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 Talys wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
Eldar have a number of things that could be moved to the LOW slot.

Eldrad
Avatar
WK

That's a lot of LoW models for faction (in the sense that they compete for the single LoW slot). There's still Revenant too. I think they'd have to look at it as which ones become an either/or situation, and which ones someone would like to put on the table at the same time.

I'm totally up for a BT sized Avatar!!

Considering what it’s supposed to be (a fragment of a war god) if they gave the Avatar a rules bump and a new mini on par with the BT, it could be awesome, and fit nicely into GW’s “gota have a big kit” release pattern. And probably sell like hotcakes.

As a plus it would make all the times it dies like a chump in the BL books/other fluff that more impressive if the tiny old model gets replaced with an 8” tall walking deity.

I agree that the Avatar would make sense as a Lord of War.

Now that it's being redone in plastic, with a new codex to pimp a new stat line, I'm afraid we can look forward to a $115 Avatar model that's 6-9" tall.

Hopefully he's fast. Like +6" to his run move or something! And maybe the god of war can even run and charge?

 Nevelon wrote:
Eldar have a number of things that could be moved to the LOW slot.

Eldrad
Avatar
WK

Given that C'Tan (which are more or less the same concept as an Avatar) and Bloodthirsters were not moved to the LoW slot, I seriously doubt the Avatar will be. Eldrad is almost a certainty to be moved to LoW. The WK would need a major rules rewrite to slip into that category. Personally, I think it should be a SH Walker as is, no dramatic changes to the weapons, and be left as a Heavy Support (they did the same for the Necron Super Heavies). Of course, the price would need to be adjusted accordingly.

I actually strongly believe that the Greater Demons will take the LoW slot whenever the CD book gets updated.

 MasterSlowPoke wrote:
I actually strongly believe that the Greater Demons will take the LoW slot whenever the CD book gets updated.

They didn't in Khorne Daemonkin.

The LoW designation is starting to become irrelevent anyway, since the formations allow any number of the non-unique character ones. I can take 9 Lords of Skulls in the Blood Host formation if I recall.

Logan, Imotekh, and Ghaz are LoW because of their storyline importance, I think (Logan might only be leader of one "Space Marine Chapter", but given the Space Wolves' make-up, he's more like a Chapter Master of Chapter Masters). At least, I hope that's the reasoning because points-wise, they don't make much sense in that slot compared to a titan or baneblade (except Logan on his sled). I always found it stupid that Ghaz and Imotekh weren't given something to bump them up to LoW calibur like Logan was with his sled, really.

I thought Knights were an LoW option for many Imperial Armies? Just not the Knight codex, itself. Or am I mistaken?

Fluff-wise, they really need to look at rarity as a basis of LoW, IMHO. Are Greater Demons about as rare as Titans? (probably, I think?) How about Daemon Princes? (um...maybe?). Wraith knights? (...I honestly have no idea). Avatars of Khaine are one per craft world and only called upon in emergencies so they'd make sense as an LoW,.

Honestly though, once you get too many LoWs, the designation starts to lose meaning. If everyone's a super, no one is.

Anyone else remember in Magic: The Gathering when Wizards of the Coast started screwing around with using "Legendary" as an actual rules mechanic for cards, and then started throwing around all kinds of Legendary cards?

That's not what you want to start happening to Lords of War.

I'm honestly not sure what the logic is behind the Lords of War concept right now. Ghazghkull is a Lord of War, but there are lots of other unique, special characters that aren't. Why? No reason I can think of, really.

From a fluff perspective, I could definitely see the Avatar being a Lord of War. But there's lots of other models and characters that have been updated in the past year which still aren't Lords of War and I would have said the same thing about those units.

The Avatar might make more sense as a Lord of War because from a fluff perspective, an Avatar is not actually going to be leading an Eldar army. The Avatar is more of a living weapon. Most special characters fit in best as leaders, and thus work very well as HQ units.

But again, you can say that for Ghazghkull, and why is he a Lord of War? He should be an HQ, he's the best "leader" the Orks have!

Who knows.

I hope we get an updated avatar that is bigger from GW. I use my FW model all the time because I think it is cooler even though it is a disadvantage for me.

I use the one from the back of then dark elf chariot kit, sexy model right there

Any new news? Getting anxious...

Space Wolves - Character LOW
Orks - Character LOW
Dark Eldar - ?
Grey Knights - Character LOW
Blood Angels - Character LOW
Necrons - Character LOW

I'm sensing a pattern in the 7E codexes

 adamsouza wrote:
Space Wolves - Character LOW
Orks - Character LOW
Dark Eldar - ?
Grey Knights - Character LOW
Blood Angels - Character LOW
Necrons - Character LOW

I'm sensing a pattern in the 7E codexes

So if that is a patteren, what is the next FULL codex that will not have a LOW and be a ? ?

I just don't know dip about the Dark Eldar. Do they have a LOW ?

Adam, you forgot the Stompa, Tesseract Vault+that other pyramid and the Transcendent Ctan, didn't you?

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Galef wrote:

 Wilson wrote:
Wraithknight will become LOW( my own wish)

NO, just NO. Imperial Knights are not LOW and they are worse offenders than WraithKnights. If the WK becomes a LOW, it will have to be a Gargantuan Creatures and that would either make them more OP than they are now, or make them so expensive that they would become unplayable.

Imperial Knights are not LoW because they're part of their own Codex.

If there were a Codex: Wraithknight, you would have a point. But since Logan Grimnar, Imotekh, Ghazghkull Thraka, and more are all LoW--there's no reason why the Wraithknight couldn't be.

The reason the WK shouldn't be LOW is because of the examples you just listed. Eldar have Eldrad, the Avatar, and all 6 Phoenix Lords. All are more appropriate LOW candidates.

I would like to see a special LOW slot that allows 1-3 Phoenix Lords, since they seem to arrive in 3's in most fluff

As much as the avatar makes more sense in low, I'm thinking it will be eldrad with more or less same power level.

 Galef wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Galef wrote:

 Wilson wrote:
Wraithknight will become LOW( my own wish)

NO, just NO. Imperial Knights are not LOW and they are worse offenders than WraithKnights. If the WK becomes a LOW, it will have to be a Gargantuan Creatures and that would either make them more OP than they are now, or make them so expensive that they would become unplayable.

Imperial Knights are not LoW because they're part of their own Codex.

If there were a Codex: Wraithknight, you would have a point. But since Logan Grimnar, Imotekh, Ghazghkull Thraka, and more are all LoW--there's no reason why the Wraithknight couldn't be.

The reason the WK shouldn't be LOW is because of the examples you just listed. Eldar have Eldrad, the Avatar, and all 6 Phoenix Lords. All are more appropriate LOW candidates.

I would like to see a special LOW slot that allows 1-3 Phoenix Lords, since they seem to arrive in 3's in most fluff

You forget that the Ork book also has the Stompa as a LoW.

adamsouza wrote:Space Wolves - Character LOW
Orks - Character LOW
Dark Eldar - ?
Grey Knights - Character LOW
Blood Angels - Character LOW
Necrons - Character LOW

I'm sensing a pattern in the 7E codexes

Actually, Blood Angels got TWO Characters as LoW, both are chapter masters. They're so rare that they wouldn't be seen on the battlefield in most circumstances, but in larger battles, there's a chance they appear.

 PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote:

adamsouza wrote:Space Wolves - Character LOW
Orks - Character LOW
Dark Eldar - ?
Grey Knights - Character LOW
Blood Angels - Character LOW
Necrons - Character LOW

I'm sensing a pattern in the 7E codexes

Actually, Blood Angels got TWO Characters as LoW, both are chapter masters. They're so rare that they wouldn't be seen on the battlefield in most circumstances, but in larger battles, there's a chance they appear.

I think one reason why Seth and Dante were both made LoW was so that you couldn't field both in the same army (since the BA book didn't use the C:SM system of Chapter Tactics to separate its characters/chapters).

I do suspect that GW may use the LoW mechanic to create limits on being able to take all the best stuff in one army. Making you choose among the baddest of dudes rather than being able to take them all. Of course, the new formation system pretty much gets around this issue anyway, so we'll see.

Bad news guys.

The redirect of 'eldar-avatar-with-spear' as it is on the FW site ALSO corrects to 'Eldar-Avatar-With-Spear'.

While this is great new evidence that FW is being migrated to the GW site, it doesn't bode well for a new plastic Avatar model.

Dang... Highly likely we're NOT getting a new plastic Avatar..

Except the GW page link is

http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Eldar-Avatar

No spear (or presumably sword) in the link.

Warhams-77 wrote:
Adam, you forgot the Stompa, Tesseract Vault+that other pyramid and the Transcendent Ctan, didn't you?

I did. No one in my meta plays any of them.

The transcendant is a heavy now in 7th.

Necron LOWs are now Imotekh the Stormlord, Obelisk, and Tesseract Vault.

Harlequins - None ?
Dark Eldar - None
Space Wolves - Character LOW
Grey Knights - Character LOW
Blood Angels - Character LOW x2
Orks - Character LOW, Superheavy LOW
Necrons - Character LOW , Superheavy LOW x2
Khorne Daemonkin - Superheavy LOW

8 7th ed Codexes
6 Character LOW
4 Superheavy LOW between 3 codexes

Character LOW outnumber Superheavy LOW 3 to 2
Only 3 out 8 codexes have Superheavy LOW

Assasins are techincally 7th, but I didn't include them.
Admech looks like it will get Imperial Knight Titans, but that is not confirmed yet.

Eldar? Tau? Space Marines?

They are redoing all the top codices besides Daemons... maybe next year.

Pretty much the only change is going to be Banshee Grenades, Serpent Shield Nerf, and Holoshield nerf, right?

Doing another Eldar book and not re-doing the Avatar would just be criminal. It is one of the oldest models in the range. It needs to be redone.

I'm sure we'll see a $115 Avatar plastic kit. On the plus side it will probably come with both spear and sword options.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Doing another Eldar book and not re-doing the Avatar would just be criminal. It is one of the oldest models in the range. It needs to be redone.

While I don’t disagree, it’s not like the eldar range is short of horribly dated minis. They could update half the range, and still have work to do...

 Crazyterran wrote:
Pretty much the only change is going to be Banshee Grenades, Serpent Shield Nerf, and Holoshield nerf, right?

I get the two first ones but why the holoshield nerf? It's already bad since you have to move to use it; it gives the same buff as IG/AM camo netting but doesn't work turn one, maybe I am missing something?

 GearheadXII wrote:
I hope we get an updated avatar that is bigger from GW. I use my FW model all the time because I think it is cooler even though it is a disadvantage for me.

I have all 3... but I like using the RT one. Its funny to have a beatstick that's less than 3" tall.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Doing another Eldar book and not re-doing the Avatar would just be criminal. It is one of the oldest models in the range. It needs to be redone.

The main reason I give any credence to the possibility has nothing to with the age or dated look, because that would have some bearing on GW doing something their customers wanted, they'd much rather release something new that nobody already owned, no, the reason this has any legs is because they want everything in plastic.

I can't see the WK becoming LOW. It has comparable models in other codex's. Eldrad and the Phoenix lords probably and maybe even the Revenant titan. What shocks me is the Eldar codex coming out so quick. At this rate I can't keep up with the books and can't paint stuff fast enough. At this rate they will push me out of the hobby on cost which I never saw coming.