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2018/01/23 12:31:44
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
Just Tony wrote: That's like saying that you order bangers and mash expecting bangers and mash but get broccoli cauliflower mix, then justify it as being okay because they are both food.
I was coming into it wanting bangers and mash. By Surak, that is what I expect.
To abuse your analogy there....
I see it as more I ordered a specific type of banger with my bangers and mash - say, a Speldhurst sausage to use one local. Instead, I get a spicey Cumberland with my mash. Ultimately, it's the same thing I was craving - but a slightly different, though no less pleasing flavour.
I'm enjoying the different take on Trek - especially as the arcing stories have a most pleasing echo of DS9. We're again seeing a crew that can't simply leg it from the decisions they make from one episode to the next. It's taken the central Trek Trope, and is in the middle of exploring it in new and interesting ways. If it was just Star Trek - The Next Generation After Enterprise But The Same Generation as ToS, I think I'd have lost interest. TNG nailed that. Voyage and Enterprise only undermined it (personal taste, YMMV etc)
And this time, we're not following The Best of The Best on the Federation flagship. We're seeing a crew of screw ups and kooks on top secret hush-hush missions where their abilities outweigh their quirks. So for me, the feel is and should indeed always be somewhere between a regular crew and the shadowy Section 31. At the heart of their efforts they are Federation - but with perhaps a skewed perspective and morality.
It's caught a lot of heat for the rather radical Klingon re-design. Personally, I think that was indeed a mistake. Ever since Search for Spock, the Pasty-heads have had a distinctive look. Making them baldy slap-heads serves little purpose to my mind. I mean, I like the look, but just no need.
In summary, I can absolutely see why some may not be enjoying it as Star Trek. But I'm not amongst them.
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
I've seen a post somewhere (was it here?) that photoshopped hair onto the new Klingons, and they don't look all that different to the ones from TNG/DS9/VOY. The "radical redesign" is new uotfits and skinheads.
2018/01/23 13:36:22
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
Paradigm wrote: Hmmm... Not sure I like this week's Big Twist...
Spoiler:
There's nothing wrong with it narratively, it's not one of those twists for which there is absolutely no evidence and it's clearly done for shock value, and they were clever enough with setting Tyler/Voq up to distract us...
I'm just put out by the revelation that my favourite character in the show was never that character, and every great line/scene/piece of development he's had was just an act... Which I guess means the betrayal did exactly what it was supposed to, but without Lorca as captain certain other cast members are really going to have to step up to fill that void going forward, no one on the cast has half as much charisma and presence as Issacs.
What I'm now not sure about is whether I want them to then say 'Regular Not Evil Lorca' also survived the wreck of his ship and has been waiting for a chance to reclaim his usurped identity and come back to Starfleet... On one hand, it's very cheap, on the other, we get proper Lorca back and he can continue to be awesome...
Automatically Appended Next Post: Incidentally, anyone know why this week's episode was only 37 mins?
I disagree. I think it makes everything make sense now. The Federation is all about idealism and then they have this one weird captain whose all pragmatic and like “context is for kings”. As we see now it wasn’t just this series trying to be edgy, he really is different than everyone else. Also, it explains why he went out of his way to free and re-enlist Burnham, Why he didn’t even care that his chief of security died, why he won’t treat his “eye injury”. If you go back there was tons of hints that shows this was always the plan and I think it makes the show better overall retroactively.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Well that was a crazy episode.
Spoiler:
I’ll miss Lorca, he was evil but an interesting guy. What the heck is Burnham thinking saving evil Georghiou? She's probably killed like millions of people as an evil tyrant and she eats Sarus! She’s definitely letting her feelings for her Georgiou cloud her judgement.
These story arch finales feel like season finales.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/29 04:53:46
2018/01/29 13:54:14
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
Well that was pretty incredible... Though the final moments reveal was a tad predicable, the rest of the episode was so great and these final 3 weeks should be very interesting indeed.
Spoiler:
I perhaps feel killing Lorca was a bit too early, but then again one more Mirror episode would probably have been one too many so it had to be done.
Saru's captain speech was just epic, if they contrive a way to take away his command and give it to Burnham it'll be a colossal waste as he's stepped into that role fantastically. Likewise Tilly and Stamets inspiring one another to greatness, a fantastic 'woooo Starfleet' moment.
Bringing Georgiou back was a terrible decision in-universe, but that's par for the course for Burnham. For the show itself I think it'll be great. There's no way she can be redeemed, but I imagine it'll take a lot for Burnham to see that (probably the same with Tyler as well) which should set up some good stuff. How far can compassion go for someone that is irredeemably evil?
I wonder how they're going to handle this Klingon victory. Have the Discovery lead a straight up rebellion, or do some more timey-wimey stuff to avert the war in the first place or something like that...
2018/01/29 17:43:14
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
I wasn't looking forward to it, to be honest, due to the whole "my favourite character is a surprise paedophile" thing last week.
I'm kind of glad I persisted. Nothing really excuses that, but still...
Spoiler:
At least he's dead (Although, it wouldn't surprise me if he ends up being a spore ghost or something, the way he died...). That lets the show move on from that.
I wonder how the Empress and Saru are going to get on. Particularly with the whole, "I just ate a buddy of yours for dinner last night" thing. And on that note... That'll be an awkward conversation with Michael too....
I don't really want to try to predict things (One of my coworkers gave me a heap of abuse on my work film forum claiming that the reason I don't like the whole, "Lorca is a paedo" thing is because I was wrong with a prediction), but Georgieu being there might suggest timey wimeyness is a possibility. - Stop the battle of the Binary Stars from ever happening, maybe?
In any case, I'm kinda curious about how the show goes, but I really don't have much of an investment in it anymore.
2018/01/29 23:29:40
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
Paradigm wrote: Well that was pretty incredible... Though the final moments reveal was a tad predicable, the rest of the episode was so great and these final 3 weeks should be very interesting indeed.
Spoiler:
I perhaps feel killing Lorca was a bit too early, but then again one more Mirror episode would probably have been one too many so it had to be done.
Saru's captain speech was just epic, if they contrive a way to take away his command and give it to Burnham it'll be a colossal waste as he's stepped into that role fantastically. Likewise Tilly and Stamets inspiring one another to greatness, a fantastic 'woooo Starfleet' moment.
Bringing Georgiou back was a terrible decision in-universe, but that's par for the course for Burnham. For the show itself I think it'll be great. There's no way she can be redeemed, but I imagine it'll take a lot for Burnham to see that (probably the same with Tyler as well) which should set up some good stuff. How far can compassion go for someone that is irredeemably evil?
I wonder how they're going to handle this Klingon victory. Have the Discovery lead a straight up rebellion, or do some more timey-wimey stuff to avert the war in the first place or something like that...
Ya, this will be the first time we have a non-human Captain as "The Captain." I hope they give Saru a fair chance before somehow making Burnham the captain. Burnham isn't even enlisted. Pretty sure Cadet Tilly outranks her. Maybe Tilly will get that command sooner than she thinks! As she's just demonstrated with Georgeiou (I'm just going to go ahead and spell that different each time) Burnham is terrible at judgement calls and should never be captain.
2018/02/04 19:28:36
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
I'm still unsure about this show as Star Trek. It's good on it's own but I feel the game of thrones format isn't very Trek. It's hard to get attached to characters and see them grow and develop when so many of the good ones are dying left and right. Too much focus on the drama and action and twists and it feels like a drawn out sci fi action movie. Not sure why this even has to be Star Trek, it could have been anything...something new perhaps. I think The Orville is the modern Star Trek I wanted....this.. is something else.
2018/02/05 22:08:04
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
KamikazeCanuck wrote: So I'm confused. Is that Tyler guy a human who had a Klingon brain stuck in him or a Klingon who got turned into a human?
He is a klingon who was transformed into a human, he was the albino one from the initial episodes of the show.
Was Tyler ever a real Human? If not how can they just act like he's a normal human guy now? Isn't he still a Klingon sleeper agent who murdered the ship's Doctor?
2018/02/06 00:25:36
Subject: Re:Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
KamikazeCanuck wrote: So I'm confused. Is that Tyler guy a human who had a Klingon brain stuck in him or a Klingon who got turned into a human?
He is a klingon who was transformed into a human, he was the albino one from the initial episodes of the show.
Was Tyler ever a real Human? If not how can they just act like he's a normal human guy now? Isn't he still a Klingon sleeper agent who murdered the ship's Doctor?
There may have been an original tyler, and voq had that personality implanted over his own. I haven't seen last nights episode yet but if they let him off the hook i'm going to be annoyed.
2018/02/06 02:04:08
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
More likely left as a plot hook to be explored later.
Spoiler:
How can we be sure Mrs Voq actually did the right job? I mean, she could've easily patched things up so Voq has absolute control over Tyler, knowing the nature of the Federation is one of forgiveness and acceptance?
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
Just watched the finale. Some very good stuff there, though I can't help but feel it should've been a two-parter. Anyone who hasn't seen it yet, STAY AWAY from anything that might contain spoilers, there's some major stuff here which you'll want to avoid until you've seen it.
Speaking of which...
Spoiler:
I do think it was perhaps a little rushed. After the epic finale to the first half of the series, and the great final episode of the Mirror arc, this one seemed a little lacking in punch. A second part (or even an hour-long episode) would have given more time for a proper showdown between Burnham and Evil Georgiou, rather than just having Burnham offer a deal and Georgiou go 'ok, yeah, actually that's fine, see ya'. I found it a little odd that such a fervent xenophobe, not to mention a former Emperor, would pass up the chance to destroy the Klingon homeworld in exchange for what amounts to life as a pirate. I get that they probably wanted her around for series 2, but resolving the whole series' arc in a few lines and handing a planet-killing bomb over to the Klingons was somewhat underwhelming.
I did like the scene in which a mutiny against Starfleet and Cornwell was proposed, but again I'm not sure they really did enough with it. Cornwell didn't even try to convince them after everyone stood up, she just flatly conceded. I'm not saying I wanted Cornwell to be as fanatical or hateful as a Terran, but you'd think with a Klingon fleet over Earth and the chance to stop it all with one act, she'd be a bit more committed to the idea. That scene had the potential to be great mirror to the first episode, and thematically it was, but could've done with some more gravitas to it.
Less time going 'Look, we can do a cantina scene just as well as the other guys' and more time on those two moments would have done the episode wonders.
As for the final shots, while it's undoubtedly a cool moment, they're going to have to play it very safe now if The Enterprise sticks around for any length of time, or run the risk of Discovery not being the star of Discovery. By all means, let's have a cool Ent/Disco team-up for an opening 2-parter, but that's about as much as I'd want. I'm also not too keen on the idea of a new captain, Saru 100% deserves to stay in command.
The series as a whole though has gone above my expectations in every way. This is what I wrote after the first trailer, and I am so glad to have been proven completely wrong.
Paradigm wrote: This seems like Backwards Trek to me; the visuals and effects are all there for once, but in that trailer at least there's no sense of substance beyond 'Klingons are bad' and 'First Officer who argues with the Captain'. I really want this to be good, but I'm not willing to trust it just yet.
Discovery is a very strong contender for my favourite show of the last year or so (only really rivalled by Stranger Things 2) and I look forward immensely to series 2. It's not been perfect throughout, but it's built an incredibly strong foundation for the future of the series, and proved that there's still a place for Star Trek in the 21st century, even if you have to approach things from a slightly different angle.
2018/02/12 22:04:52
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
Overall, thumbs up. And probably thumbs up for the series as a whole.
I still don't like the whole Lorca resolution thing, I think they could have done something better that. - And I still have real issues with the whole him being a paedophile thing...
But that's only 2 episodes out of 16. And I'm ok with them handling the rest.
2018/02/12 22:31:41
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
And playing it out with the original music as well, simply wonderful. Between the 'What is Starfleet' medal ceremony, that final scene and the original theme, anyone who still says this isn't 'proper' Star Trek is talking a load of nonsense!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/02/12 22:43:58
2018/02/13 09:30:28
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
I think the narrative risks they've taken ultimately paid off. Rather than needlessly re-invent Trek, they've just pushed things a little further - mixing the optimism of the Federation with the practicality we first glimpsed during DS9.
But, the main test is going to be how well it stands up to an old fashioned binge watch - which I'll be attempting this weekend. Replete with snacks of course.
Spoiler:
Not so much of a spoiler really, but just in case... I'm particularly impressed how well the show went without a ship's Captain and Central Team. It somehow felt a bit more fragmented than that - which I found a pleasant change of pace. Rather than the Captain shouldering all the burden, it was shared out amongst the leads.
What do I want from the next Season? More interaction with the remainder of the Bridge Crew. They've gone to lengths to avoid any of them looking like Ensign Anonymous, so please tell us of their tale and tribulations (and possibly tribbles. I'm always open to tribbles).
Other than that, continue with the arcing story - but a couple of stand alones wouldn't go amiss either.
Also. I seriously fancy Tilly. I think she is sweetly pretty.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/02/13 09:37:40
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
Not so much of a spoiler really, but just in case... I'm particularly impressed how well the show went without a ship's Captain and Central Team. It somehow felt a bit more fragmented than that - which I found a pleasant change of pace. Rather than the Captain shouldering all the burden, it was shared out amongst the leads.
What do I want from the next Season? More interaction with the remainder of the Bridge Crew. They've gone to lengths to avoid any of them looking like Ensign Anonymous, so please tell us of their tale and tribulations (and possibly tribbles. I'm always open to tribbles).
Other than that, continue with the arcing story - but a couple of stand alones wouldn't go amiss either.
The showrunners have said that with the war out of the way, the next series will probably have more standalone episodes and more classic Trek influences. Go to Planet, find a Thing, Adventures involving the Thing ensue. Not sure if it's a longer run or not, but if it is, they could certainly get away with more of that while keeping the arc up. They've also said they're going to continue to follow the Klingon characters going forward, rather than writing them out now the war's done.
2018/02/13 12:46:30
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
Really enjoyed the season but it really could have used at least one more episode to resolve the events of the finale. Felt rushed.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/02/14 06:59:23
BlaxicanX wrote: A young business man named Tom Kirby, who was a pupil of mine until he turned greedy, helped the capitalists hunt down and destroy the wargamers. He betrayed and murdered Games Workshop.
2018/02/14 08:36:42
Subject: Star Trek: Discovery - Disco is back January 2018
My minor issue is the lady at the end addresssing the council and tell them if they don’t put her in charge she presses this button and the world blows up. Like, how long does that hold up? Is her finger forever over the button? Why do they even believe her? At what point do they realize that’s federation tech and just go back to earth again to return the favor.
