1 Win / 9 Losses Necron

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**spencetacular**

Trying to get some help with my Necron Army. I tried running Decurian and CA detatchments between 1250 and 2000 points. Mainly consisting of Wraiths, Ghost Arks, Warriors, Immortals, Tomb Blades, Overlords (Cryptek, Lords), Doomsday, Night / Doom Scythe, Monolith, Ctan Nightbringer, Destroyers, Annihilation / Catacomb Barges, Deathmarks,

I cannot use Imotekh, my Nightshroud, or Veil because I lost them in previous battles. (Special Campaign Rules)

My tactics - Ghost Arks up the middle, drop the warriors following behind are immortals. Wraiths and/or Harvest sweep up on the right. Tomb Blades shoot from 24 on the left. (That is what I main)

Where I find myself losing - my units get wiped out too easily - even in Decurian. My vehicles get blown up almost instantly, Canoptek Harvest works a lil bit for me, Always put whip coils on my wraiths, use tesla when fighting hordes, gauss and tachyon vs vehicles.
Dark Eldar has a crazy deep striker that hits and wounds on 2's (Wounds based on Initiative) . Vipers, Poison, Lances obliterate me. My deep strikes always fail, (I think I'm 2 for 11 on deep strike success). Nids monster creatures (especially the one that gives extra rounds of attacks) and high strength low AP hits, and flyers.

I've fought Space Marines, and its usually a close game.

If I go CA, I'm not resilient enough to take on my opponent. If I'm Decurian, my objectives are always contested in Maelstrom. I remember in turn one, at one point I had over 400 shots fired at my army, wiped out half of them before turn 2 began.

My Ctan and Monolith really aren't used much because they dont produce for their points. Scythe is used only in CA Detachments. I try to sneak in Destroyers when possible. I haven't had a chance to fit in a stalker. I dont own any flayed ones,

I haven't had a chance to fight Chaos, Necron, or Orks.

Warlord traits are somewhat foreign to me yet. I know what is what, but they don't help that much. I dont want to melee with my Warlord much because of fear of loss. I think going to ground is a loss as well, because of saves and RP's.

Any help in strategy is highly encouraged, at least to pull a win out of here somewhere (the win I did get, I had a mentor helping with my combat decisions and target priority)

**Slayer-Fan123**

I've lost VERY little since the new codex dropped. I'm gonna have to see the original list, and we can work from there.

**vipoid**

Could you elaborate any more on that DE unit that wounds on initiative?

Is it a Forgeworld unit, because I play DE and there's no unit matching that description in the DE book or Coven supplement.

Also, could you post a full list? It might help us give you advice.

**Frozocrone**

I think a lot of this can be contributed towards improving your target priority and learning your sweet spot for range (which is 12" - 24").

Examples of target priority include:

'I need this objective this turn. So I'll fire what I need to until I can kill enough of a unit so that they are forced off the objective and I can claim it without being contested,'

'This unit is key to the opponents army, if I can take it out or cripple it my opponent is going to have an uphill struggle.'

'My opponent has some reserves to come in, at least I can make it hard for him to get to the targets he wants to by bubbling wrapping (surrounding key units with infantry) it to keep it safe, then deal with them on my turn.'

'My opponent is relying on getting this dangerous unit here by using this transport, so if I can destroy that transport, I can slow down that unit and deal with it later.'

'My opponent has deployed in a line across his deployment zone, so I'll deploy my whole army on one side so that I can encounter less resistance and be able to use more of my available forces to cripple my opponent while he re-adjusts and manoeuvres part of his army as quickly as possible.'

You'll get tactics as you gain experience in playing the game, I wouldn't worry too much. Just takes time and maybe some mentoring from an experienced player if you're struggling. With an easy to play army such as Necrons (relatively speaking, they are one of the 'power codexes' of 2015) you can afford to be a little lenient with tactics, but you'll still need a plan against experienced players who know their army and what it's capable of.

**vipoid**

Oh, with regard to Warlord Traits, unless my warlord is a CCB then I always try for Fearless/Zealot. Since getting swept is still a big weakness for Necrons, it's useful to have a warlord who's immune to it.

Oh, by the way, which army was putting out 400 shots? And what size game was that?

**Mantorok**

I have about the 1 win/?? loss ratio with my Necrons too.

I go up against Eldar though, and when I'm not, I usually forget rules or units that I have.
I have to accept that I'm bad at 40K.

Have you considered that you're bad at 40K?
It doesn't have to stop you from playing.

**Waaghboss Grobnub**

My advice.

Drop the C'than units. While very awesome they cost too much for their own good.

For Necrons i have 1 general rule, as most have with their army.
Make everything work together!
Necrons excel at this IMO

For example. We take a Stalker. It gives +1 BS to nearby units. Place a Ark at either side. Around the Arks place warriors. If done right all units around the STalker get +1 BS. This also helsp on overwatch. It doesnt make their BS 5, no it gives +1. So overwatch/Snap shots on fives as well!

Take in concideration the necron weaknesses

-Destroyer weapons HURT SO BAD!
-Average range lies around 24'' so most targets will be out of range on the first turn
- Close combat isnt their strong point

What are the Necrons strong points?
Staying power, no one does it better!

Necrons are no Eldar, they cant get everywhere at once so stick together, but not to close in case of Blasts

Now, as for the lances, just jink when possible. Its more important to have the skimmer in play than to have it fire! But do not be scared to make a sacrifice when needed!

Against Dark Eldar keep as much as possible inside your vehicles. Their poison weapons cant do anything!! With the Arks you should have their rear armours faced to eachother. Try and force the Dark Eldar player to shoot at the higher AV!

**spencetacular**

Thanks for all the help guys.

Still getting back to one of the players on the 400 shots.

The one unit that was hitting and wounding on 2's were the Warp Spiders. They were part of a formation gave +1 to BS. Fire Dragons had S8, Spiders wounded against Initiative.

I like the idea with the Stalker and bubble wrapping my Arks. I don't believe the Warriors will prevent shots against the Arks, but at least slow down any melee.

Yes, there is no doubt I am really bad at this game. Total, 15 years ago I played Skaven in Fantasy for about a year. Got into 40k about a year ago. I was doing ok in the first campaign, as I was about 50/50 in W/L. We were all playing around 500-1000 pts then.

**vipoid**

spencetacular wrote:

The one unit that was hitting and wounding on 2's were the Warp Spiders. They were part of a formation gave +1 to BS. Fire Dragons had S8, Spiders wounded against Initiative.

Ah, those are Eldar, not Dark Eldar. It makes a difference because Eldar are in a different league to Dark Eldar, in terms of power level. They're basically the standard by which overpoweredness is measured.

To be honest, I'm actually wondering if you'd be better off fielding no vehicles at all. If you're facing Eldar, then you've already lost the mobility battle, and with Fire Dragons and such, it seems they have more than enough to kill your vehicles. So, it could be better to go for the attrition game and try to outlast them with durable infantry. If you have a Decurion with multiple Canoptek Harvests and/or a Destroyer Cult, it might be better in terms of survivability.

Hell, if you don't mind a bit of cheddar, you could even do something like this:

Decurion:
Reclamation Legion:
- Overlord w/ Voidblade
- 10 Warriors
- 10 Warriors
- 5 Immortals
- 3 Tomb Blades
Canoptek Harvest:
- 4 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils
- 3 Scarabs
- Tomb Spyder
Canoptek Harvest:
- 3 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils
- 3 Scarabs
- Tomb Spyder
Canoptek Harvest:
- 3 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils
- 3 Scarabs
- Tomb Spyder
1239pts

So, in a 1250pt game, you have 10 I5 Wraiths, 3 Spyders, 9 Scarabs - all of which can have 4+ RPs (as long as you can keep the spyders safe), in addition to the Reclamation Legion. Also, you have 11pts left to spend on gear or whatever (41pts if you remove the Whip Coils from some or all of the Wraiths).

**BomBomHotdog**

Waaghboss Grobnub wrote:

So overwatch/Snap shots on fives as well!

I haven't looked at my codex for a while, but unless it says otherwise you always snap shot on 6, regardless of modifiers.

As said before, drop your C'tan Shard unless you running the formation with 2 Crypteks.

When used right monoliths can turn a game, great for blocking LoS and can pull units from across the board/out of reserve. Don't forget that when in Decurian they also can repair a hull point on a 6 since its a Heavy. Surprised how many people forget that. Keeping with the Monolith, if you have the White Dwarf there's a formation with 1 Monolith and 2 units of Warriors and 2 units of Immortals and the Monolith acts as a supper ghost ark for all for units (D6 models returned for warriors and D3 for immortals) Its expensive, but with the points your talking about it shouldn't be too bad.

Necron excel at shooting and you want a lot of it, but if your dealing with a lot of melee (like Nids) you will want a unit of Flayed Ones or a unit of Lytchguard/Pretorians. I know you want to keep your Overlord out of CC but with a Warsythe hes one of your best melee choices, and can take challenges so if you ever go up against a CSM you can take out Lords no problem most of the time.

Dont forget your Res Orbs!

**skoffs**

Waaghboss Grobnub wrote:
all units around the STalker get +1 BS. This also helsp on overwatch. It doesnt make their BS 5, no it gives +1. So overwatch/Snap shots on fives as well!

Uh...

- Close combat isnt their strong point

Heh, tell that to all our incredible CC units, because obviously the Wraiths, Flayed Ones, Lychguard, etc. didn't get the memo.

**Waaghboss Grobnub**

skoffs wrote:
Waaghboss Grobnub wrote:
all units around the STalker get +1 BS. This also helsp on overwatch. It doesnt make their BS 5, no it gives +1. So overwatch/Snap shots on fives as well!
Uh...

- Close combat isnt their strong point
Heh, tell that to all our incredible CC units, because obviously the Wraiths, Flayed Ones, Lychguard, etc. didn't get the memo.

Yeah... forget the overwatch... Didn't have the codex at hand but that is how i thought it was ruled...

Yeah those are their only units decent enought in CC except wraiths,... they are superb...
While lychguard have a very good staying power i find their offensive power a bit lacking. ...... Flayed ones on the other hand go down rather quick in my experience... They do have a nice set of attacks and yes Shred is nice... but their toughness and strength are a bit lacking. Also there is a ff ton of ap 1,2,3,4 weapons out there that cuts through their save.
Scarabs are fast and that is nice. They are good to tie up a unit as they dont flee... and yes they have a ff ton of attacks.. But, their toughness/saves/WS and strength make them quite lacking in my experience. I liked the old scarabs much better

**Slayer-Fan123**

skoffs wrote:
Waaghboss Grobnub wrote:
all units around the STalker get +1 BS. This also helsp on overwatch. It doesnt make their BS 5, no it gives +1. So overwatch/Snap shots on fives as well!
Uh...

- Close combat isnt their strong point
Heh, tell that to all our incredible CC units, because obviously the Wraiths, Flayed Ones, Lychguard, etc. didn't get the memo.

He's been making up information in the thread on how to beat Necrons with Orks. Does it surprise you they'd make this statement?

**Ffyllotek**

Stalker's Targeting Relay doesn't give +1BS when firing snap shots.

Back to the thread it may be worth going back to basics with a bigger reclaimation legion. Try up to 5/6 squads of warriors, plus two out of three of: 2/3 ghost arks, 2 big units of souped up tomb blades, a 10-strong lychguard scythe squad. That will take some beating.

Flayed ones I find are best used in packs of 20 led by a d-lord with res orb and scythe. On the charge they get five shred attacks. That's nothing to be sniffed at. They have the same staying power as any other necron unit.

I find multiple min sized units of warriors with lychguard just behind and flayed ones just behind too are excellent. If warriors get charged then enemy gets counter charged by really hard-hitting troops. Once you've mastered this basic formation add in a Jd Bn for the stalkers' +1BS and extra fire power, as well as the superb AP2 shooter/CC troops.

The thing with necrons is that they are a phalanx now more than they ever were. Keep them together in the middle of the board, with CC troops keeping enemies away whilst you blast them off the board. The few more mobile units like CCB, wraiths, tomb blades can go away from the phlanx on suicide/objective grbaber missions, but keep your forces together.

**skoffs**

Ffyllotek wrote:
Flayed ones I find are best used in packs of 20 led by a d-lord with res orb and scythe.

D.Lord with FO is a waste of his toughness, movement speed and PE. Just a regular Overlord/Lord will do the same job perfectly fine, freeing the DL up to join units where he will make a much bigger strategic impact on the game (eg. Wraiths, Warrior blobs, VBPC Praetorians, Deathmarks, etc.)

**Ffyllotek**

skoffs wrote:
Ffyllotek wrote:
Flayed ones I find are best used in packs of 20 led by a d-lord with res orb and scythe.

D.Lord with FO is a waste of his toughness, movement speed and PE. Just a regular Overlord/Lord will do the same job perfectly fine, freeing the DL up to join units where he will make a much bigger strategic impact on the game (eg. Wraiths, Warrior blobs, VBPC Praetorians, Deathmarks, etc.)

Disagree. The dlord is a cc specialist and needs to be with cc troops. Out of all the cc units, he's best in a sea of bodies for protection and its potentially 100 attacks that can benefit from pe.

**Frozocrone**

Flayed Ones already have Shred though so you're only re-rolling one's to hit and with 100 attacks w/ Shred you hardly need to worry about missing.

**Happyjew**

If OP is who I think it is (based on the Warp Spider/Fire Dragon in a Formation) then his opponents for the campaign are:

Tau (Farsight Enclaves)
Dark Eldar
Eldar with Dark Eldar and Harlequin allies
Tyranids
Tyranids
Ultramarines (Battle Company every dang game)
Chaos with Chaos Space Marine allies.

Each player has an overall army list they can pull from for each game, and there is reason to suspect (campaign has two weeks left) that his next opponent will be Tyranids. With at least 3 Flyrants.

**Frozocrone**

In that case AV13 spam should be sufficient to win, especially if you park the rear armour back to back. Will have to rely on EGrubs to do any sort of damage/Carnifexes (which can be easily dealt with).

**Happyjew**

The opponent's list is likely to be the Flyrants with devourers, a brood of 3 Carnifexes all with 2 TL devourerers, some Venomthropes, and Gaunts to shield.

Additionally since OP is defending, he can take a free fortification, which we are pressuring him to take a FoR with Void Shields on all 4 sections.

**skoffs**

Ffyllotek wrote:
skoffs wrote:
Ffyllotek wrote:
Flayed ones I find are best used in packs of 20 led by a d-lord with res orb and scythe.

D.Lord with FO is a waste of his toughness, movement speed and PE. Just a regular Overlord/Lord will do the same job perfectly fine, freeing the DL up to join units where he will make a much bigger strategic impact on the game (eg. Wraiths, Warrior blobs, VBPC Praetorians, Deathmarks, etc.)

Disagree. The dlord is a cc specialist and needs to be with cc troops. Out of all the cc units, he's best in a sea of bodies for protection and its potentially 100 attacks that can benefit from pe.

Putting an Overlord with Flayed Ones will have virtually the same effect as a Destroyer Lord in that unit (a Warscythe for handling things the FO can't hurt).
And Frozocrone already pointed it out above, but giving Flayed Ones, who already reroll their failed wounds, the ability to reroll 1s to hit is a waste of a valuable tactical ability, especially considering the other things which could dearly do with having Preferred Enemy.

On the flip side, sticking him with a unit of Deathmarks that come in on the opponent's turn will not only make their shooting INCREDIBLY lethal (wound on a 2+, rerolling 1s into possible 6-rends), but the Destroyer Lord can then split off during your following movement phase to engage anything he wants while the Deathmarks head off to cover.
A Destroyer Lord in a blob of Warriors provides a serious assault deterrent while giving them a valuable buff to their shooting (particularly if there's a Stalker in range).
A Destroyer Lord with Wraiths is a no-brainer, especially if they're Harvest Wraiths with Beamers. That's MC/GC bane.
A Destroyer Lord with VBPC Praets is vicious. A ton of VERY dangerous attacks, made more so with PE when backed up with a Warscythe.
And then there's Lychguard. An Orikan-star with a Destroyer Lord is just gravy.

Again, of all the things in the codex to add a Destoryer Lord to, Flayed Ones are not near the top of the list. Not the worst thing, but just not the best, tactically.

**vipoid**

skoffs wrote:
Ffyllotek wrote:
Flayed ones I find are best used in packs of 20 led by a d-lord with res orb and scythe.

D.Lord with FO is a waste of his toughness, movement speed and PE.

I don't disagree with your overall point, but isn't every unit you put a D. Lord in technically a waste of his toughness?

The only exception I can think of would be putting him with another character, so that both models would effectively be T6.

**skoffs**

vipoid wrote:
skoffs wrote:
Ffyllotek wrote:
Flayed ones I find are best used in packs of 20 led by a d-lord with res orb and scythe.

D.Lord with FO is a waste of his toughness, movement speed and PE.

I don't disagree with your overall point, but isn't every unit you put a D. Lord in technically a waste of his toughness?

The only exception I can think of would be putting him with another character, so that both models would effectively be T6.

You're not wrong. Personally, I prefer to stick him in at least T5 units.
OR, if you want to be crazy, you stick two Destroyer Lords together and have them rampage across the table as some sort of faux MC (S7 T6 6W 6A with AP2 and Armorbane).
I mean, it's kind of a waste of their potential, but sometimes you just want to let a wrecking ball loose.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Ffyllotek wrote:
skoffs wrote:
Ffyllotek wrote:
Flayed ones I find are best used in packs of 20 led by a d-lord with res orb and scythe.

D.Lord with FO is a waste of his toughness, movement speed and PE. Just a regular Overlord/Lord will do the same job perfectly fine, freeing the DL up to join units where he will make a much bigger strategic impact on the game (eg. Wraiths, Warrior blobs, VBPC Praetorians, Deathmarks, etc.)

Disagree. The dlord is a cc specialist and needs to be with cc troops. Out of all the cc units, he's best in a sea of bodies for protection and its potentially 100 attacks that can benefit from pe.

With Shred, though, they don't NEED additional help. The other choices are more mobile CC threats getting a better multiplier from PE. In the case of Deathmarks, you Deep Strike them on the opponent's turn and then detach the Lord for solo missions.

**spencetacular**

Add in another loss, I'm now 1-10

Top of First - Carnifex 3x came rushing in, blew up 1 ghost ark with explosion, 1 inch around, taking out a warrior and an immortal. 1 stalker with explosion, 22 hits on explode, 3 warriors fall. 3 wounds on 2nd ark, with jink saves.
Bottom of first - 80 Gauss shots at 1 carnifex. 16 hits. 4 wounds. all Saved. 4 hits, 3 wounds from Quad Cannon. All Saved. 3 staff of light shots from overlord. 1 wound, no save. stays flying.
Top of Second - 2nd ghost ark down, wrecked. Monstrous creature charges my 20 warriors. ap2 Str 10 - 5 attacks, hammer, charge bonus, and stomps. killed 9 warriors. failed leadership. failed initiative. Sweeping wiped out 11 warriors and an overlord. Conceded.

How is Necron even supposed to take on this Army?

**Slayer-Fan123**

Stomps from what?

I'm also confused as to HOW a Carnifex would ever get near a Ghost Ark.

**KelCJ**

Based on that short report I'm mildly concerned there are some rules being played incorrectly. Forgive me if I'm misinterpreting but how is a ghost ark or stalker getting damaged by an explodes result? Why are there 22 hits on the Warriors? How did the fexes charge at the top of turn 1 with only a 6" movement and a possible 12" charge max when there's 24" between each player at the start of the game? If it was by infiltration thanks to a warlord trait charging that same turn is not allowed.

Something is off and I feel you're getting the short end of the stick because of it.

**Jackal**

Correct me if I'm wrong, but fex's have 0 ability to first turn charge and do not get stomps.
I would be running my 6 wrecker fex's if that was the case.

I'm thinking some rules issues here.

**TheCustomLime**

spencetacular wrote:
Add in another loss, I'm now 1-10

Top of First - Carnifex 3x came rushing in, blew up 1 ghost ark with explosion, 1 inch around, taking out a warrior and an immortal. 1 stalker with explosion, 22 hits on explode, 3 warriors fall. 3 wounds on 2nd ark, with jink saves.
Bottom of first - 80 Gauss shots at 1 carnifex. 16 hits. 4 wounds. all Saved. 4 hits, 3 wounds from Quad Cannon. All Saved. 3 staff of light shots from overlord. 1 wound, no save. stays flying.
Top of Second - 2nd ghost ark down, wrecked. Monstrous creature charges my 20 warriors. ap2 Str 10 - 5 attacks, hammer, charge bonus, and stomps. killed 9 warriors. failed leadership. failed initiative. Sweeping wiped out 11 warriors and an overlord. Conceded.

How is Necron even supposed to take on this Army?

I'll agree with the other posters. I think the Tyranid player was cheating if what you are saying is accurate.

**Ffyllotek**

spencetacular wrote:
Add in another loss, I'm now 1-10

Top of First - Carnifex 3x came rushing in, blew up 1 ghost ark with explosion, 1 inch around, taking out a warrior and an immortal. 1 stalker with explosion, 22 hits on explode, 3 warriors fall. 3 wounds on 2nd ark, with jink saves.
Bottom of first - 80 Gauss shots at 1 carnifex. 16 hits. 4 wounds. all Saved. 4 hits, 3 wounds from Quad Cannon. All Saved. 3 staff of light shots from overlord. 1 wound, no save. stays flying.
Top of Second - 2nd ghost ark down, wrecked. Monstrous creature charges my 20 warriors. ap2 Str 10 - 5 attacks, hammer, charge bonus, and stomps. killed 9 warriors. failed leadership. failed initiative. Sweeping wiped out 11 warriors and an overlord. Conceded.

How is Necron even supposed to take on this Army?

I'm sorry there is no way a carnifex can kill a GA turn one and in turn kill a stalker. Just doesn't happen. The stalker tops would have taken a S4 hit which it can simply ignore, having A13/13/11. Even if it did then explode (which it can't) there's no way it can roll another explode from an AP-.

Eighty shots and you hit sixteen times at BS4? Really? You should be hitting about fifty five times.

22 hits from an explosion? I'm just lost for words. How?

I think you need to go over the rules. Head to your local GW and they'll clear things up for you.