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That sounds fine and all with a double weird boy list, but that means as the league progress, I'll have to keep the two weird boyz as my HQs. Might great for a small game, but not when you scale up.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Since this league is a true escalation league, I think my strategy to build a winning list that can scale from 500-1500 points. I think lets go with the double threat star.


Zhadsnark
Pain boy on a bike
Warboss, pk and BP on bike

warbikers
deffkoptas

These units will make up the core of my list. ideally I need them present in every list. Now the TO has not decided yet if he is going to allow named characters for the first week or two. So looks like I need to just run a warboss, boyz, and some deffkoptas to start. Which can still be a killer of a list.

Ya I would personally use them just because I footslog and in my area building that up to a tide would work better than trukk boys (I don't own 16 trukks so I don't have enough target saturation).

 cranect wrote:
Ya I would personally use them just because I footslog and in my area building that up to a tide would work better than trukk boys (I don't own 16 trukks so I don't have enough target saturation).

Well you can build for the whole green tide thing, but the event maxes out at 1500 point list. Also, you can supplement your target saturation with agro. Personally I take some heavy hitting units just because I know they are going to draw some fire away from the trukks. For example Big Trakk with Supa-Kannon. Your opponent has to deal with this right away or they will be pulling infantry off the table left and right. Plus if they are open-top, primary weapon kicks in and starts exploding transports. Also flanking gun trukk with supa-skorcha. This will drive players crazy. I've hide the trukk before and jumped out on a marine bike player. Wounds on 3's and every wound is a dead dude

Ahh those are some good ideas. After I make some dreads then big trakks will be next. Ya I either footslog or use the dread mob right now but the mob would not work for escalation at all. Well maybe for the 500 if you cram a gorkanaut in but that's not very nice.

 cranect wrote:
Ya I would personally use them just because I footslog and in my area building that up to a tide would work better than trukk boys (I don't own 16 trukks so I don't have enough target saturation).

If you keep the tide minimal it's not too bad of a point sink. I like to run 1 unit of armored boyz because your allowed to choose which boyz get the mob rule hits...put the hits on the armored ones and you almost never lose a boy to mob rule (assuming the painboy is still alive.) It makes the unit nearly fearless, except for fear (the only thing they fear is "fear" itself?)

You probably want a PK or two. If you do, nob placement becomes a critical issue in the blob.

The other benefit is you don't have to buy so many $35 trukks.

Just give the Warboss a Big Bosspole, then you get the Fearless rule itself.

Thanks for the advice Cranect,

I could potentially run some dreads, still a few kanz short of the formation. I agree they would certainly help, as like mentioned they are Str3, so generally without rending they can't do anything. Although this is the list I came up with in the mean time.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2x 3 BigT squadron- 4 Big shootas, riggers, Board planks, Rams

9 lootas
9 lootas
5 Flash gitz
5 flash gitz
11 shoota boyz - nob PK, BP
11 shoota boyz - Nob, PK, BP
11 shoota boyz
11 shoota boyz

3x 1 trukks, rams (DT's)

painboy on bike
Big mek, bike KFF
3 bikers, Nob, BC
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So everything is in transports apart from the bikers, in total the shot output should be pretty devastating, the BigT squadrons themselves put out 36 Str5 shots, lootas put out 18-56 shots, the shoota boyz put out 88 shots. then gitz put out 30. Not to mention, by staying in the transports I avoid Psy shenanigans, while also if they try and charge me I get to overwatch with a shoota unit, loota unit and gitz unit.

So from that with T3 models almost all will be wounding, thus making the most of the volume of shots I have. Also the 5++ is then just as good as any other save due to almost no AP values.

Finally almost all transports are jinker's with low AV, low enough that even the Bigshootas should putout enough to pop them.

That should work fairly well I would think solar.

I'm thinking trying out the earlier mentioned tactic of combining SAG with Lobbas. Wondering though should I choose the Barrage from Lobbas or more AP2 from KMK? And should I drop one Tank Busta Trukk in favor of more beefier Mek Gun squads?

I dont play tournaments, though some of my friends do, so what i say might not really mean anything.

Ever done the Big Mek w/ Tellyportablasta, Da Lucky Stikk, and a squad of Kustom Mega-Kannons? Thats a pretty fething scary ball of firepower thats able to move and shoot and has a 2+ rerollable shield in front (with LoS to a poor grot when AP2 is involved).
I tried it against my Necron friend and he was not happy with that thing lol. Ball of boyz prevented him from assaulting it with Wraiths and i just outgunned him with lootas and that ball of KMK's.

Sivious wrote:I'm thinking trying out the earlier mentioned tactic of combining SAG with Lobbas. Wondering though should I choose the Barrage from Lobbas or more AP2 from KMK? And should I drop one Tank Busta Trukk in favor of more beefier Mek Gun squads?

Vineheart01 wrote:I dont play tournaments, though some of my friends do, so what i say might not really mean anything.

Ever done the Big Mek w/ Tellyportablasta, Da Lucky Stikk, and a squad of Kustom Mega-Kannons? Thats a pretty fething scary ball of firepower thats able to move and shoot and has a 2+ rerollable shield in front (with LoS to a poor grot when AP2 is involved).
I tried it against my Necron friend and he was not happy with that thing lol. Ball of boyz prevented him from assaulting it with Wraiths and i just outgunned him with lootas and that ball of KMK's.

I haven't yet tried the teleportablasta, seems too short a range for me and unless your in a transport or against an army thats going to come to you then you wont be using it till turn 3/4 IMO. But DLS, MA KMK's I have tried, which is a great combo

As for whether SAG with KMK's or lobbas, personally I like it with both, but I find the role is different with each loadout. With lobbas I was using it to clear infantry, the AP2 meant I'd potentially ignore all saves and the Str was just something nice if I rolled high. With the KMK's I find you want to be shooting Tougher or 2+ saves, where the SAG simply adds to that. What does your list need?

I've also tried SAG with Bubblechukkas. They synergise pretty well...as well as random gak can synergise.

BTW, is it true that we can get a custom stompa with 2 massive S: D blasts for 500 pts?

 koooaei wrote:
I've also tried SAG with Bubblechukkas. They synergise pretty well...as well as random gak can synergise.

BTW, is it true that we can get a custom stompa with 2 massive S: D blasts for 500 pts?

Yes you can But that is all your stompa would have is the two massive blast D weapons.

 koooaei wrote:
I've also tried SAG with Bubblechukkas. They synergise pretty well...as well as random gak can synergise.

BTW, is it true that we can get a custom stompa with 2 massive S: D blasts for 500 pts?

No.

It's 510 points gotta pay for those Big Shootas man!

Is that in one of the IA's?

 Hawkeye888 wrote:
Is that in one of the IA's?

Yes, IA: 8. Kustom Stompa Bursta Kannon.

I prefer large Boyz blobs so I should have anti-infantry handled. I'll pair them with few KMK's.

What's your preference with Bustas? Single suicide wagon, all you can get, pair of mid-strength squads filling one role on your complex plan for victory? I'm currently thinking 3 trukks with 7 Bustas, but is it too much/too little?

I've shy'd away from the massive boy blobs due to the ease of splatting them and Mob Rule change. Now i refuse to bring more than 20 per squad, even footslogging.

Ive got 3 reasons for this.

1) Less than 20 we run into Trukkboy problems where their numbers are just too few to bother bringing them.

2) Bottlenecking. I had this problem before but because of Fearless i could usually ignore it. More than 20 models i seem to always end up congo-lining around terrain or barely moving at all.

3) Fear tests. For some godawful fething reason Fear is excluded from Mob Rule. We are the ONLY race that actually fears fear tests (badum tssh) because we are the ONLY race that wants melee combat thats either not immune to it (no fearless or atsknf) or practically immune due to LD10. Other races that are subject to it are already boned if they ever take it anyway like my Tau lol. By taking more squads at medium numbers, i limit the Fear problem somewhat. Nothing pisses me off more than a near full strength 30squad boy blob with Warboss/Painboy fail a Fear test. You'd think the Warboss at least would make the squad immune to it.

For those reasons i avoid big blobs now. Ive actually started avoiding the "boys before toys" motto as well. Heck my last Ork game at 2000pts i had 60 boyz lol im not even kidding (and those Necrons didnt know what hit them)

 Vineheart01 wrote:
I've shy'd away from the massive boy blobs due to the ease of splatting them and Mob Rule change. Now i refuse to bring more than 20 per squad, even footslogging.

Ive got 3 reasons for this.

1) Less than 20 we run into Trukkboy problems where their numbers are just too few to bother bringing them.

2) Bottlenecking. I had this problem before but because of Fearless i could usually ignore it. More than 20 models i seem to always end up congo-lining around terrain or barely moving at all.

3) Fear tests. For some godawful fething reason Fear is excluded from Mob Rule. We are the ONLY race that actually fears fear tests (badum tssh) because we are the ONLY race that wants melee combat thats either not immune to it (no fearless or atsknf) or practically immune due to LD10. Other races that are subject to it are already boned if they ever take it anyway like my Tau lol. By taking more squads at medium numbers, i limit the Fear problem somewhat. Nothing pisses me off more than a near full strength 30squad boy blob with Warboss/Painboy fail a Fear test. You'd think the Warboss at least would make the squad immune to it.

For those reasons i avoid big blobs now. Ive actually started avoiding the "boys before toys" motto as well. Heck my last Ork game at 2000pts i had 60 boyz lol im not even kidding (and those Necrons didnt know what hit them)

What's your current Boyz loadout? I'm usually running 20 Shoota Boyz w/ Boss Nob, Boss Pole and Power Klaw these days. 'Eavy Armour if I have points.

 Frozocrone wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
I've shy'd away from the massive boy blobs due to the ease of splatting them and Mob Rule change. Now i refuse to bring more than 20 per squad, even footslogging.

Ive got 3 reasons for this.

1) Less than 20 we run into Trukkboy problems where their numbers are just too few to bother bringing them.

2) Bottlenecking. I had this problem before but because of Fearless i could usually ignore it. More than 20 models i seem to always end up congo-lining around terrain or barely moving at all.

3) Fear tests. For some godawful fething reason Fear is excluded from Mob Rule. We are the ONLY race that actually fears fear tests (badum tssh) because we are the ONLY race that wants melee combat thats either not immune to it (no fearless or atsknf) or practically immune due to LD10. Other races that are subject to it are already boned if they ever take it anyway like my Tau lol. By taking more squads at medium numbers, i limit the Fear problem somewhat. Nothing pisses me off more than a near full strength 30squad boy blob with Warboss/Painboy fail a Fear test. You'd think the Warboss at least would make the squad immune to it.

For those reasons i avoid big blobs now. Ive actually started avoiding the "boys before toys" motto as well. Heck my last Ork game at 2000pts i had 60 boyz lol im not even kidding (and those Necrons didnt know what hit them)

What's your current Boyz loadout? I'm usually running 20 Shoota Boyz w/ Boss Nob, Boss Pole and Power Klaw these days. 'Eavy Armour if I have points.

I used to run shootas strictly but since the new dex and changes to Waaagh! i went back to sluggas. By default i bring 3 squads of 20 boyz with a nob, klaw, bp, and a mek to eat challenges. Thats regardless of my tactic. The numbers shift depending on if im doing wagon lists, footsloggers, or biker heavy but not that much.

Since i adopted this 20man blobs i rarely have a squad not do something important. Even if they get shot up thats still enough dakka they soaked to let the rest of my stuff get through. I tend to play both my orks and my tau with the whole "sacrificial unit" mentality where i bring units with the sole purpose of pissing you off and delaying you more than damaging you.
Course i also bring 2 MANZ missiles every game. Love those things rofl

Sivious wrote:
I prefer large Boyz blobs so I should have anti-infantry handled. I'll pair them with few KMK's.

What's your preference with Bustas? Single suicide wagon, all you can get, pair of mid-strength squads filling one role on your complex plan for victory? I'm currently thinking 3 trukks with 7 Bustas, but is it too much/too little?

I run two full size Mobs with BP Nob on foot. They normally do great things except last night against 2+ Armor save Warlocks on Bikes with Wychblades and 4++ Inv saves. He also dropped my Str down to 2 before assaulting. It was so embarrassing. He was rolling 17-19 psychic die per turn, needing 3+ instead of four, ignoring perils by spending a warp charge because, you know, Space Elves Majick!!!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
BTW, one guess how I finally killed that squad of, which was a formation of some sort with 2 HQ Psykers attached on Eldar Jetbikes: more dakka. A fresh unit of 14 regular BikerBoyz rolled on and even with 2+ I was able to kill 3 Warlocks. Then he assaulted me, killed 2 more to over watch, then we ground it out over 3 turns of assault. Thankfully the Mob rule actually kept me in the battle since, of course, he had hit me with terrify to reduce my Ld to 6!!

Awesome game I was able to win at bottom of turn 5 due to wiping him. He said at the end: "your lucky I didn't get the power that lets me reroll failed saves."

FML Eldar are ridiculous!!

I thought the points cost for the kustom stompa was faq'd and you can't get him nearly as cheap now.

Considering how much hate orks seem to be getting lately in the rules department, i wouldnt be surprised in the least.

Eh, i shouldnt be so harsh. Least we arent tyranids

Maybe I should get Tyranids as second army then so I could hate myself even more.

 PipeAlley wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:
BTW, one guess how I finally killed that squad of, which was a formation of some sort with 2 HQ Psykers attached on Eldar Jetbikes: more dakka. A fresh unit of 14 regular BikerBoyz rolled on and even with 2+ I was able to kill 3 Warlocks. Then he assaulted me, killed 2 more to over watch, then we ground it out over 3 turns of assault. Thankfully the Mob rule actually kept me in the battle since, of course, he had hit me with terrify to reduce my Ld to 6!!

Awesome game I was able to win at bottom of turn 5 due to wiping him. He said at the end: "your lucky I didn't get the power that lets me reroll failed saves."

FML Eldar are ridiculous!!

So my game against Harlie Elves's last night didn't quite go aswell as yours did. Where the mob rule seemed to save you the mob simply destroyed me. Started out I was steam rolling him, turn 1 I removed a whole 10 man troupe; I seized and then put a serious amount of firepower into it, rolling plenty of 6's for my lootas and gitz in my Big T squadrons.

However after turn 1 it was down hill. Maelstrom cards didn't go my way; I placed 4 objectives in a diamond pattern, had that side of the board and didn't draw a single objective card till turn 4. But generally it was my leadership that really failed me. Failed almost all ldrship rolls, which with the DJ, so -2 to LD resulted in my units running which ever way he wanted (typically towards a harle squad ready to assault), Every BP roll resulted in me either doing more wounds to my own units (Flash gitz take 1 casualty from DJ and then kill 2 of themselves - 6+ gitz).

Not to mention my WL BM on bike with bike squad and painboy failing a LD check and then failing BP roll, running, getting charged and getting wiped simply because they failed another check. It was just rediculous, he didn't even need any LD modifying powers and I failed almost everything. I know not all games will go that way but when the mob rule simply starts killing more models than the enemy its so depressing.

Taking an 1850 ork army only to spend most of the game tidying away units is sad times!

Ok, here's the idea from another thread.

Bunker + Escape hatch.

DLS Megaboss
Mek
14 bustas + Pk nob

8 lootas

Megaboss + bustas go escape hatching, lootas take their place and proceed shooting out of the bunker.

Initially i wanted to use shootaboyz but than i went like...hey, why not?!

Solar Shock wrote:

 PipeAlley wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:
BTW, one guess how I finally killed that squad of, which was a formation of some sort with 2 HQ Psykers attached on Eldar Jetbikes: more dakka. A fresh unit of 14 regular BikerBoyz rolled on and even with 2+ I was able to kill 3 Warlocks. Then he assaulted me, killed 2 more to over watch, then we ground it out over 3 turns of assault. Thankfully the Mob rule actually kept me in the battle since, of course, he had hit me with terrify to reduce my Ld to 6!!

Awesome game I was able to win at bottom of turn 5 due to wiping him. He said at the end: "your lucky I didn't get the power that lets me reroll failed saves."

FML Eldar are ridiculous!!

So my game against Harlie Elves's last night didn't quite go aswell as yours did. Where the mob rule seemed to save you the mob simply destroyed me. Started out I was steam rolling him, turn 1 I removed a whole 10 man troupe; I seized and then put a serious amount of firepower into it, rolling plenty of 6's for my lootas and gitz in my Big T squadrons.

However after turn 1 it was down hill. Maelstrom cards didn't go my way; I placed 4 objectives in a diamond pattern, had that side of the board and didn't draw a single objective card till turn 4. But generally it was my leadership that really failed me. Failed almost all ldrship rolls, which with the DJ, so -2 to LD resulted in my units running which ever way he wanted (typically towards a harle squad ready to assault), Every BP roll resulted in me either doing more wounds to my own units (Flash gitz take 1 casualty from DJ and then kill 2 of themselves - 6+ gitz).

Not to mention my WL BM on bike with bike squad and painboy failing a LD check and then failing BP roll, running, getting charged and getting wiped simply because they failed another check. It was just rediculous, he didn't even need any LD modifying powers and I failed almost everything. I know not all games will go that way but when the mob rule simply starts killing more models than the enemy its so depressing.

Taking an 1850 ork army only to spend most of the game tidying away units is sad times!

Ld has always been the bane of da Orks! At least since 3rd edition. That's what made the previous Mob Rule so awesome: Ld equals model count, 11+ is fearless. BP was a simple reroll. Considering 6th and 7th overall are a dumbed down, simplified version of the game, it's a head scratcher that they ADDED a new table, with modifiers.

I was also quite unlucky with my draws on Maelstrom cards. Cause a pinning test, to Eldar, whose basic troops are Ld 9!

I ran one unit of Max Lobbas (and one of max KMK's and a third full unit of Tractor Kannonz for testing purposes) and as in most games since forever, the Lobbas were my MVP's. 3+ Armor saves don't help too much when you have 17-21 wounds on a unit.

Its the new 7ed rule!
Everyone needs a table of magic randomness! Roll more dice!

Yeh lobba's are a regular feature. Even if they get charged turn 3, 5 blasts for 120 points generally make their points back by then. I have made a shift towards volume with most of my wounding, we don't have enough special rules like ignore's cover or lance to allow us to negate stuff. So I simply give them plenty of dice and watch them sweat.

I do want to try a list where i'm bringing 3x5 lobbas and use them for all my AI. Then focussing the rest of the list on hitting hard; probably another CAD and 3x3 KMK's! then flood the board with grots and make it hard to move

 PipeAlley wrote:

Solar Shock wrote:

 PipeAlley wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:
BTW, one guess how I finally killed that squad of, which was a formation of some sort with 2 HQ Psykers attached on Eldar Jetbikes: more dakka. A fresh unit of 14 regular BikerBoyz rolled on and even with 2+ I was able to kill 3 Warlocks. Then he assaulted me, killed 2 more to over watch, then we ground it out over 3 turns of assault. Thankfully the Mob rule actually kept me in the battle since, of course, he had hit me with terrify to reduce my Ld to 6!!

Awesome game I was able to win at bottom of turn 5 due to wiping him. He said at the end: "your lucky I didn't get the power that lets me reroll failed saves."

FML Eldar are ridiculous!!

So my game against Harlie Elves's last night didn't quite go aswell as yours did. Where the mob rule seemed to save you the mob simply destroyed me. Started out I was steam rolling him, turn 1 I removed a whole 10 man troupe; I seized and then put a serious amount of firepower into it, rolling plenty of 6's for my lootas and gitz in my Big T squadrons.

However after turn 1 it was down hill. Maelstrom cards didn't go my way; I placed 4 objectives in a diamond pattern, had that side of the board and didn't draw a single objective card till turn 4. But generally it was my leadership that really failed me. Failed almost all ldrship rolls, which with the DJ, so -2 to LD resulted in my units running which ever way he wanted (typically towards a harle squad ready to assault), Every BP roll resulted in me either doing more wounds to my own units (Flash gitz take 1 casualty from DJ and then kill 2 of themselves - 6+ gitz).

Not to mention my WL BM on bike with bike squad and painboy failing a LD check and then failing BP roll, running, getting charged and getting wiped simply because they failed another check. It was just rediculous, he didn't even need any LD modifying powers and I failed almost everything. I know not all games will go that way but when the mob rule simply starts killing more models than the enemy its so depressing.

Taking an 1850 ork army only to spend most of the game tidying away units is sad times!

Ld has always been the bane of da Orks! At least since 3rd edition. That's what made the previous Mob Rule so awesome: Ld equals model count, 11+ is fearless. BP was a simple reroll. Considering 6th and 7th overall are a dumbed down, simplified version of the game, it's a head scratcher that they ADDED a new table, with modifiers.

I was also quite unlucky with my draws on Maelstrom cards. Cause a pinning test, to Eldar, whose basic troops are Ld 9!

I ran one unit of Max Lobbas (and one of max KMK's and a third full unit of Tractor Kannonz for testing purposes) and as in most games since forever, the Lobbas were my MVP's. 3+ Armor saves don't help too much when you have 17-21 wounds on a unit.

*Eldar are Ld 9*
*Checks DE Codex I have*
*Units are Ld 8*

Of course they are.

In Orker news, had a chance to try Tankbustas and MANz that Deep Striked (narrative mission in GW). MANZ did really well, Tankbustas would have won the game but I was required to roll to hit against a building as per the GW employee made me (forge the narrative and whatnot). BikerStar performed as it always does (no Zhadsnark, stayed away from FW for this event).

Eldar/DE dont need melee, and the main ones that will want melee are either fearless or not the main front of the army anyway. Orks need melee unless you wanna risk youre entire game on 5+ luck and hope to god there isnt anything Rokkits cant kill.