Cyclopia Cabal: Cheesing the Cabal

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**labmouse42**

https://www.frontlinegaming.org/2016/05/15/cyclopia-cabal-cheesing-the-cabal

The Cyclopia Cabal is the from the new supplement "Black Legion" A few weeks ago I saw Tsilber wreck a GT, edging first over top players like Nick Nanavanti, Kurt Clauss, Jhason Hardy and Alexander Fennell. This article describes how the use the Cabal to get the most use out of it.

Have you tried the Cabal? Have you seen it in action?
What have you found to be really useful or effective?
Could this be used to make CSM competitive in today's meta?

**whitedragon**

Your article is pretty solid, and the idea of attaching the cabal to a KDK gorepack is awesome, but is there a way to run this that doesn't murder the fluff, lol.

I was thinking a more viable way to use this formation would be to just have as many psychic shrieks as you can, so either splitting the cabal across all the units in your army, or taking the "Chosen of Abaddon" formation to deep strike fearless sorcerers with terminators, or something.

**labmouse42**

whitedragon wrote:
Your article is pretty solid, and the idea of attaching the cabal to a KDK gorepack is awesome, but is there a way to run this that doesn't murder the fluff, lol.

I know right? I makes the fluff bunny inside me cringe.

whitedragon wrote:
I was thinking a more viable way to use this formation would be to just have as many psychic shrieks as you can, so either splitting the cabal across all the units in your army, or taking the "Chosen of Abaddon" formation to deep strike fearless sorcerers with terminators, or something.

Shrieks are not bad, and I think it's the most effective power in the book today.

The nice thing is that you have the option of where to deploy the cabal. If you are facing something where you want to have lots of shrieks vs a deathstar, just deploy them differently.

**crimson_caesar**

Check out my thread on a shriek based army.

The style is more of a MSU army, and the damage output is considerably high, able to fell a WK in 4 shrieks on average. (Assuming none are denied or failed).

Defense, however is worse, relying on T6 and relying (in emergencies) on 2+ cover with far lesser close combat skills. The deathstar wins there. Just be wary of it getting clogged up by a tarpit.

**labmouse42**

crimson_caesar, have you had a chance to try a few practice games with the shriek list yet?

I would be very interested in hearing your experiences with it.
Edit : If you don't mind, I'd also like to update the article talking about using them as a shriek-squad with your experiences. I always try and go back and update my old articles when possible.

**Drakkol**

While the slaanesh sorcs running in a hound star is completely unfluffy, I do believe unmarked sorcs are a good way to represent Word Bearers finally.

I am excited to try out a mini hound star with Word Bearer unmarked sorcs. I also think Daemonology-Sanctic works with Word Bearer fluff too. I only wish we had Word Bearer rules.

**labmouse42**

Drakkol wrote:
I do believe unmarked sorcs are a good way to represent Word Bearers finally.
I also think Daemonology-Sanctic works with Word Bearer fluff too.

Why is that?

**FoxPhoenix135**

I painted my sorcerors in Black Legion colors to go with my KDK Blood Host. In my mind, if Black Legion were orchestrating a new Black Crusade, they would use KDK warbands to throw into the grinder first to prolong their own lives

A bunch of Unmarked sorcerors from the Black Legion kinda made sense in my head.

Last game I played, I used a combination of Maelific/Telepathy in my Cabal, which came out to great affect. I gave each sorceror 3 MLs, and made one sorceror Maelific and the rest Telepathy. I would use 5-6 dice to summon with on one sorceror in a cultist blob in the back, then the remainder of the pool would get spread out among the remaining psykers for shrieks and shrouding (I didn't get invisibility, darn it). I summoned about 500 points worth of units off that one sorc before he peril'd himself to death, and still had all the other sorcs for shrieking and buffing other units. I loved how it worked, probably going to make it a regular thing.

**blackmage**

where can i find cyclopean rules white dwarf? I just saw couple of PDF around the net.

**FoxPhoenix135**

blackmage wrote:
where can i find cyclopean rules white dwarf? I just saw couple of PDF around the net.

It's not a WD, it's a Black Legion supplement update.

**crimson_caesar**

labmouse42 wrote:
crimson_caesar, have you had a chance to try a few practice games with the shriek list yet?

I would be very interested in hearing your experiences with it.
Edit : If you don't mind, I'd also like to update the article talking about using them as a shriek-squad with your experiences. I always try and go back and update my old articles when possible.

Unfortunately, I am out of town for about a month and won't be able to test it until I get back. I'll make a battle report when I do. However I believe there was another another use who was going to test it, but I forget it his name.

**blackmage**

here in my country i cant play lists with demons formations+KDK formations+chaos so i dont know how fit a cabal in a competitive list, if i play a CAD i can play 1 single formation coming from that CAD and 1 allied detachment, if i play demonic incursion i cant play nothing elsewith it, so i cant buil a list like that, or i ally cabal to demons, but then i cant join any demon unit..

**labmouse42**

blackmage wrote:
or i ally cabal to demons, but then i cant join any demon unit..

Can you ally the cabal to KDK?

You might have to take more black legion if the cabal is your primary, but that will unlock the khorne dogs as an ally -- which the cabal can join.

**Captyn_Bob**

labmouse42 wrote:
blackmage wrote:
or i ally cabal to demons, but then i cant join any demon unit..
Can you ally the cabal to KDK?

You might have to take more black legion if the cabal is your primary, but that will unlock the khorne dogs as an ally -- which the cabal can join.

That's not how detachments work. Sure you can take two formations and call it an army (ofc some tournaments might have other restrictions.)

**redleger**

Im playing a list on Sunday with this and a renegade knight. 4 Sorcerers on bikes all lvl 1 all rolling telepathy. I will post up how it works out. I want a 5th sorcerer on a bike, but that's a bit off, since I just finished buying my daemon engine pack.

**whembly**

What about nurgle spawns as a cabal delivery system?

**whitedragon**

The "delivery" can be an issue, especially if you're not trying to murder the fluff. KDK gorepacks seem like the perfect way to run the Cabal and get them where they need to go. Scout + Shriek seems like a huge no brainer, but I have a different idea I'm trying to make work.

I want to run an Emperor's Children/Slaanesh style list, and Slaanesh Heralds and KoS all get access to Telepathy themselves. I was thinking of running several heralds with Seekers, and split up the Cabal to be in Rhinos of CSM's driving alongside the seekers providing support. The problem is that it gets really pricey really fast.

**blackmage**

i can use KDK but then i m afraid too few WC to make cabal real strong

**Captyn_Bob**

so, options for fast escorts..

Spawn- good (especially nurgle) but max 15 wounds
Raptors - nah, but can go to 20
KDK hounds- up to 40 wounds, fast, not super durable
BIkers - pretty versatile- only 10 wounds tho.
KDK bloodcrushers- kinda fun, but not as efficient as hounds. 27 max wounds.

Warptalons- Nooo
Possessed-nooooo

**crimson_caesar**

Bikes are especially good, as you can go forward, shriek, then turbo boost backwards into cover.

**blackmage**

KDK hounds- up to 40 wounds, fast, not super durable

well uhmmm if you cast ednurance or invisibility they are durable at all.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
i could try this
cabal
4 sorcerer bike sigil of corruption spell familiar
10 chaos cultist
5 spawn MoN

CAD
kairos
2x11 horros
3 nurglins
Tz DP wings 2 greater 1 lesser imp.robes 3°level
23 WC short of 27 points

**FoxPhoenix135**

Made a quick list with a Gorepack to theorycraft:

Spoiler:

With so many hounds, it would be hard to get to the gooey psyker center. Minimum 20 ablative wounds, all with invul saves and t4? Not bad. Paired with bikes for the sorcerors, you have a pretty mobile and effective unit. You also have the flexibility of using whatever psychic discipline you need to get the job done. Telepathy, Maelific, Biomancy... you have some good options here. For the remaining 20 points, I'd probably invest in some meltabombs or something. The most obvious shortcoming of a list like this is the lack of armor-penetrating options. The two bike squads alone are not going to be enough to do the trick.

**SonsofVulkan**

I see a couple critical issues

1. Without HnR the cabal deathstar may have issues with other near invincible deathstars and can get tarpitted.

2. Cant really hurt IKs unless you roll hammer hand and iron arm.

**Drakkol**

Fluff for Word Bearers using Sanctic Daemonology? Unmarked so not beholden to a certain God. In the fluff, Lorgar does some crazy things that don't fit with normal chaos psychic powers including shielding from a titan stomp and self healing ("The Betrayer" I think). I am not even sure if he is a psyker actually.

Sorcerers can take meltabombs just in case you are unlucky with not getting Hammerhand. Does Gate of Infinity get you out of combat?

**Badablack**

Are Thousand Sons in the Black Legion codex? I kinda want to run the cabal and take a bunch of min squads of Sons in kitted rhinos as troops for the warp charges. Churn out pink horrors turn 1, then witchfire spam from fire support vehicles. Also, if the sorcerers are in vehicles next to sorcerers outside vehicles would that satisfy the need to be within range of each other for the extra warp charges?

**Slayer-Fan123**

Badablack wrote:
Are Thousand Sons in the Black Legion codex? I kinda want to run the cabal and take a bunch of min squads of Sons in kitted rhinos as troops for the warp charges. Churn out pink horrors turn 1, then witchfire spam from fire support vehicles. Also, if the sorcerers are in vehicles next to sorcerers outside vehicles would that satisfy the need to be within range of each other for the extra warp charges?

You'd be better off taking a minimum CAD with two Cultists and a Sorcerer. It is 10 points more, but offers WAY more too.

**Grief**

How important is it to have the warpflame host as the psychic battery for the cabal?

**astro_nomicon**

Doesnt seem completely necessary to me. There a variety of ways to build 20+ WC lists with the Cabal HoundStar

**Grief**

I was thinking of just having only the cabal with their 9 warp charges. 3 sorc bikers with ml3 each.

My head keeps telling me thag is not enough and that I reallty need more because of bad dice.

**astro_nomicon**

I meant that the Warphost isnt necessary in the sense that there's more than one way to skin a cat. You'll definitely want more than 9 WC though. Probably in the 15-17 range minimum of you want to be competitive.