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Made in us
Rebel_Princess





So...I haven't played 40k since the end of 3rd edition. At the time I played Steel Legion Imperial Guard. Currently, I play Warmachine almost exclusively, but I've been wanting to play a game that benefits from non-2D terrain and has "forge the narrative" ethos behind it. Unfortunately, looking at the "Start Collecting" boxes, I've been drawn to the Eldar box. I always liked Saim Hann and Biel Tan equally. However, since most of the Aspect Warriors are Finecash, I'd rather opt to play the entirely plastic army. I'm also quite fond of painting red.

I haven't looked at 40k rules in over a decade, but the impression I get is that Eldar are considered to be extremely overpowered, alongside Tau. I get my competitive kicks from Warmachine and really want to play a game where I can kick back and have fun. Is this even possible to do with Eldar, or will my army selection paint me as a powergaming bandwagoneer?

Here's how I was thinking of building my collection:
2 Start Collecting Boxes
1 Box of Vypers
3 jetbike mounted warlocks
1 Crimson Hunter
1 Hemlock

After building this core I'd probably want to get some Harlequins in the mix. Is this a bad idea for a fluff bunny to pursue?
   
Made in us
Sinewy Scourge




Boulder, Colorado

Eh, bringing three warlocks is a bit much, and generally, since bikes are so good, people might wince when you bring out your list.

However, if you bring one in three special weapons on the bikes, or no special weapons on the bikes, they tend to even out and aren't nearly as overpowered.

One thing to note is that you're gonna have a lot of psychers, 5 warlocks/farseers in any combination, which some may consider too strong.

The vypers kinda suck so that is a good way to help knock eldar down a bit, and so is a crimson hunter.

The tanks that can be built out of the SC are all pretty good but nothing too strong.

   
Made in us
Terminator with Assault Cannon





The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/12/11 09:24:24


 
   
Made in gb
Executing Exarch






Jetbikes get alot of flakk when the unit is fully loaded with scatter lasers, but other than that most hate against CW Eldar is directed at lists which spam Warp Spiders and Wraithknights.

Jetbike Warlocks aren't really that dangerous, they're only bad when they're in a big Seer Council rolling around with Fortune. If you're using them to lead normal Jetbike units, I wouldn't think you'd have a problem.

When building the Fire Prisms I'll suggest constructing them in such a way that you can swap the weapons for the Nightspinner - Prisms are cool, and versatile, but you'll want to try out the 'Spinner a few times too.
   
Made in gb
Shas'ui with Bonding Knife






 Traditio wrote:
The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.


You can basically ignore Traditio, and as long as you don't spam wraithguard, jetbikes with scatterlasers, wraithkinghts, huge seer councils, and warp spiders you should be fine.

DQ:90S++G++M----B--I+Pw40k07+D+++A+++/areWD-R+DM+


bittersashes wrote:One guy down at my gaming club swore he saw an objective flag take out a full unit of Bane Thralls.
 
   
Made in gb
Boosting Space Marine Biker




midlands UK

I have to agree with Wolfblade.

Almost every store I've been to has an Eldar army, and so long as you don't go full cheddar you should be okay.

Blood Ravens, 1700pts

Empire 40 wounds

Astra Militarum 2250pts

Khorne 750pts

Space Wolves 1550pts

Orks 500pts

 
   
Made in ca
Lord of the Fleet






Halifornia, Nova Scotia

 Traditio wrote:
The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.


Don't worry, someone would have to want to play with you in the first place for you to deny them playing with you.

Mordian Iron Guard - Major Overhaul in Progress

+Spaceship Gaming Enthusiast+

Live near Halifax, NS? Ask me about our group, the Ordo Haligonias! 
   
Made in gb
Stern Iron Priest with Thrall Bodyguard



UK

No one likes space elves they've been ruining the meta for so long people will give you odd looks from the outset.

You should play what you want but others may not want to play with you.

   
Made in gb
Agile Revenant Titan






Eh, screw the haters. So long as you don't spam Scatbikes, Warp Spiders and D-Scythe Wraithguard you should be fine

It's very easy to make a less WAAC eldar army.

Check out may pan-Eldar projects http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/702683.page

Also my Rogue Trader-esque spaceport factions http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/709686.page

Oh, and I've come up with a semi-expanded Shadow War idea and need some feedback! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/726439.page

Lastly I contribute to a blog too! http://objectivesecured.blogspot.co.uk/ Check it out! It's not just me  
   
Made in us
Librarian with Freaky Familiar






Well lets see, you arnt running full scatter laser bikes nor is there a wraith knight, so good and not cheese to me.

To many unpainted models to count. 
   
Made in us
Sinewy Scourge




Boulder, Colorado

Dont listen to Traditio, he is the laughing stock of this forum.

   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Hyperspace

 gummyofallbears wrote:
Dont listen to Traditio, he is the laughing stock of this forum.

No, that's Zilka.



Peregrine - If you like the army buy it, and don't worry about what one random person on the internet thinks.
 
   
Made in es
Brutal Black Orc




Barcelona, Spain

 Verviedi wrote:
 gummyofallbears wrote:
Dont listen to Traditio, he is the laughing stock of this forum.

No, that's Zilka.


Both of them are the laughingstock of the forum.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Hyperspace

Lord Kragan wrote:
 Verviedi wrote:
 gummyofallbears wrote:
Dont listen to Traditio, he is the laughing stock of this forum.

No, that's Zilka.


Both of them are the laughingstock of the forum.

I agree wholeheartedly.



Peregrine - If you like the army buy it, and don't worry about what one random person on the internet thinks.
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






 Traditio wrote:
The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.


You see, this is the type of mentality that is a blight upon this website and community.
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




 Traditio wrote:
The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.

People like this are best avoided anyway.

A major factor is what weapons your jetbikes will have. If they all have scatter lasers you'll get a lot more hate than you would if you did something like "one heavy weapon per 3 bikes".

tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam  
   
Made in gb
Keeper of the Holy Orb of Antioch





avoiding the lorax on Crion

pm713 wrote:
 Traditio wrote:
The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.

People like this are best avoided anyway.

A major factor is what weapons your jetbikes will have. If they all have scatter lasers you'll get a lot more hate than you would if you did something like "one heavy weapon per 3 bikes".


Aye.. Its also your list choices not just what it is all the time.
Just because your eldar. Does not guarantee cheese.

Sgt. Vanden - OOC Hey, that was your doing. I didn't choose to fly in the "Dongerprise'.

"May the odds be ever in your favour"

Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
I have no clue how Dakka's moderation work. I expect it involves throwing a lot of d100 and looking at many random tables.

FudgeDumper - It could be that you are just so uncomfortable with the idea of your chapters primarch having his way with a docile tyranid spore cyst, that you must deny they have any feelings at all.  
   
Made in us
Terminator with Assault Cannon





pm713 wrote:A major factor is what weapons your jetbikes will have. If they all have scatter lasers you'll get a lot more hate than you would if you did something like "one heavy weapon per 3 bikes".


I agree that 1 per 3 will get less hate than spamming scatter lasers.

However, in my view, 1 per 3 still leaves him with something that's too effective and points efficient for its points cost. 1 scatter laser per 3 bikes is still 61 points for something that's tough, highly mobile, relentless and has a high rate of fire heavy weapon.

Yes, some eldar builds are less OP than others.

But the codex is filled with a plethora of OP, unduly points efficient options that are hands down better than equivalents in other codices.

You actually have to work hard to make a bad eldar list.

My advice is to stick with a different codex if you don't want people to shun you based on the title of your codex.

If you like pointy ears, may I recommend dark eldar?

You'll lose more often. But people won't shun you because of your codex.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/12/12 00:51:14


 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




 Traditio wrote:
pm713 wrote:A major factor is what weapons your jetbikes will have. If they all have scatter lasers you'll get a lot more hate than you would if you did something like "one heavy weapon per 3 bikes".


I agree that 1 per 3 will get less hate than spamming scatter lasers.

However, in my view, 1 per 3 still leaves him with something that's too effective and points efficient for its points cost. 1 scatter laser per 3 bikes is still 61 points for something that's tough, highly mobile, relentless and has a high rate of fire heavy weapon.

Yes, some eldar builds are less OP than others.

But the codex is filled with a plethora of OP, unduly points efficient options that are hands down better than equivalents in other codices.

You actually have to work hard to make a bad eldar list.

My advice is to stick with a different codex if you don't want people to shun you based on the title of your codex.

If you like pointy ears, may I recommend dark eldar?

Most codexes have things that are too strong. Like Space Marines. Realistically nobody will shun you because of the army without even looking at it. Only a real donkey cave or lunatic would do that because it's so unreasonable.

tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam  
   
Made in us
Sinewy Scourge




Boulder, Colorado

 Traditio wrote:
pm713 wrote:A major factor is what weapons your jetbikes will have. If they all have scatter lasers you'll get a lot more hate than you would if you did something like "one heavy weapon per 3 bikes".


I agree that 1 per 3 will get less hate than spamming scatter lasers.

However, in my view, 1 per 3 still leaves him with something that's too effective and points efficient for its points cost. 1 scatter laser per 3 bikes is still 61 points for something that's tough, highly mobile, relentless and has a high rate of fire heavy weapon.

Yes, some eldar builds are less OP than others.

But the codex is filled with a plethora of OP, unduly points efficient options that are hands down better than equivalents in other codices.

You actually have to work hard to make a bad eldar list.

My advice is to stick with a different codex if you don't want people to shun you based on the title of your codex.

If you like pointy ears, may I recommend dark eldar?

You'll lose more often. But people won't shun you because of your codex.


Traditio's stupidity never fails to impress.

   
Made in us
Terminator with Assault Cannon





pm713 wrote:Most codexes have things that are too strong. Like Space Marines. Realistically nobody will shun you because of the army without even looking at it. Only a real donkey cave or lunatic would do that because it's so unreasonable.


Most codices have a handful of things that are too strong, and usually only when taken in very specific combinations.

The eldar codex is literally: "Randomly pick units from the codex until you meet the points total. Congrats. You have an OP list."
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




 Traditio wrote:
pm713 wrote:Most codexes have things that are too strong. Like Space Marines. Realistically nobody will shun you because of the army without even looking at it. Only a real donkey cave or lunatic would do that because it's so unreasonable.


Most codices have a handful of things that are too strong, and usually only when taken in very specific combinations.

The eldar codex is literally: "Randomly pick units from the codex until you meet the points total. Congrats. You have an OP list."

You need to check your idea of OP. It's way out of whack.

tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam  
   
Made in us
Douglas Bader






pm713 wrote:
You need to check your idea of OP. It's way out of whack.


A 5-man tactical squad with a missile launcher can't beat a 2000 point Eldar army. Eldar are OP.

There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. 
   
Made in us
Terminator with Assault Cannon





 Peregrine wrote:
pm713 wrote:
You need to check your idea of OP. It's way out of whack.


A 5-man tactical squad with a missile launcher can't beat a 2000 point Eldar army. Eldar are OP.


This is a massive strawman, and you perfectly well know it.
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




 Traditio wrote:
 Peregrine wrote:
pm713 wrote:
You need to check your idea of OP. It's way out of whack.


A 5-man tactical squad with a missile launcher can't beat a 2000 point Eldar army. Eldar are OP.


This is a massive strawman, and you perfectly well know it.

It looks more like a mocking insult to me.

tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam  
   
Made in us
Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter







So I guess the lesson of this thread is that you won't get as much hate for playing Eldar as you will for being Traditio and shouting about them.

Balanced Game: Noun. A game in which all options and choices are worth using.
Homebrew oldhammer project: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/790996.page#10896267
Meridian: Necromunda-based 40k skirmish: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/795374.page 
   
Made in us
Guard Heavy Weapon Crewman




Nevada

Paint all your eldar blue, and call them ultramarines.

No one will suspect anything, such is the way of your (mine) tactical genius.
   
Made in us
Sinewy Scourge




Boulder, Colorado

 Traditio wrote:
 Peregrine wrote:
pm713 wrote:
You need to check your idea of OP. It's way out of whack.


A 5-man tactical squad with a missile launcher can't beat a 2000 point Eldar army. Eldar are OP.


This is a massive strawman, and you perfectly well know it.


It's a crazy thing called a joke, it's strange you don't know what they are considering all your posts on this forum fall under that category.

   
Made in us
Gun Mage





Yeah.... trying to be diplomatic here, but I think a lot of people figure out that it's best to ignore Traditio.
   
Made in gb
Missionary On A Mission






 Bloviator wrote:
Here's how I was thinking of building my collection:
2 Start Collecting Boxes
1 Box of Vypers
3 jetbike mounted warlocks
1 Crimson Hunter
1 Hemlock


I'd play against that no problem. Games against fast, shooty Eldar armies are always tough but really good fun. I don't really like the Crimson Hunters or Hemlocks, but if you're building around fluff then there's no reason not to take them. They're decent units, I just happen not to like them.

EDIT: The Vypers likewise. Maybe try to get a few more Jetbikes or something - but again, if you're building around your fluff then Vypers are fine.

If you get any hate at all it's because people are wimps.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/12/12 02:43:23


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