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I could be mistaken Alpharius, but I believe the comment I saw simply said upgrading IN the PM will be doable, but won't be at the same price as if you pledge properly during the KS itself... which if you ask me, is completely fair.

I agree - that's perfectly fine.

But I thought that was a 'minimum to upgrade' level - but maybe not!

I'm about to go into an interview, and if all goes well I'll be backing later today. If not I'll be waiting for retail on this or Raising Sun from CMON depending on costs.

 Alpharius wrote:
I agree - that's perfectly fine.

But I thought that was a 'minimum to upgrade' level - but maybe not!

Or maybe yes!

Can I upgrade my pledge later in the Pledge Manager?

Any Pledge of $25 (Lotus Level) or higher will get access to the Pledge Manager later on after the Kickstarter Campaign is completed. In the Pledge Manager, you will be able to pay additional funds to upgrade your pledge to a Sumo or Shogun Level, but the cost of these levels will be higher than during the Kickstarter Campaign. We do not yet know what the upgrade cost in the Pledge Manager will be as it depends on how many stretch goals are unlocked and the cost to produce them.

 Alpharius wrote:
I'm in for Shogun, so I haven't really been paying attention to what FFP have said they would/would not allow in terms of PM 'upgrades'.

I think we know that "$1 Now, Upgrade Later" is out - so what is the confirmed minimum upgrade level?

From what I've seen, the $25 "Lotus" level will have access to the PM.

Edit: oh look, another page.

So, what you said...

Looks like we should finally get through that $700k barrier tonight.

Crossed it recently, though I'm not going to assume we're out of idiotic 'yo-yo range' for another couple thousand.

Barring some ridiculous 5k drop, however, I'm figuring the next update (possibly tonight, based on how they're getting pretty frequent now) will likely mention it almost regardless.

It's been too long in the making, gotta stoke that enthusiasm.

In case anyone hasn't been paying close attention, we've finally ticked over the 725k mark (Ally: Ronin Guard, figure/rules/cards), and hit a Social stretch goal/freebie (Bone Eaters, Belly of the Beast monsters).

Next target is the Spectral Horde (3 large figures) at 750k. Still sitting in the gradual increase that has characterized the middle of the campaign, but I remain hopeful we'll get to or very near the 800k mark by the time the 48 hour reminder emails go out, and break the 1m mark by the end.

Getting higher/more would be nice, but I certainly wouldn't complain if that was our final result.

I haven't been paying any attention, except for checking this thread occasionally. Timing couldn't be worse on this one, so while I'd like to go "all in", it's debatable whether I'll be able to go in at all. (and will remain so until the end).

I know everyone's all about the Kingdom Death hotness, but this is news!

They just added a pretty limited new couple of pledge tiers including the OLD Minecart that was said to be impossible to reproduce. Essentially $950 gets you EVERYTHING from the original Kickstarter and this Kickstarter, including stuff like the Outlaw class which goes for $100+ on Ebay alone.

They're going fast but that has also pushed us through three stretch-goals including the $800k unlock of the Forest of the Dead Otherworld.

When is a kickstarter exclusive not exclusive? When your campaign has been struggling along for weeks apparently.

I can see allowing the 'mine cart' all in aspect but the outlaw included just feels like a step too far.

No way I'm going shogun, I'll just wait out the Daimyo for when the next KS struggles.....

I don't see this one as struggling too much though, especially not in the face of the juggernaut that is KD:M 1.5.

This one still has a good shot at clearing $1M after all!

The Outlaw could be purchased as an add on during the first campaign for $20. Secondary market absurdity aside, it's a fun class and a nice addition, but I doubt it's the main cause people are dropping like a grand on this campaign all of a sudden.

And agreed; while it's not *exploding* like some campaigns do, in terms of a sequel campaign, I'd say treading water in the middle has been both expected and generally is what it is.

I think clearing 1 million is all but a given now, once those 48 hour reminder emails go out. 1.3 for the town? I hope, but unless this keeps up for the next 4 days in full, that seems like a bit of a reach.

Alpharius, if you've been following the campaign you'll know the whole 675k struggle and then it was flat lining until these mine cart like pledges came. Check kicktraq.

It's just annoyed me that something you pledge for years ago ( and have only received half of but that's another story) has now been used to prop up this KS. The expansions are fair game but the KS exclusive..... not so much. People would go nuts if zombicide released the S1 KS survivors for example.

Anyway the KS comments are so rose tinted anyone who complains gets yelled down.

I'm pleasantly surprised by the lack of major dip due to KDM.

It's one figure, two rules sheets, and a couple of cards. That Zombicide comparison is stretching things a bit.

As for the comments, they've been a toxic gakstorm for weeks. Frankly I'm not surprised that after finally getting a massive bump in movement there'd be a little pushback on people being dour still.

There's a couple of donkey caves in this campaign who would continue to give FFP grief if the company tucked a roll of hundred dollar bills in every package as it was shipped out.

Is this game as fun as Myth? :-)

Forar, I see where you are coming from, but the secondary market drives the 'value' of that exclusive.

For the last 3 weeks the comments have loved to express the secondary market 'value' of the sumo and Daimyo as propping up the pledges!

Each to their own, but I'm less bothered about Shogun now as no doubt the Daimyo will be available again at some point. Precedent set.

Here's hoping the town is reached as a lot of backers seem to want it, but I think it may just fall sort. 1 mil is probably a given at this point.

If these things come up as an opportunity once every 2-3 years, I'd say that's exclusive enough for my delicate sensibilities. :-P

Plus, if they are available again in the pledge manager, that could work to your favour. Even if extra Daimyo's are only available for purchase by Shogun backers, it'd mean you could possibly get in on that simply by knowing a Shogun who can hook you up with the PM goes live. Obviously it'd be beneficial if they were local to avoid extra shipping costs, but hopefully there'll be options.

Haha maybe 2-3 years is acceptable... when did the game ship again ;-p

I've been following the comments throughout so know what it's been like. Can't be doing with the white knights and constant brainwashing of value.

I know what you mean about a couple of the donkey caves though. Although I would have preferred more involvement from the frogs, something similar to MBP

Now to find a friendly Shogun....

 Fraggle wrote:
Haha maybe 2-3 years is acceptable... when did the game ship again ;op.

I'm not quite sure what you're asking here.

To take a stab at it; the Outlaw rules went out with Wave 1, which shipped in late 2014. If some "KS2 Mine Cart" people get theirs in the middle of 2017, that's nearly a 3 year 'exclusivity edge'.

And let's be real here, the game is not WYSIWYG; you can use any figure you like for any class, so the rules are the valuable thing, and I doubt five minutes on Google would disappoint me if I really wanted to find a digital copy of the character card, upgrade chart, and starter gear stats.

People being willing to pay for something they can ostensibly get for free is indicative of some pretty positive things. Using a 'real copy' as a carrot to help draw in what is approaching 150k before we even hit the final bump is pretty nice.

I'm seeing it as a win/win.

Well, debate aside... I've felt like, as someone who has quickly fallen head-over-heels for Shadows in the last month, that around 800k - 1 million, the game offers significant value at Shogun, IF you were inclined to ultimately buy it all eventually at retail or online shop prices.

In the last month the wife and I spend $500ish on a third of what Minecart backers once got for $400, and I don't feel jilted at all. If anything it just confirms that I LOVE the system, and thus know Shogun is an easy choice for us.

If I could 'add-on' the original Outlaw rules to my Forbidden Fortress Shogun pledge I would do it in a heart beat. I missed the original Kickstarter, but I have bought most of the releases retail (including both cores, caverns, trederra AND frontier town). The Outlaw is a big gaping hole in my collection that I am unlikely to be able to fill, as shelling out *checks ebay* $100 or $150 for it is patently out of the question. That's HALF of my Shogun pledge right there.

As others have said, Dragon... its a matter of how much you want to support the company. Clearly FFP has made a game in this that I had been asking for from the industry for a decade+. This is FINALLY, an even more content-rich, reimagined Warhammer Quest.

As such, I gladly will buy every single retail and FFP Webstore exclusive (and have been), and have gone in at Shogun for this KS.

But in doing so, i've show them my support... so when Google-fu accidentally resulted in my seeing the Outlaws skills, stats, etc... I wasn't TOO upset. ;-)

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
As others have said, Dragon... its a matter of how much you want to support the company. Clearly FFP has made a game in this that I had been asking for from the industry for a decade+. This is FINALLY, an even more content-rich, reimagined Warhammer Quest.

As such, I gladly will buy every single retail and FFP Webstore exclusive (and have been), and have gone in at Shogun for this KS.

But in doing so, i've show them my support... so when Google-fu accidentally resulted in my seeing the Outlaws skills, stats, etc... I wasn't TOO upset. ;-)

I think you're agreeing with me? I retail bought most of SoB because I love the game. I think the only FFP game I do not own is Fortune and Glory. I support them greatly. But I'm not going to support a third party to buy the Outlaw pack on eBay. I would buy it from FFP in a heart beat.

I do agree with you. :-p I'm just being coy because Mods scare me. :-p This post is the equivalent of explaining a joke. :-)

Just saying... we hardcore fans of the game should always show our love to FFP, and yes, if there was a way outside of Minecart 2 (and thus rebuying the entire game for many of us), I would leap at it.

But I can't so... ;-)

 Forar wrote:

To take a stab at it; the Outlaw rules went out with Wave 1, which shipped in late 2014. If some "KS2 Mine Cart" people get theirs in the middle of 2017, that's nearly a 3 year 'exclusivity edge'.

Did they? I don't think I actually got them. I got the two core boxes and a few extra red plastic sprues along with a huge invoice that was missing almost everything on it because wave shipping and multi-year delays. I do not recall any other content in my box.

Man, WHAT THE ?!?

I get off the plane and all of a sudden this thing is moving again!

FFP offers up new pledge levels that basically combine the mine cart with the shogun pledge, and offered up the upcoming otherworlds as well. This is where we are now.



The Forest Otherworld unlocked.

A monkey ally unlocked.

Fallen Sorcerers unlocked.

Giant Temple Dog statues unlocked.

A Japanese village expansion at 1.3m shown as well.

And the million dollar dragon's sculpt:


Who happens to be sitting on a 90mm base.

I REALLY hope the Feudal Town has different mechanics than the Frontier Town, if only to not render the other irrelevant.

Its shocking how much better of a game SoB is with the Frontier Town, so the thought of more of that for the new game, but where I will still want to visit both on occasion, excites me immensely.

Azazelex, all you should have for the Outlaw class so far is -

The double sided character card.
A double sided reference sheet with the upgrade chart.
Three Outlaw Starting Option cards: Hitman, Outlaw Charm, Reckless.
4 Starting Gear cards: 2×Outlaw Pistol, Bandanna, Sawed-Off Shotgun.

They were bundled up with the other promo cards.

Regarding exclusivity of the Outlaw class -

FFP worded the Outlaw exclusivity badly, from their comments during first Kickstarter it was clear that the only thing that actually was a Kickstarter exclusive was the sculpt with them intending to provide the rules on the website for free at some point in the future.

I don't mind them making more copies available now, the completionist in me would rather that all Kickstarter exclusives be timed exclusive rather than full on exclusives..

Just a semi-related head's up, but Flying Frog's webstore just updated with a limited restock of almost all the Gencon Limited Preview Classes.

I grabbed Frontier Doc, Jargono Native, Drifter, and Cowboy... but the others are still in stock too.