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Are ard boyz really gone? I mean, I haven't read all the spoilers to be honest, but maybe in 8th edition they will be elites like they were in older editions.

I've never played them so I'm certainly not disappointed if they completely disappear but about the rumors & leaks that I've read I have a very bad feeling about orks in 8th edition. Too many units with a huge points raise. I hate footslogging orks but it seems regular boyz are among the few units that will remain cheap. It seems like I won't be able to fit the same number of meganobz, trukks and bikers that I used to field in 7th edition and I'm quite sad about that.

Kinda sad how they snuck in a movement restriction with painboy on bike. I think they figured out that was the best version and had to nerf it a little.

 Blackie wrote:
Are ard boyz really gone? I mean, I haven't read all the spoilers to be honest, but maybe in 8th edition they will be elites like they were in older editions.

I've never played them so I'm certainly not disappointed if they completely disappear but about the rumors & leaks that I've read I have a very bad feeling about orks in 8th edition. Too many units with a huge points raise. I hate footslogging orks but it seems regular boyz are among the few units that will remain cheap. It seems like I won't be able to fit the same number of meganobz, trukks and bikers that I used to field in 7th edition and I'm quite sad about that.

There are point increases on special weapons and most vehicle hulls across all the codexes. Only basic infantry has remained the same. Oh, and stormboyz actually 1 pt cheaper. 8 pt boyz with 12 move. Hummmm.

 Blackie wrote:
Are ard boyz really gone? I mean, I haven't read all the spoilers to be honest, but maybe in 8th edition they will be elites like they were in older editions.

I've never played them so I'm certainly not disappointed if they completely disappear but about the rumors & leaks that I've read I have a very bad feeling about orks in 8th edition. Too many units with a huge points raise. I hate footslogging orks but it seems regular boyz are among the few units that will remain cheap. It seems like I won't be able to fit the same number of meganobz, trukks and bikers that I used to field in 7th edition and I'm quite sad about that.

Compared to what everybody else is getting, most of the ork increases are tiny.

A lot of folk are suggesting 2500 point games for their current builds. You can get a lot of dakka in those extra points.

 JimOnMars wrote:

 Blackie wrote:
Are ard boyz really gone? I mean, I haven't read all the spoilers to be honest, but maybe in 8th edition they will be elites like they were in older editions.

I've never played them so I'm certainly not disappointed if they completely disappear but about the rumors & leaks that I've read I have a very bad feeling about orks in 8th edition. Too many units with a huge points raise. I hate footslogging orks but it seems regular boyz are among the few units that will remain cheap. It seems like I won't be able to fit the same number of meganobz, trukks and bikers that I used to field in 7th edition and I'm quite sad about that.

Compared to what everybody else is getting, most of the ork increases are tiny.

A lot of folk are suggesting 2500 point games for their current builds. You can get a lot of dakka in those extra points.

WOOOWWW bro, never enough dakka.

And big updates, tankbustas 5 points each, cheaper than boyz (maybe because of the veicule progress).

Every model that isn't a named character has to buy all their gear, so tankbustas come out to 17 points with rokkits or the pistol, which is still decent.

A readjustment on what still constitutes "cheap" will happen once players and tourneys decide whether 2000-2500 is the standard level of play.

I think we came out fairly well as far as point changes go. Most things that got point increase got a good survivability bump to go along with it. The free Nob for squads adds up to a lot of saved points. Even the stuff that stayed the same or close are much better due to the general rules. A +6 save still isn't great but we do actually get to use it most times now.

Tankbustas are 17 points with a rokkit launcher.

 JohnU wrote:
Every model that isn't a named character has to buy all their gear, so tankbustas come out to 17 points with rokkits or the pistol, which is still decent.

A readjustment on what still constitutes "cheap" will happen once players and tourneys decide whether 2000-2500 is the standard level of play.

I think we came out fairly well as far as point changes go. Most things that got point increase got a good survivability bump to go along with it. The free Nob for squads adds up to a lot of saved points. Even the stuff that stayed the same or close are much better due to the general rules. A +6 save still isn't great but we do actually get to use it most times now.

Not sure about that:


Or maybe i misunderstood the line which says you have to pay the wargear.

On the points page, under points per model it will say if price of wargear is included or not.

http://i.imgur.com/Hf1chjK.jpg

For the datasheets, if something is included then you MUST purchase that gear (which sometimes just costs 0 points)

So for the tankbusta example, they must purchase a rokkit, stikkbombs, and tankbusta bombs.

You get 5 points for the boy + 12 for the rokkit + 0 for the stikkbombs and + 0 for the tankbusta bombs.

 JohnU wrote:
On the points page, under points per model it will say if price of wargear is included or not.

http://i.imgur.com/Hf1chjK.jpg

For the datasheets, if something is included then you MUST purchase that gear (which sometimes just costs 0 points)

So for the tankbusta example, they must purchase a rokkit, stikkbombs, and tankbusta bombs.

You get 5 points for the boy + 12 for the rokkit + 0 for the stikkbombs and + 0 for the tankbusta bombs.

Ah thanks, that's too bad .

Not necessarily. Some units got boosts in odd ways. Burnas for Kommandos are now free. Koptas got free bomms. Free attack squigs for biker bosses.

And then we had our nerfs. Trukkz going up over 100% in price. As did a bunch of other units.

BWs, Bikers, going up 50% in price.

And then we have our Burna's which now officially suck balls. D3 instead of D6 like every other faction. The only upside is you don't have to choose to shoot or melee.

And Kommandos get better? in what world? They have 6+ armor now standard, and they get +2 to cover instead of 1 so if they hide in ruins they are at 4+ unless they get shot at by AP-1 weapons in which case its 5+

Before those same Kommandos were getting 3+ Cover Saves.

SemperMortis wrote:
And then we had our nerfs. Trukkz going up over 100% in price. As did a bunch of other units.

BWs, Bikers, going up 50% in price.

And then we have our Burna's which now officially suck balls. D3 instead of D6 like every other faction. The only upside is you don't have to choose to shoot or melee.

And Kommandos get better? in what world? They have 6+ armor now standard, and they get +2 to cover instead of 1 so if they hide in ruins they are at 4+ unless they get shot at by AP-1 weapons in which case its 5+

Before those same Kommandos were getting 3+ Cover Saves.

Can charge t1, flamer for free on kommandos. And you have to understand the cover stealth for exemple only get -1 on hit's dices if the opponent fire on them.

kopta bombs are free!?

 davou wrote:
kopta bombs are free!?

Indeed. They can do up to 5 mortal wounds.

http://i.imgur.com/Hf1chjK.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/k9iaX3L.jpg

little-killer wrote:
Before those same Kommandos were getting 3+ Cover Saves.

Can charge t1, flamer for free on kommandos. And you have to understand the cover stealth for exemple only get -1 on hit's dices if the opponent fire on them.

They can't move, but they can try for the 9" charge.

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:

little-killer wrote:
Before those same Kommandos were getting 3+ Cover Saves.

Can charge t1, flamer for free on kommandos. And you have to understand the cover stealth for exemple only get -1 on hit's dices if the opponent fire on them.

That's something I was curious about. It says that Kommandoz can be setup at the end of a movement phase. I would interpret that as being that they can't move in the movement phase on the turn they are setup. Am I misinterpreting the rules?

Granted, they might make a 9" charge, and 'Ere We Go helps with that.

Does moving through terrain have any effect in the new edition?

Soss wrote:
Does moving through terrain have any effect in the new edition?

Moving, no. Some affect charge distance if you're using the advanced terrain rules.

http://i.imgur.com/S2kKowW.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/N3ji4br.jpg

Which of the planes seems best to you guys? Each seems to have a niche. The dakkajet seems consistent, the burna-bomber seems alright anti-infantry (but you can probably get a similar result by spamming deffkoptas with bigbomms), the blitza-bommer seems more universally applicable than the burna-bommer but honestly kind of mediocre dedicated anti-tank, and the Wazbom seems like either an alternative to a Big Mek for spreading around KFF buffs (how is it measured from the model btw?) or a decent character sniper with the tellyporta mega-blastas.

Holy crap I never bothered to look at the Shokk atack gun, it looks insane!

For those that haven't seen it:
Range60' HeavyD6 S2d6 AP-5 DD3 If 11 or 12 is rolled for the Strength then all hits immediately cause D3 mortal wounds.

They got rid of the "lol random" stuff and made it quite the threatening long-ranged weapon. I might consider picking one up now.

Don't forget it hits on a 5+

xlDuke wrote:
Don't forget it hits on a 5+

Yeah, with heavy D6 attacks you're at a fair bit of risk of whiffing entirely. If it got a bonus to hit that's make it better, but it seems kind of bad.

Unless there's a way to make it a sniper, it looks like you're better off with Lootas.

 GreatGranpapy wrote:
Holy crap I never bothered to look at the Shokk atack gun, it looks insane!

For those that haven't seen it:
Range60' HeavyD6 S2d6 AP-5 DD3 If 11 or 12 is rolled for the Strength then all hits immediately cause D3 mortal wounds.

They got rid of the "lol random" stuff and made it quite the threatening long-ranged weapon. I might consider picking one up now.

D6 average roll is 3.5, round which means that on average your going to hit 1 to 1.3 times per turn. your going to be paying 45pts + the cost of the Big Mek for 1-2 Hits on average a turn at S7 on average. Yeah.....whoopee.

Im not even pretending anymore, this edition fething blows for orks. We are royally boned.

 davou wrote:
kopta bombs are free!?

Yes, which I find interesting because there is no "bigbomm" model. Neither the "current" metal deffkopta nor AOBR ones had them, AFAIK.

Which tells me that there is a new deff kopta model in the works, each with a bomb. GW has been pretty careful to match up the models with rules, including the dual-rocket pistol wielding tankbusta.

Bets on the date for the ork release? Obviously CSM still needs a codex (judging by the death guard complainers in the rumor thread) and we're still behind bugs & guard, and of course marines will get one (because marines.)

I'm thinking September / October.





Automatically Appended Next Post:

SemperMortis wrote:
We are royally boned.

Three words:

Consolidate

Into

Combat.

gnome_idea_what wrote:Which of the planes seems best to you guys? Each seems to have a niche. The dakkajet seems consistent, the burna-bomber seems alright anti-infantry (but you can probably get a similar result by spamming deffkoptas with bigbomms), the blitza-bommer seems more universally applicable than the burna-bommer but honestly kind of mediocre dedicated anti-tank, and the Wazbom seems like either an alternative to a Big Mek for spreading around KFF buffs (how is it measured from the model btw?) or a decent character sniper with the tellyporta mega-blastas.

The gun planes are helped a lot by being able to shoot in any direction and supa shootas actually get some benefit from their AP now. Burna bombs seem strictly inferior to boom bombs now (both roll the same number of dice, both hit infantry on 4+, boom bomb hits everything else on a 4+ too and rolls extra dice against vehicles). Unfortunately, in order to pay for the cost of the plane, each bomb needs to inflict about 50 points of damage and I'm struggling to find targets that would work with. Who gathers models worth more than 20 points per wound in units bigger than five? Custodes and terminators, I guess. Inceptors might be worth it too.

Skorcha missiles would be OK if you had a decent number of shots, but D6 isn't enough. Only thing that really appeals about the burna bomma is that it blows up more when it dies, hopefully killing the enemy. Don't see anything that lets you target characters with the tellyport blastas, although careful positioning and an unwary opponent might let you get close, and most characters have enough wounds to make it unreliable at best.

Mounting a KFF on a fairly delicate vehicle which is tricky to position doesn't seem like a great idea. All of the planes suffer badly from the new supersonic rule, which makes it hard to keep them on the table and unless you are playing DFTS you can't come back if you leave.

Overall, the only one that seems likely to earn it's points back is the dakkajet.

GreatGranpapy wrote:Holy crap I never bothered to look at the Shokk atack gun, it looks insane!

For those that haven't seen it:
Range60' HeavyD6 S2d6 AP-5 DD3 If 11 or 12 is rolled for the Strength then all hits immediately cause D3 mortal wounds.

They got rid of the "lol random" stuff and made it quite the threatening long-ranged weapon. I might consider picking one up now.

Meh, it's weaker than a kustom mega kannon and a lot more expensive. The nerf to large blasts really made it quite pathetic. The only thing that makes me consider one is that you can have the big mek stand next to a few mek guns and repair them while lending supporting fire. Probably better to do that with ordinary meks or a BM with KFF though.

Not sure about whether repair is worth it and if it is whether to do it with meks, big meks or spanners. Seems like a mix might be needed; big mek for things with serious damage, meks and spanners for ones only missing one wound. Might be tricky to co-ordinate things with the whole only being able to repair each vehicle once business.

Jim, your 3 words are encouraging, right up until you realize

Orks can move 5in a turn. Trukkz more then doubled in price, Battlewagons went up over 50% in price. How the hell are you getting things into CC in the first place?

Trukks are double the cost but you aren't spending turn 1 watching your opponent blow up 4 of them with some random schlub with a lascannon. 10 wounds and a 4+ save will take a more concentrated effort to bring down in one turn, even with the increased number of shots from most weapons. Every army's heavy weapons have jumped up quite a bit in points too.

Battlewagons don't have to worry about hiding that ridiculously long side facing anymore.

The price for trukks was galling at first, but they did get a lot more survivable.

 JohnU wrote:
Trukks are double the cost but you aren't spending turn 1 watching your opponent blow up 4 of them with some random schlub with a lascannon. 10 wounds and a 4+ save will take a more concentrated effort to bring down in one turn, even with the increased number of shots from most weapons. Every army's heavy weapons have jumped up quite a bit in points too.

Battlewagons don't have to worry about hiding that ridiculously long side facing anymore.

The price for trukks was galling at first, but they did get a lot more survivable.

you are going to be paying as much for the trukk as you are for a unit of 12 boyz. actually you will be paying MORE for the trukk then the unit of boyz. And The fact that a Trukk is worse in almost every category to a Rhino and yet is more expensive is just to much. At this point im hoping GW is just trolling us and leaked fake stuff to get us all stirred up..