Would you like to see Orks buffed to Eldar/SM/Tau/Necron level?

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**SemperMortis**

This is a poll simply to see if people want Orks to be as powerful as the top tier armies. This has nothing to do whatsoever with nerfing those armies because as we all know, nerfing doesn't sell models so GW isn't likely to nerf them back down to regular army levels.

**jreilly89**

I voted no, not because they;re powerful, but because I want the game toned down. Powering Orks up to top tier level only encourages GW to push it further.

**Frozocrone**

If the option for nerfing Eldar/SM/Tau/Necrons is unavailable, then the only way to achieve balance is to inject power into the lower Codexes.

**Jacksmiles**

Personally I would love to see orks on par with my eldar. When I was deciding my first army, orks, eldar, and blood angels all appealed to me from a flavor standpoint. I'm a competitive player, though, so eldar is my big army, and the more I learn about the race the more I enjoy playing them, and playing up their fluff in narrative events. Orks though, they have a LOT of character and they just seem like such a fun army. I swear ork players seem like they're having the most fun in non-competitive games.

It would be awesome to me to be able to roll up to an ork player and feel like I'm gonna have a challenging game.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

jreilly89 wrote:
I voted no, not because they;re powerful, but because I want the game toned down. Powering Orks up to top tier level only encourages GW to push it further.

This is totally true on the other side of the spectrum. I would just like games to not feel so one sided depending on opposing army.

**TheCustomLime**

No. Then we'd get another army that would get relentlessly complained about. I'd rather they bring all armies brought in line to roughly the same power level.

**Nevelon**

I’d like to see them buffed to the level of the mid-tier codexes. And the top dogs taken down a peg. Constantly buffing everyone to the top leads to codex creep and very bad balance issues.

I did not vote on the poll due to the disconnect with the options and the OP.

**MechaEmperor7000**

I'd like them to balance the game, which include buffs and nerfs at the same time to every army so that each army is at a consistent level.

**Zan**

I agree with those that say that we need a general tone-down rather than more power creep. That said, Orks deserve something, everybody loves the Ork players.

**Jaxler**

I say tone them up to tau, but don't make anyone else go further.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Anyone voting "no" is insane. There's horrid internal balance and the boost is necessary to fix that alone.

**Eldarain**

Everyone should be on their level. Seriously the disparity we've come to expect is unacceptable.

**casvalremdeikun**

I absolutely want Orks on level with other armies. I want ALL armies on equal footing. That way there is room for stuff like tactics helping someone win the game, not pay-to-win.

**Traditio**

casvalremdeikun wrote:
I absolutely want Orks on level with other armies. I want ALL armies on equal footing. That way there is room for stuff like tactics helping someone win the game, not pay-to-win.

Agreed.

I've been saying the following:

Warhammer 40k should be like dark souls. Everything you use should have both benefits and drawbacks. You want to use a broadsword? Ok. Enjoy the fast attack speed and decent scaling, but it's not a great sword. You won't get great sword damage. You want to use the great sword for the high damage capacity? Enjoy those slow swings.

There should be a plurality of viable builds, both with respect to codices in relationship to themselves, and with respect to codices in relationship to each other.

Both the general ruleset (i.e., what's in the BRB and FAQs) and the codex specific rules should facilitate this.

Points should actually enact equality in terms of in-game utility. An eldar player should be no better off for using a wraithknight than for having used any other option in his codex, independently of his overall strategy and skill. A space marine player should be no better off for using bikes or grav than for having used any other option in his codex, independently of his overall strategy and skill. An imperial guard player should be no better off for using a wyvern or a leeman russ...

...I'm sure you get my point.

No option should be auto-take. Every option should be viable.

**TheCustomLime**

Well, 40k is already a lot like Dark Souls if you think about it. It's a painful, frustrating experience to get through and people will tell you to git gud if you complain.

**Traditio**

TheCustomLime wrote:
Well, 40k is already a lot like Dark Souls if you think about it. It's a painful, frustrating experience to get through and people will tell you to git gud if you complain.

It's different, though. In dark souls, few things actually are unfair, and the appropriate way to succeed actually is to "git gud."

The Anor Lando archers are the exception, not the rule (and even then, it's doable; you just have to "git gud" and figure it out.).

If you can't beat the giant king in Dark Souls II, that's because you suck at fighting giants. It's not because the giant king is unfair.

In 40k, viable builds are the exception, not the rule.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Eldarain wrote:
Everyone should be on their level. Seriously the disparity we've come to expect is unacceptable.

So with terrible internal balance on top of external balance because of it?

**JimOnMars**

Voted "NO."

This poll really needs a third option, as others have suggested:

Buff Orks to mid-tier.

In my book, that's just below Tau. I don't want the codex quite on par with the cows...If Tau expect to lose, their tears just aren't as sweet.

**Grimskul**

Yeah no, I don't want Orks on Eldar/Tau/Necron/SM level. You don't cure the imbalance by attempting to nuke everyone up to the crazy levels of the apex codices since it doesn't address the core issues that made them OP to begin with. It also just promotes further power creep and makes the less popular/infrequently updated factions completely in the dust.

My gaming group and I'm sure others have noted that despite Orks being underpowered, most games that I've played as or against them have always been the most memorable due to how fun they are, either to kill or to kill with. Compared to the lack of interactivity from Necrons RP and Eldar with their ability to wipe you off the board, Orks don't lack for excitement and I don't want to lose that aspect just so I can match with the cheese of the month.

**Eldarain**

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Eldarain wrote:
Everyone should be on their level. Seriously the disparity we've come to expect is unacceptable.

So with terrible internal balance on top of external balance because of it?

Is that a serious question? Obviously I'd be in favour of the entire game being built where every faction is on the same level with a variety of viable builds. In the absence of that, having everyone at least have 1-2 viable builds which can contend with the strongest options at the expense of internal balance would be a substantially better state than we find ourselves in now.

**carldooley**

No, I don't want to see them as powerful as my other armies. . . but then I don't play them.

Do they still have the telly porta? or something like it?

**edit** I voted yes, btw.

**JimOnMars**

Tellyporta is only 12" range. We have it, never seen it played as you have a good chance of tellyporta-ing yourself.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Eldarain wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Eldarain wrote:
Everyone should be on their level. Seriously the disparity we've come to expect is unacceptable.

So with terrible internal balance on top of external balance because of it?

Is that a serious question? Obviously I'd be in favour of the entire game being built where every faction is on the same level with a variety of viable builds. In the absence of that, having everyone at least have 1-2 viable builds which can contend with the strongest options at the expense of internal balance would be a substantially better state than we find ourselves in now.

Yeah that's a serious question, and one that should be easily answered if you've ever played against someone using that codex or having used that codex yourself.
The 7.5 codices seem over the top, but they've got some of the best internal and external balance (to each other) that we've seen in quite a while. The Ork codex, taking the 7.5 codices out of the equation, isn't good, period. It has gak internal balance and external balance.

So what do you REALLY think is the answer? Buff everything appropriately so that it functions as intended, or nerf those other codices not having actually fixed the core issues?

**SemperMortis**

What are you talking about? The Ork codex is the best internally balanced codex in the game. It is internally balanced because it all sucks

**Vector Strike**

ALL armies should be at the same level. Best it they all have fun stuff to do

**Iron_Captain**

Whether the power level of Orks gets buffed or that of the other codices is nerfed is irrelevant. What matters is that they are brought to equal levels again

**kronk**

Everything should be powerful, or everything should get nerfed.

**ClassicCarraway**

I voted YES simply because I want to see ALL armies at the Eldar/SM/Tau/Necron power level. That would bring balance without nerfing units, it would make for quicker games because casualty rates would be much higher for everybody, and everybody would be happier because there would be no "have-nots" because all armies would have those gross power builds.

40K is ultimately a power trip fantasy, why not give EVERYBODY a taste of game changing POWAH? I say crank it up to 11!

**jreilly89**

ClassicCarraway wrote:
I voted YES simply because I want to see ALL armies at the Eldar/SM/Tau/Necron power level. That would bring balance without nerfing units, it would make for quicker games because casualty rates would be much higher for everybody, and everybody would be happier because there would be no "have-nots" because all armies would have those gross power builds.

40K is ultimately a power trip fantasy, why not give EVERYBODY a taste of game changing POWAH? I say crank it up to 11!

Something something "D weapons" something something "Gladius". Really, you really want them to crank out the power and give everyone OP crap?

**Kap'n Krump**

I'd prefer the mega top armies getting nerfs than catapulting a low tier army to the top. Because then they'd have to make everyone (e.g. CSM) top tier, eventually, if they wanted to be fair.

Because if everything was as OP as eldar, I'm not sure how much fun the game would be.

For the sake of argument though..........how would one 'fix' orks to be on eldar level? I honestly have no idea, other than making everything ridiculously cheap and making mob rule not suck.

**Nithaniel**

There are three ways to achieve balance.

-Bring everything up to the level of the strongest
-Bring everything down to the level of the weakest.
-Do a complete revision of the rules.

At this point as my recently shelved ork army illustrates, I'd accept either of these options.