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 455_PWR wrote:
I think it was that people thought the minis would be McCoy quality but in high quality plastic.

Yep this was why I absolutely leapt into this as everything pointed me to believing it was true. Curse you marketing, information, pictures and expectations!!

 cincydooley wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:
The scenery pack was actually quite decent.

OH come on.
The scenery pack is fantastic and you know it
It gets a lot of use for us with Infinity.

I haven't used any of it for anything yet, but I think Fantastic is probabiy a little generous. Gluing the gun drone things together unevenly at the factory wasn't the greatest move ever, and it's not up to, say, GW standards of plastics. I reserve the right to modify my opinion upward or downward once I actually use some of it for something...


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 insaniak wrote:

This is a part of the problem with the unofficial language that is used to describe gaming models. Because technically, that statement is correct. 'Restic' is plastic. So is the resin used by Forgeworld, PVC, and whatever the stuff is that PP uses.

Gamers, for some reason, have latched onto the idea that 'plastic' means 'polystyrene'. Ultimately, if the description doesn't actually say that, there should be no reason to expect it.

Having said that, the pre-production shots that were shown led people to expect a certain level of quality that just wasn't present in the final figures. For me, the actual material used isn't really important... I'll work with whatever material companies choose to use. But if you're going to promote your miniatures with high-quality renders or greens, for Bob's sake make sure your chosen material is going to be up to the task of producing those figures.

It's also pretty much a non-issue at this point in time, since consumers know which questions to ask. Still, I've bought boardgames with sprued HIPS models for the better part of 30 years at that point, and so while "restic" might be "technically" plastic, etc, it's neither sprued HIPS nor is it play-out-of-the-box PVC like Doom, Zombicide or Descent. It's like the worst of all worlds for all parties concerned.

"Rules lawyer" parsing of the language of the promises made in McVey's kickstarter 4 years ago or whenever it was, which was filled with misleading and unclear statements does you as many favours as it did for them.




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 CptJake wrote:

 JohnHwangDD wrote:

games with much higher-than-average quality of miniatures because they came from a miniatures company.

Studio McVey *was* a miniatures company!

True, but he broke that nasty paradigm of providing "games with much higher-than-average quality of miniatures because they came from a miniatures company."

What an innovator!

Not to mention the language in the actual Kickstarter. They sold it pretty heavily on the back of McVey's rep and "quality miniatures".

From the mind of industry legend Mike McVey, and created by the finest artists, miniatures sculptors and game designers, the contents and play materials of the game are of the highest quality.. Sedition Wars : Battle for Alabaster represents the best that miniatures gaming has to offer!

The game contains –

50 highly detailed 28mm miniatures

Interestingly, they also bother to distinguish between resin and "plastic" on two occasions:

Docking Bay - Get a special limited edition resin version of Kara (unpainted, assembly required),

and

Terrain Pack - This was meant to be a set of resin models sold individually to "bling" out Alabaster station, but with the overwhelming response we've decided to tool it in plastic and give you a 100% complete upgrade!

 Azazelx wrote:
"Rules lawyer" parsing of the language of the promises made in McVey's kickstarter 4 years ago or whenever it was, which was filled with misleading and unclear statements does you as many favours as it did for them.

I'm not sure what you think I was saying there... all I was doing was pointing out that calling something 'plastic' isn't particularly informative.

It seems to be an implication that we shouldn't have expected HIPS, that we only had that expectation because we're not boardgamers and that Restic was a completely reasonable outcome.

Despite every plastic figure from GW boxed games having been in HIPS as well as other, similar games for many years (HQ, SC, Dark World, Battlemasters, etc)

Which is an odd assumption, since Descent/Doom/FFG-style PVC would seem to be the "other" "boardgame plastic". Right back to Crossbows and Catapults.

Restic was a shot out of the blue, and gakky baggies of gakky unassembled, warped restic was completely unexpected.

 Azazelx wrote:
It seems to be an implication that we shouldn't have expected HIPS, that we only had that expectation because we're not boardgamers and that Restic was a completely reasonable outcome. .

OK then. I have absolutely no idea how you got that from what I actually said. Particularly when you even quoted the part where I pointed out that regardless of what was said about the material, the end result did not meet expectations that were built up by the kickstarter.

Fair enough. We'll call it a misread on my part/the miscommunication that happens in a text discussion, then.

All good.

Ok I wasn't in the Kickstarter but picked up 4 boxs of the game for $100 shipped here are my thoughts on the base original game:

1: I look at the rules mmm hmmm "hey honey I got some toilet paper"

2: I look at the minis not great, but not bad, few pieces, restic not so great but lets face it its better material then some of the stuff out there. (looking at you GW ), and not as many pieces as another well known kickstarter did.

3: looks at the bases, hmm well worth the cost I paid for the boxs in just the bases.

4: looks at the base boards, not bad, nice and thicker then the ones in the Ruinscape board I got for another kickstarter, wish i had the 3D pieces to go on the board.

over all I paid around $25 for each game, did I get my moneys worth? yes, if I bought these games for like $75 - $100 I would feel a bit jipped, but it comes down to for $25 I got some toilet paper, some space troopers, some zombies and nice boards, all in all a good haul for me

by the way where does one go to get the current rules at ?

Asterios wrote:
I paid around $25 for each game, did I get my moneys worth?

by the way where does one go to get the current rules at ?

Hell, yeah, you did. $25 for SedWars is a very fair price. $100+ is not.

Don't bother with the official rules. Adapt the Space Hulk rules or AoS or something else that is light and fluffy.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:

Asterios wrote:
I paid around $25 for each game, did I get my moneys worth?

by the way where does one go to get the current rules at ?

Hell, yeah, you did. $25 for SedWars is a very fair price. $100+ is not.

Don't bother with the official rules. Adapt the Space Hulk rules or AoS or something else that is light and fluffy.

was thinking of using my own rules I was working on for another game of mine.

Yeah, at $25 and fire sale prices, it's a fantastic deal. I was going to base my Iron Warriors on the bases. Lucky I never got that far since I'll go 32mm with them now and use the SedWars bases for something else. Maybe AdMech.

funny thing is even at $25 a set they were not selling fast either, took months to sell off the last 16 it seems.

just noticed another site has them at $28 a set. but not sure of shipping costs.

I am just going to remind everyone that the THI suits cost $15, through the kickstarter. Not only was that ridiculous for what we got, but it makes me wonder what their retail price would have been. Yes, the THI suits are the minis that made me feel most ripped off.




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If you are looking to buy Sedition Wars, wait for Black Friday. Last year, I got a box for $17.

To be fair, the KD:M pinups were $15 each, and they are a lot smaller.

They were also better made.

And better sculpted.

Bigger, better, cheaper - pick one!

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
Bigger, better, cheaper - pick one!

I unfortunately picked Sedition Wars, and got smaller, worse and more expensive.

The sculpts are just fine.

They're better than anything Mantic has done and are probably the best "hard" sci fi minis on the market that don't say Corvus Belli on them.

 cincydooley wrote:
The sculpts are just fine.

Wave one? As delivered? Maybe. Wave 2? As Delivered? No. Not so much.

Well, technically, most of the wave 2 sculpts looked fine looking at the masters they painted, there was just that SNAFU with the materials. (That's semantics, not excusing it...)

I'd say I was happy with about half the second wave, the problem for me was just that the not-firefly crew was one of the worst, and what I was most looking forward to (for instance, not-Riddick looks great- I just don't care about that franchise).

Wish a few of those had been released in resin, since SMV obviously has a good resin caster.

Wave 2 had serious scale issues. The skull spiders were comically oversized, where some models were shrunk dramatically. And the cyborg girl was nothing like the awesome concept art during the KS.

OTOH, the big powersuit was nice, along with the not-powerloader.

Sedition Wars: the game that single-handedly scared me off Kickstarters with my first Kickstarter.

 AegisGrimm wrote:
Sedition Wars: the game that single-handedly scared me off Kickstarters with my first Kickstarter.

This is also true for me*.


*Ok not quite true but made me much more cautious and I've managed to get stung twice since, thankfully not for anywhere near so much cash...

I have only backed one other board-game, just this summer, called Shadowstar Corsairs. The designer is completely awesome, and did/does everything a KS designer should. The campaign is like the opposite of SedWars, with a beta test rulebook, active involvement of fans in the creation process, and pretty decent transparency by the designer.

 AegisGrimm wrote:
I have only backed one other board-game, just this summer, called Shadowstar Corsairs. The designer is completely awesome, and did/does everything a KS designer should. The campaign is like the opposite of SedWars, with a beta test rulebook, active involvement of fans in the creation process, and pretty decent transparency by the designer.

so the complete opposite of the Robotech RPG Tactics Kickstarter then ?

 AegisGrimm wrote:
I have only backed one other board-game, just this summer, called Shadowstar Corsairs. The designer is completely awesome, and did/does everything a KS designer should. The campaign is like the opposite of SedWars, with a beta test rulebook, active involvement of fans in the creation process, and pretty decent transparency by the designer.

I wonder how that campaign would have gone were it one of the first major campaigns on Kickstarter over three years ago, without tons of examples to learn from?

I think people forget about that. There are problems with Sedition Wars, but it was also, really, one of the first of it's kind on KS.

Comparing how that campaign and project was run to something being run today is a bit of an off comparison, IMO.

100% agreement, Cincy. IDK, maybe the irrational hatred is like a first girlfriend sort of thing?

 cincydooley wrote:

 AegisGrimm wrote:
I have only backed one other board-game, just this summer, called Shadowstar Corsairs. The designer is completely awesome, and did/does everything a KS designer should. The campaign is like the opposite of SedWars, with a beta test rulebook, active involvement of fans in the creation process, and pretty decent transparency by the designer.

I wonder how that campaign would have gone were it one of the first major campaigns on Kickstarter over three years ago, without tons of examples to learn from?

I think people forget about that. There are problems with Sedition Wars, but it was also, really, one of the first of it's kind on KS.

Comparing how that campaign and project was run to something being run today is a bit of an off comparison, IMO.

but what about comparing RRT to SC ? RRT is still running today, albeit its more of a running joke, i digress and before I go veering this topic off kilter.

I wasn't in the sedition wars game, but from what I have seen of it It makes more sense as a Space/zombie supply pack then a game.

 cincydooley wrote:
The sculpts are just fine.

They're better than anything Mantic has done and are probably the best "hard" sci fi minis on the market that don't say Corvus Belli on them.

The Wave 1 sculpts are great. Assembly isn't. Lots of mouldlines (actually, mouldlines everywhere), careless clipping at the factory (I had to rebuild the right shoulder on about half the Vanguard), a material that seemed to hate superglue and bent pieces.

As a modeller, none of these issues was particularly difficult to deal with, there were just so MANY issues to deal with on every mini. The boardgamers must have been tearing their hair out... Combined with a poor ruleset and those dark, dark tiles, the game was a major disappointment. Wave 2 was mostly a joke.

I've been tempted, several times, to get some more models off eBay (sold my first set painted), but the thought of assembling them again has put me right off. I won't touch Mantic restic either, after some bad experiences.

But painted up? Yeah, those are beautiful figures.