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Made in sg
Regular Dakkanaut






Was literally in the toilet when this came through.

Thoughts: Hey those 6mm Cyclones look correct.

2nd Thoughts: If you want me to suspend my disbelief at those 15mm Cyclones against a Battlepod, that's some mighty suspension.

A few more stray things:

What exactly is PB's concept of a miniature, a wargame, and a miniature tabletop wargame?

1. A miniature is not always a scale model. Scale modelers do laugh at us wargamers, and for a good reason; our stuff isn't -- and isn't supposed to -- be at their level of details. If PB wants great level of details, get Bandai or Tamiya involved. Else, you accept that sometimes good enough really is good enough.

2. A wargame can be a table with a mapboard and markers. Like Risk. Or CBT (better looking minis). Or a full blown miniature wargame. Is the miniatures you are producing meant to act like markers on a traditional board wargame, or a miniature in a minature tabletop game?

I suspect their concept of what *is* a tabletop wargame is a wee bit off. One of the things I swore at my Destroids was that the difference between a PRC factory worker assembling it as a marker for a board game vs myself is that he get paid to do that.

Back to the point. As a wargamer, those 6mm Cyclones look good for the job. Especially if we want to mix it up, Invid vs. Zent with a side-dish of Earthlings in-between. Just the mental image of a swarm of 6mm Invid Scouts vs. basic armour Zents is interesting.

The 15mm looks good as a marque, but really if you want to do it that way you might as well go 28mm. You go 15mm you limit your options and your details. Go 28mm as a RPG supplement to get around the licensing issue, but REALLY knock it out of the park with the details so that people want to use it in their RPG sessions.
   
Made in us
Nurgle Predator Driver with an Infestation




OKLAHOMA!!!

The last line of that update stings the most to me.


I'm also of the opinion that this discussion of scale change shouldn't be happening until after wave 2 is complete.

 
   
Made in us
[MOD]
Solahma






RVA

sqir666 wrote:
I'm also of the opinion that this discussion of scale change shouldn't be happening until after wave 2 is complete.
Yes, every post about scale is a victory for the terrorists.

   
Made in us
Legendary Master of the Chapter





SoCal

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
 Alpharius wrote:
Will the switch to 15mm kill the game completely, or will it 'only' kill the 6mm version?


PB can't afford to redo the 6mm stuff in 15mm. We are looking at 2 very different scales, that simply should not play on the board together.


Maybe we can use some forced-perspective techniques to trick the eye? It will be like putting on a British theatrical production with Mecha.

Do you hear the mecha shoot?
It is a sound of angry guns.
It is a music of a tech
that lays down the megatons.

When the pounding of the cannon
echos Minmei's backup drums
there is a life about the end
when the volley comes.

You see a problem. I see an excuse.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/08 18:20:01


   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

 Manchu wrote:
sqir666 wrote:
I'm also of the opinion that this discussion of scale change shouldn't be happening until after wave 2 is complete.
Yes, every post about scale is a victory for the terrorists.


Don't bring the missing malcontents faction into this!

We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
 
   
Made in es
Inspiring SDF-1 Bridge Officer






I... actually like how they look at 6mm, TBH.
   
Made in sg
Regular Dakkanaut





 Albertorius wrote:
I... actually like how they look at 6mm, TBH.

Yeah, so imagine them a wee bit better detailed, more action pose, a few of them leaping up on those weird support they like, and probably 6 to a single base. The joy of 6mm work is not in the individual unit, but the whole cohesive army.. I don't think PB gets that.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

When I get back to my desk I'll convert the 15mm down to match what I posted earlier (40% bigger or roughly 8-9mm) and multi based.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Lynx7725 wrote:
 Albertorius wrote:
I... actually like how they look at 6mm, TBH.

Yeah, so imagine them a wee bit better detailed, more action pose, a few of them leaping up on those weird support they like, and probably 6 to a single base. The joy of 6mm work is not in the individual unit, but the whole cohesive army.. I don't think PB gets that.


Those were 3d printered on shapeways iirc so lower detail than plastic would be by a little. They're not particularly well painted either which doesnt help.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/08 18:33:07


We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






SoCal, USA!

Lot of stuff going on here.

1. Wave 1 thoughts
I assembled my portion of the split roughly 3 months ago:
Spoiler:

I believe the minis look good for what we paid, and the effort is basically worth it. I haven't played RRT, and didn't intend to - I just wanted minis. If my friends build their stuff, I'll slap some paint on and give things a go.

As others not, PB delivered something, which is way better than receiving nothing.

2. Wave 2 thoughts
If PB is delivering everything, by hook or by crook, that's great. If it's by end of year, even better.

I just want my Monster, with matching scale and matching level of detail. I do NOT particularly care how many pieces it takes, because I am only building one of them, and it is still regular HIPS plastic - stuff that I can work with relatively easily. The MAC-II Monster is a showcase model, and I am prepared to do a 4+ hour build if that's what it takes. I would not be surprised to see people superdetail the MAC-II to IPMS competition level. In that context, if PB can get the part count down, that's fine, but not at the expense of any detail larger than a grain of rice.

3. 15mm vs 6mm Scale?
I am not much interested in post-Macross "Robotech", I almost don't care. If they do want to combine things (I can't see this as a good idea), then going from 6mm scale to 15mm is too big of a scale jump; Cyclones and Invid Scouts at 8mm scale (+35%) would be fine, and they should still be multi-based. If PB is dead set on 15mm, they should do it as a different game that doesn't unify with Macross-era stuff. I'm pretty sure PB has no clue what the implications are, so the likely result is that PB will fold 15mm Cyclones in with 6mm Valks and then wonder why nobody outside the echo chamber likes it.

   
Made in es
Inspiring SDF-1 Bridge Officer






 warboss wrote:
When I get back to my desk I'll convert the 15mm down to match what I posted earlier (40% bigger or roughly 8-9mm) and multi based.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Lynx7725 wrote:
 Albertorius wrote:
I... actually like how they look at 6mm, TBH.

Yeah, so imagine them a wee bit better detailed, more action pose, a few of them leaping up on those weird support they like, and probably 6 to a single base. The joy of 6mm work is not in the individual unit, but the whole cohesive army.. I don't think PB gets that.


Those were 3d printered on shapeways iirc so lower detail than plastic would be by a little. They're not particularly well painted either which doesnt help.


Heh. I remember hand painting winged swords on the shoulders of my Epic Dark Angels SMs.

for the size even that detail would be enough... they just need better posing. They could afford to do a small spur with as many as 30 different poses if they went for one piece minis...

Or just go resin\metal, for reduced costs.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

 Albertorius wrote:

Heh. I remember hand painting winged swords on the shoulders of my Epic Dark Angels SMs.

for the size even that detail would be enough... they just need better posing. They could afford to do a small spur with as many as 30 different poses if they went for one piece minis...

Or just go resin\metal, for reduced costs.


Wow... you're a dedicated painter! Here is a scale pic of the non-macross stuff increased 250% to 15mm. This assumes that the relative scales in the original source image are correct which I haven't checked exactly but when you're jumping from 6mm to 250mm the difference is so huge (pun intended) that it doesn't matter as much.

I now present the perils (if you care about playing eras against/with each other ala sentinels) of 15mm rescaling including Alphas that tower over Zentraedi and Hovertanks that look down on VF-1 battloids. :(



edit: removed previous non-combined pic

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/08 20:20:27


We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Riverside, CA USA

But that just emphasises how completely necessary the scale change is. Without going to 15mm then the other eras are going to be REALLY tiny for no other reason than to match macross with battletech players. Macross is just too large for the other eras to stay at 6mm

Honestly, I wish macross had been 1/200 and the other eras going forward were 1/72, there's already so many kits that have existed for decades now that could be licensed for gaming and palladium just had to fill in the gaps in the line

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/08 20:05:53


~Kalamadea (aka ember)
My image gallery 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

 Kalamadea wrote:
But that just emphasises how completely necessary the scale change is. Without going to 15mm then the other eras are going to be REALLY tiny for no other reason than to match macross with battletech players. Macross is just too large for the other eras to stay at 6mm


I disagree. What it shows is that there should be a sliding scale and not a blanket one size fits all rescale of everything post macross. The cyclones need to be significantly bigger so bump them up to 10mm (see the pic below). The other mecha largely look too big (other than the Invid scout) so you bump them up half way to 8.5mm instead. The alphas, bioroids, and hovertanks are STILL smaller than the macross stuff but they're also not visually jarringly smaller (more like a space marine to a terminator and not a terminator to a halfling) YMMV.

Mods, I'll be replacing the previous pic with this combined one so as not to give Kid Kyoto a spam spasm when he sees so much robotech in one day. It'll take me a bit to delete the previous pic attachments though with a link to this one. I'm obviously biased but I think the sliding scale one works the best although I'd probably say after seeing the cyclones that they get a bump up to 10mm instead. That feels like the goldilocks solution for me. The 10mm is acceptable but not preferrable whereas bumping everything up to 15mm is the absolute worst choice IMO. YMMV.
[Thumb - 6mmvs10mmvs15mm.jpg]
Robotech Minis scale changes

[Thumb - mechacompare4.jpg]
Robotech Minis scale changes

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/06/08 21:08:14


We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
 
   
Made in us
Legendary Master of the Chapter





SoCal

I think some of you guys are overestimating how many people will care (in a negative fashion) about a scale change. The many angry posters who hated X-Wing and Armada for their scale errors have not made much of a dent in FFG's sales. ST Attack Wing is presumably doing fine despite scale issues much, much greater than 6mm vs 15mm. Sure, I get that you wouldn't want to mix the two scales on the same table, but would you want them on the same table even if they were in scale? Would you enjoy seeing a Lilliputian force of flat bases with teeny bumps on them lined up against minis that actually look like mecha across the table?

The scale is probably going to be more of an issue for the people who already think the 1st wave is fiddly, as well as the people who want detail they can see without hawk eyes, and people who want to display their minis. Anyone who would quit the game over the scale jump will probably quit anyway when they see the gnerls and Lancers.


I also don't see how multibasing will capture the flavor of a show where heroes often fight alone, or in loose bands rather than orderly squadrons.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Warboss, those 10mm Cyclones look tiny. My Destroids and Valkyries are already tiny enough, if not too tiny, so I really hope they don't put out cyclones that small.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/08 20:17:25


   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
I think some of you guys are overestimating how many people will care (in a negative fashion) about a scale change. The many angry posters who hated X-Wing and Armada for their scale errors have not made much of a dent in FFG's sales. ST Attack Wing is presumably doing fine despite scale issues much, much greater than 6mm vs 15mm.


That is probably because the scale changes weren't as drastic visually even if the numbers were actually worse. If the Rebel frigate suddenly became BIGGER visually than an ISD like the what will happen with the SC/NG mecha dwarfing the Macross stuff, I'd bet that there would be a similar reaction. That kind of stuff did happen with the WOTC star wars prepainted minis and people hated it. That's why I proposed a sliding scale so that the small stuff still gets bumped but everything isnt bumped up to a ridiculous IMO 250% increase.


Warboss, those 10mm Cyclones look tiny. My Destroids and Valkyries are already tiny enough, if not too tiny, so I really hope they don't put out cyclones that small.


I'm guessing you don't play other games then at that type of battle scale like DZC, Heavy Gear, Epic, and such. It's a preference and you have your reasons but palladium chose to market this as a mass battle game (going so far as to completely gut their previously released skirmish variant rules) and at mass battle game scale involving giant stompy robots (which all the eras have), you're absolutely should have noticeably smaller human sized stuff. If they had simply just said from the get go, "hey, you know what, we're making macross at 6mm but the other stuff will be 28mm skirmish scale and not compatible to better mesh with the rpg for that era".. I'd have been fine with it. Riptide sized hovertanks and Wraithknight veritechs with terminator sized cyclones would have interested me. I'm not really fine with them trying to have their cake (tons of figure sales!) and eat it too (but we need to invalidate all the previous stuff we said to get the mouthwatering detail this time!). YMMV. They sold me a game that would be compatible with the other eras. If they change the scale to 15mm, that is yet another promise that they voluntarily are choosing to break.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/08 20:54:25


We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
 
   
Made in ca
Grizzled MkII Monster Veteran




Toronto, Ontario

Bob... bob no, bob they'll cut you.

:-P

Warboss, your comparative diagram is selling me on either 10mm later generations or the sliding scale. The VT (let alone Battlepod) standing tall over the Bioroid/Hovertank is fine by me. Yes, the Alpha being taller (when I know 'omg it's supposed to be shorter') isn't great, but if that's what it takes, I don't think I'd 'rage' about it per se.

Plus if an Alpha is that size, wouldn't a Beta be even bigger? I recall them being kind of squat but quite broad.

15mm does seem like a mistake.

The Sliding Scale is holding the most appeal, I think, but I suspect it's also the least likely option to be chosen.

As much as people would hate multiple scales, the intentional inconsistency would probably fry a couple poor souls.
   
Made in us
Legendary Master of the Chapter





SoCal

How many fans even know how the mecha scale to each other? Have they even appeared together onscreeen? Without following these kinds of threads, I would never have guessed that the jet mecha in one series were so much larger than the jet mecha in another series. Visually, having them near identical, even if the wrong one is slightly taller, is preferable to having one dwarf the other, even if it's canon. Your sliding scale might suffice for the biggest mecha, but the 'medium' mecah from later shows still look goofy-small and the tiny little human goobers would still be unusable for anything but pushing around on a multibase, which is not what I want from heroes on mechabikes.


I don't play those games. I may get into DZC, but the teeny troops are not a turn on at all, and I would almost prefer not to have them in the game at all. I use Epic minis as decoration on BFG ships.

They deserve to lose customers for breaking their promise, but they will also lose customers if they release an entire Robotech series in a scale that makes them ridiculously small. Basically, they chased the Battletech crowd and made a lot of money at the cost of the future of their game. The question is which choice will harm their brand less.

The only way I can see them not shedding fans by the dozens is to make both scales, or maybe some show piece larger-scale 'hero' models with everything else in scale, but that would be expensive and probably beyond their capabilities.

   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

 Forar wrote:
Bob... bob no, bob they'll cut you.

:-P

Warboss, your comparative diagram is selling me on either 10mm later generations or the sliding scale. The VT (let alone Battlepod) standing tall over the Bioroid/Hovertank is fine by me. Yes, the Alpha being taller (when I know 'omg it's supposed to be shorter') isn't great, but if that's what it takes, I don't think I'd 'rage' about it per se.

Plus if an Alpha is that size, wouldn't a Beta be even bigger? I recall them being kind of squat but quite broad.

15mm does seem like a mistake.

The Sliding Scale is holding the most appeal, I think, but I suspect it's also the least likely option to be chosen.

As much as people would hate multiple scales, the intentional inconsistency would probably fry a couple poor souls.


10mm would be my choice if they absolutely had to pick a single scale change for everything but I'd much rather have the sliding scale obviously. And, yes, the beta would be quite large even compared to zentraedi mecha at 10mm. It is however the second largest thing outside of macross (the wierd shadow chronicles non-transformable batlloid thing whose name escapes me is even bigger) so is a fringe case that I'd be willing to put up with just like the cyclone. YMMV.


We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
 
   
Made in us
Legendary Master of the Chapter





SoCal

And if they move all the minis to resin or metal, they're dead to me.

   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
How many fans even know how the mecha scale to each other? Have they even appeared together onscreeen?


Together on screen? Nope. Basically, the size comparison is known only to folks who bought gashapon, toys, models, and figs as well as the RPG game plus those astute enough to notice the 250% difference in cockpit sizes. Of course the brand new totally not interfering with wave 2 civilian vehicles will look odd with cyclones towering like giants over cargo trucks.

They deserve to lose customers for breaking their promise, but they will also lose customers if they release an entire Robotech series in a scale that makes them ridiculously small. Basically, they chased the Battletech crowd and made a lot of money at the cost of the future of their game. The question is which choice will harm their brand less.


While you are correct in that they may lose some future fans by not changing the scale, the macross era is by far the most popular of the three. While there are some very dedicated and vocal fans of the other two series, the macross episodes are easily the most recognizable and rembered both by the general nerd populace as well as gamers. Telling the largest single portion of your player base that everything they bought (including the half of the stuff they still have yet to receive!) is out of scale already will likely lose them the most customers. The battletech players are a wash either way as they likely wouldn't pick up any other era stuff regardless of whether it was 3mm all the way to 28mm... they just wanted their unseen and they got them.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
And if they move all the minis to resin or metal, they're dead to me.


I'm ambivalent to that one. After seeing the plastic minis' detail and parts count, I'd rather have the smaller stuff in resin or metal if it means more cinematic poses and ease of assembly. That wouldn't apply though to the much larger zentraedi where metal would be too heavy IMO. The 15mm change over though would pretty much make the game dead to me. I'm already choosing not to purchase possible more than a box or two of minis in the future due to their 2 year long douchebaggery (and I was at only the basic $140 pledge level to start because I specifically WANTED to play their abandoned skirmish variant) so at this point I'm fighting simply for the possibility of someday fielding my macross stuff against other eras. That possibility is nixed with a 15mm change. That's MORE than the difference between plopping down Inquisitor scale figs on a 40k game table and being surprised that folks raise a stink.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/06/08 21:30:17


We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
 
   
Made in au
Screaming Shining Spear





Adelaide, Australia

I'm in favour of keeping it at 6mm, I think multibasing 6mm scale Cyclones will work out fine.

At a push I'd accept this sliding scale, but not overly rapt with it.

Not at all interested in a shift to 15mm

   
Made in us
[MOD]
Solahma






RVA

This issue also kind of befuddled me when it came up with X-Wing but I'm not sure I understand the point of achieving the precisely "correct" scale with, er, make believe vehicles.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/08 21:54:36


   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 warboss wrote:
 Kalamadea wrote:
But that just emphasises how completely necessary the scale change is. Without going to 15mm then the other eras are going to be REALLY tiny for no other reason than to match macross with battletech players. Macross is just too large for the other eras to stay at 6mm


I disagree. What it shows is that there should be a sliding scale and not a blanket one size fits all rescale of everything post macross. The cyclones need to be significantly bigger so bump them up to 10mm (see the pic below). The other mecha largely look too big (other than the Invid scout) so you bump them up half way to 8.5mm instead. The alphas, bioroids, and hovertanks are STILL smaller than the macross stuff but they're also not visually jarringly smaller (more like a space marine to a terminator and not a terminator to a halfling) YMMV.

Mods, I'll be replacing the previous pic with this combined one so as not to give Kid Kyoto a spam spasm when he sees so much robotech in one day. It'll take me a bit to delete the previous pic attachments though with a link to this one. I'm obviously biased but I think the sliding scale one works the best although I'd probably say after seeing the cyclones that they get a bump up to 10mm instead. That feels like the goldilocks solution for me. The 10mm is acceptable but not preferrable whereas bumping everything up to 15mm is the absolute worst choice IMO. YMMV.


Probably should have asked first but I shared these scale shots over on the FB page. Thanks for the hard work. They look great. If you want me to take them down just let me know.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/08 22:12:44


Dimensional Warfare
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B0VSNzmthd1vVlVfU3BadVd2MVk 
   
Made in us
PanOceaniac Hacking Specialist Sergeant






 Manchu wrote:
This issue also kind of befuddled me when it came up with X-Wing but I'm not sure I understand the point of achieving the precisely "correct" scale with, er, make believe vehicles.


Honestly, nobody really was making a fuss about X-Wing scale. All of the fighters are in scale with each other entirely. This is relevant only because you want things to 'look right'. If you want to see problems with scale, check out the Star Wars Attack Wing game: Nothing has a remotely relevant scale, so you get issues like the Reliant being like 3 times larger than the Enterprise, and other things which don't feel right.

The reason scale matters at all is just not to throw off your suspension of disbelief. If they released an SDF-1 for Robotech, and it's six inches long... sure, it's larger than your battlepod. But not by enough to make sense.

TBFH, the scale thing is a giant red herring to throw the discussion off 'Where is Wave 2'.

 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

 Killionaire wrote:

TBFH, the scale thing is a giant red herring to throw the discussion off 'Where is Wave 2'.


That it is but it is also the future of the game line as well. Wave 2 is the long delayed present.

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Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






SoCal, USA!

 Manchu wrote:
This issue also kind of befuddled me when it came up with X-Wing but I'm not sure I understand the point of achieving the precisely "correct" scale with, er, make believe vehicles.


X-wing, the fighters are in scale, but capitol ships are grossly out of scale. They don't belong together. It's like trying to put Carrier Groups into a dogfighting game.
____

 Killionaire wrote:
Honestly, nobody really was making a fuss about X-Wing scale. All of the fighters are in scale with each other entirely. This is relevant only because you want things to 'look right'.

If you want to see problems with scale, check out the Star Wars Attack Wing game: Nothing has a remotely relevant scale, so you get issues like the Reliant being like 3 times larger than the Enterprise, and other things which don't feel right.

The reason scale matters at all is just not to throw off your suspension of disbelief. If they released an SDF-1 for Robotech, and it's six inches long... sure, it's larger than your battlepod. But not by enough to make sense.

TBFH, the scale thing is a giant red herring to throw the discussion off 'Where is Wave 2'.


STAW?

Ugh.

But yeah, I want Wave 2!

   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

 Mike1975 wrote:

Probably should have asked first but I shared these scale shots over on the FB page. Thanks for the hard work. They look great. If you want me to take them down just let me know.


No worries, thanks and share away and please include a link to the thread here on dakka since the site is kind of enough to host gaming pics for free. I don't own either of the original source images' copyrights so it would be a bit stupid of me to raise a stink even if it bothered me (which it doesn't). If it helps more folks accurately visualize how truly large a 15mm flat scale increase really is for the whole game line compared with 6mm Macross instead of the cyclone only focus of the palladium pics, then mission accomplished. I don't want 20ft cyclones stomping around the battlefield. 10mm isn't perfect but if there has to be a single scale then that would be it and it meshes with DZC figs and more importantly terrain as well.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/08 23:33:48


We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
 
   
Made in us
[MOD]
Solahma






RVA

You guys saying X-Wing fighters are in scale ... you should look into the A-Wing debates ...

   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

 Manchu wrote:
You guys saying X-Wing fighters are in scale ... you should look into the A-Wing debates ...


To my knowledge, that is the only one with a publicized scale issue and is the exception rather than the rule (unlike STAW where the opposite seems true). That would be the in thread equivalent of Palladium increasing ONLY the cyclone to a bigger scale and leaving the rest alone.

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Made in us
Legendary Master of the Chapter





SoCal

Warboss, I'll have to take your word for it. If 6mm is the most profitable option then they should take it. I won't buy 6mm cyclones even if they are plastic, and I wouldn't buy any mecha or Invid that are significantly smaller than a Valkyrie. I want minis I can enjoy without the game, since I won't be playing it, and an invid scout the size of my thumbnail just isn't enjoyable. Have fun with 6mm Invid if that's how it goes. I'll just wait until I can find some gashapon or toys that won't blow away in a sneeze.

Frankly, the Invid are the most distinctive designs in the whole Robotech saga. I wish I could find some good minis for them.



I love what they've done for STAW. All the ship minis are good sizes for playing with. They also cost the same amount and take up the same amount of space, which makes them easier to collect.

Killionaire, I would LOVE a 6 inch SDF1. I'd even buy it in resin.

   
 
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