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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 16:29:47
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Fixture of Dakka
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Blacksails wrote:tneva82 wrote:Game would also be cheaper if players would simply decide "screw GW-officialdom". As long as players insist on following what GW says they are at the mercy of GW's pricing strategies.
Oddly enough, I pay more for my 3rd party models than if I went with GW plastics.
What is your 3rd party models you are using then? I am curious.
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Agies Grimm:The "Learn to play, bro" mentality is mostly just a way for someone to try to shame you by implying that their metaphorical nerd-wiener is bigger than yours. Which, ironically, I think nerds do even more vehemently than jocks.
Everything is made up and the points don't matter. 40K or Who's Line is it Anyway?
Auticus wrote: Or in summation: its ok to exploit shoddy points because those are rules and gamers exist to find rules loopholes (they are still "legal"), but if the same force can be composed without structure, it emotionally feels "wrong". |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 16:31:05
Subject: Re:GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Lord of the Fleet
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Victoria Miniatures.
Some of the best resin I've ever used. That and I can have my dream Mordian army without dealing with monopose metal and limited options.
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Mordian Iron Guard - Major Overhaul in Progress
+Spaceship Gaming Enthusiast+
Live near Halifax, NS? Ask me about our group, the Ordo Haligonias! |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 16:40:13
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Locked in the Tower of Amareo
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Not talking just models. Though obviously more liberal use of alternative models helps. But whole rule thing. GW keeps changing rules and codexes so that you need to keep up buying more models. They keep decreasing point sizes so model sizes goes up.
To have playable force this days requires LOT more models than it used to.
Get rid of that and you would get rid of constant need of buying new models just to keep up with rule changes.
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2024 painted/bought: 109/109 |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 16:40:54
Subject: Re:GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Ambitious Space Wolves Initiate
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Blacksails wrote:There's telling people the truth, and then there's being an ass.
As I've pointed out, we can have a reasonable discussion about this topic without devolving into people on their high horse shouting down to the peasants about how the real world works and to just not buy it if you think its too expensive.
Well I've not called anyone a peasant, but do feel free to take what I said out of context and make up whatever words/reasoning you wish to try and justify whatever is you think is right or wrong rather than facing the actual truth of the matter.
Sally doesn't have enough time or money to play Golf as much as she would like to, especially on the nice Spring/Summer days. Sally has multiple hobbies which is one of the reasons she cannot/has not devoted more time/money to playing Golf. Sally doesn't spend time on the internet forums for Golf ranting about how she can't afford it because of other things she has going on in life. Sally is a realist.
Be like Sally.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 16:42:51
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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master of ordinance wrote:The problem with moving on Solar Cross, is that people have already invested a lot within this game and it is also still extremely popular when compared to others. If I visit my club I can be sure to see many games of 40K taking place and maybe one or two other games in a corner somewhere.
If people have already "invested" into 40k, then they probably don't need to buy any more stuff.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 16:43:19
Subject: Re:GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Lord of the Fleet
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The peasant thing was a joke, but humour doesn't seem to be your forte.
And remember that you're here on the internet ranting as much as anyone. Plus, no one made you open this thread and comment in it several times.
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Mordian Iron Guard - Major Overhaul in Progress
+Spaceship Gaming Enthusiast+
Live near Halifax, NS? Ask me about our group, the Ordo Haligonias! |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 16:47:32
Subject: Re:GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Ambitious Space Wolves Initiate
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Blacksails wrote:The peasant thing was a joke, but humour doesn't seem to be your forte.
And remember that you're here on the internet ranting as much as anyone. Plus, no one made you open this thread and comment in it several times.
This entire thread is humorous to me. We are just gonna have to agree to disagree here champ. This thread kept making it to the top of the General Section so I got interested and clicked. RIP my brain.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 16:56:36
Subject: Re:GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Librarian with Freaky Familiar
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Thing is, no matter what hobby you get into its gonna cost a lot to get into it.
No one i forcing you to buy GW modeling supplies or paints so you cant try to stick that to GW.
Rules yes, they are expensive, but that is only part of the hobby, besides every shop i have been to has the rules for free, let alone all the video online that explain how to play and how to use each rule. Additionally most stores have a store copy of he codex, but even then they are a lot cheaper now then they were.
The models, yes they are expensive for what they are, fancy plastic bits, but here is the thing, there are other companies besides GW! IF you are in it for the modeling aspect, and dont want to pay GW, there are dozens of alternatives. If you wanna play the game, you are gonna pay the prices, ill use the video game example. I love MMOs, but if i dont think WoW is worth the cost, i can either pay to play it, or play another MMO. No one is forcing you to play GW stuff.
You CAN get your moneys worth out of every box. I can buy a box of terminators for 50 bucks, they will take me a whole week to cut, shave, pin, prime, paint and base. So you cant really say they are not worth the price, if you hap hazerdly slop paint on them. Hell i know painters that take a day for 1 mini, and it looks amazing.
This is like every other hobbies out there. You are going to get out, what you put in. So if you put in 200 bucks, but only hap haphazardly care about modeling them, or the rules/game, yeah your not going to have a good time with it/feel ripped off.
If you invest 200 bucks and pain painstakingly detail your models, and go all in on making a sweet fluffy/comp army (If comp is your thing,) Then you are gonna get a lot more value outta the hobby
TL;DR:
Hobbies are expensive, you get out what you put in, Dont like it then dont play it, and make do with what you have.
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To many unpainted models to count. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 17:04:13
Subject: Re:GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Ambitious Space Wolves Initiate
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Backspacehacker wrote:Thing is, no matter what hobby you get into its gonna cost a lot to get into it.
No one i forcing you to buy GW modeling supplies or paints so you cant try to stick that to GW.
Rules yes, they are expensive, but that is only part of the hobby, besides every shop i have been to has the rules for free, let alone all the video online that explain how to play and how to use each rule. Additionally most stores have a store copy of he codex, but even then they are a lot cheaper now then they were.
The models, yes they are expensive for what they are, fancy plastic bits, but here is the thing, there are other companies besides GW! IF you are in it for the modeling aspect, and dont want to pay GW, there are dozens of alternatives. If you wanna play the game, you are gonna pay the prices, ill use the video game example. I love MMOs, but if i dont think WoW is worth the cost, i can either pay to play it, or play another MMO. No one is forcing you to play GW stuff.
You CAN get your moneys worth out of every box. I can buy a box of terminators for 50 bucks, they will take me a whole week to cut, shave, pin, prime, paint and base. So you cant really say they are not worth the price, if you hap hazerdly slop paint on them. Hell i know painters that take a day for 1 mini, and it looks amazing.
This is like every other hobbies out there. You are going to get out, what you put in. So if you put in 200 bucks, but only hap haphazardly care about modeling them, or the rules/game, yeah your not going to have a good time with it/feel ripped off.
If you invest 200 bucks and pain painstakingly detail your models, and go all in on making a sweet fluffy/comp army (If comp is your thing,) Then you are gonna get a lot more value outta the hobby
TL;DR:
Hobbies are expensive, you get out what you put in, Dont like it then dont play it, and make do with what you have.
Yep. I'd love to see some of these peoples faces when you explain/show them the cost of something like....let's say Bow Hunting.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 17:08:23
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Thane of Dol Guldur
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I'll never go broke bass fishing. There's lots of cheap hobbies...some are even free.
There's plenty of ways to mitigate the costs of 40K, as well. Helps to have generous friends, but you can do stuff like stretch out boxes with bits, scratch build, etc.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/07/13 17:10:40
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 17:18:10
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Librarian with Freaky Familiar
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jasper76 wrote:I'll never go broke bass fishing. There's lots of cheap hobbies...some are even free.
There's plenty of ways to mitigate the costs of 40K, as well. Helps to have generous friends, but you can do stuff like stretch out boxes with bits, scratch build, etc.
Exactly, i lived out of a cigar box with 40 for my first year until i was able to actually buy a box for it all. All things considering 40k is a pretty cheap hobbies you can do all year round with out any problems.
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To many unpainted models to count. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 17:26:31
Subject: Re:GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Lord of the Fleet
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WulfenClaw wrote:
Yep. I'd love to see some of these peoples faces when you explain/show them the cost of something like....let's say Bow Hunting.
Or collecting Incan matrimonial headmasks!
Ridiculous and irrelevant comparisons go!
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Mordian Iron Guard - Major Overhaul in Progress
+Spaceship Gaming Enthusiast+
Live near Halifax, NS? Ask me about our group, the Ordo Haligonias! |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 17:51:49
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade
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Korinov wrote: Snoopdeville3 wrote:
Ill try and be as short with this as possible.
- GW needs to pay their employees, benefits, 401k, insurance, etc.
- All their facilities also need to be maintained and of course rent comes in to play.
- All of their manufacturing lines cost a TON of money, I know I worked in the packaging and processing industry. They are not printing these models on some simple cheap 3D printer. They do runs on certain models and then their lines and models will need to be changed out. This depends on box size and of course the sprue. This could take hours which again costs $.
- With a company like GW I am sure they have engineers on staff to take care of their manufacturing line, which again costs $.
- They need to dump money into design and game research. New model designs don't appear in a magic box.
The same can be said about every other model manufacturing company out there. Virtually all of them offer cheaper products than GW. If GW has a problem because their costs have got too high, then it's their problem, not mine.
BTW, about the incredibly derpy Mantic "dragons", those models have been out of production for a while. And you know who's even derpier and more expensive?
No its not the same. No table top gaming company is like GW. GW is much bigger then the rest. Most others are much smaller and you also may not need as many models to play the game.
Smaller = Less employees, less manufacturing, less manufacturing lines, less benefits/insurance/salaries to pay out.
A lot of these companies run out of a small shed of a warehouse, or legit out of a garage... How do I know? Because of I have rented/sold them equipment to package their models. A lot of their models are even co packed/produced by other manufacturing companies, which is probably why their detail looks like garbage....you can't compare them to GW and if you do you have screws loose.
"If GW has a problem because their costs have got too high, then it's their problem, not mine." - if its a problem for you, guess what don't buy them, no one is forcing you.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 18:01:21
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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The Daemon Possessing Fulgrim's Body
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Economies of scale.
Google it.
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We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark
The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.
The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox
Ask me about
Barnstaple Slayers Club |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 19:39:54
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade
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That has to do with production not infrastructure expenses doesnt it?
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This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2016/07/13 19:43:15
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 19:43:19
Subject: Re:GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Ancient Venerable Black Templar Dreadnought
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Blacksails wrote:*Edit* I also don't understand the poor attitude some people have here. If someone says they think its too expensive and its stopping them (or friends) from playing, telling them get lost and say its not for them is a gakky attitude to have. At the very least, offer some alternatives or have some kind of sympathy or empathy.
I tend to think that there are a few things not being said about how these friends "Can't get into this hobby".
As you stated, there are other alternatives like buying used that can help this problem dramatically.
I see many "complaints" that the resale can sometimes be very poor with GW miniatures unless "expert painted" really is.
I think the poor attitude responding back may be that the demand or "entitlement" for more affordable miniatures, most likely new and not moving on to other possibly "better" games is disingenuine: it is making people detect some BS in the air.
There are the starter army kits or if you look, there are "push together" models for marines and imperial guard I used extensively for a really good price break for bulking up troops.
I really like Ferraris, love them in fact.
I could possibly buy one but it would hurt enough to kill the budget on necessities (and get it repossessed when I cannot afford an oil change).
I drive a Grand Caravan... I do have to on occasion suck it up and give things I want a pass.
40k for me has been seeing some hibernation due to me not liking the rules much but the cost is no small consideration.
I guess it is hard to have sympathy when someone rages over not being able to afford a leisure item: it is a part of life.
I have an adopted son because the birth-mother chose regularly a pack of cigarettes or a pretty dress over feeding her baby or buying diapers... we all make choices and live with the consequences.
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A revolution is an idea which has found its bayonets.
Napoleon Bonaparte |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 19:47:56
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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The Daemon Possessing Fulgrim's Body
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Nope. Pretty much every £ spent by a well run large business will be more efficient than a smaller one.
Everything, from specialist staff to raw materials to utilities can benefit by volume.
I guess strictly speaking it's "operational efficiencies" but it all pretty much falls under the same umbrella.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/13 19:48:33
We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark
The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.
The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox
Ask me about
Barnstaple Slayers Club |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 19:59:55
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Auspicious Skink Shaman
Louth, Ireland
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MTG isn't cheaper - $200-300 every 4 months isn't cheap
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 20:19:18
Subject: Re:GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Regular Dakkanaut
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All I can think of is that line in Starship Troopers, when Johnny turns and says "We're the old men, Ace."
It sneaks up on you quick, like when you realize Starship Troopers is almost twenty years old now...
JohnHwangDD wrote:
Some comments:
1. You can teach your kid to play. And set up a permanent game table in the basement, rather than dragging all of the stuff up and down. Make a nice gaming space down there.
Believe me, I have my plans and schemes to nerdify my children.  Sadly, one is a toddler, and the other still in her mother's womb for a couple more months. I have, however, managed to get my two year old to paint a Blood Angel for me. Which is excellent; I mean, who enjoys painting red?" (Although it is easier with base colors. Back in my day we had to make due with "Blood Red", uphill both ways!)
JohnHwangDD wrote:
2. My friends and I have also switched mostly to boardgaming: Memoir '44, BattleLore, Super Dungeon Explore, Flames of War (Open Fire! boxed set), Zombicide, X-wing, and so on. My rule for new games is that it ALL fits in ONE box (or storage tub). Having less "stuff" for the game simplifies the whole process tremendously.
So agreed - there's nothing as nice as that rare time a box game all fits nicely back into its box, maybe in a battlefoam tray, all snug and complete and intact. I haven't taken them up on it yet, but I love that GW has made so many board games lately. Something like Calth or Killteam goes a long way toward scratching that 40k itch, in a (comparatively) tiny space.
And to you! The best part of getting old, is that you have bigger joys and problems than Warhammer. (But it's still fun to throw the dice)
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/13 20:20:20
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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It is if you're only playing crap cards and seconds out of a shoebox...
But that's the same as only playing the 40k BfV starter and never getting anything else. Apples to oranges argument, really.
If you're actually playing Magic; then you're doing FNM at $20 each; playing Standard at $200+ per quarter; or playing an Eternal format with a several-thousand USD minimum buy-in.
Magic is significantly more expensive than 40k, and the obvious evidence is how every card shop makes money hand over fist, while every gaming store folds. Automatically Appended Next Post: Oggthrok wrote:
All I can think of is that line in Starship Troopers, when Johnny turns and says "We're the old men, Ace."
It sneaks up on you quick, like when you realize Starship Troopers is almost twenty years old now...
Believe me, I have my plans and schemes to nerdify my children.  Sadly, one is a toddler, and the other still in her mother's womb for a couple more months. I have, however, managed to get my two year old to paint a Blood Angel for me. Which is excellent; I mean, who enjoys painting red?" (Although it is easier with base colors. Back in my day we had to make due with "Blood Red", uphill both ways!)
So agreed - there's nothing as nice as that rare time a box game all fits nicely back into its box, maybe in a battlefoam tray, all snug and complete and intact. I haven't taken them up on it yet, but I love that GW has made so many board games lately. Something like Calth or Killteam goes a long way toward scratching that 40k itch, in a (comparatively) tiny space.
And to you! The best part of getting old, is that you have bigger joys and problems than Warhammer. (But it's still fun to throw the dice)
Thanks, you too! My boys are old enough to start, and we'll play more this summer, so you'll get there soon enough. Though you're in the tough part of the haul, no doubt. I basically did nothing for a few years, so I know where you're at. Paint-wise, I'm a fan of colored primer, and I won't basecoat anything ever again. I bought IKR for the Knights, built & played one for 40k, on the fence whether I should build or sell the 2nd... 1500 or smaller games of 40k are great, give time to kick back and shoot the breeze while pushing little toys around, making pew-pew noises. Seeing the new in my kids faces is pretty amazing.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/13 20:49:47
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/14 10:05:21
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Ancient Chaos Terminator
Surfing the Tervigon Wave...on a baby.
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JohnHwangDD wrote:
It is if you're only playing crap cards and seconds out of a shoebox...
But that's the same as only playing the 40k BfV starter and never getting anything else. Apples to oranges argument, really.
If you're actually playing Magic; then you're doing FNM at $20 each; playing Standard at $200+ per quarter; or playing an Eternal format with a several-thousand USD minimum buy-in.
Magic is significantly more expensive than 40k, and the obvious evidence is how every card shop makes money hand over fist, while every gaming store folds.
Can I add to this man? I love your points 95% of the time so I want to add to this.
Furthermore - people state the best way to get cards in MtG is through doing well at FNM.
Now, bear in mind you already have an insanely expensive buy in to get a decent tier deck for Standard (which hilariously will rotate out and cease to be viable in Modern or Legacy because 'balance' has improved meaning newer cards are pure gak outside of Standard 95% of the time, so if you want to exploit that Eternal Format it costs EVEN MORE money - and while your deck won't rotate out in an Eternal Format rulings and banlists could slap your deck straight down - Eldrazi Temple anyone?) and FNM on a regular basis isn't cheap....
And if you're unfortunate enough to play in an area that has regular MtG tournament attendees....you're not getting those prize cards either as they'll be the ones winning. And they won't just pass you down the quality cards. Oh no, those things sell rather well and can be traded in, further funding them.
MtG is literally an uphill struggle of money.
As I said earlier in this thread... you may balk at the cost of a squad of Space Marines/Orks/Eldar Guardians - but in 20 years time your core troop choices will have exactly the same armaments and still be viable as what they are. And ultimately, those will be the bulk of your army.
Only one army had its base troop choice gain any major variance in their armament - Tyranids and this was when they introduced Spinefists and Devourers as Gaunt options back in the 3rd ed book. Space Marines, CSM, Orks, Eldar Guards? All the same. Same with DE Warriors, Necron Warriors, SoB and Tau Fire Warriors - your base armament is constant.
At most you might have to buy a single squad or some bits to convert over special or heavy weapons depending on meta changes...
Big deal.
40k is a long term investment tbh.
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Now only a CSM player. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/14 10:53:07
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Stealthy Space Wolves Scout
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Yeah, I'm still using the same Grey Hunters that I bought in the 90s.
GW is expensive. My son and wife also started now and they only picked up used models.
Everyone is talking about cheap alternatives. What? Where? I have never ever seen any nice and cheap models that would mix well with GW. Sure, Victoria minis are nice and better than what GW sells for IG, but they are also more expensive.
Other games are only less expensive because the the model count is lower, the rules are cheaper/free and/or the models are not that great. But model for model is not really much more expensive than other companies, except character clampacks maybe.
Most other hobbies are expensive. My boss does RC car racing. He burnt tires for 80€ in one day. Hell, even running is expensive. Have you an idea what special sports clothing and running shoes cost?
I'm not happy with GW prices, but I can (must?) live with them. You just have to carefully chose what and where you buy. I.e. I love the knight model, but I always found it to be too expensive. But IKR with a 20% discount was a definitive buy for me.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/14 12:15:58
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Pulsating Possessed Chaos Marine
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Azreal13 wrote:
Nope. Pretty much every £ spent by a well run large business will be more efficient than a smaller one.
Everything, from specialist staff to raw materials to utilities can benefit by volume.
I guess strictly speaking it's "operational efficiencies" but it all pretty much falls under the same umbrella.
Exactly.
If GW is stuck with an incredibly inefficient corporate structure, it's their problem and theirs alone.
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Progress is like a herd of pigs: everybody is interested in the produced benefits, but nobody wants to deal with all the resulting gak.
GW customers deserve every bit of outrageous princing they get. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/14 12:32:41
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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I mean, I own an incredibly diverse collection. I own more armies than I don't own, and some of them I own over 8k points in. I've been buying into this game, heavily, since 3rd edition. The current cost to me isn't a big deal...I haven't bought a rulebook since 5th, I just download everything (for 3rd, 4th, and 5th, I own everything).
The reason the high cost is so...difficult to me, personally, is I can't get anyone into the hobby. The first game is extremely expensive. Here is what it'll cost for a first game;
Rulebook, $100
Codex $ 40-50
Paint and other items $20-30
Mini's, usually around 50 per box, often need 4 boxes to start playing (2 Troops, HQ, one other thing).
So that's what, over 300 to start? And that's a 500 point game, hopefully. You can buy second hand, often at a 20-25% discount, which will help (about $75 off).
The starter sets were a great idea, but GW messed up there. They aren't available for every army, you and your friend have to want to play the armies in the box (not enough variety to pick and choose) and the armies are often not balanced (DV anyone?). Imagine buying DV and you pick chaos. You are in for some rough games and will feel cheated until you buy the codexes and find out you were playing at a huge handicap.
Compare this to WM/H, where for $135 you can get an all in one box that is 70 out of the 100 points you need. The rules are free, and the codex is about $5 and available on an Ipad with an army builder app (though to be fair, you often need 2 for mercs or minions). The all in one boxes are usually competitive choices and priced very well. Battle boxes are also a good deal, and WM/H encourages journeyman leagues.
I'm not getting into the rules and support, but comparing GW to other mini games is crazy. They are way more expensive. Keep in mind, the majority of my friends are professors, engineers, business owners...we aren't hurting for cash here. But its hard to convince someone to get 20 minis and 2 books instead of a Ps4, which is usually the argument. In WM/H, I'm asking them not to buy 2 video games with DLC and they are nearly ready to play.
Sure, other hobbies are pricey. I used to do MTG and moved to 40k because it was cheaper in the long run during 3rd edition. I play golf. I go hunting, scuba diving, fishing...all of these are very expensive. But if I want to hunt, I can decide what to hunt but I can't decide not to hunt. I can decide where to dive but I can't decide not to dive. With GW, if I want to play mini war games, I can just play something else.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/14 13:29:31
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Ancient Venerable Black Templar Dreadnought
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I find for "pick-up" games 40k is a bit of a loser in my area.
It is because of their choices in making entry into their game hard I HAD to move-on to other systems: that is where everyone else is.
No sense being angry at GW for choices that are hurting their business even if they refuse to acknowledge that raising price and reducing quantity does not increase profit margin if the customer purchases are ramping down faster.
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A revolution is an idea which has found its bayonets.
Napoleon Bonaparte |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/14 13:38:21
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Pick up games for 40k have their own issues, mainly the rules and incredible imbalance going on. I can't do PUGs in 40k and haven't been able to since the end of 5th. That's strictly a WM/H or X-wing thing. Or guild ball.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/14 15:04:42
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Worthiest of Warlock Engineers
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JohnHwangDD wrote: master of ordinance wrote:The problem with moving on Solar Cross, is that people have already invested a lot within this game and it is also still extremely popular when compared to others. If I visit my club I can be sure to see many games of 40K taking place and maybe one or two other games in a corner somewhere.
If people have already "invested" into 40k, then they probably don't need to buy any more stuff.
Until GW changes the scale of the game or makes everything that they have irrelevant meaning that they have to buy even more.
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Free from GW's tyranny and the hobby is looking better for it
DR:90-S++G+++M++B++I+Pww205++D++A+++/sWD146R++T(T)D+
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/14 15:41:46
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Tzeentch Veteran Marine with Psychic Potential
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I personally just wish more people could get into the game easier.
I'm not complaining about the prices for myself, I can afford more than I buy at gw, it just sucks that my group would more than double in size with more reasonable prices. I want more people to play the game.
It's about more than "people living beyond their budget" as was mentioned earlier. The prices don't bother me for myself, I can pay the price, and most kits are worth their money to me personally.. What saddens me is that the game doesn't seem reasonable to people even slightly below my income level. It would be better at least for my local scene if the game was slightly cheaper.
I think it would go a long way towards helping this issue if they simply reduced prices on kits that are extremely old sculpts that they've more than made profit on already. Then they can keep prices where they are on newer kits, while still having more incentive for people to start playing.
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7500 pts Chaos Daemons |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/14 16:17:31
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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DarkStarSabre wrote: JohnHwangDD wrote:Magic is significantly more expensive than 40k, and the obvious evidence is how every card shop makes money hand over fist, while every gaming store folds.
Furthermore - people state the best way to get cards in MtG is through doing well at FNM.
while your deck won't rotate out in an Eternal Format rulings and banlists could slap your deck straight down - Eldrazi Temple anyone?
As I said earlier in this thread... you may balk at the cost of a squad of Space Marines/Orks/Eldar Guardians - but in 20 years time your core troop choices will have exactly the same armaments and still be viable as what they are. And ultimately, those will be the bulk of your army.
40k is a long term investment tbh.
I'm skeptical of FNM being best way to get cards. I think it's still box buy plus singles, if you know what you're looking for. FNM is just a way for spreading out that box buy over several weeks.
To be fair, banning something like Temple only affects a small portion of your deck, once you've taken the HUGE step and bought your core cards. Although, to be fair, the thing that replaced 1.5 is completely different from what I used to play. Oh, well...
You are right that I'm still playing with my original Eldar Harlequins and Aspects and monopose Guardians. Along with my Tallarn Guardsmen. Those OOP models are good pretty much forever.
Over the long term, 40k is not unreasonable, and much cheaper than Magic.
Automatically Appended Next Post: master of ordinance wrote: JohnHwangDD wrote:If people have already "invested" into 40k, then they probably don't need to buy any more stuff.
Until GW changes the scale of the game or makes everything that they have irrelevant meaning that they have to buy even more.
The biggest thing that people need to understand is that you don't have to play with the new stuff if you don't want to. Just agree to play small stuff or old school, and it's fine.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/14 16:20:40
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/07/14 16:30:06
Subject: GW pricing: Why my friends can't get into this hobby (rant)
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Stern Iron Priest with Thrall Bodyguard
UK
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Agreeing to play old school only works with friends, a pugs not going to agree every time and GW stores will insist your being up to date rules wise.
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