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 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:

 adamsouza wrote:
A model count cap unfairly rewards elite armies.

I'm the first person, in this thread, to chime in about my experiences with horde tactics in Kill Team. I explored that option after my space marines force was shredded by Tau Pathfiders. While playing a single squad of Kill Team Space Marines is fluffy, it's simply not optimal given the rules. You are handicapping yourself, by limiting your offensive capabilities.

A tournament that limits model count, for time constraints, is definitely skewing what armies are viable in that setting, towards those that wear power armor.

Incidently, anyone thinking about participating in that tounament should invest in some Pathfinders with Rail Rifles, and perhaps a crisis suit with twin plasma.

I hardly see it as skewing it solely towards Power Armor forces. There are plenty of Small Elite units out there which can take out power armor with ease, either through weight of fire or having AP3 Weapons.

Not my point. You limit it to 15 models and you HAVE to take elite models with AP3 if you want to be competitive at all.
Adeptus Astartes, Adeptus Sororitas, Heretic Astartes, Necron Destroyers, Eldar Fire Dragons

What about Astra Militarum, Chaos Daemons, Orks ?

Yes, I'm sure those dozen orks in a trukk, without a painboy, will do fine... or those 10 imperial Guard....

At the risk of starting a flame war...but this was AWESOME.
Now get some more female figures for the Armies that have them...and get someone besides Matt Ward to write the SoBs fluff...

 BrookM wrote:
From Facebook:

We had a go at our first Kill Team game using the new rules yesterday.

Eddie brought some Tyranids, and Sarah brought some warriors from the Tau Empire. We kept our Kill Teams pretty straightforward for our first game, but we're both already keen to try out some different combinations next time.

One of the great things about Kill Team is that you see every unit in a new light. Units that may sit in the background of a bigger game can be surprisingly effective in a smaller skirmish match-up like this one.

How are your Kill Teams coming along?

 adamsouza wrote:

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:

 adamsouza wrote:
A model count cap unfairly rewards elite armies.

I'm the first person, in this thread, to chime in about my experiences with horde tactics in Kill Team. I explored that option after my space marines force was shredded by Tau Pathfiders. While playing a single squad of Kill Team Space Marines is fluffy, it's simply not optimal given the rules. You are handicapping yourself, by limiting your offensive capabilities.

A tournament that limits model count, for time constraints, is definitely skewing what armies are viable in that setting, towards those that wear power armor.

Incidently, anyone thinking about participating in that tounament should invest in some Pathfinders with Rail Rifles, and perhaps a crisis suit with twin plasma.

I hardly see it as skewing it solely towards Power Armor forces. There are plenty of Small Elite units out there which can take out power armor with ease, either through weight of fire or having AP3 Weapons.

Not my point. You limit it to 15 models and you HAVE to take elite models with AP3 if you want to be competitive at all.
Adeptus Astartes, Adeptus Sororitas, Heretic Astartes, Necron Destroyers, Eldar Fire Dragons

What about Astra Militarum, Chaos Daemons, Orks ?

Yes, I'm sure those dozen orks in a trukk, without a painboy, will do fine... or those 10 imperial Guard....

The Militarum that has Scions in the book? Has Carapace Vets with Plasma Guns? Sniper Vets? Ratlings? Ogryn? Chimera Vet Squads?

And no, you dont NEED AP3, Eldar have Blade Storm, IG have weight of fire even in small numbers.

Granted Orks could have problems, but there are Heavy Armor Nobs, Bikers.

Honeslty you've got me on Daemons cause I dont know enough about their list.

How about, They can play whatever they want in their own tournament and leave it at that eh?

I'm wondering if I can somehow make my converted Necromunda Goliaths into a kill team somehow. Maybe the cultist rules would work for them.

Certainly might actually get me playing 40k though, a good move GW

 Red__Thirst wrote:

 General Kroll wrote:
Are there links to these kill team list building/ painting threads?

The painting/showcase thread, not yet. Ben2 hasn't created it as yet that I've found.

The tactics/list building thread is here:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/701266.page

Hope that helps. Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

Thanks


Automatically Appended Next Post:

tpryan01 wrote:
At the risk of starting a flame war...but this was AWESOME.
Now get some more female figures for the Armies that have them...and get someone besides Matt Ward to write the SoBs fluff...

 BrookM wrote:
From Facebook:

We had a go at our first Kill Team game using the new rules yesterday.

Eddie brought some Tyranids, and Sarah brought some warriors from the Tau Empire. We kept our Kill Teams pretty straightforward for our first game, but we're both already keen to try out some different combinations next time.

One of the great things about Kill Team is that you see every unit in a new light. Units that may sit in the background of a bigger game can be surprisingly effective in a smaller skirmish match-up like this one.

How are your Kill Teams coming along?

Spoiler:

Agreed, warhammer tv and their Facebook offerings were starting to look like a boys club. Good to see some female representation.

Goliaths could certainly work as cultists, or as veterans from the Imperial Guard codex.

Orrrrrrr if you really want to use them as a squad of super meatheads straight from a Hollywood movie, use the Space Marine codex.

I'll have to dig out the cultist rules. Nothing is going to be perfect because I've got heavy flamers, heavy stubbers, shotguns, autopistols and plasma pistols all mixed in - but I'm sure my opponents won't care about a little bit of fudging.

Any excuse to get them on the table!

Go team Beef!

Army builder will do Kill team lists

Leggy wrote:15 is a bit tight. 25 seems fairer. A model cap is good for tournament play though. I went to a GW killteam tourniquet a few years back. Some guy brought 40 cultists. No-one could make a dentist in his force. He swamped everyone.
Not fun when you've brought 10 guys along.

So finally a week army can actually play and be competitive, but take it out of them because other people play with a smaller number? That is not fair and that is just telling people "play my way" instead of how the actual rules go. I am all up for house rules but this is one that is just not fair because people don't want to adapt to that tactic.

 tirnaog wrote:
Army builder will do Kill team lists

including the new skill ist?

What is the recommended table size for Kill Team? I assume that lots of scenery is the way to go?

 Thraxas Of Turai wrote:
What is the recommended table size for Kill Team? I assume that lots of scenery is the way to go?

One would assume 4x4 with lots of scenery.

4' X 4' with 50 - 75% terrain coverage.

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:

The Militarum that has Scions in the book? Has Carapace Vets with Plasma Guns? Sniper Vets? Ratlings? Ogryn? Chimera Vet Squads?.

Since when have Ogryns been a sane pick for... anything? They've always been a horrendous unit, and I doubt the current codex has much improved them.

I ran Ogryn for Kill Team once, sadly it was against the Tau, but they held their own in melee at least.

Yeah
I love how grots have spacemarines shaking in their boots!
Before the rules even land!

Glad this is just a house rule... Hope it doesn't gain traction .
But limiting squad size will limit the awesomeness that could be had in odd match ups;
Spacemarines sent to kill a grot rebel uprising.
Classic Guard vs Ork foot sloggers!

Panic.

 Agamemnon2 wrote:

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:

The Militarum that has Scions in the book? Has Carapace Vets with Plasma Guns? Sniper Vets? Ratlings? Ogryn? Chimera Vet Squads?.

Since when have Ogryns been a sane pick for... anything? They've always been a horrendous unit, and I doubt the current codex has much improved them.

Hey! I love my Ogryn, they might not work great against strong stuff, but they bully weak things really well, stick them up against guard squads and they go through them like a hot knife through butter. One after the other. Squish Squish Squish. Stick a priest with them for added hilarity.

The new White Dwarf has a blurb (on page 120) about an Eldar Kill Team with a Guardian squad, a Warlock leader and a War Walker. I don't have the Eldar Codex, but according to Battlescribe, the War Walker is a Heavy Support choice.

 Witchfinder General wrote:
The new White Dwarf has a blurb (on page 120) about an Eldar Kill Team with a Guardian squad, a Warlock leader and a War Walker. I don't have the Eldar Codex, but according to Battlescribe, the War Walker is a Heavy Support choice.

Forgeworld? There is a jump war walkers that's fa I think.

That's probably it. It looks like a regular War Walker, but probably counts as a FW Wasp Assault Walker (Elite).

 Agamemnon2 wrote:

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:

The Militarum that has Scions in the book? Has Carapace Vets with Plasma Guns? Sniper Vets? Ratlings? Ogryn? Chimera Vet Squads?.

Since when have Ogryns been a sane pick for... anything? They've always been a horrendous unit, and I doubt the current codex has much improved them.

Bullgryns aren't necessarily bad on a 4x4 table with lots of scenery with a lack of str 10 opponents and lack of monstrous creatures/gargantuan creatures or superheavies and lack of super formations. However fear wulven or anyone with str 10 melee. 3 bullgryn upgraded with brute shield and power mauls, a priest are 4+ armour 5+ invul (4+ invul w reroll priest) both are rerollable with priest, majority 5 toughness, fearless me stubborn and with 13xr 7 ap4 atks and a priest str6 ap2 smash atk that reroll to hit (zealot)and 3x str5 ap- with reroll to wound hammers wraith for 215pts. Ok your right it's not that great and you are better off with Militarum tempestus but it's ok in kill team.

gungo wrote:

 Agamemnon2 wrote:

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:

The Militarum that has Scions in the book? Has Carapace Vets with Plasma Guns? Sniper Vets? Ratlings? Ogryn? Chimera Vet Squads?.

Since when have Ogryns been a sane pick for... anything? They've always been a horrendous unit, and I doubt the current codex has much improved them.

Bullgryns aren't necessarily bad on a 4x4 table with lots of scenery with a lack of str 10 opponents and lack of monstrous creatures/gargantuan creatures or superheavies and lack of super formations. However fear wulven or anyone with str 10 melee. 3 bullgryn upgraded with brute shield and power mauls, a priest are 4+ armour 5+ invul (4+ invul w reroll priest) both are rerollable with priest, majority 5 toughness, fearless me stubborn and with 13xr 7 ap4 atks and a priest str6 ap2 smash atk that reroll to hit (zealot)and 3x str5 ap- with reroll to wound hammers wraith for 215pts. Ok your right it's not that great and you are better off with Militarum tempestus but it's ok in kill team.

Are you suggesting that bullgryn would get buffed by the priest? Because in Kill Team every model is their own unit so he can't transfer his buffs.

don't Buff become Bubbles? (or is that in HoR Only?)

tpryan01 wrote:
don't Buff become Bubbles? (or is that in HoR Only?)

Nope. As far as I know, there are no rules in Kill Team that alter unit buffing rules from models. I don't think you can even take a priest in Kill Team since they technically come from the HQ slot, even if they don't take up one.

Grimskul is correct.

Another example would be my Blood Angels Command Squad. The Sanguiniary Novitiate (medic) is locked into the squad. The model is also locked into his wargear, but has a Narthecium (He is a character too). His feel no pain normally is restricted to the squad, however in Killteam it only effects him sadly. Until I figured that out, I had planned on running the command squad as my Killteam. Now I'm working on a Death Company killteam.

In addition, the priest won't be allowed either, as it comes from the HQ slot, much like the Primaris Psyker. Wish certain HQ's were allowed, but them's the breaks.

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

So everyone knows the updated download is available now.

There are a few renamed skills(Fleshbane becomes "Killer Instinct" instead, for example) and I'm still looking everything over...but it's interesting from what I can see.

Reading it before finally racking out tonight, will answer questions tomorrow if nobody else has picked up the hurdle.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
PS:

There's a picture of a Genestealer Cult Kill Team fighting Ultramarines in there.

The digital edition(at least the iPad version) also includes the stuff from the Kill Team box as well so rules/layouts for "Strike Team Bright Conquest"(Tau) and Squad Stornus(Raven Guard).

Might anyone have a link for the download? (At work here still)

Just checking.

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

PPS:

Deathwatch are going to be mean as hell under this system, provided someone takes a Frag Cannon or Infernus Heavy Bolter and gives the wielder the "Reaping Volley" perk(attacks with a ranged weapon firing more than one shot may target different enemy models with each shot. Announce the intended target for each shot before making any To Hit rolls).

Eagle Eye is going to be nasty for a Tau force; increases the range of any ranged weapons fired by this model by half of their range(i.e. a Boltgun becomes 36" instead of 24"). It also does affect your Rapid Fire and Melta distances.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Red__Thirst wrote:
Might anyone have a link for the download? (At work here still)

Just checking.

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

You would need to go into your device(assuming you're on an Apple product), delete the old file and then redownload it. It automatically downloads the new file.

Reaping Volley = renamed split fire.

Eagle Eye is neat though!