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And Baneblade. GW has an amazing 8-in-1 kit combining the original 2-in-1 Baneblade / Hellhammer with the extra sprues for the 6-in-1 Shadowsword / Stormlord / ... kit.

There is no way IG don't get the Baneblade in their next Codex.

As much as I liked Doctrines, I don't think a modified port over of the doctrines from the older codex is likely. GW only wants rules that have accompanying models and many of the techy upgrades require something other than GWs current plastic kits.

 aka_mythos wrote:
As much as I liked Doctrines, I don't think a modified port over of the doctrines from the older codex is likely. GW only wants rules that have accompanying models and many of the techy upgrades require something other than GWs current plastic kits.

If anything I think they will make them formation based.

 Anpu42 wrote:

>Rank and File (If all Models of a unit are in base contact with each other they may fire Over-watch at full BS)
>Formation March ( If all Models of a unit are in base contact with each other they may Fire one extra shot with Non-Heavy Weapons)

this plus first rank fire order. Non shall live.

 Sledgehammer wrote:

 aka_mythos wrote:
As much as I liked Doctrines, I don't think a modified port over of the doctrines from the older codex is likely. GW only wants rules that have accompanying models and many of the techy upgrades require something other than GWs current plastic kits.

If anything I think they will make them formation based.

That makes a lot of sense.

What I want but probably won't get:

- Platoon doctrines.

- Infinite ranged vox casters (it is a radio and will add some much needed flexibility to infantry placement.)

- Lasguns infiite range (it is a laser..)

- Veteran Leman Russes.

- Heavy plasma gun team.

- Hydra with intercept.

- Trench fortifitation.

- Rough riders replaced with dino riders or, failing that, motorcross bikes.

- Bayonet upgrade?

- Mines.

- Company standard isn't useless.

- Themed detachmwnts, eg: artillery only detachment, russ only detachment, infantry only deatcahment, etc, ect...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also a Vortex missile upgradefor the Deathstrike with the pie plate staying on the board after detonation and it continues to move around for the remainder of the game based on scatter dice.

I would like to see sentinels (armored and scout), bullgryns, ogryns, rough riders, chimeras, hell hounds all become more cost efficient. Either make them stronger or, keeping with the motif of the army, make them cheaper in points. they are not worth what we pay for them. really, just make the units in the codex way more cost efficient. These are meant to be the most expendable warriors in the 40k universe which means cheap cheap cheap and very few to no special rules. give me a reason to buy the models lol.

I expect them to cut storm troopers and taurox out of the codex as they are their own codex now just as inquisition became their own army. could be wrong here, but I could see it happening.

It will never happen, but bring back Marbo!

Would like to see a veteran driver upgrade to the chimera. Only for Vet Squads. Makes the BS for the chimera 4.

Smotejob wrote:

I expect them to cut storm troopers and taurox out of the codex as they are their own codex now just as inquisition became their own army. could be wrong here, but I could see it happening.

They had the opportunity to do that the last time and didn't do it. That's not to say they wouldn't do it the next update, though. Brave new GW world and all...

martin74 wrote:Would like to see a veteran driver upgrade to the chimera. Only for Vet Squads. Makes the BS for the chimera 4.

That would actually be an interesting upgrade for any vehicle. Veteran sentinels would be an autotake, IMO.

Would like to see a veteran driver upgrade to the chimera. Only for Vet Squads. Makes the BS for the chimera 4.

I have a homebrewed character that lets me upgrade the crews of my tanks to veterans with +1 BS for 10 points. It is something that needs doing IMO and GW need to fix it.

Personally, I'd like to see some sort of buff to the lasgun. e.g. an order that lets you halve your shots, but get extra strength based on the number of models firing.

In an edition where the entire enemy army can be AV10 (or better), or T7+ MCs, or have some other ridiculous survivability method, S3 lasguns just feel pointless.

if I need to have 8-9 guardsmen for each special/heavy weapon I include, then I'd rather those guardsmen were armed with something more threatening than a letter-opener.

I think they should be able to take up to 4 fortifications, first off.

Basic guardsmen and russes (not variants) get endless swarm rules.

More navy aircraft in the book. Let each scion sergeant give orders to his squad like a prime.

Heavy weapon teams get stealth and a price break.

 Silverthorne wrote:


Heavy weapon teams get stealth and a price break.

Taking fortified positions. (If you dont move you get a cover bonus) would be pretty cool

 vipoid wrote:
Personally, I'd like to see some sort of buff to the lasgun. e.g. an order that lets you halve your shots, but get extra strength based on the number of models firing.

In an edition where the entire enemy army can be AV10 (or better), or T7+ MCs, or have some other ridiculous survivability method, S3 lasguns just feel pointless.

if I need to have 8-9 guardsmen for each special/heavy weapon I include, then I'd rather those guardsmen were armed with something more threatening than a letter-opener.

This. The Lasgun was an adequate weapon back in 5th when armies where composed of sane units. These days however it is just a largely useless weapon.

 master of ordinance wrote:
This. The Lasgun was an adequate weapon back in 5th when armies where composed of sane units. These days however it is just a largely useless weapon.

I don't get it, the lasgun is one of the best infantry weapons in the game. The sheer amount of dice you can roll is awesome. I also love how it makes anything taking a toughness 6 upgrade (such as nurgle bikes) a waste of points.

Yea. Plus we have oodles of plasma and melta and lascannons.

The lasgun is fine.

At a point where basic 13pt troops in some armies can require an average of 29 BS3 lasgun shots to inflict a single wound against, and where troops on jetbikes can pack quad-shot S6 weaponry, I think the issue is that the game has simply run away on itself so much that the basic Lasgun is ultimately both pointless and entirely too granular.

In my last dozen games I can probably count on one hand the number of successfully inflicted wounds my Lasguns have caused.

I don't think the problem was inherently really with the Lasgun so much, as it is the fact that the game has simply run amok and inflation has reached the point where such weapons are too granular to really matter. One might almost want to ditch them as an individual weapon entirely and treat the entire squad's shooting as a single combined weapon based on size.

Let's be fair though, the problem there is not worst for IG. Bolter marines suffer even worse, because they pay over twice as much for +1s - which is unlikely to make much difference with Wraithknights carving through your lines. There is very little that 10 BS4 S4 shots can achieve that 30 BS3 S3 shots can't.

And in return, with Ion Accelerators and Scatter Lasers, the T4 is not very useful either, and thanks to how easy it is to get a cover save the 3+ armour is not cost-effective either. In fact, the Scatter Laser is rather inefficient against Guardsmen because that extra point of strength is wasted. Orks suffer far more.

I think the best way is to recycle troop. and free tanks

The issue with lasguns is that you're lucky if you even inflict one wound per guard squad on a marine. That's 50pts to try to hurt one marine (and that's INCLUDING prescience and FRFSRF) You gotta add special weapons and heavy weapons to increase your chances but even then they'll only kill one marine each so its 60/70pts to kill 2-3 marines, provided they pass the buff rolls. THEN you gotta try to make up for the fact that these guard will go down instantly.

You're reliant on tanks then and the sad truth is that our tanks... aren't really that good. They have great firepower but they're incredibly unreliable and there are countless hard counters to them. Not to mention how expensive they are. It's not that rare for non-guard armies to out-tank the guard amd a wall if AV12/14 just isn't what it used to be.

 Ashiraya wrote:
Let's be fair though, the problem there is not worst for IG. Bolter marines suffer even worse, because they pay over twice as much for +1s - which is unlikely to make much difference with Wraithknights carving through your lines. There is very little that 10 BS4 S4 shots can achieve that 30 BS3 S3 shots can't.
.

Well, assuming average Guard:

30 shots @50% hitrate so 15 shots hit. Average target is T4 so 33.3'% wounding = 5 wounds. Average save of a 3+ so of these only one wound will be actually taken. So for your 30 shots you inflict 1 wound on an MEQ. Even on something lighter with a 4+ save you are still only inflicting 2-3 wounds on average. The Lasgun is just terrible in this era of modern weapon inflation.

My person take on what I would like to see:

Bring back lord commander solar macharius – but not at 173 points, make him worth it

Bring back captain alrahem, chenkov and sly!

Make the imperial armour 2nd edition vanquisher the normal Vanquisher with option of beast hunter shells

Bring back 12” leadership bubble for CCS + PCS + commissar

Make orders come from sergeants and veteran sergeants

Vox allows to use leadership of PCS/CCS if outside 12 in bubble

LIMIT vets to 0-1 per army same as 3rd edition - in their original fluff, vets were rare. They were the last guys to survive 10 years of war out of a starting army of 600,000 or something. So these dude should be psycho elites, all come with shotguns standard, every man in squad can upgrade to melta-guns, they infiltrate, have stealth, move through cover, camo - they can take sly marbo to replace their vet Sargent

Reduce ogryn price to 20-30 points per ogryn, +10 points for bonehead

Lumbering behemoth – we want it back

Leman russ demolisher should be 140 points or 130 points not 170....

All leman russ get 4 or 5 hull points – necron transports get 4 hull points

Hydra gets interceptor and can shoot ground troops

Bring back cut artillery vehicles

Medics for infantry platoons to give blobs FNP

Give foot-slogging guard get camo-cloak options and light infantry/move through cover options – if they elect to take a transport then they loose these two upgrades/options

get rid of lasguns, make them autoguns or something ... lasers that cant kill...really?

 Trickstick wrote:

I don't get it, the lasgun is one of the best infantry weapons in the game.

By what possible measure?

 Trickstick wrote:
The sheer amount of dice you can roll is awesome.

No, it really isn't. Mostly it's just a waste of time - when you roll 50+ dice and do maybe 1 wound as a result. Yeah, that was really worth the effort.

Most of the time, it's the equivalent of snapshotting bolters - you're rolling a lot of dice but having a negligible impact on the game.

Also, I think you're vastly underestimating the ease with which other armies can sweep guardsmen off the table. You'll often have a squad firing 40 lasgun shots in your turn, and then just 10 the turn after. Meanwhile, I strongly doubt that your lasguns inflicted comparable casualties on the enemy.

 Trickstick wrote:
I also love how it makes anything taking a toughness 6 upgrade (such as nurgle bikes) a waste of points.

Indeed. I bet those Nurgle bikers are really trembling when it takes a mere 36 lasgun shots to down a single one of them.

sumi808 wrote:My person take on what I would like to see:

Bring back lord commander solar macharius – but not at 173 points, make him worth it

Bring back captain alrahem, chenkov and sly!

Make the imperial armour 2nd edition vanquisher the normal Vanquisher with option of beast hunter shells

Bring back 12” leadership bubble for CCS + PCS + commissar

Make orders come from sergeants and veteran sergeants

Vox allows to use leadership of PCS/CCS if outside 12 in bubble

LIMIT vets to 0-1 per army same as 3rd edition - in their original fluff, vets were rare. They were the last guys to survive 10 years of war out of a starting army of 600,000 or something. So these dude should be psycho elites, all come with shotguns standard, every man in squad can upgrade to melta-guns, they infiltrate, have stealth, move through cover, camo - they can take sly marbo to replace their vet Sargent

Reduce ogryn price to 20-30 points per ogryn, +10 points for bonehead

Lumbering behemoth – we want it back

Leman russ demolisher should be 140 points or 130 points not 170....

All leman russ get 4 or 5 hull points – necron transports get 4 hull points

Hydra gets interceptor and can shoot ground troops

Bring back cut artillery vehicles

Medics for infantry platoons to give blobs FNP

Give foot-slogging guard get camo-cloak options and light infantry/move through cover options – if they elect to take a transport then they loose these two upgrades/options

get rid of lasguns, make them autoguns or something ... lasers that cant kill...really?

I would say yes to most of this but as to limiting veterans HELL NO! I run Veteran IG armies at the moment as they are the most reliable troops choice and to be honest the only one even remotely worth investing the masses of points in. And do NOT make the Shotgun the standard weapon. Unless you are facing Tau or the sole last survivor of a SM squad you do NOT want to be entering assault as everyone is better than you.

Apart from that I agree with you. The Demolisher needs to be cheaper, 130 to 140 points. Sure its a big ass cannon, but its mounted on an expensive tank with a rear armour of 11 and a requirement to get realllllllyyyyy close to the enemy in order to be used and unlike the SM vindicator it can not just ignore terrain.
Blobs of FNP would be a beautiful sight, each Medic should have an 8" bubble or something.
Hull Points need to just vanish and be replaced with separate Glance and Penetration tables. But given that GW seem to be fixed on this 'LOMG! TANKS ARE LIKE MC'S BUT WEAKER!!1!1' kind of attitude the LR does need its HP buffed to 4 or 5.
Rough Riders. Make them 6 points per model and make that lance a multi use weapon that is Strength and Initiative +2 and AP2 on the charge. They might actually be worth taking then.
LB. Yes, just yes.
Give the Vanquisher Beast Hunter shells and a +4 on the penetration damage role. And the ability to fire HE shells as it can in fluff. It might actually be useful then.
Hydra's should have had Interceptor and Ground Attack first. Seriously, they where the first ever dedicated AA weapons in the game.
Ogryns need to be 20-25 points. Bullgryns around 30 at the most.

vipoid wrote:

 Trickstick wrote:

I don't get it, the lasgun is one of the best infantry weapons in the game.

By what possible measure?

 Trickstick wrote:
The sheer amount of dice you can roll is awesome.

No, it really isn't. Mostly it's just a waste of time - when you roll 50+ dice and do maybe 1 wound as a result. Yeah, that was really worth the effort.

Most of the time, it's the equivalent of snapshotting bolters - you're rolling a lot of dice but having a negligible impact on the game.

Also, I think you're vastly underestimating the ease with which other armies can sweep guardsmen off the table. You'll often have a squad firing 40 lasgun shots in your turn, and then just 10 the turn after. Meanwhile, I strongly doubt that your lasguns inflicted comparable casualties on the enemy.

 Trickstick wrote:
I also love how it makes anything taking a toughness 6 upgrade (such as nurgle bikes) a waste of points.

Indeed. I bet those Nurgle bikers are really trembling when it takes a mere 36 lasgun shots to down a single one of them.

Just ignore him. He appears to be one of these SM players whom is butthurt because 50+ Lasgun shots killed one of his precious Tactical Marines, and he was only able to wipe out 98% of the IG unit in his next turn as the result.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, we need IA Volume two to be updated. Almost every unit in there is overpriced for what it does.

Yeah, don't limit vets. Vets are actually in a decent spot right now, they just need a better ride and better support.

Lots of good ideas in this thread over all, very few I'd entirely disagree with.

On the subject of doctrines/regimental traits, I'd prefer if GW/the power that be decided against using a specific regiment name tied to a specific trait, and were more generic with the traits. Like 'Light Infantry' instead of 'Catachan Jungle Fighters', or 'Masters of the Siege' instead of 'Death Korps of Krieg'.

Allows for more flexibility and logic with existing regiments, and more fluff oriented for DIY regiments. I just don't like being pigeon-holed or having to explain to someone that my clearly Mordian Iron Guard force is using a trait that is not the actual Mordian Iron Guard trait.

Hopefully we see more formations to give Guard the extra boost we need, but I really want Ordnance Russes to be fixed, we need Lumbering behemoth back and the MBT and Demolisher both need to be a lot cheaper.

Lasguns do need improvement as well, they barely kill anything, I think my conscripts have killed more models in close combat than shooting, due to the re-rolls from the Priest.


Would like the Hellhound and it's variants to be a lot cheaper, maybe around 70-75 pts?

Oh, there's no way there won't a dozen formations and some sort of super formation.

Yeah, Hellhounds and their ilk shouldn't be more than 90pts. Then again, at ~70pts, it steps on the toes of the humble chimera, but then again again, the Chimera is overpriced, which means the Taurox is also overpriced if the chimera drops in points.

Yeah the Chimera is overpriced and should also drop in points, it's the side armour 10 that really kills it, being able to be boltered to death on such a large portion of the vehicle really hampers it, I'd rather have Rhino armour stats if it meant a drop in points.