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So...I haven't played 40k since the end of 3rd edition. At the time I played Steel Legion Imperial Guard. Currently, I play Warmachine almost exclusively, but I've been wanting to play a game that benefits from non-2D terrain and has "forge the narrative" ethos behind it. Unfortunately, looking at the "Start Collecting" boxes, I've been drawn to the Eldar box. I always liked Saim Hann and Biel Tan equally. However, since most of the Aspect Warriors are Finecash, I'd rather opt to play the entirely plastic army. I'm also quite fond of painting red.

I haven't looked at 40k rules in over a decade, but the impression I get is that Eldar are considered to be extremely overpowered, alongside Tau. I get my competitive kicks from Warmachine and really want to play a game where I can kick back and have fun. Is this even possible to do with Eldar, or will my army selection paint me as a powergaming bandwagoneer?

Here's how I was thinking of building my collection:
2 Start Collecting Boxes
1 Box of Vypers
3 jetbike mounted warlocks
1 Crimson Hunter
1 Hemlock

After building this core I'd probably want to get some Harlequins in the mix. Is this a bad idea for a fluff bunny to pursue?

Eh, bringing three warlocks is a bit much, and generally, since bikes are so good, people might wince when you bring out your list.

However, if you bring one in three special weapons on the bikes, or no special weapons on the bikes, they tend to even out and aren't nearly as overpowered.

One thing to note is that you're gonna have a lot of psychers, 5 warlocks/farseers in any combination, which some may consider too strong.

The vypers kinda suck so that is a good way to help knock eldar down a bit, and so is a crimson hunter.

The tanks that can be built out of the SC are all pretty good but nothing too strong.

The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.

Jetbikes get alot of flakk when the unit is fully loaded with scatter lasers, but other than that most hate against CW Eldar is directed at lists which spam Warp Spiders and Wraithknights.

Jetbike Warlocks aren't really that dangerous, they're only bad when they're in a big Seer Council rolling around with Fortune. If you're using them to lead normal Jetbike units, I wouldn't think you'd have a problem.

When building the Fire Prisms I'll suggest constructing them in such a way that you can swap the weapons for the Nightspinner - Prisms are cool, and versatile, but you'll want to try out the 'Spinner a few times too.

 Traditio wrote:
The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.

You can basically ignore Traditio, and as long as you don't spam wraithguard, jetbikes with scatterlasers, wraithkinghts, huge seer councils, and warp spiders you should be fine.

I have to agree with Wolfblade.

Almost every store I've been to has an Eldar army, and so long as you don't go full cheddar you should be okay.

 Traditio wrote:
The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.

Don't worry, someone would have to want to play with you in the first place for you to deny them playing with you.

No one likes space elves they've been ruining the meta for so long people will give you odd looks from the outset.

You should play what you want but others may not want to play with you.

Eh, screw the haters. So long as you don't spam Scatbikes, Warp Spiders and D-Scythe Wraithguard you should be fine

It's very easy to make a less WAAC eldar army.

Well lets see, you arnt running full scatter laser bikes nor is there a wraith knight, so good and not cheese to me.

Dont listen to Traditio, he is the laughing stock of this forum.

 gummyofallbears wrote:
Dont listen to Traditio, he is the laughing stock of this forum.

No, that's Zilka.

 Verviedi wrote:

 gummyofallbears wrote:
Dont listen to Traditio, he is the laughing stock of this forum.

No, that's Zilka.

Both of them are the laughingstock of the forum.

Lord Kragan wrote:

 Verviedi wrote:

 gummyofallbears wrote:
Dont listen to Traditio, he is the laughing stock of this forum.

No, that's Zilka.

Both of them are the laughingstock of the forum.

I agree wholeheartedly.

 Traditio wrote:
The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.

You see, this is the type of mentality that is a blight upon this website and community.

 Traditio wrote:
The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.

People like this are best avoided anyway.

A major factor is what weapons your jetbikes will have. If they all have scatter lasers you'll get a lot more hate than you would if you did something like "one heavy weapon per 3 bikes".

pm713 wrote:

 Traditio wrote:
The fact that you are playing eldar at all means that at least some people might deny you games.

Personally, I don't even care what your army list is. If I see pointy ears and stupid looking helmets on your models and the word "craftworlds" on the front cover of your codex, I'm not playing with you.

People like this are best avoided anyway.

A major factor is what weapons your jetbikes will have. If they all have scatter lasers you'll get a lot more hate than you would if you did something like "one heavy weapon per 3 bikes".

Aye.. Its also your list choices not just what it is all the time.
Just because your eldar. Does not guarantee cheese.

pm713 wrote:A major factor is what weapons your jetbikes will have. If they all have scatter lasers you'll get a lot more hate than you would if you did something like "one heavy weapon per 3 bikes".

I agree that 1 per 3 will get less hate than spamming scatter lasers.

However, in my view, 1 per 3 still leaves him with something that's too effective and points efficient for its points cost. 1 scatter laser per 3 bikes is still 61 points for something that's tough, highly mobile, relentless and has a high rate of fire heavy weapon.

Yes, some eldar builds are less OP than others.

But the codex is filled with a plethora of OP, unduly points efficient options that are hands down better than equivalents in other codices.

You actually have to work hard to make a bad eldar list.

My advice is to stick with a different codex if you don't want people to shun you based on the title of your codex.

If you like pointy ears, may I recommend dark eldar?

You'll lose more often. But people won't shun you because of your codex.

 Traditio wrote:

pm713 wrote:A major factor is what weapons your jetbikes will have. If they all have scatter lasers you'll get a lot more hate than you would if you did something like "one heavy weapon per 3 bikes".

I agree that 1 per 3 will get less hate than spamming scatter lasers.

However, in my view, 1 per 3 still leaves him with something that's too effective and points efficient for its points cost. 1 scatter laser per 3 bikes is still 61 points for something that's tough, highly mobile, relentless and has a high rate of fire heavy weapon.

Yes, some eldar builds are less OP than others.

But the codex is filled with a plethora of OP, unduly points efficient options that are hands down better than equivalents in other codices.

You actually have to work hard to make a bad eldar list.

My advice is to stick with a different codex if you don't want people to shun you based on the title of your codex.

If you like pointy ears, may I recommend dark eldar?

Most codexes have things that are too strong. Like Space Marines. Realistically nobody will shun you because of the army without even looking at it. Only a real donkey cave or lunatic would do that because it's so unreasonable.

 Traditio wrote:

pm713 wrote:A major factor is what weapons your jetbikes will have. If they all have scatter lasers you'll get a lot more hate than you would if you did something like "one heavy weapon per 3 bikes".

I agree that 1 per 3 will get less hate than spamming scatter lasers.

However, in my view, 1 per 3 still leaves him with something that's too effective and points efficient for its points cost. 1 scatter laser per 3 bikes is still 61 points for something that's tough, highly mobile, relentless and has a high rate of fire heavy weapon.

Yes, some eldar builds are less OP than others.

But the codex is filled with a plethora of OP, unduly points efficient options that are hands down better than equivalents in other codices.

You actually have to work hard to make a bad eldar list.

My advice is to stick with a different codex if you don't want people to shun you based on the title of your codex.

If you like pointy ears, may I recommend dark eldar?

You'll lose more often. But people won't shun you because of your codex.

Traditio's stupidity never fails to impress.

pm713 wrote:Most codexes have things that are too strong. Like Space Marines. Realistically nobody will shun you because of the army without even looking at it. Only a real donkey cave or lunatic would do that because it's so unreasonable.

Most codices have a handful of things that are too strong, and usually only when taken in very specific combinations.

The eldar codex is literally: "Randomly pick units from the codex until you meet the points total. Congrats. You have an OP list."

 Traditio wrote:

pm713 wrote:Most codexes have things that are too strong. Like Space Marines. Realistically nobody will shun you because of the army without even looking at it. Only a real donkey cave or lunatic would do that because it's so unreasonable.

Most codices have a handful of things that are too strong, and usually only when taken in very specific combinations.

The eldar codex is literally: "Randomly pick units from the codex until you meet the points total. Congrats. You have an OP list."

You need to check your idea of OP. It's way out of whack.

pm713 wrote:
You need to check your idea of OP. It's way out of whack.

A 5-man tactical squad with a missile launcher can't beat a 2000 point Eldar army. Eldar are OP.

 Peregrine wrote:

pm713 wrote:
You need to check your idea of OP. It's way out of whack.

A 5-man tactical squad with a missile launcher can't beat a 2000 point Eldar army. Eldar are OP.

This is a massive strawman, and you perfectly well know it.

 Traditio wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:

pm713 wrote:
You need to check your idea of OP. It's way out of whack.

A 5-man tactical squad with a missile launcher can't beat a 2000 point Eldar army. Eldar are OP.

This is a massive strawman, and you perfectly well know it.

It looks more like a mocking insult to me.

So I guess the lesson of this thread is that you won't get as much hate for playing Eldar as you will for being Traditio and shouting about them.

Paint all your eldar blue, and call them ultramarines.

No one will suspect anything, such is the way of your (mine) tactical genius.

 Traditio wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:

pm713 wrote:
You need to check your idea of OP. It's way out of whack.

A 5-man tactical squad with a missile launcher can't beat a 2000 point Eldar army. Eldar are OP.

This is a massive strawman, and you perfectly well know it.

It's a crazy thing called a joke, it's strange you don't know what they are considering all your posts on this forum fall under that category.

Yeah.... trying to be diplomatic here, but I think a lot of people figure out that it's best to ignore Traditio.

 Bloviator wrote:
Here's how I was thinking of building my collection:
2 Start Collecting Boxes
1 Box of Vypers
3 jetbike mounted warlocks
1 Crimson Hunter
1 Hemlock

I'd play against that no problem. Games against fast, shooty Eldar armies are always tough but really good fun. I don't really like the Crimson Hunters or Hemlocks, but if you're building around fluff then there's no reason not to take them. They're decent units, I just happen not to like them.

EDIT: The Vypers likewise. Maybe try to get a few more Jetbikes or something - but again, if you're building around your fluff then Vypers are fine.

If you get any hate at all it's because people are wimps.