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 Albertorius wrote:

 warboss wrote:

My only real complaint about the rules from a viewing of a couple AS games (didn't play though) is the damage by range bracket. It's simplification one step too far for me as I do like the ability to shoot individual weapons with different stats. The abstraction of shooting them all with a combined single stat at each range feels a bit off to me although I realize that is a preference and yet a reasonable design mechanic on their part.

Well, if that's your only complaint, you might be happy to know that there's an optional variable damage rule in the Compendium ^_^.

It's an easy rule, too, and not too slow either (although it's another roll, so...). Basically, whenever you hit, instead of just marking off the whole damage, you roll 1d6 for each damage point. Every 4+ on a die does 1 point of damage.

It's variable damage results but still the same combined abstract total damage at a range though? If so then it won't scratch my itch frankly. I just like individual weapons (even if they slow down the game and bloat the stats a little bit).

 warboss wrote:
My only real complaint about the rules from a viewing of a couple AS games (didn't play though) is the damage by range bracket. It's simplification one step too far for me as I do like the ability to shoot individual weapons with different stats. The abstraction of shooting them all with a combined single stat at each range feels a bit off to me although I realize that is a preference and yet a reasonable design mechanic on their part.

An understandable issue but Alphastrike was meant for huge battles so the mechanic for me at least preserves the damage vs range capabilities.
Your preference is why classic B-tech is still around.
I have friends who have some 700 models in B-tech and they want to field them all (still saying that is madness)... so stripped-down is appreciated to preserve my sanity.

 Talizvar wrote:

 warboss wrote:
My only real complaint about the rules from a viewing of a couple AS games (didn't play though) is the damage by range bracket. It's simplification one step too far for me as I do like the ability to shoot individual weapons with different stats. The abstraction of shooting them all with a combined single stat at each range feels a bit off to me although I realize that is a preference and yet a reasonable design mechanic on their part.

An understandable issue but Alphastrike was meant for huge battles so the mechanic for me at least preserves the damage vs range capabilities.
Your preference is why classic B-tech is still around.
I have friends who have some 700 models in B-tech and they want to field them all (still saying that is madness)... so stripped-down is appreciated to preserve my sanity.

Yup, that's why I said it was a reasonable design mechanic. I understand why they did it in theory.. but I just don't like it in actual practice. What's the largest model count per side you guys have played with using Alpha Strike? I've seen a couple dozen (roughly 30 models) per side on a 6x8 table.

 warboss wrote:

 Talizvar wrote:

 warboss wrote:
My only real complaint about the rules from a viewing of a couple AS games (didn't play though) is the damage by range bracket. It's simplification one step too far for me as I do like the ability to shoot individual weapons with different stats. The abstraction of shooting them all with a combined single stat at each range feels a bit off to me although I realize that is a preference and yet a reasonable design mechanic on their part.

An understandable issue but Alphastrike was meant for huge battles so the mechanic for me at least preserves the damage vs range capabilities.
Your preference is why classic B-tech is still around.
I have friends who have some 700 models in B-tech and they want to field them all (still saying that is madness)... so stripped-down is appreciated to preserve my sanity.

Yup, that's why I said it was a reasonable design mechanic. I understand why they did it in theory.. but I just don't like it in actual practice. What's the largest model count per side you guys have played with using Alpha Strike? I've seen a couple dozen (roughly 30 models) per side on a 6x8 table.

well outside of AS I've been in some pretty big battles where we used a large floor for the map.

 warboss wrote:

Yup, that's why I said it was a reasonable design mechanic. I understand why they did it in theory.. but I just don't like it in actual practice. What's the largest model count per side you guys have played with using Alpha Strike? I've seen a couple dozen (roughly 30 models) per side on a 6x8 table.

I played a demo with 5 people per side each in charge of a lance so only about 20 per side.
Learning from that, I was able to play with 4 lances comfortably.
10 lances... 40 models I would need some counter or something to keep track of what last moved.
This is why the fielding 100's is just not looking doable to me.

It played fast and we had fun, it was about a similar sized table I think it was 4X8 which is what I have for a gaming table at home.

One comment about the game is the small fast mechs seem to come in for the shooting you in the back attacks.
Filling the same roll as a thief in D&D.

Anyway, I could easily see playing RRT with Alphastrike but I honestly think it would be less fun due to the lack of detail.
Robotech even cinematically would zoom in on more skirmish combat rather than the massive battle playing out.

I think many here would rather be the squadron leader than the general in this case.

 Talizvar wrote:

10 lances... 40 models I would need some counter or something to keep track of what last moved.
This is why the fielding 100's is just not looking doable to me.

It played fast and we had fun, it was about a similar sized table I think it was 4X8 which is what I have for a gaming table at home.

One comment about the game is the small fast mechs seem to come in for the shooting you in the back attacks.
Filling the same roll as a thief in D&D.

Anyway, I could easily see playing RRT with Alphastrike but I honestly think it would be less fun due to the lack of detail.
Robotech even cinematically would zoom in on more skirmish combat rather than the massive battle playing out.

I think many here would rather be the squadron leader than the general in this case.

Ah, thanks. You mentioned the friends with huge collections that want to play them all so I was curious if the rules are streamlined enough to support 100+ models per side games. They seemed to strain enough at the roughly 30 or so I saw personally so I was a bit incredulous as to using much more without resorting to "units" of mechs that act/fight as one instead of individually moving and shooting models. I agree that for someone of my preferences just sticking with a smaller skirmish scale model count is probably best (as opposed to a higher model count with less crunch). I'm a bit of a goldilocks in that sense as I don't want Battletech levels but Alpha Strike is a pendulum swing too far in the opposite direction.

I think I remember Mike talking abou this in a thread a while back but robotech sorta made the internet this weekend:




About 5 minutes in. Apparently he's using them for Horizon wars. I briefly looked at the KS when it started but discounted it due to the similarity I saw to epic 40k (which I wasn't a fan of). I might have to take another look at it again.

 warboss wrote:
About 5 minutes in. Apparently he's using them for Horizon wars. I briefly looked at the KS when it started but discounted it due to the similarity I saw to epic 40k (which I wasn't a fan of). I might have to take another look at it again.

OMG! (I am suffering from a "Squirrel!!! moment).
Buildings made of peg board!
Brilliant!
Sorry, I was distracted by his buildings... oh, I am quite happy with this.
Tough, inexpensive, readily available, very little work.
It would make for consistent means of modular terrain.
Heck, would light up nice with led tea lights.
Thanks!

A friend and i played trinary on trinary. 15 mechs per side. 30 total. 16 maps. We were all over them. We called the game a draw at 14 hours with both sides having only moderate losses.

 warboss wrote:
Yup, that's why I said it was a reasonable design mechanic. I understand why they did it in theory.. but I just don't like it in actual practice. What's the largest model count per side you guys have played with using Alpha Strike? I've seen a couple dozen (roughly 30 models) per side on a 6x8 table.

Yeah, if you want individual weapons you're kind of out of luck, there, I'm afraid. It would just run counter to their design objectives, after all.

Largest AS battle I've seen was... battalion-sized, plus infantry and vehicle support. Around 30 'mechs per side, and as many secondary units.

Biggest Battletech battle I've played was battalion level (36 mechs per side). We spent a whole weekend with that one.


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 Talizvar wrote:

Anyway, I could easily see playing RRT with Alphastrike but I honestly think it would be less fun due to the lack of detail.

It's... kind of the point, really. Otherwise I'd only need to assemble a couple more minis and I'd leave the bulk of my pledge in the closet, forever. I'd rather have a reason to assemble them.

Robotech even cinematically would zoom in on more skirmish combat rather than the massive battle playing out.

I think many here would rather be the squadron leader than the general in this case.

RRT works awfully for that, too, I'd say, seeing as on the whole AS seems to have quite a bit more detail than RRT.

Something like the Flightpath system would probably work wonders for a true to source Macross game, though.

I'd kill (or maim, really, whatever. Particularly if it's someone involved with this KS, PB or HG) for a Flightpath game that used the whole Macross universe. That would be stupendous. So many VFs to play with....


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jaymz wrote:
A friend and i played trinary on trinary. 15 mechs per side. 30 total. 16 maps. We were all over them. We called the game a draw at 14 hours with both sides having only moderate losses.

Battletech? I could certainly see that happening. If that happened with Alpha Strike, though... ouch. Also, 16 maps seem a tad too much for 30 'mechs. Too much cat & mouse, I'd say.

Alpha strike didnt exist yet (this was back in 93 or so)

Oh there was plenty of attacks and such. Mostly medium ckan mechs so moving at a good speed constantly as well. We were just that evenly matched.

Hope that paint table guy isn't in any hurry to get the Gnerls...

Autarch wrote:
Hope that paint table guy isn't in any hurry to get the Gnerls...

There appears to be other ways to get them...

 Talizvar wrote:

Autarch wrote:
Hope that paint table guy isn't in any hurry to get the Gnerls...

There appears to be other ways to get them...

The dark side of the 3d printing is a pathway to many models some at Palladium consider to be unnatural.

 warboss wrote:

The dark side of the 3d printing is a pathway to many models some at Palladium consider to be unnatural.

Some at Palladium are unnatural.

 warboss wrote:

 Talizvar wrote:

Autarch wrote:
Hope that paint table guy isn't in any hurry to get the Gnerls...

There appears to be other ways to get them...

The dark side of the 3d printing is a pathway to many models some at Palladium consider to be unnatural.

The Robotech models come from a darker time, a lost art, an era where spheres and cubes and such shapes didn't obey the laws of men, but their own whims and fancies. It is only now, with the discovered (perhaps re-discovered?) art of 3D printing that their Eldritch forms might be contained in a form that can exist within our world. Lo, the era known as 'the 80's' had many things beyond understanding, beyond reason (That hair! Those shoulderpads!), are something that only the insane might glance upon for more than a moment, for their minds are already broken, impervious to other damage.

...

Seriously if I never again hear someone say "omg those mechs weren't designed for minis" as though they used 5-D shapes and Unobtainium, it'll be too soon. Of a series of discussions had in the comments, that's always been one of the dumbest. You'd think they had to be forged in the fires of Mount Doom by the finest Dwarven craftsmen in the fething kingdom, the way some people went on about it.

 Forar wrote:
Seriously if I never again hear someone say "omg those mechs weren't designed for minis" as though they used 5-D shapes and Unobtainium, it'll be too soon.

Particularly when talking about a japanese mecha series. feth, those series are fething made to sell toys. Have been since forever.

 Albertorius wrote:

 Forar wrote:
Seriously if I never again hear someone say "omg those mechs weren't designed for minis" as though they used 5-D shapes and Unobtainium, it'll be too soon.

Particularly when talking about a japanese mecha series. feth, those series are fething made to sell toys. Have been since forever.

Well then, if they REALLY were for selling toys they should have been a lot simpler like this:

I honestly think this transforming toy has less parts than the Veritech models.
It turns into an F-15 fighter.
A 1984 Tv series which would have looked like garbage with Robotech out 1 year later.

As opposed to the team of magical girls in the actual, current Macross series?

 Forar wrote:

 warboss wrote:

 Talizvar wrote:

Autarch wrote:
Hope that paint table guy isn't in any hurry to get the Gnerls...

There appears to be other ways to get them...

The dark side of the 3d printing is a pathway to many models some at Palladium consider to be unnatural.

The Robotech models come from a darker time, a lost art, an era where spheres and cubes and such shapes didn't obey the laws of men, but their own whims and fancies. It is only now, with the discovered (perhaps re-discovered?) art of 3D printing that their Eldritch forms might be contained in a form that can exist within our world. Lo, the era known as 'the 80's' had many things beyond understanding, beyond reason (That hair! Those shoulderpads!), are something that only the insane might glance upon for more than a moment, for their minds are already broken, impervious to other damage.

...

Seriously if I never again hear someone say "omg those mechs weren't designed for minis" as though they used 5-D shapes and Unobtainium, it'll be too soon. Of a series of discussions had in the comments, that's always been one of the dumbest. You'd think they had to be forged in the fires of Mount Doom by the finest Dwarven craftsmen in the fething kingdom, the way some people went on about it.

No kidding Shoji Kawamori must have been a witch using non-euclidian geometries if you believe Kevin.

I think the painter guy was talking about the official Gnerls. Obviously hasn't been following this thread or the kickstarter comments. Poor unsuspecting guy.

 Talizvar wrote:

Autarch wrote:
Hope that paint table guy isn't in any hurry to get the Gnerls...

There appears to be other ways to get them...

How? I would be happy if I can get my hands on such miniatures!

For the page 164 correction that probably nobody caught or cares about but me, I confused Horizon Wars with Polyversal in regards to seeing a KS campaign in my previous comment and I just wanted to clarify that just in case. The latter is now back on kickstarter after cancelling the first campaign.


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 Nesbet wrote:

 Talizvar wrote:

Autarch wrote:
Hope that paint table guy isn't in any hurry to get the Gnerls...

There appears to be other ways to get them...

How? I would be happy if I can get my hands on such miniatures!

Probably some sort of hush but not too hush underground 3d printing group order on Mike's facebook page. It appears amateurs in their spare time are doing what palladium has proven incapable/unwilling to do professionally despite $1,400,000+ USD in funding. PM MikeMorpheus or Asterios for likely details since they're they ones posting 3d prints of previously unavailable models in that scale.

thanks, i'll write them then

 warboss wrote:
For the page 164 correction that probably nobody caught or cares about but me, I confused Horizon Wars with Polyversal in regards to seeing a KS campaign in my previous comment and I just wanted to clarify that just in case. The latter is now back on kickstarter after cancelling the first campaign.

Yes, Horizon Wars is out from Osprey right now.

 warboss wrote:
For the page 164 correction that probably nobody caught or cares about but me, I confused Horizon Wars with Polyversal in regards to seeing a KS campaign in my previous comment and I just wanted to clarify that just in case. The latter is now back on kickstarter after cancelling the first campaign.

Oh, I thought I was misremembering ^_^. So it's back on KS now then? Interesting.

Probably some sort of hush but not too hush underground 3d printing group order on Mike's facebook page. It appears amateurs in their spare time are doing what palladium has proven incapable/unwilling to do professionally despite $1,400,000+ USD in funding. PM MikeMorpheus or Asterios for likely details since they're they ones posting 3d prints of previously unavailable models in that scale.

I need to look onto that.


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 Easy E wrote:
Yes, Horizon Wars is out from Osprey right now.

Any idea how is it?

I've looked into the rules some and Horizon Wars is an ultra simplified game. It will be hard to keep all units unique with large numbers of units. It's too simplified for my taste but then again I thought RRT was simple.....the right balance between simplicity and detail.....I took that and am improving on it with Nodal Wars.

Well, I don't think this is the right place to introduce myself, but alas...
I registered here on DAKKADAKKA after been lurking for months in this particular thread. Seriously, like 120 pages ago xD
When I saw the last 3D prints and sculpts/recasts of alternative wave 2 minis I knew I had to sign up and start asking
I'm a chilean dentist, who used to play Warhammer Fantasy since I was 18 and then, with the birth of the abomination of Age of Sigmar I started playing RTT (yeah I know, I changed a dead corpse for another in comma)
Still waiting for the joke of Kevin Simbieda to produce and give us the promised wave 2 miniatures :(

Well, everyone says pics speak more than 1000 words, so I'll post quite a lot of pics LOL
(LOTS)




Well, I think that´s enough for now. I have moar pics and tutorials and other things on my blog.
Seeya!

EDIT: Sorry, the pics look way too big :(
Here's the album on imgur to see them better...
http://imgur.com/a/NhJSM

Nesbet wrote:Well, I don't think this is the right place to introduce myself, but alas...
I registered here on DAKKADAKKA after been lurking for months in this particular thread. Seriously, like 120 pages ago xD
When I saw the last 3D prints and sculpts/recasts of alternative wave 2 minis I knew I had to sign up and start asking
I'm a chilean dentist, who used to play Warhammer Fantasy since I was 18 and then, with the birth of the abomination of Age of Sigmar I started playing RTT (yeah I know, I changed a dead corpse for another in comma)
Still waiting for the joke of Kevin Simbieda to produce and give us the promised wave 2 miniatures :(

Well, everyone says pics speak more than 1000 words, so I'll post quite a lot of pics LOL
(LOTS)

Welcome to dakka. That's a nice table! Have you enjoyed the actual game rules?

Albertorius wrote:
Oh, I thought I was misremembering ^_^. So it's back on KS now then? Interesting.

Yup. There's a thread here on the new KS and it seems they've addressed some of the issues from the previous campaign (high starting goal and ridiculous PDF prices to name two).

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/690414.page

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 Easy E wrote:
Yes, Horizon Wars is out from Osprey right now.

Any idea how is it?

It looks intersting. It's hard to pigeon hole the rules or mathhammer out the mechanics similar to how it is with Infinity. From my youtube viewings last night, it looks like a d12 system where your firepower is how many d12's you roll. Your target number is the actual range in inches (very granular target number) plus the targets armor plus any mods (like cover). You can apparently add multiple dice together till you get the target number (not sure if only two or any number.. I only saw two in the video added together). The defender rolls his defense dice and can negate one of your firepower dice if he rolls the exact same result on the d12. It's hard to get an accurate theory gauge on the gameplay but the d12 dice and discrete range target number make it feel like a close range type of game as opposed to plinking away from longer distances >24".

Thanks warboss. Yeah, I'm enjoying the game, regardless of the flaws in the rulebook... We have a small community of wargamers, from such, 6 play RTT.
We have like a club, since here in the city is no geek store with tables to play. The biggest thing are one or 2 cards shops... And none of them is as big as the single store in my home city ¬¬U
Anyways, we got a press conference room from the local soccer team, so we met to play there and store the tables.
Those pics are from last saturday and we used one of my mats. I have several PVS printed mats to play

I think I'll make a review of the mat designs (made by a rusian fella) because they rock!

@Nesbet: Welcome aboard! Especially to the "most negative forum in all of dakka!"
Looking at that sea of well organized paints (you re-potted those and labelled them... awesome), dynamically posed models (again with the very nice clear flying pegs which I should have done) and well laid out boards: I have a sudden need to go to Chile.
I mean this in the most manly of ways... I think I love you.
BTW why does your posting flag jump between USA and Chile?

I like those armored cars (APC?) on the table, I cannot place where they are from.
They would have huge utility since they could literally be anything.
That industrial building with all the ducts: where did you get that? That is the best pre-fab building I have seen.

I am happy to see some "new blood" here and some very good efforts in awesome looking games.

@Tal: might be the same issue I had; a work VPN was misidentifying me as being in the US. It's addressed in one of the Dakka FAQs, and a moderator can permanently affix one given flag if a user so chooses (which is why mine no longer does the same thing).

And yeah, welcome aboard Nesbet! Those figures are fantastic, great job on the paint jobs and the poses, especially the pods! You've done some great work there.