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 Grot 6 wrote:
So,

When you wait for a new edition like this is supposed to be, are we seriously supposed to be like an inmate on death row, waiting for a stay of execution?

Yes. At this point myself & many other fantasy players have a WHFB purchasing freeze. Unless I can get something over 50% off I'm not buying. The local game stores are annoyed but they can't blame us. Who wants to buy something that may be invalid in a month?

 Grot 6 wrote:
So,

When you wait for a new edition like this is supposed to be, are we seriously supposed to be like an inmate on death row, waiting for a stay of execution?

KInda feeling like that, so in a word, 9th edition is crap. The whole campaign of execution for development is garbage, the basic publicity is garbage, and GW is acting like an ostrich with its head in the sand, with a pack of hyenas circling... In GW world.... everything is fine......

A new game should not feel that way at all. Why do I want to shell out paramount to a $1,000.00 for a feeling like that? Feth them at this point. If I can't get excited about it, then GW can feth off. I have other good games worth my time.

Bases are not even the issue here. Its the overall.... vibe. It honestly sucks from them at this point.

I'm with you completely. I know it's how GW does things but it's ridiculous in my opinion. Infinity announced they were doing their new edition in like April and it was released in October or November, they explained why they were doing it, we were in the loop. Malifaux had betas for 2nd edition I believe, and do for the expansion books still. GW; we don't hear anything until like 1/2 weeks before and it really annoys me.

Any new edition will have to support existing Army books, I cannot see GW dropping the Army book model as they would have to include a Bestiary and full equipment listings in the basic rulebook; something they have not done since 3rd edition.

That being the case existing units will be useable in whatever form the new universe comes about in.

Whether GW continues to make all units remains to be seen as new Armybooks are released as they will not have unit entries without models anymore.

 notprop wrote:
Any new edition will have to support existing Army books, I cannot see GW dropping the Army book model as they would have to include a Bestiary and full equipment listings in the basic rulebook; something they have not done since 3rd edition.

False. 6th edition did this as well:

wikipedia wrote:

6th Edition was released in October 2000. All army books were initially replaced by a get-by list in Ravening Hordes, distributed for free.

I have the feeling 9th Ravening Hordes will not be free.

 notprop wrote:
Any new edition will have to support existing Army books, I cannot see GW dropping the Army book model as they would have to include a Bestiary and full equipment listings in the basic rulebook; something they have not done since 3rd edition.

That being the case existing units will be useable in whatever form the new universe comes about in.

Whether GW continues to make all units remains to be seen as new Armybooks are released as they will not have unit entries without models anymore.

There's several methods that can be done. The Ravening Hordes option has been used before, but since 2000 GW has been careful not to outright invalidate a stack of books in 1 fell swoop. It's a pita for their own scheduling if nothing else. They've prefered slow obsolescence.

They could for example not bring out "Warhammer 9th" as a direct replacement for 8th, instead bring out a new game, let's call it "Warbubbles" for the sake of it. Warbubbles has no rules directly matching Warhammer, (so old army books are not used) and it's sold alongside. Over the following year they bring out 6 new Warbubbles army books, one per new faction, only including rules support for the models suitable to the new vision and with new model releases. Warhammer 8th withers on the vine with no new support (like the hobbit now) and then gets dropped, along with any models not included in the new books.

MaxT wrote:
They could for example not bring out "Warhammer 9th" as a direct replacement for 8th, instead bring out a new game, let's call it "Warbubbles" for the sake of it. Warbubbles has no rules directly matching Warhammer, (so old army books are not used) and it's sold alongside. Over the following year they bring out 6 new Warbubbles army books, one per new faction, only including rules support for the models suitable to the new vision and with new model releases. Warhammer 8th withers on the vine with no new support (like the hobbit now) and then gets dropped, along with any models not included in the new books.

Smart, and supported by GeeDub's detachment from Specialist Games, which IMO have largely done alright for themselves out in the Wilds, with some systems thriving a bit more than others.

- Salvage

With the rumors of Warhammer 30,000 being released this year to allow historic battles in the 40k setting, maybe the goal of 9th edition WHFB (Warhammer Fragmented-Bubbleverse) is to create something new so they can later try to entice the old-timers by releasing a companion game (Warhammer Pre-Fragmented-Bubbleverse) so they can fight historic battles in that setting...

dwarf...war...machine?

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU SO MUCH GW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I LOVE YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! YOU'RE BRINGING BACK THE DWARFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





LET'S CELEBRATE THE RETURN OF DWARFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'd never thought I'd see the day.

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Calm down... It's just a rumour, and what dyou mean you never thought you'd see the day? They aren't officially gone yet, no more than, well, everything is...

Wow.. way to get over excited over the reversal of something that was never true.

Wow, I didn't expect a new edition so soon! I suppose that is always the way, though, don't you agree?

 Solorg wrote:
Wow, I didn't expect a new edition so soon! I suppose that is always the way, though, don't you agree?

New edition so soon? From my understanding WHFB is still "on schedule" for edition releases. 8th was released on July 10th, 2010.

40k is where people are panicking about "OMG, they're going to change the books on us every 2 years" crap.

 Shas'O Dorian wrote:

 Grot 6 wrote:
So,

When you wait for a new edition like this is supposed to be, are we seriously supposed to be like an inmate on death row, waiting for a stay of execution?

Yes. At this point myself & many other fantasy players have a WHFB purchasing freeze. Unless I can get something over 50% off I'm not buying. The local game stores are annoyed but they can't blame us. Who wants to buy something that may be invalid in a month?

I imagine that this attitude may be prevelant enough to noticeably bring down WHFB sales (just conjecture, but I've heard it from multiple different directions). If that's the case, then I wonder how GW is interpereting the dip in sales. Somehow I doubt they are doing so as they should, for the reasons that you list, but somehow they'll intperperet it as justification for reaming Fantasy...

-C6

Stay on the meds, Badrukk. Or, possibly, get off the meds.

 Korinov wrote:
I have the feeling 9th Ravening Hordes will not be free.

Ravening Hordes: Ninth Edition - hardback, £50.

Rules for monsters and monstrous cav - DLC, £30 for each army.

Rules for war machines - DLC, £30 for each army.

Rules for characters - DLC, £30 for each army.

Points costs for all of the above - DLC, £20 for each army.

 Vermis wrote:
Stay on the meds, Badrukk. Or, possibly, get off the meds.

 Korinov wrote:
I have the feeling 9th Ravening Hordes will not be free.

Ravening Hordes: Ninth Edition - hardback, £50.

Rules for monsters and monstrous cav - DLC, £30 for each army.

Rules for war machines - DLC, £30 for each army.

Rules for characters - DLC, £30 for each army.

Points costs for all of the above - DLC, £20 for each army.

Custom Font that allows DLC to be read, otherwise it shows up only as boxes in your reader - £30.
Password for Zip files to open them - An additional £20
Citadel Fine-Unlocker - which unlocks your computer after our program locks it up until you pay a ransom - £1000 payable to a Nigerian Prince.

And in 10th they'll charge you for the Nigerian Prince's datasheet

I got excited over nothing?

Heresy!!!

A few hundred smilies and exclamation marks is probably overdoing it; but yeah, I'll also be interested to see just how the dwarfs fared and how their look's changed.

 Vermis wrote:
A few hundred smilies and exclamation marks is probably overdoing it; but yeah, I'll also be interested to see just how the dwarfs fared and how their look's changed.

You like dwarfs too???

 KaptinBadrukk wrote:

 Vermis wrote:
A few hundred smilies and exclamation marks is probably overdoing it; but yeah, I'll also be interested to see just how the dwarfs fared and how their look's changed.

You like dwarfs too???

You do know there is an entire dwarf forum right? http://www.bugmansbrewery.com/

 Shas'O Dorian wrote:

 KaptinBadrukk wrote:

 Vermis wrote:
A few hundred smilies and exclamation marks is probably overdoing it; but yeah, I'll also be interested to see just how the dwarfs fared and how their look's changed.

You like dwarfs too???

You do know there is an entire dwarf forum right? http://www.bugmansbrewery.com/

Actually, I didn't. Thanks for letting me know.

More stuff:

 Haight wrote:
From Bols, which is really just a round up from other places, but there's a few different sources here.


Rumors are starting to coalesce around the position that what is coming in May - the skirmish level game - is entirely separate from the large scale combat game we all know, which will see its 9th ed update this Summer.

As always with any rumor, take with NaCl, but if the gist of this stuff is true, i think the fantasy community can breathe a rather large sigh of collective relief.


http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2015/04/rumors-fantasy-9th-two-modes-of-play.html



Apologies if this was posted elsewhere, I saw the 9th ed starter contents thread, but honestly, that didn't seem applicable entirely (only one 5 or 6 rumors talks about the starter, and its really not relegated to the contents).


Have at it !


-- Haight


Of course, this opens up tons of questions even if this scant stuff is true.... what about round bases... is that true for skirmish, if so is it true for large scale, ... if the answer to skirmish is "yes" but "no" for large scale, how do you reconcile that as a true bridge from one to the other etc....


I do kind of like the idea of the skirmish game being small bands fighting at the microcosm level within a larger battle. There's lots of opportunity there for campaign play.

So whfb is failing badly, so they launch a second all new game which uses different rules and potentially models while still keeping the current dead weight.

It makes no sense at all, so of course gw may see it as the route to go down.

Still most likely click bait by bols or desperate wish listing by the dozen or so people that still play whfb. Most likely both to be honest.

Sounds like it's just more stuff being rolled on to an already existing rumor ball. Wouldn't be surprised if most of it's BS.

Lalalalalalala Rumari Damacy.

SeanDrake wrote:
So whfb is failing badly, so they launch a second all new game which uses different rules and potentially models while still keeping the current dead weight.

It makes no sense at all, so of course gw may see it as the route to go down.

Still most likely click bait by bols or desperate wish listing by the dozen or so people that still play whfb. Most likely both to be honest.

Remember how many games GW used to run at the same time, and consider the size of the company as it is now compared to back then?

They could run half a dozen different systems sequentially if they wanted to, easily.

I think really this is the ideal solution; a new game, while the existing mass battle system remains for those who still want to collect and play at that scale.

Even with my time-worn cynicism I found it hard to believe that GW would drop the standard game completely. And to do so would have been the most callous act the company had ever committed by some margin.

The rather hilarious thing now is that if it's possible a few weeks away from the biggest release in years, and still there is nothing solid in terms of news about it. I know this policy of secrecy has been going on for a few years now, but I really can't get my head around it. Is it really just to give us forumites something to chat about, do they care about us so much?!

I don't like the idea of random stuff occurring in the skirmish game because a wider battle is raging on all sides.

Hopefully there will be modes of play that omit those random events.

 Pacific wrote:

SeanDrake wrote:
So whfb is failing badly, so they launch a second all new game which uses different rules and potentially models while still keeping the current dead weight.

It makes no sense at all, so of course gw may see it as the route to go down.

Still most likely click bait by bols or desperate wish listing by the dozen or so people that still play whfb. Most likely both to be honest.

Remember how many games GW used to run at the same time, and consider the size of the company as it is now compared to back then?

They could run half a dozen different systems sequentially if they wanted to, easily.

I think really this is the ideal solution; a new game, while the existing mass battle system remains for those who still want to collect and play at that scale.

Even with my time-worn cynicism I found it hard to believe that GW would drop the standard game completely. And to do so would have been the most callous act the company had ever committed by some margin.

The rather hilarious thing now is that if it's possible a few weeks away from the biggest release in years, and still there is nothing solid in terms of news about it. I know this policy of secrecy has been going on for a few years now, but I really can't get my head around it. Is it really just to give us forumites something to chat about, do they care about us so much?!

I agree with this one million per cent. In the history of the world, I can't think of a single company who would want to hide away a major release, weeks before it comes out. It's sheer madness.

Anyway, here's my prediction about 9th, which I posted on that other thread that got locked:

If this is true, then fantasy is going down the LOTR route - a skirmish game and the bigger battles a la war of the ring.

Round bases for the skirmish game is not a problem for switching to a larger game, because as people know, war of the ring had those move trays for round bases that allowed them to rank up into bigger formations. I'm sure somebody could post a picture of these move trays to demonstrate what I mean.

However, if GW are having two systems within fantasy with two separate rulebooks, then it proves they have learned nothing from the competition. Because any other company would combine them into one book for £40 rather than GW selling each book for £30.

I'm not happy with that, and I'm sure most people would agree.

Finally, to that person who keeps stalking me I don't want to do the bet - I'm backing out because I don't want to lose my Sean avatar

You are right, I am wrong. You win. Waves white flag

 Pacific wrote:

Remember how many games GW used to run at the same time, and consider the size of the company as it is now compared to back then?

They could run half a dozen different systems sequentially if they wanted to, easily.

I think really this is the ideal solution; a new game, while the existing mass battle system remains for those who still want to collect and play at that scale.

Even with my time-worn cynicism I found it hard to believe that GW would drop the standard game completely. And to do so would have been the most callous act the company had ever committed by some margin.

Remember how many games GW dumped like a sack full of kittens and a brick because they weren't puking up quite the volumes of cash they desired? You're right in that they could run half a dozen of them - if they wanted to. For the past few years they haven't, which is why I'm not so sure what to make of these new rumours. If they introduce a new game alongside, rather than a replacement, potentially acting as a gateway to 'proper' WHFB, then fair enough; but I'm still cynical about how many players will be funneled through if you still have to buy a wheelbarrowful of minis at GW's prices (heck, I even expect them to bump the prices up again, due to the smaller model count of a skirmish game, despite already being at 'skirmish prices' and then some) and if the gameplay is the same old clunky, micromanaging, unbalancing act. Which one will then receive GW's paranoia and be viewed as 'cannibalising' sales off the other, or off the ol' spakky mariens? It could, as someone already mentioned, be the first step in winding down WHFB.

But I don't think that'll be the most callous act of the company. (Forgotten Spots already...?) In fact I'd see it as a kind of a mercy killing, and enabling some kind or level of diaspora to other deserving mass battle games. People who go for the 'zoom in', focusing on the actions of individual models and kitting out characters with specific combinations of magic items (and possibly confusing it for 'character'; all of which, from where I'm sitting, seems like the majority of WHFB players), will have the more appropriate skirmish game. People who decide they prefer manoeuvre of units and armies instead are already well catered to with several rule sets, without even having to step outside the WHFB setting.

ET was a huge race in rulebooks and I bet GW made a good chunk on money just by selling them. I can see WFB being split into 2 variants for the sake of creating more books and generate sales. Personally I'm ok with 2 games and I think WFB will be a better system overall if people can opt by playing it the way they prefer.

For us with armies we can grab some minis and do some skirmish and for the newcomers they can start up by doing some skirmish warbands. Sure its not going to be cheap because you have to buy 2 books at least ( assuming that these skirmish rules are not included on the 9th).

All in all soon enough we will know if these skirmish rules are any good... random events and crazy magic are things I avoid, I rather prefer traditional hack and slash... lets wait and see.

Thinking about it would be very clever if GW to created some starter sets for some Killteam gaming in 40k, like all simplified rules and stats in one box.