV (helmets only on the last - not a fan of the armour itself)? Very much yesly please!
Plastic Contemptors? Oh Hell Yes! I need 10-11 Contemptors, 2-3 Deredeos and 1-2 Mk IV/V Dreads to fill out my dream Salamanders list, and the cheaper I can get them, the better!

 Paradigm wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:
Is there really this vast, untapped market of heresy players who have sat out because of FW's prices? I would imagine that the people who want to play HH have ponied-up the cash and are happily painting their Mark-whatever armor. I get that it's popular and that I'm in the minority because it doesn't apeal to me, I just don't see what customer this is intended for.

I reckon there is. FW prices (especially, as I pointed out before, for the basics of an army) are pretty insane, even by GW standards, and plastic HH marines would get me using GW product for my 30k stuff rather than Anvil/Kromlech, which is good for them. I'd hazard a guess that there are many like myself that would love to play 30k on a significant scale, but balk every time we see the cost.

For a 10-man tac squad, you're looking at 47 GBP, or about $72. If you want them to, you know, have bolters to fire, that's another 11.50 GBP or about $18.

So it's about 58.5 GBP or $90 for 10 *basic* guys.

Now, if you want legion-specific add-ons, heads will run you about 11.50 GBP/$18 for 10, torsos 11.50 GBP/$18 for 5, and pads 9.50/$15 for 5 sets. You see where this is going. A full squad of 20 (HH tacs go up to 20) with all the trimmings would set you back 224 GBP or about $345.

Clearly you don't *need* all the trimmings, but I think price is a MAJOR barrier for people. What's more, we also probably shouldn't underestimate how much of this is about presenting an alternative to certain other sources of FW that are out there. Reasonably priced plastic infantry would keep more of that money flowing to Nottingham instead of certain other countries.

Edit: Corrected my math above.

To me this is great for the consumer. I see some of these getting on ebay and going for a decent price.

I wonder when was the last time someone bought a carnifex brood at $70?

And forge world will sue gw for invalidating their whole buisness.
oh and i just seen the post some way above no fw and gw both have factories in england.

 the_Armyman wrote:
Is there really this vast, untapped market of heresy players who have sat out because of FW's prices? I would imagine that the people who want to play HH have ponied-up the cash and are happily painting their Mark-whatever armor. I get that it's popular and that I'm in the minority because it doesn't apeal to me, I just don't see what customer this is intended for.

I would have jumped all over this 5 years ago. I hate resin, love plastic, and really loved the Black Library Horus Heresy novels. Now, though.... I expect the prices to be almost as big a joke as the current Black Library.

 e.earnshaw wrote:
And forge world will sue gw for invalidating their whole buisness.
oh and i just seen the post some way above no fw and gw both have factories in england.

Erm they are part of the same company...

 reds8n wrote:
Somewhat old news I'm afraid.



However as far as one can see the thread(s) where this was discussed have either moved on or finished so we'll leave this one open for now.

Also, old news for those of us that made our own Pre-Heresy/Heresy miniatures from conversions, back in 2008 or so!

*Into Pre-Heresy before it was cool*

 Carlson793 wrote:

 warboss wrote:
In any case, it'll be nice to see some of the older marks concentrated in one box in plastic. I don't, however, relish the idea of *yet* another contemptor dreadnought being released.

More Mk II, Mk III and Mk IV (helmets only on the last - not a fan of the armour itself)? Very much yesly please!
Plastic Contemptors? Oh Hell Yes! I need 10-11 Contemptors, 2-3 Deredeos and 1-2 Mk IV/V Dreads to fill out my dream Salamanders list, and the cheaper I can get them, the better!

Don't get me wrong. I really like the normal contemptor design ever since I saw it in the Visions of HH art book back in 5th edition (I didn't play the ccg). I loved the FW contemptor enough when they first released it to make it my first direct from FW order ever. I was a bit miffed when the "relic" version came out a few months later as I would have preferred that one. Then came the contemptor for each and every legion which I wasn't a fan of. YMMV but I would have preferred an upgrade kit to the relic with the bits for each legion (similar to the rhino kits) and to devote those resources to making more of the individual units and characters. And then came the weaponized yellow M&M doredo...

I'm in all honesty fine with a single plastic contemptor but I do hope that GW doesn't follow even further in FW's pioneering steps and make even more of them. Normally, I'd say it would be very unlikely but the Blood Angels nothing really different but you get a completely different plastic terminator assault and tactical squad kit indicates otherwise. Twisting a good idea and driving it into the ground seems to be a hallmark of main GW of late.

http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/The-Horus-Heresy#


does this url work for people ...?

It does, but it doesn't load anything.

Ditto.

Interesting.

At least it doesn't give a 404 error, so it means it's probably just claimed and has to be filled in.

 e.earnshaw wrote:
And forge world will sue gw for invalidating their whole buisness.
oh and i just seen the post some way above no fw and gw both have factories in england.

GW owns the brand, they control it and can do whatever they want. Hardly the first time they've done plastic versions of popular FW kits, plastic SM drop pods, plastci IG valkyries, chapter specific vehicle doors and icons, venerable dreadnoughts and Leman Russ variants etc.

As far as "invalidating FW's entire business", hardly. FW was doing fine making kits long before HH came out and will continue to be fine. There's always some new thing that GW doesn't want to produce a kit for, and FW has shown they're perfectly capable of coming up with new vehicles and units things to make, some of which later gets produced in plastic by GW. Been happening since FW first came on the scene.

I would have jumped all over this 5 years ago. I hate resin, love plastic, and really loved the Black Library Horus Heresy novels. Now, though.... I expect the prices to be almost as big a joke as the current Black Library.

Exactly this. I'm pretty much over GW at this point, but when HH first released I would have bought up the plastics like hotcakes.

As far as "invalidating FW's entire business", hardly. FW was doing fine making kits long before HH came out and will continue to be fine. There's always some new thing that GW doesn't want to produce a kit for, and FW has shown they're perfectly capable of coming up with new vehicles and units things to make, some of which later gets produced in plastic by GW. Been happening since FW first came on the scene.

Hmm, lets just hope that FW will still be the ones making the HH books instead of GW. No offense, but the artwork and background produced by GW since the 4th edition has been rather disappointing. FW's Horus Heresy books are really amazing, would be a shame if those would disappear with GW taking over...

Maybe that means FW will start doing figures other than HH related stuff when GW proper starts muscling in?

A man can dream.

I'd be interested in the game aspects of this, especially if it's played differently than 40k.

A bit of nostalgia for me as well, as some of my first GW figures were of the old antiquated armor sets when I'd asked my dad to get some guys in power armor- they were most certainly not the beakies of the times. I want to say they were Iron and Thunder armor sets I had, and possibly some of the Mk V armors as well.

 Alpharius wrote:
The details of the Horus Heresy, revealed...

Rules for Primarchs...

And now plastic Horus Heresy models AND a game from GW?!?

This truly is...The End Times!

It's long been said that the day GW main start producing Horus Heresy, it was a sign they're in trouble and trying to create a new lease of life.

Not that it has to be a bad thing but I rather fear that when it moves from Forgeworld to standard GW, it will become diluted and made more generic. Forgeworld are doing all the best stuff at the moment, GW just make childish rubbish.

Curiouser and curiouser...

 Malika2 wrote:
Hmm, lets just hope that FW will still be the ones making the HH books instead of GW. No offense, but the artwork and background produced by GW since the 4th edition has been rather disappointing. FW's Horus Heresy books are really amazing, would be a shame if those would disappear with GW taking over...

Agreed! Especially now that the codex books have become picture books almost entirely devoid of art, it's great to see that FW has raised the bar for their own publications.

 Carlson793 wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:
Is there really this vast, untapped market of heresy players who have sat out because of FW's prices? I would imagine that the people who want to play HH have ponied-up the cash and are happily painting their Mark-whatever armor. I get that it's popular and that I'm in the minority because it doesn't apeal to me, I just don't see what customer this is intended for.

Actually, I think it might be the other way around. I think GW might be trying to lure previously 40K-only players in for HH then, due to limited unit selection from GW, get them interested in buying FW stuff so they can field competitive units like Sicarans and Typhons and Spartans (oh my!). Not that FW necessarily needs the extra sales, but it can't hurt the company to get people previously uninterested in FW products to make a purchase.

I suppose that makes sense from a business perspective. I just wonder if at some point, the whole game just becomes so saturated in power armor that it starts to lose even more customers. I was never one of those guys that complained about SMs, but if we see a HH plastic boxed set and a new set of core rules featuring SMs fighting it out in the far distant past, I might turn into one of those guys.

So, just to summarize: 40K with a majority of the game composed of power armor, HH is power armor all the time, and rumors of Warhammer Fantasy introducing a new faction of heavily armored knights similar to Space Marines. Anyone at all concerned about that?

 BrookM wrote:

 Malika2 wrote:
Hmm, lets just hope that FW will still be the ones making the HH books instead of GW. No offense, but the artwork and background produced by GW since the 4th edition has been rather disappointing. FW's Horus Heresy books are really amazing, would be a shame if those would disappear with GW taking over...

Agreed! Especially now that the codex books have become picture books almost entirely devoid of art, it's great to see that FW has raised the bar for their own publications.

Not only that, but that the artwork that does appear in these books seems to be rather generic. Which is a real shame since GW's artwork was one of those things that really set it apart from its peers.

 the_Armyman wrote:

 Carlson793 wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:
Is there really this vast, untapped market of heresy players who have sat out because of FW's prices? I would imagine that the people who want to play HH have ponied-up the cash and are happily painting their Mark-whatever armor. I get that it's popular and that I'm in the minority because it doesn't apeal to me, I just don't see what customer this is intended for.

Actually, I think it might be the other way around. I think GW might be trying to lure previously 40K-only players in for HH then, due to limited unit selection from GW, get them interested in buying FW stuff so they can field competitive units like Sicarans and Typhons and Spartans (oh my!). Not that FW necessarily needs the extra sales, but it can't hurt the company to get people previously uninterested in FW products to make a purchase.

I suppose that makes sense from a business perspective. I just wonder if at some point, the whole game just becomes so saturated in power armor that it starts to lose even more customers. I was never one of those guys that complained about SMs, but if we see a HH plastic boxed set and a new set of core rules featuring SMs fighting it out in the far distant past, I might turn into one of those guys.

So, just to summarize: 40K with a majority of the game composed of power armor, HH is power armor all the time, and rumors of Warhammer Fantasy introducing a new faction of heavily armored knights similar to Space Marines. Anyone at all concerned about that?

While the underlined is true, you'd be surprised at how divergent the armies get even with them sharing the core legion list. FW has handled the legions very, very well IMO. It obviously helped that they were able to build them all from scratch, instead of having all the legacy issues that entangle the GW studio.

I don't care how expensive they are. If they actually make them, I'm happy.

 Malika2 wrote:

 BrookM wrote:

 Malika2 wrote:
Hmm, lets just hope that FW will still be the ones making the HH books instead of GW. No offense, but the artwork and background produced by GW since the 4th edition has been rather disappointing. FW's Horus Heresy books are really amazing, would be a shame if those would disappear with GW taking over...

Agreed! Especially now that the codex books have become picture books almost entirely devoid of art, it's great to see that FW has raised the bar for their own publications.

Not only that, but that the artwork that does appear in these books seems to be rather generic. Which is a real shame since GW's artwork was one of those things that really set it apart from its peers.

Older B&W stuff gets coloured in, though the campaign books do feature new pieces thankfully and sometimes it's actually quite good. Though most of it is playing safe by sticking to the established already done stuff.