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Hey Dakka, I'd like to get some opinions on the LotD on the tabletop.
I personally love the concept, and I love them on the table.

But how do you guys feel about them?
Over powered? Under powered? Just right?
What would you change, if anything?

From what little I've seen, they seem worth it, although having to DS can be a pain if your opponent plans around it.

I like them and overall they seem like a cool idea, but the downside is they don't benefit from any Chapter Tactics.

They can also be pretty pricey. Having 3+/3++ means that against many opponents, you're rolling 3's to save wound regardless... and against high volume of fire they can often be shot down before they even get to do much.

Even then... i'm not sure that their role really is. They're super Tacticals... without Obsec, and who lose Chapter Tactics (which to be fair often means nothing), but i'm not entirely sure what they can do which anything else could do nearly as well, but at lower cost.

What they bring is 3 Melta/plasma per 5 guys (special, heavy, combi) that can reliably DS without much chance of Scatter, on a pretty durable frame, and if they survive the turn, can move at full effect and do it again.

The key here is that they ignore cover. So if your list has a glaring weakness - they can go seek that weakness out regardless of where your enemy puts it. They are expensive but you get a pretty reliable squad that could easily pay for itself the turn it comes in. I think throwing some ablative wounds on them is worth it too as it make your opponent deal with them with more than they probably wanted to.

 Paradigm wrote:
What they bring is 3 Melta/plasma per 5 guys (special, heavy, combi) that can reliably DS without much chance of Scatter, on a pretty durable frame, and if they survive the turn, can move at full effect and do it again.

Which is fine... but they are pretty expensive, and more-so if equipped that way. In terms of hypothetical efficiency, a group of Melta Dominions for Adepta Sororitas, in an Immolator, are just as good, and cost dramatically less.

LotD, like a lot of 40k, are totally viable, but just definitely don't hit the threshold of "OMG WOW!" which often determines what makes a cut in most lists.

Couldn't Sternguard, geared to the gills do the same thing from a Pod, and have even more versatility with their ammo types, etc?

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:

Which is fine... but they are pretty expensive, and more-so if equipped that way.

On the contrary, they're the cheapest way for Space Marines to deep strike 3 meltas or 3 plasma weapons - that alone has value.

Add in their special rules (invul, ignores cover, SnP, re-roll scatter), and they're great. Killing skimmers is an obvious use for them, but there are other practical uses for them as well. They can wreck TEQ infantry with a plasma alpha strike, or tarpit scary MCs and walkers with their invul saves. Obviously they're not some sort of super unit - they die just as easily to small arms fire as a regular marine, and they don't have the amazing firepower that something like a command squad can bring.

Didn't realize they're the cheapest. My only local opponent who runs them, inexplicably runs a unit of 10, with no special anything, and the end result usually is a comically failed deep-strike followed by their death. :-p

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
My only local opponent who runs them, inexplicably runs a unit of 10, with no special anything, and the end result usually is a comically failed deep-strike followed by their death. :-p

Yeah, that's a terrible way to run them. For the same price you could put ten Sternguard in a pod, who could do so much more damage with their special ammunition than LotD could do with their ignores cover bolters.

Yeah... he's a good guy... but a TERRIBLE player.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:

 Paradigm wrote:
What they bring is 3 Melta/plasma per 5 guys (special, heavy, combi) that can reliably DS without much chance of Scatter, on a pretty durable frame, and if they survive the turn, can move at full effect and do it again.

Which is fine... but they are pretty expensive, and more-so if equipped that way. In terms of hypothetical efficiency, a group of Melta Dominions for Adepta Sororitas, in an Immolator, are just as good, and cost dramatically less.

LotD, like a lot of 40k, are totally viable, but just definitely don't hit the threshold of "OMG WOW!" which often determines what makes a cut in most lists.

Couldn't Sternguard, geared to the gills do the same thing from a Pod, and have even more versatility with their ammo types, etc?

That Immolator is easily blown up and has less mobility compared to the DS Ability. Coupled with 3++ and ignoring cover, there's lots of potential for pure slaughtering.
They're totally worth it in any army, but shine most in two specific lists:
1. Vulkan making their Melta better as long as they're part of the same detachment.
2. In any Raptors list with Lias. Reserve shenanigans with a Locator Beacon in case...

http://murphy80.hubpages.com/hub/Legion-of-the-Damned-Codex-Warhammer-40k

The only problem of LotD is that they share slots with Sternguard.

But now they have their own supplement, so that's not a problem anymore. Less than 160p for 3 meltas are awesome

LotD are the only non-vehicle unit in the Space Marine roster which can move and shoot with a Multi-Melta and ignores cover to boot. This is HUGE, especially when a tiny 5 man squad can have an additional melta and a combi-melta on the sarge as well.

Pretty good method of deleting a non-bubble-wrapped enemy tank in an alpha strike and you dont even have to eat a round of enemy fire to do it.

Alternately, you can go MEQ/TEQ killing by arming them with plasma, but I prefer the melta loadout because a dead tank means usually around 150 points of the enemy gone, while killing 7 tacs or 3 terminators in a turn is only around 98/120ish plus plasma always brings the chance of overheating with it.

totally worth it. especially if you're running them with vulkan as your warlord (his bonus to melta isn't a chapter tactic, so it still applies to LotD).

I run two 5-man units full of melta in my 1500+ point salamanders lists. they have a pretty reasonable chance to land where you want them, they have a small deep-strike footprint, they don't need cover due to their 3++, they're fearless (and cause fear, iirc) so they don't run if you lose a model or two, ignoring cover is *huge* against certain targets (looking at you, skimmers) and they're not half bad in close combat if you need to tie something up. all that for under 160 points? yes, please.

the biggest downside that I have personally seen is that since they must arrive by deep strike, you never know exactly when you're going to get them. you can mitigate this somewhat with reserve manipulation shenanigans, but there's always an element of randomness vs. having them start on the board.

 varl wrote:
the biggest downside that I have personally seen is that since they must arrive by deep strike, you never know exactly when you're going to get them. you can mitigate this somewhat with reserve manipulation shenanigans, but there's always an element of randomness vs. having them start on the board.

That's one advantage a melta command squad or sternguards have - turn 1 deep strike with a drop pod. LotD are a turn 2 beta strike at best, a turn 4 annoyance at worst.

I like them, ignore cover, fear, fearless, 3 meltas per 5 man. Looks cool, 3+ 3++, technically daemons (i think)

 DanielBeaver wrote:

 varl wrote:
the biggest downside that I have personally seen is that since they must arrive by deep strike, you never know exactly when you're going to get them. you can mitigate this somewhat with reserve manipulation shenanigans, but there's always an element of randomness vs. having them start on the board.

That's one advantage a melta command squad or sternguards have - turn 1 deep strike with a drop pod. LotD are a turn 2 beta strike at best, a turn 4 annoyance at worst.

true enough. and it's worth noting that the drop pod you get with the command squad can potentially contest an objective that your command squad/sternguard have moved on from. I still like my LotD better, though

They also do a hell of a number on broadsides sitting in ruins, as those meltas will double them out with no armour or cover, just need to survive the interceptor fire, but if you've got some stormtalons coming in on the same turn...

Their most underrated rule is fear - I've seen a squad of 5 legionnaires send a 30 strong mob of Boyz running in CC, just a shame they can't sweep them due to Slow and Purposeful. But then that rules means they can move and shoot the MM / PC and then charge, so its swings and roundabouts.

Worth running as their own detachment imo rather than using up elite slots (except with previously mention Vulkan combo) - some of the warlord traits are fantastic (but at the cost of having a very squishy warlord) while the Animus Malorum relic is hilarious when it comes off.

Anyway, LotD are awesome - you wont regret giving them a go

They're a steal for the price. Basically what 1000 sons must have been + sorc.

I was thinking the same thing with the legion i was really considering them as a detachment with a shunt heavy GK army. Running incinerators for them blobs, Dreadknights to tarpit, pair of libs aiming for gate of infinity and a couple of melta loaded lotd.

Plan is to hold out til the legion come rocking down shunt and gate across the board and be in their face. All im thinking now is how to get a reserve roll mod so i have a better chance of controlling when they come in. yeah it will lack bodies on the field but the whole "oh S**T why is all that in my shooty army face" will make me smile

 XdeadpoolX wrote:
I was thinking the same thing with the legion i was really considering them as a detachment with a shunt heavy GK army. Running incinerators for them blobs, Dreadknights to tarpit, pair of libs aiming for gate of infinity and a couple of melta loaded lotd.

Plan is to hold out til the legion come rocking down shunt and gate across the board and be in their face. All im thinking now is how to get a reserve roll mod so i have a better chance of controlling when they come in. yeah it will lack bodies on the field but the whole "oh S**T why is all that in my shooty army face" will make me smile

A fair warning I can speak to though... Taking very elite/low-model count allies with GK... that way lies madness. :-p

I don't know what you play, scenario/objective-wise, but anything Maelstrom-esque is already a tough proposition for Knights who urgently want more bodies. Like you I tried to go ultra-elite when I played them almost exclusively, and the objective format caused a lot of hair pulling.

Sometimes I run 2 LoTD with one 5 man squad using artifact that gives them FNP and plasma and other one with meltas. I think its maybe 15 points for the artifact, but you have to run LoTD as a detachment to gain access to it.
Gives you versatility in what types of units you deal with.

They are a fantastic unit and one of my favorite to run in the game. I love sticking them with all plasma (Rifle, Pistol and Canon) and then having them deep strike in and blast away the same turn (due to relentless) while ignoring any cover the enemy has.

I absolutely love them.

 cvtuttle wrote:
They are a fantastic unit and one of my favorite to run in the game. I love sticking them with all plasma (Rifle, Pistol and Canon) and then having them deep strike in and blast away the same turn (due to relentless) while ignoring any cover the enemy has.

I absolutely love them.

Just remember, they're not relentless. SaP is the one you're looking for.

 Ond Angel wrote:

 cvtuttle wrote:
They are a fantastic unit and one of my favorite to run in the game. I love sticking them with all plasma (Rifle, Pistol and Canon) and then having them deep strike in and blast away the same turn (due to relentless) while ignoring any cover the enemy has.

I absolutely love them.

Just remember, they're not relentless. SaP is the one you're looking for.

Because I'm forgetting, what's the difference?

Slow and purposeful can't overwatch

 DoomShakaLaka wrote:
Slow and purposeful can't overwatch

Or make a Sweeping Advance.
Also, only one model needs SaP for them all to have it.

 krazynadechukr wrote:
http://murphy80.hubpages.com/hub/Legion-of-the-Damned-Codex-Warhammer-40k

Just reverse searched your image.

Why dude? Why?