Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

What I have found with the Culexus is that it forces a decision by my opponent. Even if they go first, they have to decide if they want their blessings, either avoiding the Culexus dead zone during movement ("pushing" them to a flank), or saying "screw that" and giving up the protection of Invis/Sanctuary/Endourance/Fortune, etc. Even if they take him out in the shooting phase top of turn 1, he just forced an ultimatum down their throat. That has been the least he ever did for me, and that is huge.

Often he really shines when I'm facing opponents with no Psykers, as they tend to ignore him. The Culexus is still a beast in combat, ignoring armor and getting Instant Death on 6s to wound. He's tons of fun for a reasonable price tag.

p.s. NEVER forget to throw his grenades and force a Perils at -3 Ld. Lots of laughs to be had!

boom. Wisdom./

Hello, all. I'm new to the forum but have lurked for years. I played a lot of 6th but only a bit of 7th, before rage quitting due to old serpent spam. I played mainly mech list, as that's what I have painted, and the old serpent shield made half of my list almost useless.

I am re-entering the hobby and have decided to paint up a new army for the summer-fall tourney scene in NE USA. As I own 2 unopened riptides and two unopened pathfinder boxes, I've decided to base the army around the finders, as the riptide wing is almost an auto include in tough tourneys. As is the surge, imho.

So I've been putting quite a bit of thought into how to get the most out of 20 finders, and Darkstrider, since he doesn't get much love.

First, a bit of background on my attempts at outflanking lists. I started toying with pos relay gimmick outflank lists in 6th, and while I found them fun, and my opponents did as well, the 50% on board at start rule crippled the playstyle. Then seventh came along and I found a new interest in it, as that rule was removed. Unfortunately, I found that the reserve rolls still could make or break the game for me, so I felt it just wasn't a tourney level style of play. Granted , my local meta had yet to embrace mealstrom, so the strength of shifty scoring units went unreallized.

Now enter the new infiltration cadre formation. This formation has given this playstyle a huge boost. It remains to be seen how clever opponents decide to deal with that first turn, as I haven't seen anyone trying it yet in batreps.

So, if using this formation, I feel one should have a very heavy amount of reserves (obviously), to justify the cost. That said, luckily five of the six units in the formation have the ability to outflank. Also, those same units all have the option to take pos relays, so there should be at least one or two in there. I like the stealths, as it's a cheaper buy, and their infiltrate and mobility can be used to jet towards the opponents back edge on turn 1, making them even juicier bait. I believe the key to using this formation will be understanding which of these units to use or combine together to bait the specific army you are against. I can think of too many scenarios to get into now myself.

The next key to the outflank list is having the long range fire power to force you're opponent to come to you. You have to draw out the enemy force so that when the outflankers arrive they can consolidate their fire on one section of the enemy's army that has either the best chance at turning our lines, or those sections that have the least potential to inflict return damage. Basically, you have to think of the list as a null deploy counter strike. The biggest strength of this style, and what seperates it from deep strike heavy lists is the precision deployment of the pos relays over deep striking. Believe me when I say it makes a huge difference. It is not difficult for us to have all four board edges viable for deployment, and indeed this style of list should have enough redundencies of pos relays to ensure it always has that option.

Anyway, perhaps posting the sample list I was considering building for tourneys will help with understanding my ramblings on this subject.

Tau Empire CAD - 1188

HQ- Darkstrider
Fast- Pathfinder x4 w/3 railrifles
Fast- Pathfinder x4 w/2 railrifles
Troop- Kroot x10
Troop- Kroot x10
Elite- Iontide w/ewos
Elite- Burstide w/ vt
LOW- Stormsurge w/ ewos, shield gen

Infiltration Cadre - 427pts

Stealth suits x3 w/ pos relay (1)
Stealth suits x3 w/ pos relay (1)
Pathfinder x4 w/ x2 ion rifles
Pathfinder x4 w/ x2 ion rifles
Pathfinder x4 w/ x2 ion rifles
Piranha w/ fusion

Drone Net - 224pts

Marker Drones x4
Marker Drones x4
Marker Drones x4
Marker Drones x4

Total - 1839pts

With this list you have three parts, the bait (most likely Piranha or Stealth team. I would keep at least one Stealth team in reserve for that relay), the firebase, and the ambush party.

The bait depends on the enemy. The firebase can either start on the table with the markers if needed, but most likely you gave up first turn or your opponent opted to take it, so you null deploy and force the bait kill. In this case your opponent will not have a focal point to charge his troops at, and my experience is that he will either play safe and stay huddled up, allowing you to deploy your firebase with the best ratio for damage out vs damage in, or he will committ to storming at your deployment zone in a more spread out fashion trying to secure as many objectives as he can early on. In this case you concentrate everything on one section of his army and deal a crippling blow that leaves them playing catch up the rest of the game.

Now the outflankers' role is one of two things. First, they can make a play for a backfield firebase of the enemy. This ideally cause your opponent to redirect movement towards his own backfield, weakening the push he was making for your firebase and pulling his force in two on YOUR terms, and losing usefulness that turn of the units thus redirected.

Second, and I found this was more often the case, I would use them to outflank on my strong table side, helping the firebase crush the front most threatening units. This ideally leaves my opponents with a crippled charge into a now much larger and closely concentrated force. "Turning the Flank" as described by Jancoran earlier. Never used pathfinders in this role before, but I've used 40 Kroot to do it plenty.

I feel this tactic has a strong potential for competative play. It won't out shoot the strongest of lists, but it has the tools and tricks for an extremely accurate counter strike. Pathfinders in this list perform the role of crisis suits, with a more precise method of attacking those exploitable points in your opponents army, at the trade off of being less mobile and resilient after their strike.

I feel that the options for army building are more abundant than ever before, and all armies are still experimenting with the new format of 7th. I remember the days of 3rd edition (when I started) and the multitude of deployment techniques used by various armies. Drop guard, turn 1 attack genestealers, infiltrating havoc squad lists, "ninja" tau where the game was won or lost on your 4th turn drop.... I feel we have been stuck in napoleonic warfare mode since 5th, but if GW keeps writing formations like this, I can see these lists beginning to turn that boring style of play around. One can only hope...

Looks to me like you could get a hunter cadre with minor tweaking. I might try that over the CAD for more efficient markerlights, especially since your markerlights don't have any added durability. Once they're gone, they're gone

 Plainshow wrote:
p.s. NEVER forget to throw his grenades and force a Perils at -3 Ld. Lots of laughs to be had!

I did this with a Culexus and my opponent's damn Tzeentch Daemon Prince rolled a 6 on his Perils result and then made the morale check, becoming Super Saiyan. However, I then shot that prince off the board (he kept rolling 2's on his Invulnerable Save, which meant no rerolls).

 luke1705 wrote:
Looks to me like you could get a hunter cadre with minor tweaking. I might try that over the CAD for more efficient markerlights, especially since your markerlights don't have any added durability. Once they're gone, they're gone

I will admit Darkstrider is there as a fluffy HQ tax. A 93pt Mark'O would benefit the list much more. But then again, so would 9 riptides, which crushed at the last tourney in my former local meta. Also, I'm not quite sure what you mean by that. The marker drones are the marker source, and the net is the obvious first choice for markerlights now.

That said, I do not want to keep creating the same autoplay net lists. That cycle needs to end, and it will take people stepping away from those tired ideas to force that change. I believe that GW is trying to balance it in the only way feasible for the company. They can't backtrack too much on already sold merchandise, they just have to keep expanding. "If you can't find a way out...find one further in" and what-not. Now you'll say "That doesn't bring balance!". Doesn't it? I believe it has made "Take all comers" lists obsolete, and that is sad in it's own way. But the paper rock scissors match it is becoming may just move people out of this formula of first turn shoot outs, second turn charges, roll dice until game ends. Honestly, the pos relay and infiltration cadre makes us one of the prime candidates for moving this new era forward, but it will take some of us playing tourneys with the idea of not winning, but throwing randomness into the meta to shake up the dominant gimmick lists. GW gave us the tools to change the flyer game and we did. That neutralizing force was perhaps a bit more obvious, but I feel we all are just beginning to understand these new formations. I really only see the obvious ones being played, wing and net, with the OSC being an odd exception given that you have to pay a 180pt tax for a unit almost everyone spat on (except myself and Jancoran, if I remember "Unorthodoxy" correctly from those days).

So now, disclaimer time. Even though I am espousing in favor of trying these tactics in tourney settings, I will not be doing so this year. The list I posted above was the best "outflank" list I could build using the unpainted half of my army. I would have felt confident taking it to these events (Mechanicon will be the largest I think), but i know it would not match up against 5 titans, 9 riptides, etc. The list I have settled on is, to my eternal shame, my version of a "leafblower" list, and while it still includes Strider for fluffiness, the rest is pure shootiness. I will be "playing my pocketbook" and buying the models just for it. The list and model theme I am using is a cadre that is tasked with cleansing a planet of a very large and dangerous indigenous species. "Big Game Hunters" it will be called. This list still uses the pathfinders as it's base, but in the ranged support cadre instead. Once again, no hunter contingent. Darkstrider is not too big of an HQ tax, especially in a monster meta, and my two troop choices are almost as minimal as can get. I want high strength at range for my theme, and the contingent is too restrictive, points wise, for my intentions.


Farsight Enclaves CAD - 571

HQ- Darkstrider
Troop- Crisis w/ flamer (modeled using the recon drone w/ a weapon swap, perfect for a sacrificial drop point score @ 28pts. I wish I had six of them!)
Troop- Crisis w/ flamer
LOW- Stormsurge w/ D-shotgun, ewos, shield gen


Ranged Support Cadre - 651

Pathfinders x7
Pathfinders x7
Pathfinders x7
Railsides x2 w/ ewos, sms
Railsides x2 w/ ewos, sms
Railsides x2 w/ ewos, sms


Riptide Wing - 615
Iontide w/ ewos, sms
Iontide w/ ewos, sms
Burstide w/ vt stims, sms

Total - 1837

In this list the finders obviously perform a completely different job, as they are the sole source of markerlights, and are forbidden to fire special weapons to keep their awesome formation perks. I've always played marker-finders defensively, as in positioning them safely far back to mark things that reach my deployment zone, rather than trying to paint my enemys' specific units on turn one. That's what tetras and drones are for. I wonder how these new formation perks will influence how I play them...

Why railsides? Well, monster hunter themed list... so...range. I actually think they may perform better than missiles against those 5-10 MC/GC lists, but that remains for me to see.

 luke1705 wrote:
Looks to me like you could get a hunter cadre with minor tweaking. I might try that over the CAD for more efficient markerlights, especially since your markerlights don't have any added durability. Once they're gone, they're gone

Onjective Secured is better in my opinion. I hate not having it. Especially in a list like this where deployment shenanigans are the soup du jour.

spacelord321 wrote:
Hello, all. I'm new to the forum but have lurked for years. I played a lot of 6th but only a bit of 7th, before rage quitting due to old serpent spam. I played mainly mech list, as that's what I have painted, and the old serpent shield made half of my list almost useless.

I am re-entering the hobby and have decided to paint up a new army for the summer-fall tourney scene in NE USA. As I own 2 unopened riptides and two unopened pathfinder boxes, I've decided to base the army around the finders, as the riptide wing is almost an auto include in tough tourneys. As is the surge, imho.

So I've been putting quite a bit of thought into how to get the most out of 20 finders, and Darkstrider, since he doesn't get much love.

First, a bit of background on my attempts at outflanking lists. I started toying with pos relay gimmick outflank lists in 6th, and while I found them fun, and my opponents did as well, the 50% on board at start rule crippled the playstyle. Then seventh came along and I found a new interest in it, as that rule was removed. Unfortunately, I found that the reserve rolls still could make or break the game for me, so I felt it just wasn't a tourney level style of play. Granted , my local meta had yet to embrace mealstrom, so the strength of shifty scoring units went unreallized.

Now enter the new infiltration cadre formation. This formation has given this playstyle a huge boost. It remains to be seen how clever opponents decide to deal with that first turn, as I haven't seen anyone trying it yet in batreps.

So, if using this formation, I feel one should have a very heavy amount of reserves (obviously), to justify the cost. That said, luckily five of the six units in the formation have the ability to outflank. Also, those same units all have the option to take pos relays, so there should be at least one or two in there. I like the stealths, as it's a cheaper buy, and their infiltrate and mobility can be used to jet towards the opponents back edge on turn 1, making them even juicier bait. I believe the key to using this formation will be understanding which of these units to use or combine together to bait the specific army you are against. I can think of too many scenarios to get into now myself.

The next key to the outflank list is having the long range fire power to force you're opponent to come to you. You have to draw out the enemy force so that when the outflankers arrive they can consolidate their fire on one section of the enemy's army that has either the best chance at turning our lines, or those sections that have the least potential to inflict return damage. Basically, you have to think of the list as a null deploy counter strike. The biggest strength of this style, and what seperates it from deep strike heavy lists is the precision deployment of the pos relays over deep striking. Believe me when I say it makes a huge difference. It is not difficult for us to have all four board edges viable for deployment, and indeed this style of list should have enough redundencies of pos relays to ensure it always has that option.

Anyway, perhaps posting the sample list I was considering building for tourneys will help with understanding my ramblings on this subject.

Tau Empire CAD - 1188

HQ- Darkstrider
Fast- Pathfinder x4 w/3 railrifles
Fast- Pathfinder x4 w/2 railrifles
Troop- Kroot x10
Troop- Kroot x10
Elite- Iontide w/ewos
Elite- Burstide w/ vt
LOW- Stormsurge w/ ewos, shield gen

Infiltration Cadre - 427pts

Stealth suits x3 w/ pos relay (1)
Stealth suits x3 w/ pos relay (1)
Pathfinder x4 w/ x2 ion rifles
Pathfinder x4 w/ x2 ion rifles
Pathfinder x4 w/ x2 ion rifles
Piranha w/ fusion

Drone Net - 224pts

Marker Drones x4
Marker Drones x4
Marker Drones x4
Marker Drones x4

Total - 1839pts

With this list you have three parts, the bait (most likely Piranha or Stealth team. I would keep at least one Stealth team in reserve for that relay), the firebase, and the ambush party.

The bait depends on the enemy. The firebase can either start on the table with the markers if needed, but most likely you gave up first turn or your opponent opted to take it, so you null deploy and force the bait kill. In this case your opponent will not have a focal point to charge his troops at, and my experience is that he will either play safe and stay huddled up, allowing you to deploy your firebase with the best ratio for damage out vs damage in, or he will committ to storming at your deployment zone in a more spread out fashion trying to secure as many objectives as he can early on. In this case you concentrate everything on one section of his army and deal a crippling blow that leaves them playing catch up the rest of the game.

Now the outflankers' role is one of two things. First, they can make a play for a backfield firebase of the enemy. This ideally cause your opponent to redirect movement towards his own backfield, weakening the push he was making for your firebase and pulling his force in two on YOUR terms, and losing usefulness that turn of the units thus redirected.

Second, and I found this was more often the case, I would use them to outflank on my strong table side, helping the firebase crush the front most threatening units. This ideally leaves my opponents with a crippled charge into a now much larger and closely concentrated force. "Turning the Flank" as described by Jancoran earlier. Never used pathfinders in this role before, but I've used 40 Kroot to do it plenty.

I feel this tactic has a strong potential for competative play. It won't out shoot the strongest of lists, but it has the tools and tricks for an extremely accurate counter strike. Pathfinders in this list perform the role of crisis suits, with a more precise method of attacking those exploitable points in your opponents army, at the trade off of being less mobile and resilient after their strike.

I feel that the options for army building are more abundant than ever before, and all armies are still experimenting with the new format of 7th. I remember the days of 3rd edition (when I started) and the multitude of deployment techniques used by various armies. Drop guard, turn 1 attack genestealers, infiltrating havoc squad lists, "ninja" tau where the game was won or lost on your 4th turn drop.... I feel we have been stuck in napoleonic warfare mode since 5th, but if GW keeps writing formations like this, I can see these lists beginning to turn that boring style of play around. One can only hope...

First of all, my applause., this is a good looking list. While I go about the Markerlights a different way, this looks pretty decent.

I'll tell you what I like about it: it goes everywhere it wants to. There is no quadrant you wont contest, no Line Breaking Objectives you can't get from Maelstroms and the "Surprise! You're dead!" aspect of it appeals to me greatly.

The Kroot would be better if you put a Recon drone in those Pathfinder Squads. Its just an incredible asset to be able to bring Kroot onto the enemy's long board edge. I think Id rather have that than the Stealthsuits because it gives you the two wound, T4, 4+ armored thing between your Pathfinders and the bolter shots but it also actually shoots a Burst Cannon to boot. Pretty good return but mainly it maximizes the deployment shenanigans. Stealth suits are then free to do their thing and range free.

.DarkStrider is definitely awesome to fill a CAD HQ choice for the force. Relatively Cheap, synergizes well (albeit I have to say, less so when the Pathfinder units are as small as yours but still good) and if you even care, fluffy.

Null-Tastic list as well which is super cool.

 Jancoran wrote:

 luke1705 wrote:
Looks to me like you could get a hunter cadre with minor tweaking. I might try that over the CAD for more efficient markerlights, especially since your markerlights don't have any added durability. Once they're gone, they're gone

Onjective Secured is better in my opinion. I hate not having it. Especially in a list like this where deployment shenanigans are the soup du jour.

Agreed. I forgot to mention that the Marker formation outflanks as well, so in total 13 outflanking units, with 2 MCs and a GMC that push forward to meet them. As said, my experience was almost always a side flank, with any rear edge deployments focused on that strong side, enveloping those forward assault units. Mind you this was mostly in 6th w/ the 50% rule, and I lost most games but never by more than 4. Always found that to be a good thing actually, In those days I used stealth squads w/ fusions and markers in place of finders. The hardest part was keeping enough of that initial 50% squads alive to influence the fight, although that list has mass infiltrate, which was a different story. This new "null deployment" option is very cool, IMHO.

 Jancoran wrote:

spacelord321 wrote:
Hello, all. I'm new to the forum but have lurked for years. I played a lot of 6th but only a bit of 7th, before rage quitting due to old serpent spam. I played mainly mech list, as that's what I have painted, and the old serpent shield made half of my list almost useless.

I am re-entering the hobby and have decided to paint up a new army for the summer-fall tourney scene in NE USA. As I own 2 unopened riptides and two unopened pathfinder boxes, I've decided to base the army around the finders, as the riptide wing is almost an auto include in tough tourneys. As is the surge, imho.

So I've been putting quite a bit of thought into how to get the most out of 20 finders, and Darkstrider, since he doesn't get much love.

First, a bit of background on my attempts at outflanking lists. I started toying with pos relay gimmick outflank lists in 6th, and while I found them fun, and my opponents did as well, the 50% on board at start rule crippled the playstyle. Then seventh came along and I found a new interest in it, as that rule was removed. Unfortunately, I found that the reserve rolls still could make or break the game for me, so I felt it just wasn't a tourney level style of play. Granted , my local meta had yet to embrace mealstrom, so the strength of shifty scoring units went unreallized.

Now enter the new infiltration cadre formation. This formation has given this playstyle a huge boost. It remains to be seen how clever opponents decide to deal with that first turn, as I haven't seen anyone trying it yet in batreps.

So, if using this formation, I feel one should have a very heavy amount of reserves (obviously), to justify the cost. That said, luckily five of the six units in the formation have the ability to outflank. Also, those same units all have the option to take pos relays, so there should be at least one or two in there. I like the stealths, as it's a cheaper buy, and their infiltrate and mobility can be used to jet towards the opponents back edge on turn 1, making them even juicier bait. I believe the key to using this formation will be understanding which of these units to use or combine together to bait the specific army you are against. I can think of too many scenarios to get into now myself.

The next key to the outflank list is having the long range fire power to force you're opponent to come to you. You have to draw out the enemy force so that when the outflankers arrive they can consolidate their fire on one section of the enemy's army that has either the best chance at turning our lines, or those sections that have the least potential to inflict return damage. Basically, you have to think of the list as a null deploy counter strike. The biggest strength of this style, and what seperates it from deep strike heavy lists is the precision deployment of the pos relays over deep striking. Believe me when I say it makes a huge difference. It is not difficult for us to have all four board edges viable for deployment, and indeed this style of list should have enough redundencies of pos relays to ensure it always has that option.

Anyway, perhaps posting the sample list I was considering building for tourneys will help with understanding my ramblings on this subject.

Tau Empire CAD - 1188

HQ- Darkstrider
Fast- Pathfinder x4 w/3 railrifles
Fast- Pathfinder x4 w/2 railrifles
Troop- Kroot x10
Troop- Kroot x10
Elite- Iontide w/ewos
Elite- Burstide w/ vt
LOW- Stormsurge w/ ewos, shield gen

Infiltration Cadre - 427pts

Stealth suits x3 w/ pos relay (1)
Stealth suits x3 w/ pos relay (1)
Pathfinder x4 w/ x2 ion rifles
Pathfinder x4 w/ x2 ion rifles
Pathfinder x4 w/ x2 ion rifles
Piranha w/ fusion

Drone Net - 224pts

Marker Drones x4
Marker Drones x4
Marker Drones x4
Marker Drones x4

Total - 1839pts

With this list you have three parts, the bait (most likely Piranha or Stealth team. I would keep at least one Stealth team in reserve for that relay), the firebase, and the ambush party.

The bait depends on the enemy. The firebase can either start on the table with the markers if needed, but most likely you gave up first turn or your opponent opted to take it, so you null deploy and force the bait kill. In this case your opponent will not have a focal point to charge his troops at, and my experience is that he will either play safe and stay huddled up, allowing you to deploy your firebase with the best ratio for damage out vs damage in, or he will committ to storming at your deployment zone in a more spread out fashion trying to secure as many objectives as he can early on. In this case you concentrate everything on one section of his army and deal a crippling blow that leaves them playing catch up the rest of the game.

Now the outflankers' role is one of two things. First, they can make a play for a backfield firebase of the enemy. This ideally cause your opponent to redirect movement towards his own backfield, weakening the push he was making for your firebase and pulling his force in two on YOUR terms, and losing usefulness that turn of the units thus redirected.

Second, and I found this was more often the case, I would use them to outflank on my strong table side, helping the firebase crush the front most threatening units. This ideally leaves my opponents with a crippled charge into a now much larger and closely concentrated force. "Turning the Flank" as described by Jancoran earlier. Never used pathfinders in this role before, but I've used 40 Kroot to do it plenty.

I feel this tactic has a strong potential for competative play. It won't out shoot the strongest of lists, but it has the tools and tricks for an extremely accurate counter strike. Pathfinders in this list perform the role of crisis suits, with a more precise method of attacking those exploitable points in your opponents army, at the trade off of being less mobile and resilient after their strike.

I feel that the options for army building are more abundant than ever before, and all armies are still experimenting with the new format of 7th. I remember the days of 3rd edition (when I started) and the multitude of deployment techniques used by various armies. Drop guard, turn 1 attack genestealers, infiltrating havoc squad lists, "ninja" tau where the game was won or lost on your 4th turn drop.... I feel we have been stuck in napoleonic warfare mode since 5th, but if GW keeps writing formations like this, I can see these lists beginning to turn that boring style of play around. One can only hope...

First of all, my applause., this is a good looking list. While I go about the Markerlights a different way, this looks pretty decent.

I'll tell you what I like about it: it goes everywhere it wants to. There is no quadrant you wont contest, no Line Breaking Objectives you can't get from Maelstroms and the "Surprise! You're dead!" aspect of it appeals to me greatly.

The Kroot would be better if you put a Recon drone in those Pathfinder Squads. Its just an incredible asset to be able to bring Kroot onto the enemy's long board edge. I think Id rather have that than the Stealthsuits because it gives you the two wound, T4, 4+ armored thing between your Pathfinders and the bolter shots but it also actually shoots a Burst Cannon to boot. Pretty good return but mainly it maximizes the deployment shenanigans. Stealth suits are then free to do their thing and range free.

.DarkStrider is definitely awesome to fill a CAD HQ choice for the force. Relatively Cheap, synergizes well (albeit I have to say, less so when the Pathfinder units are as small as yours but still good) and if you even care, fluffy.

Null-Tastic list as well which is super cool.

Thank You. My second list aside, this is my playstyle, and what I would bring to the table against friends. Haven't played since early seventh, and I had just added in a riptide in my last three games. Yep, played through all of 6th with no tide! I have two now, but I haven't gotten the surge yet, however.

I could definitely see adding in a recon drone if that is your flavor. It all depends on how many you think you would need, and which units you would be using for the bait. The bait dynamics alone sets my mind awhirl! Do I start a ion finder squad in the open within rapid fire range of an easy target, shove my piranha up the tailpipe of the closest vehicle, infiltrate my stealths in a suicide spot but with aim on the command squad? It goes on...

As for the finders, I kind of plan on them being sacrificial, although I will certainly try to keep them alive. As for Darkstrider, if he survives return fire I would leap frog him around the 5 finder squads for the rest of the game. I think a much better choice would be to lose that 3rd rifle and strider and put in an ethereal and a 3rd 10 man kroot squad. Sure you're going to give up that fishpriest point, but after how many turns of him casting stubborn on 50 outflanking infantry?

Interesting list to say the least. Let me us know you perform(pics etc. Greatly appreciated!)

I thought you said you wanted to add a riptidewing, and seems you are one riptide short. Did you forget are didnt do it deliberately?

Also look at ghostkeelwing. Are you units have bad saves, maybe with stealth bubkle you create a more durable list?

spacelord321 wrote:

Thank You. My second list aside, this is my playstyle, and what I would bring to the table against friends. Haven't played since early seventh, and I had just added in a riptide in my last three games. Yep, played through all of 6th with no tide! I have two now, but I haven't gotten the surge yet, however.

I could definitely see adding in a recon drone if that is your flavor. It all depends on how many you think you would need, and which units you would be using for the bait. The bait dynamics alone sets my mind awhirl! Do I start a ion finder squad in the open within rapid fire range of an easy target, shove my piranha up the tailpipe of the closest vehicle, infiltrate my stealths in a suicide spot but with aim on the command squad? It goes on...

As for the finders, I kind of plan on them being sacrificial, although I will certainly try to keep them alive. As for Darkstrider, if he survives return fire I would leap frog him around the 5 finder squads for the rest of the game. I think a much better choice would be to lose that 3rd rifle and strider and put in an ethereal and a 3rd 10 man kroot squad. Sure you're going to give up that fishpriest point, but after how many turns of him casting stubborn on 50 outflanking infantry?

You will need those Rail Rifles. Especially since you don't put EMP on them. The lone Piranha being eployed...and nothing else.... is a delicious option as i mentioned. I might think about a fusion blaster on the Stealth Suits btw.

I love Aun'Va but his ability would be kind of wasted on 5 man squads. Theres a reason i take bigger ones. =). So I think you're fine. MAIN worry is always that a unit wont do its job when called upon. So dont be shy with those Rail Rifles.

arthorn wrote:
Interesting list to say the least. Let me us know you perform(pics etc. Greatly appreciated!)

I thought you said you wanted to add a riptidewing, and seems you are one riptide short. Did you forget are didnt do it deliberately?

Also look at ghostkeelwing. Are you units have bad saves, maybe with stealth bubkle you create a more durable list?

I may just do some batreps once I get back to the table officially. Right now I'm buckled down building and buying that second list to get it ready for tourney play, which I prefer.

I had a version w/ a 4 tide wing at the expense of the SS, but I'm pretty set on buying the surge and now don't plan on buying more than 3 non FW tides.

The ghostkeel wing would be an interesting twist to the list, but in that case I would lose the surge to squeeze it in. That's actually an even more thematic "ambush" list, and would be awesome for a next project, as I am pretty much a Tau supremacist, and my current project won't use all those dang unpainted kroot I've had laying around for years.

That list really has my gears turning. I love the concept. I'm concerned that your mobility will be a bit limited once you come on from the edge and that your reserves manipulation - specifically your outflank manipulation - is a bit lacking to throw together a concentrated force on the desired side. I also worry that your performance against marines (MSU, deathstars, etc.) will be mediocre, given the dearth of low-AP fire. That said, I'm impressed with the amount of mobile firepower you packed into the list. The mobility and outflanking potential are great. I honestly wouldn't change a whole lot with the list. Maybe switch around some upgrades or something, but it sounds like a ton of fun to play with.

I'm considering doing something similar with Crisis Suits as the fire base and a bit of extra obsec. I think you could improve your damage output and mobility a bit but perhaps at the cost of a little durability. It'd be an interesting change.

Piranha Fire stream of 5 total models alpha struck an imperial Knight for first blood today..

It was glorious

 Grizzyzz wrote:
Piranha Fire stream of 5 total models alpha struck an imperial Knight for first blood today..

It was glorious

Fusion Blasters go in... Imperial Knight innards come out.

 Jancoran wrote:

 Grizzyzz wrote:
Piranha Fire stream of 5 total models alpha struck an imperial Knight for first blood today..

It was glorious

Fusion Blasters go in... Imperial Knight innards come out.

That would work too I just used seeker misslws haha

Which books do I need to get access to all the Tau formations? Does anyone have a link to formations-by-book, or perhaps wouldn't mind listing them?

Asura Varuna wrote:
Which books do I need to get access to all the Tau formations? Does anyone have a link to formations-by-book, or perhaps wouldn't mind listing them?

Tau Codex -- Hunter Contingent and Auxiliaries (most notably, Optimized stealth cadre)
Kauyon -- Tau Codex + Tidewall rules

Farsight Supplement -- Dawn Blade Contingent and Auxiliaries (most notably, piranha firestream, drone net)
Montka -- FSE Supp + Riptide Wing + Ghostkeel Wing

Hello all,

So I basically have played Warhammer off and on forever. (Since 3rd edition, not literally forever) and I have recently decided to get back into it after one of my friends re-introduced me. I'm not really familiar with some of the changes that they've made, and I don't know any armies rules anymore except Tau because I bought their books. I made an army list for 1850 and I'd like to know how it would work, if at all. Forgive me if I made mistakes making this list, because I used Battlescribe. (Also this is my first post here. Hello all.)

Combined Arms Tau (Farsight Enclaves)

HQ
-Commander
--Drone Controller
--2x Markerlight Drones

Troops
-XV8 Crisis Battlesuit
--Drone Controller
--2x Markerlight Drones

-XV8 Crisis Battlesuit
--Drone Controller
--2x Markerlight Drones

Heavy Support
-TX7 Hammerhead Gunship
--Longstrike
--Railgun /w Submunitions
--Twin Linked Smart Missile Sponsons

--TX7 Hammerhead Gunship
--Railgun /w Submunitions
--Twin Linked Smart Missile Sponsons


Retaliation Cadre
-Broadside Team
--Bonding Knife
--Broadside Battlesuit
---Twin Linked Heavy Rail Rifle
---Velocity Tracker
---Twin Linked Plasma Rifle

--Broadside Battlesuit
---Twin Linked Heavy Rail Rifle
---Velocity Tracker
---Twin Linked Plasma Rifle

-Commander
--Talisman of Arthas Moloch
--Fusion Blaster
--Plasma Rifle
--Target Lock
--Drone Controller
--2x Markerlight Drones

-Riptide Battlesuits
--Riptide Shas'vre
--Ion Accelerator
--Stimulant Injector
--Twin Linked Plasma Rifle
--Bonding Knife

(Instead of copy + pasting this three times, there are 3 units of battlesuits all equipped the same)
-XV8 Crisis Battlesuits
--XV8
---Cyclic Ion Blaster
---Cyclic Ion Blaster
---Target Lock
---2x Markerlight Drones
---Bonding Knife
--XV8
---Fusion Blaster
---Fusion Blaster
---Target Lock
---2x Markerlight Drones
---Bonding Knife
--XV8
---Cyclic Ion Blaster
---Fusion Blaster
---Target Lock
---2x Markerlight Drones
---Bonding Knife

This all comes out to exactly 1850 points.


So basically the plan of this list is the entire formation will low altitude deploy right next to whatever the highest value target on the table is, and hopefully using their drop site clear that they get murderize some stuff and cripple the other player. After that it's kind of winging it, jetpacking around and whatever. I guess I kinda took the Mont'ka strategy to heart after I read the books. I realize that an army that deep strikes a lot of stuff is sort of strong against this because the initial strike will not have the impact I want, but that's why I will try to cede the first turn to the opponent so they have as much time on table as possible before my army deploys.

I've never really tested this strat on anyone, but I have played a very small version of it vs friends and I did pretty well, but I don't know if that's because they're bad or my strategy is sound. Help is appreciated.

EDIT: I thought I should say that I put Target Locks on all the battlesuits because they are a unit with the drones, and so the 'unit' (drones) will shoot a target, and then the battlesuits can target something else (Or multiple other things, if needed) while at the same time the unit is helping the army take down priority targets with markerlights. Also the initial core is just so I have units on the field on turn 1 because I have been told that if I have nothing on the field on turn 1 then I automatically lose. (I have not researched this, and I don't have my book with me to look it up. Also they are for extra markerlights so they can remain useful)

The shooting phase will look something like core units (Markerlights), Commander (Markerlight, Targets TEQ units), XV8 teams (More markerlights, other small/insignificant units and/or light vehicles, potentially also burns markers), Riptide (TEQ units, priority MEQ units, burns markers), Hammerheads (Vehicles, submunitions on light infantry if no vehicles exist, burns markers), Broadsides (Air units, vehicles, TEQ units, burns markers)

Sicarioos wrote:
...

Per forum rules we can't list specific wargear points values.. so I would remove those Generally points aren't really needed anyway except for the total you have and what you are aiming for (say you have 1700/1850 and are looking for some help.. for example)..

I haven't read the list yet but I will give it a read.

I have a fun one, what do people recommend to take down a heirophant bio titan, with no storm surges, or supremacy armor. I had the fun of dealing with one of those at a tournament.

oz of the north wrote:
I have a fun one, what do people recommend to take down a heirophant bio titan, with no storm surges, or supremacy armor. I had the fun of dealing with one of those at a tournament.

depends on your list.. don't recall the exact stats of the guy... but I would consider HYMP broadsides with a buffcommander attached (atleast with puretide for Monster hunter). Other options include riptide wing with 1 or more HBC, nova them .. say you had 2 .. thats 48 s6 rending shots one turn... that could really lay some hurt. A plasma/fusion team could do well also.

oz of the north wrote:
I have a fun one, what do people recommend to take down a heirophant bio titan, with no storm surges, or supremacy armor. I had the fun of dealing with one of those at a tournament.

They're actually not that bad. Yes, it does have 2+ armor, is T9 and has a ton of wounds. It also is 1,000 points, and could be 1250 or more if they have it transporting anything.

What you get for those points, however, is incredibly lackluster. A single imperial knight or wraithknight could easily kill it in hand to hand, and massed grav will end its day (even without the hunter's eye). It only has a 6+ invuln.

For us, the stormsurge and it's D is the answer. Maybe a ton of fusion pihrannas with seeker missiles. But it would take a lot. The HBC riptide wing would do some work for sure, especially because the hierophant can't kill a tide until combat (only guns are AP 3). The upside is that all wounds are rending. The downside is that to be really effective, you would need monster hunter....don't believe you can get that on a riptide wing.

If you don't want to do that, do what has been happening ever since the dawn of war - if you can't kill it, ignore it. Tau have more mobility than you think with their jet pack moves, and I have literally never seen a hierophant make its points back (that includes my hierophant, so that is especially sad haha)


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Grizzyzz wrote:

oz of the north wrote:
I have a fun one, what do people recommend to take down a heirophant bio titan, with no storm surges, or supremacy armor. I had the fun of dealing with one of those at a tournament.

depends on your list.. don't recall the exact stats of the guy... but I would consider HYMP broadsides with a buffcommander attached (atleast with puretide for Monster hunter). Other options include riptide wing with 1 or more HBC, nova them .. say you had 2 .. thats 48 s6 rending shots one turn... that could really lay some hurt. A plasma/fusion team could do well also.

You can pretty reliably assume that you're going to nova with those bad boys....should be putting out 72 shots the turn they double fire

EDIT I can read haha. But I think that unless you have zero stormsurges, the HBC are far superior to the ion accelerator in a riptide wing. If you can consistently nova, they are brutal

I dont even think that a riptide wing would be able to kill one. Wounding on 6s and its fnp, also the ability to move 24 inches a turn it would be able to just run down a riptide wing and crush in combat.

 luke1705 wrote:

You can pretty reliably assume that you're going to nova with those bad boys....should be putting out 72 shots the turn they double fire

EDIT I can read haha. But I think that unless you have zero stormsurges, the HBC are far superior to the ion accelerator in a riptide wing. If you can consistently nova, they are brutal

So if you ran a rip wing with three HBC, would you run them with SMS ??? I was actually putting a list together and was thinking:
- HBC, SMS, VT
- HBC, SMS, VT
- HBC, SMS, VT

If i run up against a horde.. i can opt to ripple fire for 48 SMS missles + however many HBC shots (48?)

Plus I deny flying circus demons and Nids or this 5 stormtalon formation I have seen more often now.

If they have a ton of TEQ or AV, then i nova up all my HBCs and as you said.. unleash 72 rending shots downfield.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

oz of the north wrote:
I dont even think that a riptide wing would be able to kill one. Wounding on 6s and its fnp, also the ability to move 24 inches a turn it would be able to just run down a riptide wing and crush in combat.

Assuming BS5.. your doing 3.33 wounds turn you double fire. But that is exactly average. you potentially could do worse.. but more likely your going to do better. Before FNP.. your dealing 10 rending wounds.. so if he rolls bad he is gone right there..

oz of the north wrote:
I dont even think that a riptide wing would be able to kill one. Wounding on 6s and its fnp, also the ability to move 24 inches a turn it would be able to just run down a riptide wing and crush in combat.

It kind of depends,

Most WKs in the competitive scene aren't running with a shield, so if they aren't in cover any 6 will only have to pass the FNP.

with hailfire you should on average roll around 7-8 rending, and wound another 16 times with the burst cannons, and another 4-5 wounds with the SMS.

so around 7-8 5+ FNP rolls and then 20 3+ 5++

comes down to rolling but the WK could certainly die if left out of cover.

Sheit27 wrote:

oz of the north wrote:
I dont even think that a riptide wing would be able to kill one. Wounding on 6s and its fnp, also the ability to move 24 inches a turn it would be able to just run down a riptide wing and crush in combat.

It kind of depends,

Most WKs in the competitive scene aren't running with a shield, so if they aren't in cover any 6 will only have to pass the FNP.

with hailfire you should on average roll around 7-8 rending, and wound another 16 times with the burst cannons, and another 4-5 wounds with the SMS.

so around 7-8 5+ FNP rolls and then 20 3+ 5++

comes down to rolling but the WK could certainly die if left out of cover.

I was talking about the biotitan, not the WK. Not being able to take one of those down without bringing some sort of str D weaponry.

How many wounds it has?

Riptides with IA seems like the go-to choice here due to S7AP2 shots, but perhaps plasma crisis are a better fit. they die more easily, but get far more shots of at the same pricerange, that wound on the same 6 and same AP2.

Snipers also wound on 6s, and being sniper a wound of 6 is AP2, making sniper drones and sniper kroot an interesting prospect.

A bio titan has 10 wounds and fnp and regeneration, so super fnp on a 4+.