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 =Angel= wrote:

 sfshilo wrote:

Everyone forgets that plasma pistols are cc weapons, the 5 points is because you can get +1 Attack when combined with another cc weapon.....

No-one is forgetting. A laspistol is free, a bolt pistol is one point and they do the same thing. A plasma pistol is not 14 points better than a bolt pistol.
You get +1 attack when combined with a non specialist weapon- a powerfist, for example would not gain +1 attack.
We're mostly talking about s3, ws3 attacks here.

Plasmaguns are explicitly better in most situations because that extra 12 inches of range or that extra S7 AP2 shot will do more than walking up to the enemy and hitting them with the butt will.

A Plasma Pistol is significantly better than a Laspistol or Bolt Pistol, certainly 14 pts worth. The problem isn't with the pistol, its with the gun. Plasma Pistols are 15pts in all the Marine codexes as well, but Plasmaguns are also 15pts.

Genestealers can take scything talons for 4pts. The purpose? Despite having 4 arms by default, they only have one set of rending claws listed in their profile - therefore swapping one set of claws for the strictly worse scytals somehow makes them better in CC...

 Deadshot wrote:

Traditio wrote:
Honor guard have the option to replace their bolt pistols with a close combat weapon. Ruleswise, it doesn't really make sense.

Chapter Champions do, not Honour Guard, and its an option purely because the Chapter Champion model is the UM one that comes with Calgar, which has a power sword and combat blade. The option exists purely to make that model legal as is.

Actually, that is a great option as you can replace the champion's power sword with a hammer then swap out his boltgun for the CCW. You still get +1A.

 Tactical_Spam wrote:

 Deadshot wrote:

Traditio wrote:
Honor guard have the option to replace their bolt pistols with a close combat weapon. Ruleswise, it doesn't really make sense.

Chapter Champions do, not Honour Guard, and its an option purely because the Chapter Champion model is the UM one that comes with Calgar, which has a power sword and combat blade. The option exists purely to make that model legal as is.

Actually, that is a great option as you can replace the champion's power sword with a hammer then swap out his boltgun for the CCW. You still get +1A.

But only when wielding his Bolt Pistol and CCW, in which case you only just gone and paid 15pts on top of the 15 built into the unit to not use that weapon.

I should say, this is more a -lack- of option then one.

Landraiders can't take dozer blades (or get an equivalent rule).

So my hulking behemoth of a tank gets stuck going over a bit of rubble, but that rhino is a-ok. I don't even.

Razorbacks (the base version) costing +20 over a rhino for a TL HB, -4 transport cap, no repair rule, no firing points.

Honour guard can't take jump-packs, but can take bikes.

Combat shields, always pointless imo.

and finally, the existence of the Space Marine Hunter, when the Stalker is just better in every way (the missile launcher on top looks ridiculous also).

Anything which can have soulfright from tge dark eldar dex. S1 blast no ap that forces a ld test and wounds on the diffrence if failed. BUT does not work on fearless and imp marines all for the low price of 15 points. (The real kicker is this replaces assault and defence grenades for the unit same name diffrent effect).

Izural wrote:
I should say, this is more a -lack- of option then one.

Landraiders can't take dozer blades (or get an equivalent rule).

So my hulking behemoth of a tank gets stuck going over a bit of rubble, but that rhino is a-ok. I don't even.

Razorbacks (the base version) costing +20 over a rhino for a TL HB, -4 transport cap, no repair rule, no firing points.

Honour guard can't take jump-packs, but can take bikes.

Combat shields, always pointless imo.

and finally, the existence of the Space Marine Hunter, when the Stalker is just better in every way (the missile launcher on top looks ridiculous also).

chaos land raiders can (str 10 Ram!).... and they said chaos raiders were the bad ones. Must be tricky exiting thru the front assault ramp though!

Perhaps not quite the intent of this thread, but it amuses me that Njal Stormcaller is the only Marine that doesn't trade up his bolt pistol for a storm bolter when he puts on Terminator armour.