How could they fix the Astra militarum with a new codex?

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**vipoid**

Kanluwen wrote:

Warlord traits are a different beast entirely. The Warlord rules are written so that armies which don't have HQs or so that models in Formations can have Warlords.

You pick your Warlord. It's not randomly generated or any such nonsense. You want your Company Commander to be the Warlord? Then pick him.

What on earth are you babbling about?

This has no relevance to anything I wrote.

**Kanluwen**

vipoid wrote:
Kanluwen wrote:

Warlord traits are a different beast entirely. The Warlord rules are written so that armies which don't have HQs or so that models in Formations can have Warlords.

You pick your Warlord. It's not randomly generated or any such nonsense. You want your Company Commander to be the Warlord? Then pick him.

What on earth are you babbling about?

This has no relevance to anything I wrote.

You wrote that a "Platoon Sergeant can outrank a Company Commander".

So, explain how that's working please unless you're referring to Warlord traits.

Because if you're referring to a Lord Commissar? The only thing that rule affects is Lord Commissars being your Warlord if you have no Senior Officers.
Platoon Commanders(I'm assuming you mean a Platoon Commander, not a Sergeant in one of the Infantry Squads that are part of your Infantry Platoon) are Junior Officers, not Senior Officers.

**vipoid**

Kanluwen wrote:

You wrote that a "Platoon Sergeant can outrank a Company Commander".

So, explain how that's working please unless you're referring to Warlord traits.

Because if you're referring to a Lord Commissar? The only thing that rule affects is Lord Commissars being your Warlord if you have no Senior Officers.
Platoon Commanders(I'm assuming you mean a Platoon Commander, not a Sergeant in one of the Infantry Squads that are part of your Infantry Platoon) are Junior Officers, not Senior Officers.

I'm saying that the restriction on Lord Commissars not being your warlord if your army includes a Company Commander doesn't make sense, when the presence of a company commander doesn't stop a platoon sergeant from being your warlord.

And I do mean platoon sergeant (though platoon commanders can apparently also outrank company commanders).

I get that it's optional, but that's exactly the point. I have the option of having a platoon sergeant outrank my company commander. I have the option of having a regular commissar outrank my company commander. But, I don't have the option for my Lord Commissar to outrank my company commander.

**Kanluwen**

You don't have the option for them to "outrank" anyone, they just get a Warlord trait.

In any regards, that whole thing is simply how the "pre-picture pages" books worked. There were very few characters that had "X must be your Warlord".

**vipoid**

Kanluwen wrote:
You don't have the option for them to "outrank" anyone, they just get a Warlord trait.

And they're also your warlord. You know, the leader of your army.

Hence why the enemy get points for killing them, but not for killing any of your other 20 or so platoon sergeants.

**easypeasylemonsquezy**

I think the Platoon Standard would be cool/make more sense if it reduced the ld penalty during a lost combat (assault phase) by 1 or 2 (but not above normal ld) within 12 inches.

Its a flag its suppose to stand tall and give the guard courage! not add a melee wound...

**vipoid**

easypeasylemonsquezy wrote:
I think the Platoon Standard would be cool/make more sense if it reduced the ld penalty during a lost combat (assault phase) by 1 or 2 (but not above normal ld) within 12 inches.

Its a flag its suppose to stand tall and give the guard courage! not add a melee wound...

I know what you mean, but the trouble is that this still isn't a useful effect. If you've got a combined infantry squad, then you've almost certainly got a priest or commissar in it (which also stops it from falling back as a result of shooting casualties). And, if you've only got smaller squads, is this really going to help them? Stuff like the PCS, SWS, heavy weapon teams and infantry squads will fold to just about any unit in the game.

Moreover, with small units, do you even want to stay in combat? Unless I'm using a large infantry squad as a tarpit (which will have the aforementioned priest/commissar), then passing a Ld test to stay in combat usually provokes frustration on my part - as the enemy has just become immune to guns in my subsequent turn.

**Kanluwen**

Honestly, something to be considered is the way battle standard bearers work in Age of Sigmar.

Different races have different unique abilities, but all share one thing: planting the battle standard grants an 18" bubble of that ability.

Come up with something cool and unique and go from there. I would love to see a standard which grants Preferred Enemy or allows you to make the units under its auspices Stubborn or grants them the Zealot special rule.

**vipoid**

Kanluwen wrote:
Honestly, something to be considered is the way battle standard bearers work in Age of Sigmar.

Different races have different unique abilities, but all share one thing: planting the battle standard grants an 18" bubble of that ability.

Come up with something cool and unique and go from there. I would love to see a standard which grants Preferred Enemy or allows you to make the units under its auspices Stubborn or grants them the Zealot special rule.

What about Counter Attack?

**master of ordinance**

vipoid wrote:
Kanluwen wrote:
Honestly, something to be considered is the way battle standard bearers work in Age of Sigmar.

Different races have different unique abilities, but all share one thing: planting the battle standard grants an 18" bubble of that ability.

Come up with something cool and unique and go from there. I would love to see a standard which grants Preferred Enemy or allows you to make the units under its auspices Stubborn or grants them the Zealot special rule.

What about Counter Attack?

What about the ability to Overwatch at BS2?

I can think of few other ways to make it useful.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Some other things that I want to see:

Veteran Heavy Weapon Sections - These would actually be worth taking over the current overpriced and unreliable ones.

Veteran Special Weapon Sections - PLEASE GW, please. And whilst we are here, transport options for both of them.

Chimeras gain another two fire points and take a massive points drop.

An actual reason to take Ogryns/Bullgryns

Storm Troopers become worth the vast points expenditure per man. And whilst we are at it buff the Hellgun.

The Lasgun returned to being a viable weapon system. Right now it is outmoded by EVERYTHING.

Something that I have observed in this age of powercreep is the odd inbalance within the IG codex. The average Guardsman is actually worth 5 points. He is cheap, comes with average stats and a slightly below average weapon and average armour. The problem is that he is balance for times before things like 4+ and 3+ saves became common and before 4 became the new average for a stat line and 4+ the basic armour save. Your Guardsman is well balanced for what he gets but the real problem is not with the Guradsman himself but with the other codexes.
The new books have steadily progressed and ramped up the power level. Whereas 3 3 3 3 1 3 1 7/8 5+ used to be the base average for everything the newer codexes have steadily ramped up the baseline for the power level. Now 4 4 3/4 3/4 1 4 1 8/9 4+ is the average stat line for most basic infantry and in most cases the base price of these models has not increased at all to account for the new and improved stats. What is more these new and improved basic infantry units tend to have better equipment than your average Guardsmen such as Strength 4 guns and an AP of at least 5, come with AT grenades as standard and have one or more flashy special rules to go with them.

Given all this your average 3 3 3 3 1 3 1 7/8 5+ guardsman with his R24" S3 AP- Rapidfire lasgun is just completely outmoded. Yes his price of 5 PPM is fair.... Until you factor in the fact that every damn army has had a massive buff to its basic infantrymans capabilities with no increase to its points costs.
And this is all before yu factor in the new shiny things and specialist units/big stupid things that are now spammed by most armies.

Looking at all of this your average Guardsman just does not make the cut. Sure he is balanced, but not for this edition. Guardsmen are balanced for the older editions when basic infantry where just that, simple and basic grunts, and specialist units where extremely rare for the most part. He is balanced for a time before this blatant power inflation.
He needs a buff and a big one at that.

**Hawky**

I would like to see a return of named characters. Those who were removed and several more. Mostly replacements for Veteran/basic Sergeants who give the squad some special abilities to compensate the thing whi the guy above me mentioned.

For example: Sniper dude who gives the squad Move through cover, shrouded and give Shread USR to sniper rifles but can't take carapace.
(representing SpecOps sneaky bas*ards)

Or

Grenadier sergeant replacement who gives the squad Relentless USR and makes opponent reroll succesfull "to wound" rolls, but the squad must take Carapace armor...
(representing the biggest (and toughest) boys with biggest toys)

And so on...
Just little guys who makes our average little guys bit more less average.

**vipoid**

Oh, a very minor point, but would making our relic sword AP2 be too much to ask?

I mean, when 4 wound T5 2+/3+ guys can be wielding S6-7 AP2 weapons that strike at initiative, I find it hard to believe that a few S4 AP2 attacks from a T3 5++ Company Commander or Lord Commissar will somehow break the game.

But then, I'd also suggest halving the costs of all our artefacts.

**master of ordinance**

vipoid wrote:
Oh, a very minor point, but would making our relic sword AP2 be too much to ask?

I mean, when 4 wound T5 2+/3+ guys can be wielding S6-7 AP2 weapons that strike at initiative, I find it hard to believe that a few S4 AP2 attacks from a T3 5++ Company Commander or Lord Commissar will somehow break the game.

But then, I'd also suggest halving the costs of all our artefacts.

You mean people actually USE Imperial Guard artifacts?!

**vipoid**

master of ordinance wrote:

You mean people actually USE Imperial Guard artifacts?!

Of course!

Why? Haven't you ever felt like handicapping your lists by taking some overpriced crap?

**master of ordinance**

vipoid wrote:
master of ordinance wrote:

You mean people actually USE Imperial Guard artifacts?!

Of course!

Why? Haven't you ever felt like handicapping your lists by taking some overpriced crap?

Now that you mention it I do feel a hankering to bring some Rough Riders...

**JohnHwangDD**

vipoid wrote:
master of ordinance wrote:

You mean people actually USE Imperial Guard artifacts?!

Of course!

Why? Haven't you ever felt like handicapping your lists by taking some overpriced crap?

Dude, we all play Imperial Guard in here...

**master of ordinance**

JohnHwangDD wrote:
vipoid wrote:
master of ordinance wrote:

You mean people actually USE Imperial Guard artifacts?!

Of course!

Why? Haven't you ever felt like handicapping your lists by taking some overpriced crap?

Dude, we all play Imperial Guard in here...

There was a Space Marine player a few pages back....

**Blacksails**

What would I even do with an AP2 sword?

Woosh it around overhead and pretend to hurt Smash fether McSmashface?

Now give him a badass hand cannon or two and now we're talking about something useful and badass.

Picture like a plasma pistol, but with two barrels. No! Three! Or something.

*Edit* Unrelated, drunk Friday posting commences now. Apologies in advance.

**Hoyt**

Honestly, the current relics are a bit pointless, we don't have lultastic Chapter Masters to give them to, I'd rather have all of them give bonuses to surrounding units within 12" than some silly AP 2 sword.

**Hawky**

Rather a fancy gun, not a melee weapon. Your guy will be decapitated in moct cases when fighting models with 2+ armor.

Master-crafted Boltgun, Relic plasma rifle (no Gets Hot), Heavy Lasgun (S4 AP5 Salvo 2/4) and such...

**JohnHwangDD**

I'd rather a fancy radio that calls in S(D) AP1 Apocaplyptic Barrages.

**master of ordinance**

JohnHwangDD wrote:
I'd rather a fancy radio that calls in S(D) AP1 Apocaplyptic Barrages.

Maybe an upgrade to the MoO?

**Selym**

master of ordinance wrote:
JohnHwangDD wrote:
I'd rather a fancy radio that calls in S(D) AP1 Apocaplyptic Barrages.

Maybe an upgrade to the MoO?

Something to represent off-board basilisk batteries would be fun

**JohnHwangDD**

Marco Cannon¡, not mere Bassies!

Yes, That's how GW wrote macro cannon, due to lack of proper proofing.

**Selym**

**vipoid**

Blacksails wrote:
What would I even do with an AP2 sword?

Woosh it around overhead and pretend to hurt Smash fether McSmashface?

*Shrugs*

I think it's a nice option to have, even if it's more for flavour than anything else. Commissars are almost always pictured with fancy swords, after all.

But then, nor should it cost more than 15pts.

Blacksails wrote:

Now give him a badass hand cannon or two and now we're talking about something useful and badass.

Picture like a plasma pistol, but with two barrels. No! Three! Or something.

Come on, man, this is GW we're talking about - any double-barrelled plasma pistol would have to cost 50pts and get hot on any roll that isn't a 6. Because plasma pistols are already the strongest weapons in the game.

But, yeah, an upgrade to the Emperor's Benediction certainly wouldn't go amiss. Especially when I look at the stuff Skitarii get - like 5-shot pistols!

Hoyt wrote:
Honestly, the current relics are a bit pointless, we don't have lultastic Chapter Masters to give them to, I'd rather have all of them give bonuses to surrounding units within 12" than some silly AP 2 sword.

Well, we already have 3 of those - the problem is that the vox one is crap, the Ld one can make your army flee and they're all overpriced. I'd also suggest removing the 'Company Commanders only' clause from the Aquila.

More importantly though, I don't think our HQs should be reliant on artefacts to produce auras. I mean, they're inevitably support units - so it seems that if they need auras then they should start with those auras, if you see what I mean.

**Ignatius**

master of ordinance wrote:
vipoid wrote:
master of ordinance wrote:

You mean people actually USE Imperial Guard artifacts?!

Of course!

Why? Haven't you ever felt like handicapping your lists by taking some overpriced crap?

Now that you mention it I do feel a hankering to bring some Rough Riders...

Hey man, leave Rough Riders out of this. They've had a hard time these past -oh I don't know- 5 editions.

**mr. peasant**

master of ordinance wrote:
[An actual reason to take Ogryns/Bullgryns

I think what could work is if the two of them were merged into a single unit, with the following options:

- Each Ogryn may replace its Ripper gun for:
- Slabshield and Grenadier gauntlet
- Brute shield and Power weapon (or alternatively:, just Power axes)

- The entire squad may take Carapace armour
- The entire squad may take Cavalry mounts and Hunting lances

- The Bone'ead may take Melta bombs

In my opinion, Bullgryns were given the least useful Power weapon relative to their stats and purpose, and that giving them Power axes instead would be far more useful. Also, allowing them to be turned into Cavalry units would help resolve their transport issues in a possibly better way then just shrinking them down to "Bulky" (as you'd still be limited by Transport capacity) and in a way that would appeal to GW (since it would mean new models to sell).

master of ordinance wrote:
[Storm Troopers become worth the vast points expenditure per man. And whilst we are at it buff the Hellgun.

Here's a random thought. What about making use of the new "Burst pistol" weapon type and turning the Hot-shot lasguns into something of a SMG, with a profile along the lines as follows:

Hot-shot lasgun: R: 12", S: 3, AP: 3, Type: Burst pistol

It would still fulfill the Storm Trooper's gimmick of being a close-ranged, deep striking suicide unit while the high shot count per weapon would help make up for the weapon's low strength and low model count. Incidentally, it ties in quite well with the MT's twin-linked order and should have the same efficacy as FRFSRF for a five-man squad against MEQs.

My third and final suggestion would be for a new order called "Relay my command".; which gives the ordered unit the "Voice of command" special rule for that turn. Units that receive orders from a Senior officer - whether directly or by proxy - will also have access to Senior orders. The idea behind this is to help alleviate the problem of limited range for orders. Sure, you could have solved it instead by allowing orders to have unlimited range. my method introduces an element of risk when trying to go for long distance orders (as it requires a series of successive leadership tests).

**Ashiraya**

How to fix the codex:

Cheaper rough riders.

Ratings to troops (though can't be taken as compulsory)

Done. Maybe some other little tweaks like letting lord commissars be warlords even if you have a company commander as well, but nothing major.

The codex is pretty okay. It works and will do adequately once what is actually broken (Necrons, Eldar...) is fixed.

It's certainly in a better shape than several other codices.

Much like Codex: Chaos Space Marines, it is more in need of some minor tweaks and fixes than anything major, as well as the toning down of Wraithknights, Grav and their abominable kin.

**Vaktathi**

Ashiraya wrote:
How to fix the codex:

Cheaper rough riders.

Ratings to troops (though can't be taken as compulsory)

Done. Maybe some other little tweaks like letting lord commissars be warlords even if you have a company commander as well, but nothing major.

The codex is pretty okay. It works and will do adequately once what is actually broken (Necrons, Eldar...) is fixed.

It's certainly in a better shape than several other codices.

Much like Codex: Chaos Space Marines, it is more in need of some minor tweaks and fixes than anything major, as well as the toning down of Wraithknights, Grav and their abominable kin.

There's a whole lot wrong with a grip of units beyond just Ratlings and RR's. Ogryns, Scions, Vanquishers, Demolishers, LRBT's, Basilisks, etc all have major functionality issues and the internal balance of the book is absolutely horrific. That's not even getting into the giant pile of gak that is heavy & special weapons teams.

The book is only "ok" in the sense that, against pre-2015 armies, you could use like 40% of the book to make "OK' armies, which was enough to at least play for most players. Aside from that, it's got a lot of issues, and GW's design philosophy trend doesn't seem to be going out of its way to address the 2015 books power level issues any time soon