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Chad Warden wrote:
this release seems a bit pointless, if you must do Khorne surely something like flesh hounds would sell far more?
or at least do things from the starter set that dont have individual models (though they may be coming too)

Slaughterpriests were a big seller. One of the few AoS things to actually have gone "Temporarily Out of Stock". It makes sense that they and the Exalted Deathbringers would get another model, if only because those two units are mandatory in quite a few Bloodbound formations and it helps to have some "alternate" sculpts/profiles out there.

The only Aspiring Deathbringer right now is Finecast, so a plastic kit was inevitable.

Flesh Hounds I'm genuinely surprised we haven't seen released in plastic, but they're not a Bloodbound thing aside from as a 'weapon' for an Exalted Lord of Khorne. They're Daemon units; whenever we see Daemons get something done to them I wouldn't be shocked to see a plastic Flesh Hound kit show up.


Regarding Grand Alliance: Order...
Remember that this is following the pattern of Grand Alliance: Chaos. It consists of things we already have(Stormcast Eternals, Extremis, Sylvaneth being their own faction now, and likely Fyreslayers) PLUS Legacy stuff that isn't going away or is being renamed/split off from their main bit(Dark Elves getting Blood Cults, High Elves getting Phoenix Temple, etc).

I wonder if we will get a cross format demon release to coincide with Fenris part 2. It seems that the beasts and the remaining greater demons are the last things that need plastic, unless they start creating some new ones. Despite the change to a weekly format, there still seems to be one major release a month. Jan- fyreslayers, Feb- spacewolves, March- deathwatch, April Orruks etc. New demon plastics probably merit their own month.

 streetsamurai wrote:
You'd have to be blind to not see the similitudes between stormcast and marines. Are they exactly similar. No, But they are obviously inspired by them, in fluff and in appearance (the "first smiting" thing was the straw that broke the camel back for me.

I think we can agree in essence: Space Marines are super space sci fi knights in full plate armor, and Stormcast Eternals are super fantasy magic knights in full plate armor. The similarities between the two exist because they both share a common design basis - late medieval knights in plate armor. The original Rogue Trader beakie marine is straight up a guy in full plate armor with a houndskull bascinet, a 2000AD jet pack, and a space gun.

The Stormcast Eternals are bipedal, wear uniforms, use weapons, and tend to be victorious over their foes, which gives them the same number of equivalencies to Space Marines as, say, Napoleonic British line infantry.

But even then, objectively, Stormcast Eternals have more in common with Titans in Greek mythology than they do with Space Marines. This incorrect conflation occurs because it is erroneously repeated so often, including here (e.g., this forum's own moderators calling Stormdrakes "Space Mariness [riding] dragons"), which is unfortunate.

nb: if the mods feel this post, and the several last pages of posts, such as the overwhelming majority of posts in this N&R thread, are all offtopic spam, please feel free to move the discussion

The comparison between Stormcast Eternals and Space Marines merits its own thread, probably in the AoS General Discussion sub-forum. Further comments on the subject posted here will be deleted as off-topic. Thanks!

 Kanluwen wrote:

Regarding Grand Alliance: Order...
Remember that this is following the pattern of Grand Alliance: Chaos. It consists of things we already have(Stormcast Eternals, Extremis, Sylvaneth being their own faction now, and likely Fyreslayers) PLUS Legacy stuff that isn't going away or is being renamed/split off from their main bit(Dark Elves getting Blood Cults, High Elves getting Phoenix Temple, etc).

Were any units/factions/armies/models axed in the Grand Alliance (Unded/Chaos) books? If not I believe that every model will get a profile.

That said I really hope the elves get new units and style, because especially the High Elves (and Dark Elves to an extent) units were very tied with Ulthuan and its Kingdoms fluffwise...

I mean Dragon Princes without Caledor? White Lions without a Phoenix King to guard? It just feels wrong... :(

 Siegfried VII wrote:
Were any units/factions/armies/models axed in the Grand Alliance (Unded/Chaos) books? If not I believe that every model will get a profile.

Does dropping the entire Tomb Kings line count?

 Siegfried VII wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Regarding Grand Alliance: Order...
Remember that this is following the pattern of Grand Alliance: Chaos. It consists of things we already have(Stormcast Eternals, Extremis, Sylvaneth being their own faction now, and likely Fyreslayers) PLUS Legacy stuff that isn't going away or is being renamed/split off from their main bit(Dark Elves getting Blood Cults, High Elves getting Phoenix Temple, etc).

Were any units/factions/armies/models axed in the Grand Alliance (Unded/Chaos) books? If not I believe that every model will get a profile.

Off the top of my head, several characters(Galrauch, Throgg immediately spring to mind) were removed from Chaos. I don't know for sure regarding the units.
Death lost the entirety of the Tomb Kings.

That said I really hope the elves get new units and style, because especially the High Elves (and Dark Elves to an extent) units were very tied with Ulthuan and its Kingdoms fluffwise...
I mean Dragon Princes without Caledor? White Lions without a Phoenix King to guard? It just feels wrong... :(

White Lions weren't just the guardians of the Phoenix King. They also guarded his envoys, his chosen generals, etc.
Dragon Princes without Caledor...eh. One of the pictures in the leak was definitely Dragon Princes in a massed cavalry charge.

We DO know that Aelves are getting new factions. We've had one namedropped, the Shadowkin dwelling in Ulgu(Realm of Shadow), who are led by Malerion(Malekith reborn).
We've also been given information that names Tyrion as the new God of Light with Teclis as his blind high priest.
Then of course we know that Alarielle is now the Avatar of Life and has the Sylvaneth.

This new book is definitely an auto-buy for me, and probably for a whole lot of other people, once you factor in all those who had Empire, High/Wood/Dark Elves, Lizardmen (who presumably will be included?) and Dwarves. My High Elf army has been rebased and is nearly fully painted, so I'm keen to find out both what changes have happened to them, and also what kinds of stuff to expect going forward.

 Siegfried VII wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Regarding Grand Alliance: Order...
Remember that this is following the pattern of Grand Alliance: Chaos. It consists of things we already have(Stormcast Eternals, Extremis, Sylvaneth being their own faction now, and likely Fyreslayers) PLUS Legacy stuff that isn't going away or is being renamed/split off from their main bit(Dark Elves getting Blood Cults, High Elves getting Phoenix Temple, etc).

Were any units/factions/armies/models axed in the Grand Alliance (Unded/Chaos) books? If not I believe that every model will get a profile.

Did you seriously miss the Tomb Kings getting squatted?!

On top of that, lots of Death special characters were made generic (Krell is just a Wight Lord, Konrad, Vlad, and Isabella are all generic Vampire Lords, etc.). On the Chaos side, Forsaken and the Hellcannon were left out of the book, and again several special characters were either dropped (Galrauch, Throgg) or made generic (Sigvald, Villitch).

@Ghaz: I just checked the store and indeed Tomb Kings went "bye bye". So things do get the axe...


@Kanluwen: Hopefully we'll see some new Elven models. It's been ages as there weren't any new models in the End Times too at all.

What bothers me is the fact that when I see certain models/units they remind me directly of the old world... It's been thousands of years since its destruction, so even if the new Aelfs are direct descendants of the elves of the Old World they shoud at least have changed a bit aesthetically as well as change the names of their units/add new units ot their armies...


@Manfred von Drakken: I did not follow the Age of Sigmar new for a couple of months so yes I missed it.

So in the new Chaos Grand Alliance book there is no Hellcannon or Forsaken? Does that mean they are sort of illegal now?

Yeah, the GA books are the bridge between the Legacy Warscrolls and current 'legal' -I.e. will have a place in the Mortal Realms going forwards - units.
Expect the 'last chance to buy' section of the GW to go ape when this drops.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Siegfried VII wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Regarding Grand Alliance: Order...
Remember that this is following the pattern of Grand Alliance: Chaos. It consists of things we already have(Stormcast Eternals, Extremis, Sylvaneth being their own faction now, and likely Fyreslayers) PLUS Legacy stuff that isn't going away or is being renamed/split off from their main bit(Dark Elves getting Blood Cults, High Elves getting Phoenix Temple, etc).

Were any units/factions/armies/models axed in the Grand Alliance (Unded/Chaos) books? If not I believe that every model will get a profile.

Off the top of my head, several characters(Galrauch, Throgg immediately spring to mind) were removed from Chaos. I don't know for sure regarding the units.

In addition to characters, Skavenslaves were axed in GA:C. I believe Skaven Chieftain with BSB was cut too, but that is (sort of) a character.

 Siegfried VII wrote:
@Ghaz: I just checked the store and indeed Tomb Kings went "bye bye". So things do get the axe...


@Kanluwen: Hopefully we'll see some new Elven models. It's been ages as there weren't any new models in the End Times too at all.

What bothers me is the fact that when I see certain models/units they remind me directly of the old world... It's been thousands of years since its destruction, so even if the new Aelfs are direct descendants of the elves of the Old World they shoud at least have changed a bit aesthetically as well as change the names of their units/add new units ot their armies...


@Manfred von Drakken: I did not follow the Age of Sigmar new for a couple of months so yes I missed it.

So in the new Chaos Grand Alliance book there is no Hellcannon or Forsaken? Does that mean they are sort of illegal now?

No, legacy units are still legal. For example, all the TK units are still in the Age of Sigmar app.

 Manfred von Drakken wrote:

 Siegfried VII wrote:
@Ghaz: I just checked the store and indeed Tomb Kings went "bye bye". So things do get the axe...


@Kanluwen: Hopefully we'll see some new Elven models. It's been ages as there weren't any new models in the End Times too at all.

What bothers me is the fact that when I see certain models/units they remind me directly of the old world... It's been thousands of years since its destruction, so even if the new Aelfs are direct descendants of the elves of the Old World they shoud at least have changed a bit aesthetically as well as change the names of their units/add new units ot their armies...


@Manfred von Drakken: I did not follow the Age of Sigmar new for a couple of months so yes I missed it.

So in the new Chaos Grand Alliance book there is no Hellcannon or Forsaken? Does that mean they are sort of illegal now?

No, legacy units are still legal. For example, all the TK units are still in the Age of Sigmar app.

So far...

 Zywus wrote:

So far...

Can't find it (don't use FB) so maybe someone can chime in here, but pretty sure someone posted the other day that according to the official AoS page warscrolls will only be updated on the app, they won't get deleted.

Yes, the GW Facebook guy confirmed TK etc rules won't be going anywhere.

Chikout wrote:
I think all the factions will lose some models. Wardancers and warhawks for example. Brettonia will probably be the last faction to be axed completely.

Will we really miss the pole dancing elves though??

So the new book will have 175 warscrolls but the store currently has 264 units in Order...

Are we going to lose close to 100 units? Ouch!

That's a lot of units. Brets only have 18 in the store, so you'd be looking at losing something like all the wood elves and empire (for example) to cut that many units out.

Lots of FineCast characters and redundant listings (bleakswords, breadsticks, sidesalad etc.) that could now just be one warscroll. Probably not as dramatic a chop as those numbers would suggest.

Still saddening to think about what will be axed. Such a waste of good fluff and models.

Don't worry, it's just 100 less warscrolls until the grand alliance order volume 2 book comes out in 6 months

But how many of those 270 are just redundancies - one box that has 2+ builds all listed separately. Or special war scrolls that combine multiple models into a force?

stormboy wrote:
But how many of those 270 are just redundancies - one box that has 2+ builds all listed separately. Or special war scrolls that combine multiple models into a force?

If you can build a box into 2 units it requires 2 warscrolls. Even rebranding of special characters into generic ones requires a warscroll for each. Yeah hopefully the cuts will mostly be felt on old finecast people don't care for - there are also some multiples in the store too like multiple warrior priests that get covered under one warscroll - and then cutting the battalion boxes counts for a few of the cuts too.

Still, it's a little bit worrying as 264 to 175 is a big drop.

Gonna go ahead and make some predictions for High Elves:
High Elf Prince on Griffon
Archers
Silver Helms
Spearmen
Eltharion on Stormwing
Imrik
Tyrion
Teclis
Caradryan
Korhil
Prince Althran
Alarielle the Radiant
Alith-Anar()
Tiranoc Chariot
White Lion Chariot
White Lions
Handmaiden of the Everqueen
Repeater Bolt Thrower

High Elves go from 38 unit entries to 20 unit entries.

Also gonna throw this out there, but I think we'll see the Swordmasters, Loremaster, and Ellyrion Reavers go. Swordmasters only had a plastic kit in the Isle of Blood set, Loremaster is one of the characters with an integrated base that can't really be adjusted easily and the "subfaction" that they would belong to(Swordmasters, Teclis, Loremaster, etc would possibly be a "subfaction" of their own) being removed...I could easily see them being removed. Ellyrion Reavers have the same issue with only having been plastics in IoB.

I could POSSIBLY see Alith-Anar making a comeback whenever we get to Shadowkin, but given that he's still in metal...I don't have high hopes for him.


Y'know what, what the hell! I'm gonna do Wood Elves too as a prediction:
Waywatcher Lord
Waywatchers
Wardancers
Shadowdancer
Orion
Hunting Hounds
Sisters of Twilight on Forest Dragon
Wood Elf Glade Lord on Forest Dragon
Glade Lord on Great Stag(Who is No Longer Available now no less, and was still in metal when I bought him a few months back)
Warhawk Riders
Glade Lord on Great Eagle
Glade Riders
Glade Guard
Spellweaver
Mounted Glade Lord
Glade Lord
Great Eagles

From 23(discounting the 6 Sylvaneth entries in there) down to 6(!) entries.

Dark Elves:
Harpies
Shades
Malekith, the Witch King
Sorceress on Cold One
Dreadlord on Cold One
Shadowblade(becomes Dark Elf Assassin instead)
Reaper Bolt Thrower
Beastmaster on Manticore
Morathi
Dreadlord
Malus Darkblade
Lokhir Fellheart
Hellebron(becomes an alternate setup for a Hag Queen)
Master with Battle Standard

From 38 to 24.

Why would I keep Dreadspears, Bleakswords, and Darkshards? They actually gave them all different rules.


After reading/writing this list...it makes me feel kinda sad. But at the same time I think I might actually be on to something as I've gone from 270 down to 222.

Anyone curious about this blog post excerpt?

Large models, like the Riptide, give you plenty of space to try out imaginative paint jobs. The striking greens on this example by Panaglotis Galanis bring to mind a swamp or jungle.

If you fancy having a go at painting your own towering suit of war-armour, check out the Ghostkeel, Stormsurge and Riptide.

Tomorrow, orcs.

See you then.

 Da Boss wrote:
That's a lot of units. Brets only have 18 in the store, so you'd be looking at losing something like all the wood elves and empire (for example) to cut that many units out.

Do you realize how much of the Wood Elf range is currently metal?

Waywatchers
Waywatcher Lord
Glade Captain with Battle Standard
Glade Lord on Great Stag(No Longer Available)
Glade Lord on Great Eagle(Temporarily Out of Stock)
Wardancers
Great Eagle
Warhawk Rider
Mounted Glade Lord
Glade Lord with Bow
The Spellsinger that is kind of pulling an 'iron cross' style handhold in midair.

11 models/units that are strictly metal at this point in time.

There are 30 random items like shield packs etc. With Kanluwen's guesses that takes it down to 192. Only 17 to go! Edit just realised Kanluwen's didn't include Brettonia. That takes it to 164. That would mean Empire and Dwarfs get through the unscathed. The reality is that a few of the old characters and finecast stuff from the Empire and Dwarf lines will go. (Get you dwarf adventures now!) so Kanluwen's cuts are probably a little overzealous. All this goes to say that, the likely demise of Brettonia aside, the cuts will probably not be too bad.

Chikout wrote:
There are 30 random items like shield packs etc. With Kanluwen's guesses that takes it down to 192. Only 17 to go!

UPDATED COUNT!

I went and counted every unit entry in the Order Warscrolls section of the AoS app.

It's 253 units all told.

Take my guesses (18, 17, 14) and you're down to 204. Subtract 4 for the Lizardmen units still listed(Oxyotl, Skink Chief, Tehenhauin, and Jungle Swarms) for an even 200.

I don't think it will be as bad as people are suggesting. Chances are those models you are thinking of won't get cut, far more likely it's the models you aren't thinking of. Those ones that you see in the web store and go "oh yeah, I remember those now".

Here's what I think is getting axed out of that 270:

-Thorek Ironbrow
-High King Thorgrim
-Dwarf Adventurers
-Drunken Dwarfs
-Joseph Bugman
-We also have three Dwarf Lord options that share the same warscroll (counting as two 'lost items')
Dwarfs lose 7

-Malekith
-Morathi
-Both finecast Sorceress'
-Finecast assassin
-Individual cold one
Delves lose 6

-High Elf Battalion
-Prince Imrik
-Tyrion
-Eltharion
-Swordsmasters
-Loremaster
-Alarielle
-Prince Althran
-Handmaiden
-Alith Anar
-Hero w/Sword n Board
-Two single store entries that have multiple warscrolls
Helves lose a net 9

-sisters
-tree kin
-orion
-lord on eagle
-lord on stag
-wardancer command
-wardancers
-araloth
-great eagle
-warhawk rider
-standard bearer
-shadowdancer
-one of the spellsinger options
Welves lose 13

-empire battalion
-valtens
-engineer on steed
-marius leitdorf
-balthasar gelt
-ludwig
-kurt helborg
-luther huss
-redundent generals and priests count for 4 more
empire loses 13

-brettonia gets cut for 18

-a number of items such as warscroll compendiums, collection bundles, and paint sets are counted in that 270 (41 in fact)

Totaling that up we get 107 out of the projected loss of 95 options. Naturally I probably made a mistake or predicted incorrectly here and there, and some of those 175 warscrolls will be battalions, but looking at the list above does not give me the impression that Order is going to be gutted.