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 Fayric wrote:

 privateer4hire wrote:

Requizen wrote:
DA, GK, Harlies will probably get one. KDK I'm not sure about, but possibly.

Daemons have Fantasy get started boxes, but no 40k rules with them. At least, Khorne and Nurgle have them.

Sisters and Inquisition... probably not.

Dunno about Cult Mechanicus. Their HQ is in the Skitarii box, who knows what'll happen there.

Oooh. I could possibly go for a Harlies one.

The best part of a harlie starter would be if they got a small formation to go with it so can have them as allies without fielding minimum 3 troupe squads. I got some harlies a while ago, but has no meaningful way to field them (must go unbound) because the base formations are to cumbersome, and the really small one is basicly just the old harlie unit from eldar codex but dont even fit in a transport
Id like to see 2 bikes, a transport and a troupe + formation for that, but expect them to throw in a blister model as per usual.
Hm, actually, a formation without the psycher would suck, so ad that to my wishlist. Thanks.

Small point, but the Troupe in the Cegorach's Jest formation can always take a Starweaver as a dedicated transport. I wish it could take a Shadowseer too though.

I have to mention, I do like these 'Start Collecting!' -boxes. It's how they should do business - sell a vanilla core army as a reasonably priced army box, then let the players expand with the regular single unit boxes.

 prowla wrote:
I have to mention, I do like these 'Start Collecting!' -boxes. It's how they should do business - sell a vanilla core army as a reasonably priced army box, then let the players expand with the regular single unit boxes.

Yeah I think it's great. Make the core rules available free online, and it would make it really easy to get into the hobby.

 General Kroll wrote:

 prowla wrote:
I have to mention, I do like these 'Start Collecting!' -boxes. It's how they should do business - sell a vanilla core army as a reasonably priced army box, then let the players expand with the regular single unit boxes.

Yeah I think it's great. Make the core rules available free online, and it would make it really easy to get into the hobby.

Well said, we need more people in this Hobby.

I cant imagine GK getting a collecting box. They dont have enough different units as it is. 24" of force death!

DA are mostly about the wings which they do have sets for already.

How about more 30k starter sets?

 Uriels_Flame wrote:
I cant imagine GK getting a collecting box. They dont have enough different units as it is. 24" of force death!

DA are mostly about the wings which they do have sets for already.

How about more 30k starter sets?

I can't see 30k getting started sets, at least not legion specific plastic stuff. They won't want to dilute the waters too much, or take business away from FW. Dark Angels could get a starter set easily enough, though they kind of have the whole Dark Vengeance thing going on. Grey Knights could do it at a push too, a squad of power armour dudes and a razorback, with a terminator HQ could fill it out easy enough.

The only problem I see with GK getting a start collecting box is that they don't have a plastic clampack hero, which all the other kits so far have had (or in terms of guard/CSM/SW, a multi-part character set.) BA and DA are bound to come sometime soon, though. For BA, could imagine the terminator lord, a tac or DC squad and a dread. For DA, I presume it'll be a chaplain, a tac squad and a landspeeder vengeance.

 nudibranch wrote:
The only problem I see with GK getting a start collecting box is that they don't have a plastic clampack hero, which all the other kits so far have had (or in terms of guard/CSM/SW, a multi-part character set.) BA and DA are bound to come sometime soon, though. For BA, could imagine the terminator lord, a tac or DC squad and a dread. For DA, I presume it'll be a chaplain, a tac squad and a landspeeder vengeance.

Blood Angels are Terminator Captain, Tac squad and Baal predator. Already seen the photos.

The more I think about it, the more I wish it had the Terminator Librarian.

Ah, thanks!

That's a nice box of BA. I might actually pick one of those up eventually. Good deal.

 nudibranch wrote:
The only problem I see with GK getting a start collecting box is that they don't have a plastic clampack hero, which all the other kits so far have had (or in terms of guard/CSM/SW, a multi-part character set.) BA and DA are bound to come sometime soon, though. For BA, could imagine the terminator lord, a tac or DC squad and a dread. For DA, I presume it'll be a chaplain, a tac squad and a landspeeder vengeance.

Well, the plastic clampack terminator librarian is listed as a Grey Knight HQ (although, you have to do some minor conversions to really make it fit in as a Grey Knight. What self-respecting Grey Knight would use a storm bolter IN THEIR HAND? Absurd.)

Rihgu wrote:

 nudibranch wrote:
The only problem I see with GK getting a start collecting box is that they don't have a plastic clampack hero, which all the other kits so far have had (or in terms of guard/CSM/SW, a multi-part character set.) BA and DA are bound to come sometime soon, though. For BA, could imagine the terminator lord, a tac or DC squad and a dread. For DA, I presume it'll be a chaplain, a tac squad and a landspeeder vengeance.

Well, the plastic clampack terminator librarian is listed as a Grey Knight HQ (although, you have to do some minor conversions to really make it fit in as a Grey Knight. What self-respecting Grey Knight would use a storm bolter IN THEIR HAND? Absurd.)

Just cut off the base, move the ammunition feed and magazines to the side, and attach the hand that doesn't have a Storm bolter. Win win.

Rihgu wrote:

 nudibranch wrote:
The only problem I see with GK getting a start collecting box is that they don't have a plastic clampack hero, which all the other kits so far have had (or in terms of guard/CSM/SW, a multi-part character set.) BA and DA are bound to come sometime soon, though. For BA, could imagine the terminator lord, a tac or DC squad and a dread. For DA, I presume it'll be a chaplain, a tac squad and a landspeeder vengeance.

Well, the plastic clampack terminator librarian is listed as a Grey Knight HQ (although, you have to do some minor conversions to really make it fit in as a Grey Knight. What self-respecting Grey Knight would use a storm bolter IN THEIR HAND? Absurd.)

Grey Knights could easily get a box with;
- Termie Librarian
- 5x Terminators
- Venerable Dreadnought

OR, what about;
- Termie Librarian
- 5x Strikes
- Dreadknight

Or else they could just as easily do a set with the Libby + 5x Termies + 5x Interceptors, and give them a formation rule revolving around better Deep Strike shenanigans?!

GK are fairly simple to do. I think if they did a Dread Knight it would be for the best. Iconic vehicles seem to be a theme.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
GK are fairly simple to do. I think if they did a Dread Knight it would be for the best. Iconic vehicles seem to be a theme.

Personally I hope they don't put the Dreadknight into the SC! kit for them, because then I almost certainly wouldn't be able to resist picking one up! (and I really need to save up for Fenris Part II and the rumor-promised 'year of Chaos' supposedly coming next year!)


Actually, is there anywhere that's compiled the formation benefits for each of currently released Start Collecting sets?
It'd be interesting to see & compare all these sets...

Experiment 626 wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
GK are fairly simple to do. I think if they did a Dread Knight it would be for the best. Iconic vehicles seem to be a theme.

Personally I hope they don't put the Dreadknight into the SC! kit for them, because then I almost certainly wouldn't be able to resist picking one up! (and I really need to save up for Fenris Part II and the rumor-promised 'year of Chaos' supposedly coming next year!)


Actually, is there anywhere that's compiled the formation benefits for each of currently released Start Collecting sets?
It'd be interesting to see & compare all these sets...

Well, a Dreadknight is about in the right price for one of these sets. A Terminator Librarian, a squad of Terminators, and a Dreadknight is about equal to the Blood Angels set. I think a Strike Squad (10-man) is more likely though.

Anyone else feel at this point like the GW philosophy for chaos is not only to make the rules completely underwhelming in terms of viability and power compared to other formations but also to make them as un-inspired as possible? MT got a fun "without numbers" ruling, it's totally unique too, necron got one aswell. Nids got the gargoyle re-deployment (which is fun regardless of power level). Tau got a re-positioning power for their FW and space marines get 2 shooting phases.

Chaos got a USR (and an arguably not very good one) bubble shoe-horned in. It's just... boring. No tactics to it, no strategy. Just run at your opponent and hope they don't shoot you to death before you get there (and with marines 2 shooting phases+overwatch that is likely), then hope you don't fail a charge roll... I'm not a power gamer, not by a long shot, I take lists I know are very underpowered because they seem like they'd be fun to play. Plain and simple, nothing coming from chaos has been fun or fluffy for a long time. I feel at this point un-inspired is probably the best way to describe chaos marines and the rules they've been receiving.

On another note I'm curious to see what a DA and SW start collecting box would consist of. BA getting the Baal pred was refreshing to see over another dreadnaught.

 Inevitable_Faith wrote:

On another note I'm curious to see what a DA and SW start collecting box would consist of. BA getting the Baal pred was refreshing to see over another dreadnaught.

Space Wolves already have one. Comes with 10 Greyhunters, 3 Thunderwolf Cavalry, and Space Marine captain / "Wolf lord". Rules for it are pretty nice too, be within 12 inches of the lord and the two units can run and charge or reroll 1's in the shooting phase and both units can choose what one they want.

And yes it specifies. The only thing you'd really need to buy after that is a Drop pod.

Spiritfox22 wrote:

 Inevitable_Faith wrote:

On another note I'm curious to see what a DA and SW start collecting box would consist of. BA getting the Baal pred was refreshing to see over another dreadnaught.

Space Wolves already have one. Comes with 10 Greyhunters, 3 Thunderwolf Cavalry, and Space Marine captain / "Wolf lord". Rules for it are pretty nice too, be within 12 inches of the lord and the two units can run and charge or reroll 1's in the shooting phase and both units can choose what one they want.

And yes it specifies. The only thing you'd really need to buy after that is a Drop pod.

The SM Commander kit is the perfect kit to include in and of the standard Marine kits (not GK because the armor mark is different). It is a shame only one came with it (thought SW can work with it pretty well).

The regular C:SM kit is functional for DA. The Captain is can make a Company Master easy enough. The Tactical Kit is just fine for DA Greenwing Tacticals. The Venerable Dreadnought kit is perfect. It can made into a Deathwing Dreadnought or even a plain Greenwing Dreadnought. Unfortunately, it doesn't have anything Ravenwing. But otherwise it works well enough. Heck, buy a DW Upgrade kit and you are set.

 Inevitable_Faith wrote:
Anyone else feel at this point like the GW philosophy for chaos is not only to make the rules completely underwhelming in terms of viability and power compared to other formations but also to make them as un-inspired as possible? MT got a fun "without numbers" ruling, it's totally unique too, necron got one aswell. Nids got the gargoyle re-deployment (which is fun regardless of power level). Tau got a re-positioning power for their FW and space marines get 2 shooting phases.

Chaos got a USR (and an arguably not very good one) bubble shoe-horned in. It's just... boring. No tactics to it, no strategy. Just run at your opponent and hope they don't shoot you to death before you get there (and with marines 2 shooting phases+overwatch that is likely), then hope you don't fail a charge roll... I'm not a power gamer, not by a long shot, I take lists I know are very underpowered because they seem like they'd be fun to play. Plain and simple, nothing coming from chaos has been fun or fluffy for a long time. I feel at this point un-inspired is probably the best way to describe chaos marines and the rules they've been receiving.

Yep, the running 'theme' of Chaos Marines at this point is to be nothing more than a bunch of inept, mustache twirling NCP villains who exist solely to be bolter fodder for Little Timmy's much more manly Speesh Muhreens.

I've been a dedicated Chaos player since the beginning of 3rd edition, and in all that time, we've had exactly ONE really 'good' codex. (the fabled 3.5ed)
Other than that brief period from late 3rd through early 4th ed, we've routinely been a joke army.

At least we've got Daemons going for us though.

Spiritfox22 wrote:

 Inevitable_Faith wrote:

On another note I'm curious to see what a DA and SW start collecting box would consist of. BA getting the Baal pred was refreshing to see over another dreadnaught.

Space Wolves already have one. Comes with 10 Greyhunters, 3 Thunderwolf Cavalry, and Space Marine captain / "Wolf lord". Rules for it are pretty nice too, be within 12 inches of the lord and the two units can run and charge or reroll 1's in the shooting phase and both units can choose what one they want.

And yes it specifies. The only thing you'd really need to buy after that is a Drop pod.

Ah I totally missed that! That's a really cool kit and the formation bonus is not too shabby either. I love that it comes with wolf cav.

Experiment 626 wrote:

 Inevitable_Faith wrote:
Anyone else feel at this point like the GW philosophy for chaos is not only to make the rules completely underwhelming in terms of viability and power compared to other formations but also to make them as un-inspired as possible? MT got a fun "without numbers" ruling, it's totally unique too, necron got one aswell. Nids got the gargoyle re-deployment (which is fun regardless of power level). Tau got a re-positioning power for their FW and space marines get 2 shooting phases.

Chaos got a USR (and an arguably not very good one) bubble shoe-horned in. It's just... boring. No tactics to it, no strategy. Just run at your opponent and hope they don't shoot you to death before you get there (and with marines 2 shooting phases+overwatch that is likely), then hope you don't fail a charge roll... I'm not a power gamer, not by a long shot, I take lists I know are very underpowered because they seem like they'd be fun to play. Plain and simple, nothing coming from chaos has been fun or fluffy for a long time. I feel at this point un-inspired is probably the best way to describe chaos marines and the rules they've been receiving.

Yep, the running 'theme' of Chaos Marines at this point is to be nothing more than a bunch of inept, mustache twirling NCP villains who exist solely to be bolter fodder for Little Timmy's much more manly Speesh Muhreens.

I've been a dedicated Chaos player since the beginning of 3rd edition, and in all that time, we've had exactly ONE really 'good' codex. (the fabled 3.5ed)
Other than that brief period from late 3rd through early 4th ed, we've routinely been a joke army.

At least we've got Daemons going for us though.

Yeah chaos was my first army over 10 years ago. It saddens me to see them on the shelf for so long now but weak rules or not GW managed to suck the life out of the army, it has no personality anymore. It doesn't help I wasn't a fan of the dino-bots directions they took either. It's a shame that GW doesn't seem to realize there are living breathing humans playing the chaos army. Does GW assume because we play an "evil" army that we just want to show up and play the bad guy so the "good guy" armies can prove once again that "justice always prevails" or something like that?

So what would you guys have preferred to see in the chaos Get started box? Which units and what formation rule would have gotten you excited for it?

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

Spiritfox22 wrote:

 Inevitable_Faith wrote:

On another note I'm curious to see what a DA and SW start collecting box would consist of. BA getting the Baal pred was refreshing to see over another dreadnaught.

Space Wolves already have one. Comes with 10 Greyhunters, 3 Thunderwolf Cavalry, and Space Marine captain / "Wolf lord". Rules for it are pretty nice too, be within 12 inches of the lord and the two units can run and charge or reroll 1's in the shooting phase and both units can choose what one they want.

And yes it specifies. The only thing you'd really need to buy after that is a Drop pod.

The SM Commander kit is the perfect kit to include in and of the standard Marine kits (not GK because the armor mark is different). It is a shame only one came with it (thought SW can work with it pretty well).

It's also a shame that the GS:SW box is currently the only way you get get the kit as it seems to be 'No Longer Available'.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

Spiritfox22 wrote:

 Inevitable_Faith wrote:

On another note I'm curious to see what a DA and SW start collecting box would consist of. BA getting the Baal pred was refreshing to see over another dreadnaught.

Space Wolves already have one. Comes with 10 Greyhunters, 3 Thunderwolf Cavalry, and Space Marine captain / "Wolf lord". Rules for it are pretty nice too, be within 12 inches of the lord and the two units can run and charge or reroll 1's in the shooting phase and both units can choose what one they want.

And yes it specifies. The only thing you'd really need to buy after that is a Drop pod.

The SM Commander kit is the perfect kit to include in and of the standard Marine kits (not GK because the armor mark is different). It is a shame only one came with it (thought SW can work with it pretty well).

It's also a shame that the GS:SW box is currently the only way you get get the kit as it seems to be 'No Longer Available'.

There is one left at the GW store I frequent, I should pick it up. It is a great kit. It was great way to make my Captain Aphael for my Blood Angels and it was my first HQ for my Crimson Fists (he has been through several rebuilds though).

I suppose I could change the weapons on Karlaen out, give him a new head. But I am probably going to offload him on eBay.

 Inevitable_Faith wrote:

Spoiler:

Experiment 626 wrote:

 Inevitable_Faith wrote:
Anyone else feel at this point like the GW philosophy for chaos is not only to make the rules completely underwhelming in terms of viability and power compared to other formations but also to make them as un-inspired as possible? MT got a fun "without numbers" ruling, it's totally unique too, necron got one aswell. Nids got the gargoyle re-deployment (which is fun regardless of power level). Tau got a re-positioning power for their FW and space marines get 2 shooting phases.

Chaos got a USR (and an arguably not very good one) bubble shoe-horned in. It's just... boring. No tactics to it, no strategy. Just run at your opponent and hope they don't shoot you to death before you get there (and with marines 2 shooting phases+overwatch that is likely), then hope you don't fail a charge roll... I'm not a power gamer, not by a long shot, I take lists I know are very underpowered because they seem like they'd be fun to play. Plain and simple, nothing coming from chaos has been fun or fluffy for a long time. I feel at this point un-inspired is probably the best way to describe chaos marines and the rules they've been receiving.

Yep, the running 'theme' of Chaos Marines at this point is to be nothing more than a bunch of inept, mustache twirling NCP villains who exist solely to be bolter fodder for Little Timmy's much more manly Speesh Muhreens.

I've been a dedicated Chaos player since the beginning of 3rd edition, and in all that time, we've had exactly ONE really 'good' codex. (the fabled 3.5ed)
Other than that brief period from late 3rd through early 4th ed, we've routinely been a joke army.

At least we've got Daemons going for us though.

Yeah chaos was my first army over 10 years ago. It saddens me to see them on the shelf for so long now but weak rules or not GW managed to suck the life out of the army, it has no personality anymore. It doesn't help I wasn't a fan of the dino-bots directions they took either. It's a shame that GW doesn't seem to realize there are living breathing humans playing the chaos army. Does GW assume because we play an "evil" army that we just want to show up and play the bad guy so the "good guy" armies can prove once again that "justice always prevails" or something like that?

What's infuriating is that we had Legion rules at one point, and +2S power swords, and massive amounts of flexibility & wargear/gifts for our characters, etc, etc... And then GW took every last ounce of character from us under the premise that it was both, "too complicated" AND more importantly, "too over powering".
And then they turn around and give those Loyalist scum everything they took from us, but suddenly decided that it was now "balanced" and all with the purpose of better representing the individuality & background of Loyalists.

And now they just don't even try anymore... Anything unique we've had, GW finds a way to shoehorn 10x better versions of into each new Muhreen codex. (*cough*centurions*cough*)

 Inevitable_Faith wrote:
So what would you guys have preferred to see in the chaos Get started box? Which units and what formation rule would have gotten you excited for it?

Personally I wish they'd have just waited the 3 freaking months until Fenris Part II!

They could have easily opened up the second half of the campaign with the new plastic Thousand Sons, then 3-4 weeks later, put up the pre-orders for a Start Collecting set that could have been;
- Termie Sorc
- 5x Thousand Sons
- 10x Cultists
- Helbrute

Give them a formation rule that let's the Sorcerer 'sacrifice' Cultists for +1WC dice per Cultist removed, once per phase. (ie: The Sorc wants to cast a WC2 power, the Chaos player uses 2 of his normally generated dice, and then 'sacrifices' 2 Cultists to add +2 'free' dice to his casting attempt!)
Of course the Sorc would be required to join the Cultist squad for the ability to work, but it'd be fluffy as hell, and fun to boot. (and brings back something similar to the old 3.5ed Thrall Wizards that Tzeentch sorcerers could readily sacrifice for more power!)

Or else just do a box that's;
- Aspiring Champion
- 5x Possessed
- 10x Cultists
- Fiend
Give 'em a formation rule that let's the Aspiring Champ sacrifice Cultists to effect repairs to any damage the Fiend has suffered?!
Or make it a Maulerfiend, and give a rule that'd allow both the Possessed & Fiend to buff each other, such as Fleet & no enemy Overwatch if they both assault the same target!?

@626 this is not the thread to keep complaining about how Chaos Space Marines get shafted. Yes we understand they're a very underpowered army and you want things back to 3.5 where they could curbstomp just about everything. For the love of whatever you believe in just MAKE A THREAD and discuss it over there.

Back on topic of this thread

Honestly I cant wait to see what the rules for the Dark Eldar and Blood Angels Starter boxes come with. Hopefully the DE get something akin to move shoot move or quite frankly something to pack a punch in armor. Blood Angels however I'm betting they'll get Rage or something stupid to "Show their bloodthristy nature"

If DA get a Start Collecting box I'm going to bet it will focus on either Ravenwing or Deathwing entirely. GK's probably a Libarian, Strike squad, and Dreadknight.

Dark Eldar probably get something stupid like 'everything cause Fear' if GW is just phoning theirs in... Otherwise, maybe Scout on everything or some kind of Deep Strike shenanigans?
Long shot would be some kind of boost to their Splinter weaponry or boosted FnP.

BA's could get Scout back on their Baal Pred... or maybe it gets to double-shoot ala Vanilla formation's Dreadnought. (which would be 'effing terrifying!)
Even strait Rage would be decent, as +2A on the charge + their basic +1S Furious Charge bonus means even basic Tacticals can start doing more than just bullying the likes of Guardsmen & Tau. (would make a Drop Pod a no-brainer add-on/next purchase too!)

If/when GK's get one, they'll probably get something that buffs a Dreadknight or the (likely) Librarian's psychic potential.

Experiment 626 wrote:
Dark Eldar probably get something stupid like 'everything cause Fear' if GW is just phoning theirs in... Otherwise, maybe Scout on everything or some kind of Deep Strike shenanigans?
Long shot would be some kind of boost to their Splinter weaponry or boosted FnP.

BA's could get Scout back on their Baal Pred... or maybe it gets to double-shoot ala Vanilla formation's Dreadnought. (which would be 'effing terrifying!)
Even strait Rage would be decent, as +2A on the charge + their basic +1S Furious Charge bonus means even basic Tacticals can start doing more than just bullying the likes of Guardsmen & Tau. (would make a Drop Pod a no-brainer add-on/next purchase too!)

If/when GK's get one, they'll probably get something that buffs a Dreadknight or the (likely) Librarian's psychic potential.

I am more hoping that the DE lets the Kabalites shot at full BS out of the Raider since that was taken from them. BA is probably going to do nothing to the Baal Pred. Rage or +1WS is probably all the Tacticals will get.

Experiment 626 wrote:
Dark Eldar probably get something stupid like 'everything cause Fear' if GW is just phoning theirs in... Otherwise, maybe Scout on everything or some kind of Deep Strike shenanigans?
Long shot would be some kind of boost to their Splinter weaponry or boosted FnP.

BA's could get Scout back on their Baal Pred... or maybe it gets to double-shoot ala Vanilla formation's Dreadnought. (which would be 'effing terrifying!)
Even strait Rage would be decent, as +2A on the charge + their basic +1S Furious Charge bonus means even basic Tacticals can start doing more than just bullying the likes of Guardsmen & Tau. (would make a Drop Pod a no-brainer add-on/next purchase too!)

If/when GK's get one, they'll probably get something that buffs a Dreadknight or the (likely) Librarian's psychic potential.

Huge shot in the dark but I could see something like if the Librarian in the formation casts Force then all other models from the formation within 12" also get force.

Hopefully the dark eldar one is interesting and not just more silly fear or minus leadership gak.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Dark Angels got a Ravenwing Bike Squad (not the Black Knights, the regular bikes), a Deathwing Command Squad (to make regular Termies), and the clampack Interrogator Chaplain. Then again, it could be the Black Knights kit instead. I dunno.