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 Melissia wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
The Sisters codex is midtier

Hey, whatever you have to tell yourself to sleep at night, man.

Play it as MSU Melta and Exorcist spam (and maybe a couple of Flamers) instead of going all out. The army suddenly makes sense. Leagues ahead of Blood Angels, CSM, Guard, DE, and Orks.

Or you think those armies are better somehow?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Pouncey wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:
Except you can. I've seen it done with metal, I've done it myself with metal, what's the issue?

YOU can. OTHERS can.

I CAN'T.

If I can work with metal you can too. No excuse outside you don't want to practice.

It's silly to think boycotting buying the models will have any impact at all on game balance.

GW sales have been declining for years, they took a huge hit when warmahordes came out because privateer press did this thing GW used to do called supporting the community, and they actually playtested their rules and made sure they worked. GW still didn't figure it out.

If writing god awful rules that a tuna fish sandwich could see were broken and driving customers away was going to be realized by them they'd have noticed by now. They literally don't even have QA for rules. But nope, they just keep lowering points so you need more models, making formations that are laughably OP but only if you buy 3 of every kit to be able to run them, ect.

That's the corporate world. My company (not GW) has been losing ground for 10 years, it's plain as day, our customers tell us exactly why they hate us, the employees and analysts tell the leadership exactly what the problem is. And instead of doing anything about it we crank our prices up by huge percentages every year and lower the quality of our product instead of actually trying to earn people's business.

Magnus can be killed with a single Stomp/D-shot. He costs over 600 points.

He might be cheese in an upcoming tournament build that someone surely will cook up, but there are worse things out there, point for point.

If anything is problematic in the new release, it's the Pink Horrors and what happens when you take them to the extreme. Magnus isn't an issue.

 Pouncey wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:
...Maybe you should think about what I just said.

There is no productive force I can do.

No option to make it better.

Every complaint about imbalanced rules and overpowered units on this forum is the same. All of it fruitless whining.

If you decide so.

Funny our games don't get screwed by GW the way yours are.

Difference? We decided to do something about it.

One post up, buddy. Just read one post up.

Nothing up that proves your faulty logic that there's nothing you can do.

You can do. If you want. We decided we wanted to do something. As a result GW's bad rules don't affect us and we play 40k with more enjoyment than ever before.

Difference between you and me? We wanted to do something. You just hide on false claim there's nothing you can do.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 kronk wrote:

 koooaei wrote:


why don't you get 3-d party

From reading all of his posts, I think Pouncey's issue with GW is not the models, it's the rules.

Which doesn't mean there's nothing he can do.

Actually that makes it EASIER. Miniatures can be lot harder to sort than rules depending on how specific your tastes are. At worst there would be literally no option but to make them yourself which is something most cannot do to level they are happy.

 Runic wrote:
Magnus can be killed with a single Stomp/D-shot. He costs over 600 points.

He might be cheese in an upcoming tournament build that someone surely will cook up, but there are worse things out there, point for point.

If anything is problematic in the new release, it's the Pink Horrors and what happens when you take them to the extreme. Magnus isn't an issue.

Hard to stomp him tho because he flies and strikes first. That Eldar flyer with D weapons might become more popular.

Agreedo the pink horrors are the worst and have potential to really break the game.

 axisofentropy wrote:
Hard to stomp him tho because he flies and strikes first. That Eldar flyer with D weapons might become more popular.

The problem with that Eldar Flyer is A) Death from the Skies makes it an Attack flyer and thus it loses Skyfire or B) The final draft FAQ removes the ability for skyfire blasts to hit FMCs

I thought of another reason why 2 WKs are actually bad against Magnus: Treason of Tzeentch. Magnus can "take control" of one WK to shoot at the other. Then he can D-beam that same WK and other targets.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Melissia wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
The Sisters codex is midtier

Hey, whatever you have to tell yourself to sleep at night, man.

Play it as MSU Melta and Exorcist spam (and maybe a couple of Flamers) instead of going all out. The army suddenly makes sense. Leagues ahead of Blood Angels, CSM, Guard, DE, and Orks.

Or you think those armies are better somehow?

This, basically. I take Retributors with Heavy Flamers instead of the Exorcists, though the Exorcists would probably be better. Full TLMM Immolators as transports. No Celestine, no Priests, no stupid CC units, just guns everywhere. You can squeeze 12 Immos in at 1850pts, half of which are ObSec carrying ObSec Sisters.

Built like that they're perfectly capable of giving any midtier armies a seriously bad day - in fact they're probably near the very top of midtier, able to smush similarly sub-optimal lists with ease. A few top tier builds are probably beatable with mech Sisters, but it'll be a seriously difficult matchup, and the likes of Taudar are out of your league - but that's how it goes if you choose to play a midtier army.

If I can work with metal you can too. No excuse outside you don't want to practice.

In fairness, converting metal models is an expensive thing to practise, and it's really easy to mess up. I've killed a fair few metal Kasrkins, Grey Knights and Dark Angels Vets in my time, but that was back in the days when metal minis weren't vastly more expensive than plastic ones; nowadays the same mistakes would cost me an arm and a leg.

okay so can I have a fmc dreadknight? So I can bitch slap magnus the red out of the sky with my greyknights?

 Xenomancers wrote:
okay so can I have a fmc dreadknight? So I can bitch slap magnus the red out of the sky with my greyknights?

I would be interested to see a fight between Magnus and 3 decked out DKs. My guess is that Magnus would still win.

 Galef wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
okay so can I have a fmc dreadknight? So I can bitch slap magnus the red out of the sky with my greyknights?

I would be interested to see a fight between Magnus and 3 decked out DKs. My guess is that Magnus would still win.

Just 1 - invis force and nullzone up. He will be a coward and fire d blast from the air though :(

Magnus strikes first, at S8 AP2, with 6 attacks (I'm assuming neither side charged, somehow). 4 hit, 3.33 wound, 2.22 go through their Invuln.

The Dreadknights then strike, with 4 attacks each, so 12 total, hitting on 4s for 6 hits, 5 wounds, 2.08 go through his saves.

The Dreadknights then strike first, since I gave them Hammers, and the math stays the same. 2.08 more wounds, Magnus is down to 2.84.

Magnus strikes back, with Force active this time (he didn't think to do it beforehand, or couldn't for some reason) and does another 2.22 wounds, downing two of the Dreadknights.

The last Dreadknight then strikes, 2 hits, 1.67 wounds, .70 through his save. Magnus is down to 2.14.

Magnus then murders the last Dreadknight.

Overall, ON AVERAGE, Magnus can win the fight with Force. If he (somehow) fails to get Force off, or more likely, gets a little unlucky or the GK player gets lucky with saves, it becomes less likely.

 JNAProductions wrote:
Magnus strikes first, at S8 AP2, with 6 attacks (I'm assuming neither side charged, somehow). 4 hit, 3.33 wound, 2.22 go through their Invuln.

The Dreadknights then strike, with 4 attacks each, so 12 total, hitting on 4s for 6 hits, 5 wounds, 2.08 go through his saves.

The Dreadknights then strike first, since I gave them Hammers, and the math stays the same. 2.08 more wounds, Magnus is down to 2.84.

Magnus strikes back, with Force active this time (he didn't think to do it beforehand, or couldn't for some reason) and does another 2.22 wounds, downing two of the Dreadknights.

The last Dreadknight then strikes, 2 hits, 1.67 wounds, .70 through his save. Magnus is down to 2.14.

Magnus then murders the last Dreadknight.

Overall, ON AVERAGE, Magnus can win the fight with Force. If he (somehow) fails to get Force off, or more likely, gets a little unlucky or the GK player gets lucky with saves, it becomes less likely.

And this is not taking it account the various spells Magnus can use other than Force, and the fact that the DKs would not use Force at all, but would try Banishment or Sanctuary.
I still think Magnus wins as I ma sure he gets some sort of awesome buff for himself. I'll have to check.

yeah - with magnus having force it's kind a done deal.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Galef wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
Magnus strikes first, at S8 AP2, with 6 attacks (I'm assuming neither side charged, somehow). 4 hit, 3.33 wound, 2.22 go through their Invuln.

The Dreadknights then strike, with 4 attacks each, so 12 total, hitting on 4s for 6 hits, 5 wounds, 2.08 go through his saves.

The Dreadknights then strike first, since I gave them Hammers, and the math stays the same. 2.08 more wounds, Magnus is down to 2.84.

Magnus strikes back, with Force active this time (he didn't think to do it beforehand, or couldn't for some reason) and does another 2.22 wounds, downing two of the Dreadknights.

The last Dreadknight then strikes, 2 hits, 1.67 wounds, .70 through his save. Magnus is down to 2.14.

Magnus then murders the last Dreadknight.

Overall, ON AVERAGE, Magnus can win the fight with Force. If he (somehow) fails to get Force off, or more likely, gets a little unlucky or the GK player gets lucky with saves, it becomes less likely.

And this is not taking it account the various spells Magnus can use other than Force, and the fact that the DKs would not use Force at all, but would try Banishment or Sanctuary.
I still think Magnus wins as I ma sure he gets some sort of awesome buff for himself. I'll have to check.

pretty sure force is your best bet. it's a 1 shot kill. not to mention - if you have psilencers you can attempt to get lucky twice. If I knew I was facing magnus I would certainly have psilencers.

 JNAProductions wrote:
Magnus strikes first, at S8 AP2, with 6 attacks (I'm assuming neither side charged, somehow). 4 hit, 3.33 wound, 2.22 go through their Invuln.

The Dreadknights then strike, with 4 attacks each, so 12 total, hitting on 4s for 6 hits, 5 wounds, 2.08 go through his saves.

The Dreadknights then strike first, since I gave them Hammers, and the math stays the same. 2.08 more wounds, Magnus is down to 2.84.

Magnus strikes back, with Force active this time (he didn't think to do it beforehand, or couldn't for some reason) and does another 2.22 wounds, downing two of the Dreadknights.

The last Dreadknight then strikes, 2 hits, 1.67 wounds, .70 through his save. Magnus is down to 2.14.

Magnus then murders the last Dreadknight.

Overall, ON AVERAGE, Magnus can win the fight with Force. If he (somehow) fails to get Force off, or more likely, gets a little unlucky or the GK player gets lucky with saves, it becomes less likely.

Don't forget that if Magnus activates Force on himself, he gets +1 to his Invulnerable Save when part of a Grand Cabal because of the "Blessing of Tzeentch" rule(Anything with Veterans of the Long War affected by a Blessing gets +1 Invulnerable Save).

 JimOnMars wrote:

 koooaei wrote:
I don't get how Magnus gets the hate and 90 horrors for 90 points don't.

What is drives me nuts about Tradio's "argument" is that 10 bolters get 1 wound on a gliding Magnus in rapid fire. If Magnus is buffed or swooping then the wound total is less than 1, but there's still a chance to ping him.

Those same bolteres will get exactly zero glances on a chaos rhino. Why is Tradio not ranting that chaos rhinos are overpowered?

Next thread: "Why You Should Boycott Chaos Rhinos"

 Kanluwen wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
Magnus strikes first, at S8 AP2, with 6 attacks (I'm assuming neither side charged, somehow). 4 hit, 3.33 wound, 2.22 go through their Invuln.

The Dreadknights then strike, with 4 attacks each, so 12 total, hitting on 4s for 6 hits, 5 wounds, 2.08 go through his saves.

The Dreadknights then strike first, since I gave them Hammers, and the math stays the same. 2.08 more wounds, Magnus is down to 2.84.

Magnus strikes back, with Force active this time (he didn't think to do it beforehand, or couldn't for some reason) and does another 2.22 wounds, downing two of the Dreadknights.

The last Dreadknight then strikes, 2 hits, 1.67 wounds, .70 through his save. Magnus is down to 2.14.

Magnus then murders the last Dreadknight.

Overall, ON AVERAGE, Magnus can win the fight with Force. If he (somehow) fails to get Force off, or more likely, gets a little unlucky or the GK player gets lucky with saves, it becomes less likely.

Don't forget that if Magnus activates Force on himself, he gets +1 to his Invulnerable Save when part of a Grand Cabal because of the "Blessing of Tzeentch" rule(Anything with Veterans of the Long War affected by a Blessing gets +1 Invulnerable Save).

SO all magus needs to have a 2++ save. Is to activate force on himself and be inside cursed earth? The is straight idiotic. 1/36 chance of anything wounding him and most everything is going to be hitting on 6's (functionally indestructible). Lets cap it off with the ability to cast 5 spells with 2+ success rate - the rules for this model are everything that is wrong with the game wrapped into one. Tradito is right - a boycot is necessary - and if you are buying this gak - you are actually the problem.

 Xenomancers wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
Magnus strikes first, at S8 AP2, with 6 attacks (I'm assuming neither side charged, somehow). 4 hit, 3.33 wound, 2.22 go through their Invuln.

The Dreadknights then strike, with 4 attacks each, so 12 total, hitting on 4s for 6 hits, 5 wounds, 2.08 go through his saves.

The Dreadknights then strike first, since I gave them Hammers, and the math stays the same. 2.08 more wounds, Magnus is down to 2.84.

Magnus strikes back, with Force active this time (he didn't think to do it beforehand, or couldn't for some reason) and does another 2.22 wounds, downing two of the Dreadknights.

The last Dreadknight then strikes, 2 hits, 1.67 wounds, .70 through his save. Magnus is down to 2.14.

Magnus then murders the last Dreadknight.

Overall, ON AVERAGE, Magnus can win the fight with Force. If he (somehow) fails to get Force off, or more likely, gets a little unlucky or the GK player gets lucky with saves, it becomes less likely.

Don't forget that if Magnus activates Force on himself, he gets +1 to his Invulnerable Save when part of a Grand Cabal because of the "Blessing of Tzeentch" rule(Anything with Veterans of the Long War affected by a Blessing gets +1 Invulnerable Save).

SO all magus needs to have a 2++ save. Is to activate force on himself and be inside cursed earth? The is straight idiotic. 1/36 chance of anything wounding him and most everything is going to be hitting on 6's (functionally indestructible). Lets cap it off with the ability to cast 5 spells with 2+ success rate - the rules for this model are everything that is wrong with the game wrapped into one. Tradito is right - a boycot is necessary - and if you are buying this gak - you are actually the problem.

You're not actually thinking about the model on the field. If he's swooping, all he's doing is using psykic powers, and he only has 5 WD by himself. It's like, ok sure he's flying around going pew pew, for 650 points. You can do a lot more with a lot less if you want something flying around shooting things. He's much better on the ground where he can charge and smash things with his staff while casting powers, thus making him more vulnerable but actually getting your points worth for him.

Honestly I don't know why I'm restating what's been said for pages on pages now. Just read through the thread, he really isn't that bad on paper. If you're insistent on killing him over objective secured units or other threats, maybe you need to rethink your strats.

 andysonic1 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
Magnus strikes first, at S8 AP2, with 6 attacks (I'm assuming neither side charged, somehow). 4 hit, 3.33 wound, 2.22 go through their Invuln.

The Dreadknights then strike, with 4 attacks each, so 12 total, hitting on 4s for 6 hits, 5 wounds, 2.08 go through his saves.

The Dreadknights then strike first, since I gave them Hammers, and the math stays the same. 2.08 more wounds, Magnus is down to 2.84.

Magnus strikes back, with Force active this time (he didn't think to do it beforehand, or couldn't for some reason) and does another 2.22 wounds, downing two of the Dreadknights.

The last Dreadknight then strikes, 2 hits, 1.67 wounds, .70 through his save. Magnus is down to 2.14.

Magnus then murders the last Dreadknight.

Overall, ON AVERAGE, Magnus can win the fight with Force. If he (somehow) fails to get Force off, or more likely, gets a little unlucky or the GK player gets lucky with saves, it becomes less likely.

Don't forget that if Magnus activates Force on himself, he gets +1 to his Invulnerable Save when part of a Grand Cabal because of the "Blessing of Tzeentch" rule(Anything with Veterans of the Long War affected by a Blessing gets +1 Invulnerable Save).

SO all magus needs to have a 2++ save. Is to activate force on himself and be inside cursed earth? The is straight idiotic. 1/36 chance of anything wounding him and most everything is going to be hitting on 6's (functionally indestructible). Lets cap it off with the ability to cast 5 spells with 2+ success rate - the rules for this model are everything that is wrong with the game wrapped into one. Tradito is right - a boycot is necessary - and if you are buying this gak - you are actually the problem.

You're not actually thinking about the model on the field. If he's swooping, all he's doing is using psykic powers, and he only has 5 WD by himself. It's like, ok sure he's flying around going pew pew, for 650 points. You can do a lot more with a lot less if you want something flying around shooting things. He's much better on the ground where he can charge and smash things with his staff while casting powers, thus making him more vulnerable but actually getting your points worth for him.

Honestly I don't know why I'm restating what's been said for pages on pages now. Just read through the thread, he really isn't that bad on paper. If you're insistent on killing him over objective secured units or other threats, maybe you need to rethink your strats.

Magnus is easily the most broken unit "rules wise" that GW has ever laid on 40k. That much is already quite clear. In case you havnt seen - change has a beam D shot (meaning autohit - ignores cover and can bypass invis) - in the same turn he can shoot your best unit at your next best unit and possibly cast some novas and witch-fires after. Easily capable of destroying 400 points a turn or more starting at turn 1. Anything a flying daemon could do before Magnus is doing about twice as good.

Why does the beam ignore cover?

 Xenomancers wrote:

 andysonic1 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
Magnus strikes first, at S8 AP2, with 6 attacks (I'm assuming neither side charged, somehow). 4 hit, 3.33 wound, 2.22 go through their Invuln.

The Dreadknights then strike, with 4 attacks each, so 12 total, hitting on 4s for 6 hits, 5 wounds, 2.08 go through his saves.

The Dreadknights then strike first, since I gave them Hammers, and the math stays the same. 2.08 more wounds, Magnus is down to 2.84.

Magnus strikes back, with Force active this time (he didn't think to do it beforehand, or couldn't for some reason) and does another 2.22 wounds, downing two of the Dreadknights.

The last Dreadknight then strikes, 2 hits, 1.67 wounds, .70 through his save. Magnus is down to 2.14.

Magnus then murders the last Dreadknight.

Overall, ON AVERAGE, Magnus can win the fight with Force. If he (somehow) fails to get Force off, or more likely, gets a little unlucky or the GK player gets lucky with saves, it becomes less likely.

Don't forget that if Magnus activates Force on himself, he gets +1 to his Invulnerable Save when part of a Grand Cabal because of the "Blessing of Tzeentch" rule(Anything with Veterans of the Long War affected by a Blessing gets +1 Invulnerable Save).

SO all magus needs to have a 2++ save. Is to activate force on himself and be inside cursed earth? The is straight idiotic. 1/36 chance of anything wounding him and most everything is going to be hitting on 6's (functionally indestructible). Lets cap it off with the ability to cast 5 spells with 2+ success rate - the rules for this model are everything that is wrong with the game wrapped into one. Tradito is right - a boycot is necessary - and if you are buying this gak - you are actually the problem.

You're not actually thinking about the model on the field. If he's swooping, all he's doing is using psykic powers, and he only has 5 WD by himself. It's like, ok sure he's flying around going pew pew, for 650 points. You can do a lot more with a lot less if you want something flying around shooting things. He's much better on the ground where he can charge and smash things with his staff while casting powers, thus making him more vulnerable but actually getting your points worth for him.

Honestly I don't know why I'm restating what's been said for pages on pages now. Just read through the thread, he really isn't that bad on paper. If you're insistent on killing him over objective secured units or other threats, maybe you need to rethink your strats.

Magnus is easily the most broken unit "rules wise" that GW has ever laid on 40k. That much is already quite clear. In case you havnt seen - change has a beam D shot (meaning autohit - ignores cover and can bypass invis) - in the same turn he can shoot your best unit at your next best unit and possibly cast some novas and witch-fires after. Easily capable of destroying 400 points a turn or more starting at turn 1. Anything a flying daemon could do before Magnus is doing about twice as good.

So, anything one FMC at 300~ points each can do, Magnus can do for 650? Assuming two FMC DPs with ML3, they get 6 warp charges combined compared to Magnus' 5, and can get some different powers compared to him filling a different roll each compared to him being just an offensive psyker. Also, his beam is five warp charges and 18 inches, so he has to get pretty close to your models to hit them with it, putting him closer to your guns and retaliation. In fact, most of his offensive spells are 18 inches. He has to get right up to you. I have no idea where you are getting the idea that he's going to just be spamming powers like some kind of primarch of the psyker god when he takes up so much of your army and brings only 5 warp charges with him.

 Xenomancers wrote:
If I knew I was facing magnus I would certainly have psilencers.

Why? Pscilencers wound him on 6s and only ever do 1 wound to him....because he is Eternal Warrior.
Which is a reason DKs would only ever try to use Sanctuary, since Force is worthless and Magnus can deny Banishment on a 3+ (+1 for Psyker, +1 for Ad Will, and +1 for being higher ML)

 andysonic1 wrote:
Also, his beam is five warp charges and 18 inches, so he has to get pretty close to your models to hit them with it, putting him closer to your guns and retaliation. In fact, most of his offensive spells are 18 inches. He has to get right up to you. I have no idea where you are getting the idea that he's going to just be spamming powers like some kind of primarch of the psyker god when he takes up so much of your army and brings only 5 warp charges with him.

Magnus has 2 D powers, 3 if you have any D shooting. The D-beam, the D shot from Change lore, and the power that takes control of an enemy unit and can shoot you will it.
Magnus also harnesses WC on 2+, meaning that he really only needs to roll 1 more die per WC to reliably get off any power.
5 WC only really need 6 dice for him to succeed.

Magnus is better that 2 DPs for sure. He costs the same as Fateweaver and Belakor combined, yet can do a lot more damage that both, although FW & Bels are better support units

 Galef wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
If I knew I was facing magnus I would certainly have psilencers.

Why? Pscilencers wound him on 6s and only ever do 1 wound to him....because he is Eternal Warrior.
Which is a reason DKs would only ever try to use Sanctuary, since Force is worthless and Magnus can deny Banishment on a 3+ (+1 for Psyker, +1 for Ad Will, and +1 for being higher ML)

 andysonic1 wrote:
Also, his beam is five warp charges and 18 inches, so he has to get pretty close to your models to hit them with it, putting him closer to your guns and retaliation. In fact, most of his offensive spells are 18 inches. He has to get right up to you. I have no idea where you are getting the idea that he's going to just be spamming powers like some kind of primarch of the psyker god when he takes up so much of your army and brings only 5 warp charges with him.

Magnus has 2 D powers, 3 if you have any D shooting. The D-beam, the D shot from Change lore, and the power that takes control of an enemy unit and can shoot you will it.
Magnus also harnesses WC on 2+, meaning that he really only needs to roll 1 more die per WC to reliably get off any power.
5 WC only really need 6 dice for him to succeed.

Magnus is better that 2 DPs for sure. He costs the same as Fateweaver and Belakor combined, yet can do a lot more damage that both, although FW & Bels are better support units

Eternal warrior - holy crap - this just keeps getting better and better. He is immune to all but 6's on d shots. Which he is practicaly immune to by being flying and being able to use your own D against you...jezz.

You know Magnus doesn't know Cursed Earth, right? So best he's getting, by himself, is a 4+ rerolling 1s. If taken in a formation, he can give himself a 3+ rerolling 1s with any Blessing (Force comes to mind), but he absolutely requires support to net a 2+ rerollable. And if he has that support, it has to be able to keep up, meaning Magnus is either on the ground, or you dropped around 300 points on a flying Cursed Earth caster.

 Xenomancers wrote:
Tradito is right - a boycot is necessary - and if you are buying this gak - you are actually the problem.

Nah. I don't particularly care since even if I were to buy that model the rules would be irrelevant for our games.

Now the reason I don't buy him at least currently are a) his price b) oversized horns c) primarch sized models are too big for 40k games.

But what do we care about GW's crappy rules when there's better option available for 40k...

 JNAProductions wrote:
You know Magnus doesn't know Cursed Earth, right? So best he's getting, by himself, is a 4+ rerolling 1s. If taken in a formation, he can give himself a 3+ rerolling 1s with any Blessing (Force comes to mind), but he absolutely requires support to net a 2+ rerollable. And if he has that support, it has to be able to keep up, meaning Magnus is either on the ground, or you dropped around 300 points on a flying Cursed Earth caster.

You can just get a chaos sorcerer on a mount to keep up and cast cursed earth and that's around 100 pints. Or get a loyalist Lib on a bike for 85.

 mew28 wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
You know Magnus doesn't know Cursed Earth, right? So best he's getting, by himself, is a 4+ rerolling 1s. If taken in a formation, he can give himself a 3+ rerolling 1s with any Blessing (Force comes to mind), but he absolutely requires support to net a 2+ rerollable. And if he has that support, it has to be able to keep up, meaning Magnus is either on the ground, or you dropped around 300 points on a flying Cursed Earth caster.

You can just get a chaos sorcerer on a mount to keep up and cast cursed earth and that's around 100 pints. Or get a loyalist Lib on a bike for 85.

you still have to roll cursed earth. Also I can just kill the sorcerer he won't have 2++ invul

Danny slag wrote:GW sales have been declining for years, they took a huge hit when warmahordes came out because privateer press did this thing GW used to do called supporting the community, and they actually playtested their rules and made sure they worked. GW still didn't figure it out.

I think a lot of people can disagree with you here. Warmahordes 3.0 isn't going off to well from what I read. It's already in "fix mode" so even the al mighty Privateer Press can't do things correctly the first time around or even the third time around by "playtesting" and making sure they work. Difference is at least Privateer Press is willing to go into "fix mode" right away when they make a mistake.

GW is changing. It will take time for them to become great, but to say PP can do no wrong is just false in my opinion. Only time will tell if GW is willing to go what PP does.

 JNAProductions wrote:
You know Magnus doesn't know Cursed Earth, right? So best he's getting, by himself, is a 4+ rerolling 1s. If taken in a formation, he can give himself a 3+ rerolling 1s with any Blessing (Force comes to mind), but he absolutely requires support to net a 2+ rerollable. And if he has that support, it has to be able to keep up, meaning Magnus is either on the ground, or you dropped around 300 points on a flying Cursed Earth caster.

An army with daemons in it without getting cursed earth seems highly unlikely.

To be fair, a large portion of the appeal of WM 1E at launch was that the starter box was really cheap on the Internet, and you could get playing casually with a $30-ish box, no rulebook or other stuff. WM has never had any sort of internal balance, but it did luck into having good external balance, and that was enough for many players. Of course, they only had to externally balance 4 factions at the time (Mercs weren't balanced, IIRC), which is the same as the current top tier of 40k competitive play. If GW were to restrict 40k to SM, Eldar, Tau & Necrons, then they'd be considered a model of balance, too. The Eldar S(D) toys would balance off the MSU bonus of FREE Transports which trades off against unkillable WBBs.

 Xenomancers wrote:

 Galef wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
If I knew I was facing magnus I would certainly have psilencers.

Why? Pscilencers wound him on 6s and only ever do 1 wound to him....because he is Eternal Warrior.
Which is a reason DKs would only ever try to use Sanctuary, since Force is worthless and Magnus can deny Banishment on a 3+ (+1 for Psyker, +1 for Ad Will, and +1 for being higher ML)

 andysonic1 wrote:
Also, his beam is five warp charges and 18 inches, so he has to get pretty close to your models to hit them with it, putting him closer to your guns and retaliation. In fact, most of his offensive spells are 18 inches. He has to get right up to you. I have no idea where you are getting the idea that he's going to just be spamming powers like some kind of primarch of the psyker god when he takes up so much of your army and brings only 5 warp charges with him.

Magnus has 2 D powers, 3 if you have any D shooting. The D-beam, the D shot from Change lore, and the power that takes control of an enemy unit and can shoot you will it.
Magnus also harnesses WC on 2+, meaning that he really only needs to roll 1 more die per WC to reliably get off any power.
5 WC only really need 6 dice for him to succeed.

Magnus is better that 2 DPs for sure. He costs the same as Fateweaver and Belakor combined, yet can do a lot more damage that both, although FW & Bels are better support units

Eternal warrior - holy crap - this just keeps getting better and better. He is immune to all but 6's on d shots. Which he is practicaly immune to by being flying and being able to use your own D against you...jezz.

He's 650 points. Did you not expect EW or something? Like, really?