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My local scene is starting its competitive series of tournaments. We are using 1850 ITC? rules. (Personally not a big fan of using someone else rules, but I guess this is how its going down) So I guess my list needs approval for each event since the list of LoW from ITC rules just says STOMPA not 'Kustom' STOMPA. Now if you talk to Forge World, they will tell you that the Kustom Stompa and the Stompa should be treated as the same thing. Below is the list I'm wanting to play:

HQ:
Zhadsnark (Seriously, who does not use this guy, lol)
Painboy on a bike
Big Mek with KFF

Troops
2x 20 'ard boyz with a Nob BP, PK
1x 7 warbiker unit with a Nob PK

Fast Attack
3 different units of 1 deffkoptas (Mainly for objective grabbing and overwatch interference)

Heavy support
2x battle wagons with deff rolla and a big shoota


LoW:
Klaw Frenzy Stompa! with power fields, super charger, flambelcha and 3 big shoota

If you have never played the Klaw Frenzy stompa, here what you should now. First, you do not have a lot of range weapons as you have to give up your gun arm for another melee weapon, called a Titan Close Combat weapon. IA: Apocalypse says a Titan Close Combat weapon gives you +3 to your Attack stat. (in this stompa's case, that is a +6) Frenzy Stompa's gain an additional 3 attacks. Then you have +1 for two CC weapons and +1 for charging, for a grand total of 15! (base 4 +6+3+1+1=15) Now the Super charger, which is a Klaw frenzy only upgrade, doubles your charge range! (2d6 x 2). You might be like this is awesome, crazy, WTF? and etc. This is all to make up for the fact you are missing your gun arms and using melee as your primary weapons. You can easy make a first turn charge with him. Kind of want to see the look on the guy's face when I roll a 10 and then double that to 20" for a charge from the center of the table on turn one. Also, if the Klaw stompa kills a vehicle in the assault he then gets to through it as if he had a lifta dropa. (if you scatter right, you can throw the vehicle into another unit or vehicle, )

Something for us to talk about, because the Stompa is I1 and his stomp attacks are at I1 does that mean you get to still stomp after you destroy whatever you are in combat with, with all those D str attacks? Personally, I believe the answer is yes, because you are still resolving the stompa's attacks and we only check for the enemy at the beginning of the initiative step, but I could be wrong.

Now the rest of the army is your basic cult of speed army. Zhadsnark will lead the bikes in the long head-on charge accross the field. If you flat out the bike unit has a 2+ jink save. You can make this even more effective when you put Zhadsnark in the front. So 2+ LOS then a 2+ jink. (FNP 5+) Means you have to roll 1 and then another 1 for Zhadsnark to need a FNP roll. 1/36 chance of rolling snake eyes. The units of 20 boyz are the main assault force. Dumping 20 'ard boyz right in front of the enemy can be pretty scary. Maybe the stompa will leave something for them to kill. The deffkoptas job are to grab objectives and run overwatch interference/ Screening. Its a nifty little trick where you declare the assault from the deffkopta first and then another unit, then your opponent has to choose overwatch the deffkopta of overwatch whatever is assaulting them, but if the deffkopta makes it you can not fire overwatch at the second unit assaulting you because the unit is engaged already.

Thoughts my fellow Warbosses?

Assault ends when either all the initiative steps have been taken, or when one side has been completely destroyed. I can't imagine your stomps would carry over out of combat once the enemy has been destroyed. Believe me, as a melee-heavy warboss, I would love for wounds to spill over to nearby enemies, but that's just not the case.

Also, I'd get rid of the deff rolla on battlewagons. They used to be good, but they're pretty garbage now. They only get their +d3 attacks when an enemy model tries a death or glory attack, and not many units are going to try that against your 14 front armor. The worst part is that it no longer works on vehicles, which was the whole point of the damn thing. Just take the reinforced rams instead. They're cheaper, give you the higher front armor when ramming, and get you the reroll.

Also, that stompa sounds terrifying, but you really might want to look into approving that with the tournament. I don't know how they'd rule that.

I might look into putting an extra HQ with the 'ard boyz, even something as cheap as a naked mek. PK nobs are scary, but not so much in challenges due to their init. Having a naked mek to eat challenges helps a lot.

Also, Zhadsnark is a great model in general. Heck, I'd look into pumping a few more bikers in there just to make it all the scarrier.

 Vitali Advenil wrote:
Assault ends when either all the initiative steps have been taken, or when one side has been completely destroyed. I can't imagine your stomps would carry over out of combat once the enemy has been destroyed. Believe me, as a melee-heavy warboss, I would love for wounds to spill over to nearby enemies, but that's just not the case.

Also, I'd get rid of the deff rolla on battlewagons. They used to be good, but they're pretty garbage now. They only get their +d3 attacks when an enemy model tries a death or glory attack, and not many units are going to try that against your 14 front armor. The worst part is that it no longer works on vehicles, which was the whole point of the damn thing. Just take the reinforced rams instead. They're cheaper, give you the higher front armor when ramming, and get you the reroll.

Also, that stompa sounds terrifying, but you really might want to look into approving that with the tournament. I don't know how they'd rule that.

I might look into putting an extra HQ with the 'ard boyz, even something as cheap as a naked mek. PK nobs are scary, but not so much in challenges due to their init. Having a naked mek to eat challenges helps a lot.

Also, Zhadsnark is a great model in general. Heck, I'd look into pumping a few more bikers in there just to make it all the scarrier.

If I remember right, you can actually stomp thing out side of close combat. The first small blast in touch with you, but the next one is with in 3" and the next one is another 3" away. I'll have to double check, but from what I remember it is possible. Yeah I hope they are cool with it. They were last year, but they where not use ITC rules and FAQ.

I have some left over points I might do the whole mek thing.

I broke out my rulebook, and it looks like you are right. It doesn't actually say whether it has to be done during a current combat, just that it occurs in the fight sub-phase at init 1. But since the blasts are scattering so far, I'd say that maybe it works? I'd clear that with the TO as well.

 Vitali Advenil wrote:
I broke out my rulebook, and it looks like you are right. It doesn't actually say whether it has to be done during a current combat, just that it occurs in the fight sub-phase at init 1. But since the blasts are scattering so far, I'd say that maybe it works? I'd clear that with the TO as well.

That is how we played it last year at this event. My stompa got into cc with a reverent and we were stomping everything around us. It was kind of funny. Basically how giant robots should fight!

Stomps can't be used on gargantuans or shv

 Frozocrone wrote:
Stomps can't be used on gargantuans or shv

Yes, but that doesn't mean I can't stomp that near by x unit that is not a GMC or SH. Provided I get enough stomp attacks to reach them.

Forgive me for asking this if it's obvious, but theoretically I could take multiple Ork Horde detachments if I wanted, correct? So if I wanted to take 3 Ork Horde detachments, I could field nine HQ's and nine troops. Though I suppose I would be better off fielding 4 CAD's with 8 HQ's and 8 troops minimum, with Objective Secured.

Of course, if you're going to throw that many points into HQ's, might as well invest in the Council of the Waaagh! Obviously you can't take multiples of that formation since it contains unique IC's.

Just brainstorming. I'm aware that tournaments often put restrictions on the number of detachments you can field. It's fun thinking about a deathstar of HQ's. An Ork can dream, right?

Yes that's legal. Or unbound if you're not opposed to unbound armies.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Glitcha wrote:

 Frozocrone wrote:
Stomps can't be used on gargantuans or shv

Yes, but that doesn't mean I can't stomp that near by x unit that is not a GMC or SH. Provided I get enough stomp attacks to reach them.

True dat. Stomp away!

 Cleatus wrote:
Forgive me for asking this if it's obvious, but theoretically I could take multiple Ork Horde detachments if I wanted, correct? So if I wanted to take 3 Ork Horde detachments, I could field nine HQ's and nine troops. Though I suppose I would be better off fielding 4 CAD's with 8 HQ's and 8 troops minimum, with Objective Secured.

Of course, if you're going to throw that many points into HQ's, might as well invest in the Council of the Waaagh! Obviously you can't take multiples of that formation since it contains unique IC's.

Just brainstorming. I'm aware that tournaments often put restrictions on the number of detachments you can field. It's fun thinking about a deathstar of HQ's. An Ork can dream, right?

For sure, though to be honest Ork horde detachments attract me most because they seem like a great way to fill your list full of painboyz more than anything else. Hard to say no to objective secured though.

If we had the old cybork bodies I think we could definitely make a scary biker deathstar (and the council of WAAAGH wouldn't be nearly as crappy as it is now) but alas until that day where it returns to being an invuln I think we are best off using them as bullies, as usual.

Yeah. To be honest, I'm never completely sure how to use my bikers. In my army they're a huge fire magnet, so they often die rather quick. I need advice to maximize their effectiveness.

Also, as far as formations go, the only ork one I'd consider taking is the warband since that lets you declare a waaagh every turn. Combibe that with the bellowing tyrant trait and your army is fearless after turn 1.

Why not just spam allied detachments if you want HQ? 1 HQ, 1 Troop. AND you get obsec.

 koooaei wrote:
Why not just spam allied detachments if you want HQ? 1 HQ, 1 Troop. AND you get obsec.

Because an Allied Detachment can't be your primary detachment, and also Orks can't ally with themselves, right?

How so, noone prohibits you from running a number of detachments.
How's that not just another detachment?

Pretty sure that allied detachments can't be from the same faction as your primary detachment.

 Cleatus wrote:
Pretty sure that allied detachments can't be from the same faction as your primary detachment.

Yup, Cleatus is right, one of the restrictions is that it has to have a different faction than the one in your primary detachment.

OK, I gave my Deff Dread 4 power klaws. Here are the pics.

What do you guys think? I think it's dead killy.

Very nice.


You know, I'm surprised that more Orks don't go with Unbound armies- I mean, yeah, Objectve Secured is handy, but aren't there people out there that want to build completely fluffy lists? Or just try stuff that's silly, like an entire army made up of Lootas or Burnaboyz?

Anvildude wrote:
Very nice.


You know, I'm surprised that more Orks don't go with Unbound armies- I mean, yeah, Objectve Secured is handy, but aren't there people out there that want to build completely fluffy lists? Or just try stuff that's silly, like an entire army made up of Lootas or Burnaboyz?

I would say largely because most Ork players are used to the standard FOC of previous editions and its hard to break out of that habit and therefore unbound still has a lot of stigma. Also because for the most part Orks don't really benefit from unbound compared to other armies given that our army really doesn't have much that you can't do already in a battle-forged list that's themed and fluffy.

I'd be fine with unbound in pre-made/agreed scenarios with other players and friends but when it comes to pick-up games its much easier and generally polite to stick with battle-forged armies.

I would agree that we don't need unbound all that much. I could see it occasionally to get an extra looted wagon or battlewagon for blood axes or maybe squiggoths for snakebites but that's unusual and you can normally just use 2 detachments and stay bound with basically the same list you were going to take as unbound.

I avoid unbound just because ObSec is so important. I had grots hold an objective against Space Wolf cavalry today because we had ObSec and they didn't. I mean, I still ended up losing that battle, but it was one hell of a fight with a single combat that got 3 different units from my side and 2 different units from his side sucked into it. My warboss and a handfull of shootas were the only survivors in that scrap. It was a good fight.

ALright I am looking for some advice guys

I have a friendly tourney coming up want some tips and opinions.

The short version of the list is

CAD:

HQ: Big Mek (KFF/Fixer uppers/ 2 oilers

Elite: Tankbustas x5 1 squig in trukk (Three of these squads)

Troops: Gretchin (3 squads)

Fast attack: Two deffkoptas 1 warbuggy

Heavy Support: Gun Wagons x3 (all with boarding plank)

LOW: Buzzgobs stompa: 2 suppa rokkets

Bully boyz: Meganobs X5 W/ kombi skorcha x3


Did some play testing today and it worked very well for me, but I have some questions on it as a friendly tourney list

1. Would you say its a friendly tourney list? One on hand it is an ork list, but on the other I am using the best units in the codex as well as the super cheap stompa in addition to FW Gun Wagons. It is going by ITC rules so its totally legal from that aspect, but I want to make sure that its not a dick move to bring this. My opinion of it is that its me trying to make the best out of a weak army.

2. I am thinking of swapping out Buzzgobs stompa for a klawfrenzy kustom stompa. Its around the same price and brings a ton more meele carnage, but I am not sure where to find the rules for it. Can anyone help me out with that part?

3. If this list seems unfriendly what changes would you think of? My first thought was to replace the stompa with a bunch of bikers including Zhard.

4. A lot of vehicles have the choice of taking big shootas or rokket launchas. Which would you advise taking?


And another quick question:

Can you target a Super heavy vehicle that is engaged in combat? The person I played today said you can, but I have never heard of the rule. He is a good guy so I dont think he would lie so I didnt fight him on it. I looked up Super heavy vehicles and walkers in the rule book and I dont see anything that says it can be shot in combat. Maybe its an ITC thing he was talking about?

Nah, looks fine to me for a tournament. You'll be facing knights and riptides and all sorts of OP shenanigans so don't feel bad.
The rules for the klaw stompa are in IA8.

No, you can't shoot any unit that's engaged in combat. Not heard anything about it on ITC either. I think he was trying to pull a fast one on you, and it worked.

So I have a problem with my warbikers. I know they're good, but I never know how to use them. Throwing them at tougher units always ends in a slaughter, so the main thing I can think is to send them after enemy backfield units to force them off objectives? What can I do to use them effectively?

 Vitali Advenil wrote:
So I have a problem with my warbikers. I know they're good, but I never know how to use them. Throwing them at tougher units always ends in a slaughter, so the main thing I can think is to send them after enemy backfield units to force them off objectives? What can I do to use them effectively?

Warbikers might be more durable but they aren't any better at CC than boyz so picking your close combat fights is very important. Warbiker's strengths are mobility, durability (for an Ork), and their shooting so focus on softening up targets with your shooting and only charge in when you can clean up the unit in the initial assault. In general strong melee units will chew through Orks so you have to chip them down with shooting or just ignore them while you focus on removing ranged threats. Units like Meganobz are your heavy hitter close combat units but even they get shredded by good melee units that can cut through their armor saves before the Nobz get to swing.

 r_squared wrote:
Nah, looks fine to me for a tournament. You'll be facing knights and riptides and all sorts of OP shenanigans so don't feel bad.
The rules for the klaw stompa are in IA8.

No, you can't shoot any unit that's engaged in combat. Not heard anything about it on ITC either. I think he was trying to pull a fast one on you, and it worked.

Well remember its a fun tourney and it does specify not to bring super strong, soul crushing lists. Now I dont think my list is all that mighty, but I am just really wondering if the fact that I am Orks off sets the bringing of the super discounted stompa.

Yeah I dont see any mention of that rule anywhere, but again I dont think he would cheat to win. It did win him the game, but oh well. It was just a beer and pretzel game anyways xD

Is he in the tourney too? ;-)

TBH I've played a couple of fun tourneys, and it's usually OK to take what you want. Personally I'd go with a kustom stompa with some power fields, you'll need them, it will be a fire magnet.

Some people will try and pull a "funny" rule as a challenge to see if they can get away with it. The easiest way to deal with it if you're not sure, is to ask them to show you the rule. Puts it in their court then.

Who was top Orks at LVO? I know John McCool was 48 with a Big Mek Stompa + Bikes list. Was there anyone higher?

 Glitcha wrote:

If you have never played the Klaw Frenzy stompa, here what you should now. First, you do not have a lot of range weapons as you have to give up your gun arm for another melee weapon, called a Titan Close Combat weapon. IA: Apocalypse says a Titan Close Combat weapon gives you +3 to your Attack stat. (in this stompa's case, that is a +6) Frenzy Stompa's gain an additional 3 attacks. Then you have +1 for two CC weapons and +1 for charging, for a grand total of 15! (base 4 +6+3+1+1=15) Now the Super charger, which is a Klaw frenzy only upgrade, doubles your charge range! (2d6 x 2). You might be like this is awesome, crazy, WTF? and etc. This is all to make up for the fact you are missing your gun arms and using melee as your primary weapons. You can easy make a first turn charge with him. Kind of want to see the look on the guy's face when I roll a 10 and then double that to 20" for a charge from the center of the table on turn one. Also, if the Klaw stompa kills a vehicle in the assault he then gets to through it as if he had a lifta dropa. (if you scatter right, you can throw the vehicle into another unit or vehicle, )

That's totally insane for a measly 430 grots.

Take a seat Eldar, Orks showing how speed is done!
That's amazing though. Does it have Ere We Go?

Might have to review it after IA8 is rereleased