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Col. Dash wrote: . One student with a personal weapon could have stopped this madman .
John Parker Jr., a veteran and student at UCC, spoke with MSNBC and revealed that he was in a campus building with a concealed handgun when the shooting started. He suggested other students with him at the time were also carrying concealed handguns.
. By the time he became aware of the shooting, a SWAT team had already responded. He was concerned that police would view him as a “bad guy” and target him, so he quickly retreated into the classroom.
Yep. "Could have stopped" would only work if the armed person was in the actual area and knew what was going on (the 'close proximity' the guy mentions). Being across campus and not even hearing gunshots kind of rules that out. Now, if someone in the classroom or an adjacent classroom had been armed and confronted the gak bag, they 'could have stopped' him. Maybe not. We do know he was eventually stopped by folks with guns.
Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings.
Yep. "Could have stopped" would only work if the armed person was in the actual area and knew what was going on (the 'close proximity' the guy mentions).
To be fair, that's like questioning the effectiveness of fire extinguishers not being able to extinguish a fire because there's none nearby.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/10/02 14:33:39
It seems like it is becoming excaptable to shoot peoeple in usa.
I think it stems more from the usa culture of people need to except me or I am allowed to hurt them. Peoepl freaking out at the police, people freaking out at the judges questioning and thinking they deserve what ever they consider jutice ext.
So less guns more guns wont help I think it is the culture of the states everyone thinks they deserve better then him and with the 10 law things that breed hatred. You can tell when you ask them a simple question.
Who are you they all say the same type of thing, i am latin, muslim,african ect. I never heard anyone from canada say anything like that, they all say I am canadian. To much hatred and self deversity
I need to go to work every day.
Millions of people on welfare depend on me.
OgreChubbs wrote: It seems like it is becoming excaptable to shoot peoeple in usa.
I think it stems more from the usa culture of people need to except me or I am allowed to hurt them. Peoepl freaking out at the police, people freaking out at the judges questioning and thinking they deserve what ever they consider jutice ext.
So less guns more guns wont help I think it is the culture of the states everyone thinks they deserve better then him and with the 10 law things that breed hatred. You can tell when you ask them a simple question.
Who are you they all say the same type of thing, i am latin, muslim,african ect. I never heard anyone from canada say anything like that, they all say I am canadian. To much hatred and self deversity
When Americans are killed in mine disasters, we work to make mines safer. When Americans are killed in floods and hurricanes, we make communities safer. When roads are unsafe, we fix them to reduce auto fatalities. We have seatbelt laws because we know it safes lives. The notion that gun violence is somehow different—that our freedom and our Constitution prohibits any modest regulation of how we use a deadly weapon, when there are law-abiding gun owners all across the country who could hunt, and protect their families, and do everything they do under such regulations—doesn't make sense."
Nice words from a gun grabber. This isn't Britain. This isn't Canada. The regulations being put forth don't stop this from happening, but do harm those law abiding gun owners. Let me be clear as he likes to say, he's for confiscation. Holder got a warm fuzzy up his leg about it, and said so. Pelosi et al have said so. The moment you lead off with long gun bans you betray that you're not about reducing mass murders or crime in general, but about confiscating guns from legal law abiding gun owners.
When you talk about that, push for that, but do nothing about the mental health system, nothing about linking mental health to background checks, then you're just lying under the cover of false righteousness.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
You cant stop crazy unless someone else knows they are crazy. If this guy has never been to a shrink then there is no way to know he was certifiable. If its not on paper then you have no reason to deny them a gun. Now granted, gun store owners always have the right to deny a sale if they sense something fishy or isn't right. It does happen and I have seen it first hand and stuck around as back up waiting for the police to arrive to verify what happened. But if the person acts like a normal person and his or her record is spotless, gun store owners aren't mind readers and will have no reason not to sell to someone.
Even if the person goes to a shrink and is being treated, unless the doctor actually thinks the guy is a danger to himself or others he is bound by client/doctor confidentiality(last I heard). So again you have another human failure point in the mix.
Just because the guy is a Nazi fan or racial supremacist, or in this case atheist fanatic according to myspace(who the hell uses myspace anymore?) that doesn't give a legal reason to deny someone a basic right. The real world isn't Minority Report. Conversely instead of terrorism, he could have used his guns to stop a serial rapist in the future despite being all of the above and we would have never heard of him except on a couple pro-gun sites, which wouldn't have given him the infamy he so desperately wanted.
Again, you cannot legislate crazy.
If you dont short hand your list, Im not reading it.
Example: Assault Intercessors- x5 -Thunder hammer and plasma pistol on sgt.
or Assault Terminators 3xTH/SS, 2xLCs
For the love of God, GW, get rid of reroll mechanics. ALL OF THEM!
Just because the guy has his CC permit doesn't mean he has to rush across campus and naturalize the gunman. He did the right thing and let law enforcement naturalize the threat, He protected himself and the classroom he was in.
Yep. "Could have stopped" would only work if the armed person was in the actual area and knew what was going on (the 'close proximity' the guy mentions).
To be fair, that's like questioning the effectiveness of fire extinguishers not being able to extinguish a fire because there's none nearby.
It takes training to use a fire extinguisher correctly. Incorrect use can cause more damage than leaving the fire to burn. Besides, it isn't fire extinguishers that put out fires, it's kids who play video games.
Yep. "Could have stopped" would only work if the armed person was in the actual area and knew what was going on (the 'close proximity' the guy mentions).
To be fair, that's like questioning the effectiveness of fire extinguishers not being able to extinguish a fire because there's none nearby.
It takes training to use a fire extinguisher correctly. Incorrect use can cause more damage than leaving the fire to burn. Besides, it isn't fire extinguishers that put out fires, it's kids who play video games.
You don't need training to vote, freely assemble, practice your religion, be free from illegal searches of your person and papers, be free from cruel or unusual punishment, or how not to quarter troops. The Bill of Rights says your argument is worthless. Don't like it, change the ing Constitution. Good luck with that.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
As I said in an earlier post, the mental health issue surrounding gun violence is a complete smokescreen, affecting a statistically insignificant proportion of actual gun crime.
American prisons are full of people who probably didn't know they were criminals until they came home one night and found their wife in bed with somebody else.
It's a complex issue, more complex than the left arguing for more gun control, and the right arguing for more guns etc etc
I do agree that America shouldn't look abroad for solutions, because it's circumstances are pretty unique.
When we had the Hungerford massacre and the Dunblane massacres in the UK, there was no outcry at guns being banned, quite the opposite. The majority of the UK population wanted them banned.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
Ustrello wrote: Guns should be required to own guns. How else will they protect themselves from other mentally unstable guns?
Am I doing this right?
No, you're not.
Anyway...
About the gun free zone thing, here is clarification I did not know about:
The current policy of the State Board of Education states that people with concealed carry permits are allowed to bring their firearms on campuses, but are not into university buildings, which means a person can roam a campus with a concealed weapon, but if they want to go indoors, they must have somewhere (like the trunk of their car) to store their weapon. Umpqua Community College is not governed by the State Board of Education, but has a similar policy in place.
I read the same thing but figured I would let it go for someone else. Whoever had the armed friend there might want to tell him to shut up about it or end up in the same shoes as that navy officer who returned fire against the recruitment building.
If you dont short hand your list, Im not reading it.
Example: Assault Intercessors- x5 -Thunder hammer and plasma pistol on sgt.
or Assault Terminators 3xTH/SS, 2xLCs
For the love of God, GW, get rid of reroll mechanics. ALL OF THEM!
Da Boss wrote: America is going to keep it's guns, and we'll be back here in however many months it is til the next one of these.
Hopefully it's a lot of months.
Obama's speech was great. We'll see if it gets followed up with anything substantive, but that was the best I'd seen him on any topic in a long while.
Obama can afford to talk like that, because he's out the door in a year's time. We may see the 'real' Obama coming through in the next few months on various issues, for the simple reason he's not up for re-election and can tread on toes.
As for anything substantive, not a chance. If Obama proposed that Christmas day should fall on the 25th December, the Republicans would block it.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
Chute82 wrote: Just because the guy has his CC permit doesn't mean he has to rush across campus and naturalize the gunman. He did the right thing and let law enforcement naturalize the threat, He protected himself and the classroom he was in.
Yup, just another side effect of our broken immigration system.
*looks around wearily for the inevitable hail of criticism for how this chart was put together, or the source, or the fact that the two are incomparable*
Da Boss wrote: America is going to keep it's guns, and we'll be back here in however many months it is til the next one of these.
Hopefully it's a lot of months.
Obama's speech was great. We'll see if it gets followed up with anything substantive, but that was the best I'd seen him on any topic in a long while.
Obama can afford to talk like that, because he's out the door in a year's time. We may see the 'real' Obama coming through in the next few months on various issues, for the simple reason he's not up for re-election and can tread on toes.
As for anything substantive, not a chance. If Obama proposed that Christmas day should fall on the 25th December, the Republicans would block it.
Nothing substantive will happen but not because of Obama, but because historically substantive changes have always struggled to get passed by Congress for reasons that have pretty much been consistently the same. In my lifetime there have been 2 substantial federal gun laws passed, the creation of NICS for background checks run by FFL dealers and the assault weapons ban that was passed with a sunset clause and subsequently not renewed. Conversely, we know have more states issuing more concealed permits than ever making it easier for more citizens across the country to own and carry firearms. On the whole, we've moved to be more permissive than restrictive with firearm ownership so it's unlikely for that trend to suddenly be discounted by the politicians in Congress.
It wasn't... in fact, he's a jackass for politicizing this.
The NRA have been doing this for decades, long before Obama rolled into Washington.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
whembly wrote: It wasn't... in fact, he's a jackass for politicizing this.
Let's get something straight. Obama is *for* confiscation. Anyone who's arguing that he's not is deluding themselves...
A.) Of course, if he said nothing, there would be an equal amount of spittle-flecked keyboards
B.) The unintentional irony on that second sentence is just.... immeasurable. President Obama, probably the weakest president on gun control in a generation, supporting confiscation, while stating that people are deluding themselves? I mean, you literally don't even realize how ridiculous that is. And, that's sad.
lord_blackfang wrote: Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote: The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
Da Boss wrote: America is going to keep it's guns, and we'll be back here in however many months it is til the next one of these.
Hopefully it's a lot of months.
Obama's speech was great. We'll see if it gets followed up with anything substantive, but that was the best I'd seen him on any topic in a long while.
Obama can afford to talk like that, because he's out the door in a year's time. We may see the 'real' Obama coming through in the next few months on various issues, for the simple reason he's not up for re-election and can tread on toes.
As for anything substantive, not a chance. If Obama proposed that Christmas day should fall on the 25th December, the Republicans would block it.
Nothing substantive will happen but not because of Obama, but because historically substantive changes have always struggled to get passed by Congress for reasons that have pretty much been consistently the same. In my lifetime there have been 2 substantial federal gun laws passed, the creation of NICS for background checks run by FFL dealers and the assault weapons ban that was passed with a sunset clause and subsequently not renewed. Conversely, we know have more states issuing more concealed permits than ever making it easier for more citizens across the country to own and carry firearms. On the whole, we've moved to be more permissive than restrictive with firearm ownership so it's unlikely for that trend to suddenly be discounted by the politicians in Congress.
In the 19th and for most the 20th century, SCOTUS were quite happy to uphold gun control laws.
Hell, before Heller, SCOTUS ruled 4 times that the 2nd wasn't a blanket individual right to own arms.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
*looks around wearily for the inevitable hail of criticism for how this chart was put together, or the source, or the fact that the two are incomparable*
Well... it's as just as a valid comparison as the Gun Deaths vs Abortions:
Spoiler:
Or, looking at the CDC data...
Gun Deaths: ~30,000 per year
Abortions: ~730,000 per year
But, that isn't a politically convenient comparison.
What I find highly amusing is that Obama "asked" for this comparison and Vox jumped right into it...
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: As I said in an earlier post, the mental health issue surrounding gun violence is a complete smokescreen, affecting a statistically insignificant proportion of actual gun crime.
The fact that the large majority of gun deaths in the United States are suicides would seem to contradict this claim....
*looks around wearily for the inevitable hail of criticism for how this chart was put together, or the source, or the fact that the two are incomparable*
What's the point of the chart? Did anybody think that religious extremist goatherds on the other side of the planet were killing more Americans in the US than American criminals? Nobody was claiming that ISIS was here in America launching a murderous crime wave across the country.
Da Boss wrote: America is going to keep it's guns, and we'll be back here in however many months it is til the next one of these.
Hopefully it's a lot of months.
Obama's speech was great. We'll see if it gets followed up with anything substantive, but that was the best I'd seen him on any topic in a long while.
Its better than Putin laughing in his face like the day before.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Also, I heard that two police ran into the building to confront the shooter w/o hesitating for backup or approval. Those two should be lauded too...
IIRC after Columbine most (all?) police departments revamped their protocol for responses to shootings and instead of treating it like a hostage situation and establishing a perimeter and wating for back up/SWAT they now go in as quickly as possible to minimize the number of casualties the gunman can create.
ing Constitution. Good luck with that.
