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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 02:40:34
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Member of the Ethereal Council
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Like I said, genitals are such an odd thing to base an entire identity on.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 02:42:55
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Fixture of Dakka
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Though they remain a good indicator for which locker room to use.
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"The Omnissiah is my Moderati" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 02:44:13
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Huge Hierodule
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Tannhauser42 wrote:
"Cormier told the paper she feels the gym could provide a third set of changing stalls for transgendered people."
Doesn't that defeat the point of changing your physical gender? If you were born a man and are now a woman and want to live as a woman, why should you be forced to use a separate (but equal  ) room and broadcast your life decisions to everyone?
Some of us don't want to get dragged into gender debates that go nowhere every time we need a pee or to change our clothes.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 02:44:14
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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cincydooley wrote:
I just don't think that would fly in a lot of the United States. Culturally, we're still pretty conservative as a whole regarding people being naked around each other, especially when we don't know them.
Except in the gym.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 02:47:43
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Member of the Ethereal Council
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Alex C wrote:
Though they remain a good indicator for which locker room to use.
Hmmm nope. Its like having seperate bathrooms or locker rooms for skin or hair color. It is just something determined by genetics.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 02:51:41
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Fixture of Dakka
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hotsauceman1 wrote: Alex C wrote:
Though they remain a good indicator for which locker room to use.
Hmmm nope. Its like having seperate bathrooms or locker rooms for skin or hair color. It is just something determined by genetics.
And locker rooms differentiate by this genetic trait, so if you have balls it's probably advisable to use the one intended for people with balls.
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"The Omnissiah is my Moderati" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 02:53:26
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Member of the Ethereal Council
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But why? Why seperate from those who have balls from those who have ovaries. They are both Gonads.
I want to know, other then protecting them from harm because they hurt when hurt, why do genitals matter so much and who has which one?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 02:53:26
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Sniping Reverend Moira
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hotsauceman1 wrote:[
Hmmm nope. Its like having seperate bathrooms or locker rooms for skin or hair color. It is just something determined by genetics.
It really isn't.
Also, I think old guys in the locker room that do that gak are disgusting. Automatically Appended Next Post: hotsauceman1 wrote:But why? Why seperate from those who have balls from those who have ovaries. They are both Gonads.
I want to know, other then protecting them from harm because they hurt when hurt, why do genitals matter so much and who has which one?
Because for those of us that have regular sex, we're able to see, first hand, the very real differences between the sex organs.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/08 02:54:27
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 02:56:22
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Huge Hierodule
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Sigvatr wrote:1 person going to the opposite sex's locker room with 3 people = 1 person inconveniencing 3 people.
1 person going in his own sex's locker room despite person thinking he's not male / female = 1 inconvenienced person.
Do the math.
Seriously, though, before the golden social justice shower comes raining down again: in a locker room, nobody gives a poo about what you think you are. If you look like a man to others, you're man to them. If you look like a woman to others, you're a woman to them. If you purposefully mix that up, then it's you purposefully causing trouble. If you feel that not setting people up would let you fall into a deep existential crisis, then you have extremely serious problems.
If you feel, for whatever reason, oppressed, then the proper way is to adress the studio owner / your major etc. and make a call for unisex dressing rooms or any similar reason. Trying to force your opionion / ideas upon others is just poor behavior. Yes, it might be that others are just bigots, but provoking them by purposefully setting them up and thus causing negative experiences is the worst way to handle the issue.
I'm a trans woman who goes to the gym. There's a neutral private room I use. I'm too scared of rapists and Roseannes to use either shared room.
1 trans woman going into female locker room with 3 people = maybe three people inconvenienced by their misconceptions, maybe one person inconvenienced by bigots. (Us "social justice shower" try our best to dispel some of those misconceptions by challenging guys who joke about 'I'm going to claim to identify as a woman to get in the ladies locker room', though criticising rape culture is a sure fire way to get yourself denounced as a 'feminazi'; we just can't win)
1 trans woman going into male locker room = 1 person absolutely bloody terrified of real and significant danger.
When women freak out about trans women, they report us to the bathroom police. When men freak out about trans women, they murder us. Your maths use binary 'yes/no' conditions for 'is someone disturbed' without taking into account the scale of the situations involved.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 02:58:06
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Sniping Reverend Moira
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I'm personally still confused if a "trans woman" is a penis that identifies as a woman or a vagina that identifies as a man.
It's all very confusing.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 02:58:48
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Huge Hierodule
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Alex C wrote:locker rooms differentiate by this genetic trait, so if you have balls it's probably advisable to use the one intended for people with balls.
If some people with balls who are happy about having balls could stop murdering people with balls who aren't happy about having balls, that'd help.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:00:27
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Member of the Ethereal Council
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cincydooley wrote:I'm personally still confused if a "trans woman" is a penis that identifies as a woman or a vagina that identifies as a man.
It's all very confusing.
Trans Woman= Male>Female
Trans Man=Female>Male
You always use the word they want to be associated with
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:01:40
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Fixture of Dakka
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lindsay40k wrote: Alex C wrote:locker rooms differentiate by this genetic trait, so if you have balls it's probably advisable to use the one intended for people with balls.
If some people with balls who are happy about having balls could stop murdering people with balls who aren't happy about having balls, that'd help.
Sorry, I had no idea that men murdering transexuals in locker rooms was such a large and consistent problem.
I'm out.
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"The Omnissiah is my Moderati" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:02:06
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests
Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.
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I won't claim to know what a "Roseanne" is, but I think this says more about you than it does about other people. Walking around constantly afraid of rape? Get counselling.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:06:36
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Huge Hierodule
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Alex C wrote: lindsay40k wrote: Alex C wrote:locker rooms differentiate by this genetic trait, so if you have balls it's probably advisable to use the one intended for people with balls.
If some people with balls who are happy about having balls could stop murdering people with balls who aren't happy about having balls, that'd help.
Sorry, I had no idea that men murdering transexuals in locker rooms was such a large and consistent problem.
I'm out.
It's not, because if a trans women actually goes in a men's room after transitioning, it's probably because she's in a male prison. And in that environment, attackers generally have other things on their mind than murder.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:12:06
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Sniping Reverend Moira
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Additionally, I've never been in a locker room with these mythical "changing stalls."
All the ones I've ever been in have benches and lockers.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:15:42
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Huge Hierodule
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H.B.M.C. wrote:
I won't claim to know what a "Roseanne" is, but I think this says more about you than it does about other people. Walking around constantly afraid of rape? Get counselling.
Refers to Roseanne Barr, who during her presidential campaign decided to kick trans women under the bus.
The third comment in this thread was "time for me to identify as a woman and go peep at people in the women's locker room" and I'm the one who is being advised to seek counselling
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:21:44
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Sniping Reverend Moira
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lindsay40k wrote:
The third comment in this thread was "time for me to identify as a woman and go peep at people in the women's locker room" and I'm the one who is being advised to seek counselling
Do we need to start including #sarcasm for you?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:27:50
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests
Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.
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lindsay40k wrote:The third comment in this thread was "time for me to identify as a woman and go peep at people in the women's locker room" and I'm the one who is being advised to seek counselling
You seem to be seeing rapists behind every corner. You've mentioned it in damn near every post you've made so far.
So... yes.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:36:31
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Huge Hierodule
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:42:56
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Liche Priest Hierophant
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Change/locker/bath rooms are separated by sex, not gender. While your gender may be that of a woman/man, if you are transgender pre-op (so sexually male/female respectively) you should use that room (and therefore post-op use the female/male respectively)
In the current system (which I'm not saying is right or wrong) if a transwoman was using a female room pre-op, they were in the wrong as sexually they would still be male, and therefore should have been using the male room.
That said, it may be time for unisex change/locker/bath rooms to be the norm, if only so stupid stuff like this doesn't come up.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:43:08
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Sniping Reverend Moira
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Um, no.
That's a whole lot of bs.
If you see that around every corner, that's on you. Not womanhood.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:44:58
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Colonel
This Is Where the Fish Lives
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cincydooley wrote:
Um, no.
That's a whole lot of bs.
If you see that around every corner, that's on you. Not womanhood.
It's a good thing your life spent as a women has given you the clarity to make that claim.
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d-usa wrote:"When the Internet sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending posters that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing strawmen. They're bringing spam. They're trolls. And some, I assume, are good people." |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:52:20
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Huge Hierodule
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Actually, they're generally separated by an icon of a person wearing a skirt and an icon of a person wearing trousers, with the minutiae of what exactly this means being down to the organisation running the venue and the law of the land.
Which, in this case, produces the result of 'if you're a woman you don't have to go into the trousers room regardless of how your gender was assigned at birth'.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/03/08 03:54:48
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:55:00
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Fixture of Dakka
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cincydooley wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
hotsauceman1 wrote:But why? Why seperate from those who have balls from those who have ovaries. They are both Gonads.
I want to know, other then protecting them from harm because they hurt when hurt, why do genitals matter so much and who has which one?
Because for those of us that have regular sex, we're able to see, first hand, the very real differences between the sex organs.
Well spoken, sir.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:56:22
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Sniping Reverend Moira
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ScootyPuffJunior wrote: cincydooley wrote:
Um, no.
That's a whole lot of bs.
If you see that around every corner, that's on you. Not womanhood.
It's a good thing your life spent as a women has given you the clarity to make that claim.
I don't have to be woman to know that someone calling it "womanhood" is fething bs.
Obviously we don't have enough women here to support that, but I know plenty of women that would attest that they don't go walking around worried that the next rapist is around the corner.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 03:59:58
Subject: Re:Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Last Remaining Whole C'Tan
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I think the gym made the right call. The lady that was upset is free to vote with her dollars. Automatically Appended Next Post: cincydooley wrote:[Obviously we don't have enough women here to support that, but I know plenty of women that would attest that they don't go walking around worried that the next rapist is around the corner.
The unintended irony of this is that it comes on the heels of many, many people ITT claiming that trans people going into locker rooms are potential child molesters or peeping toms. I mean, that "fear of molestation" has been a pretty 2 way street in this thread.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/08 04:01:37
lord_blackfang wrote:Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote:The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 04:03:26
Subject: Re:Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Sniping Reverend Moira
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Ouze wrote:
The unintended irony of this is that it comes on the heels of many, many people ITT claiming that trans people going into locker rooms are potential child molesters or peeping toms. I mean, that "fear of molestation" has been a pretty 2 way street in this thread.
Has anyone actually claimed that?
I know when I make a similar comment it was entirely in the context of creepy ass perverts taking advantage of it.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 04:17:14
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Glorious Lord of Chaos
The burning pits of Hades, also known as Sweden in summer
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cincydooley wrote:I don't have to be woman to know that someone calling it "womanhood" is fething bs. Obviously we don't have enough women here to support that, but I know plenty of women that would attest that they don't go walking around worried that the next rapist is around the corner. No, walking around ever-worried about rape is not a key part to being a woman. In normal situations, there is no need to be afraid. OTOH there's very easy indeed to be a privileged (yes I used that word, deal with it) man and wave off concerns from transpeople, since very few of you are part of one of the (if not -the-) most disprivileged group in society. Numbers. The biggest fairy tale ITT seems to be the villainous 'fake transgender' - sure, those who abuse the help and respect given to transgender people exist (and that really does not help the transpeople's cause) but honestly, what's the actual risk of one of the transgender bogeymen peeping on your butt? The attention it is given by media is not proportional to its actual representation. Seems like a trivial thing, really, when considered in the context of the debate. Meanwhile, this happens. Someone care to run the math? Automatically Appended Next Post: cincydooley wrote: Ouze wrote: The unintended irony of this is that it comes on the heels of many, many people ITT claiming that trans people going into locker rooms are potential child molesters or peeping toms. I mean, that "fear of molestation" has been a pretty 2 way street in this thread. Has anyone actually claimed that? I know when I make a similar comment it was entirely in the context of creepy ass perverts taking advantage of it. Which actually raises the question, what about those who are both creepy ass perverts and transgender? They are, after all, people like us, who vary between heroes and creeps. One does not exclude the other. Although I guess that would be picking at the minority of an already tiny minority. So you can consider this just a questioning of the mutual exclusivity. At least in theory. In practice, it's quite possible that if you are a serious transgender you've seen enough gak to realise that jeopardising what you so tenously have is really not a good idea. Either way, blanket statement is blanket.
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This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2015/03/08 04:27:37
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/08 04:23:08
Subject: Going to the gym just became more complicated
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Member of the Ethereal Council
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cincydooley wrote:
Because for those of us that have regular sex, we're able to see, first hand, the very real differences between the sex organs.
Wow, I thought we where having a civil argument. And you bust out an insult against my person. Jeez dude.
And to answer your statement. So? There is a different in function between curly and Straight her, light and dark skin, so why dont we seperate them?
Why doe what someone has between their legs and on their chest honestly matter so much?
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