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 welshhoppo wrote:
Alien3 was kind of decent on its own merits. Interesting set up, decent acting (and actors) and quite a few good twists and turns.

It just wasn't all that scary, the alien didn't look at good because they kept cgi in the thing, it doesn't flow from the prequel and it is kind of cliched.

I also kind of enjoy alien resurrection, I just feel like it could have used better direction.

And the newborn sucked, how was that an improvement over the old method?

I think the fact that it was made by a crazy scientist explains it lol.

 Manchu wrote:
We see a hatched egg in Alien 3.

Really? Huh. Oh well, I guess I don't remember that movie as well as I thought I did. Of course, having only watched it twice (and twenty years ago at that) I'm not surprised that the memory fails me.

I really like Alien 3 (the Assembly Cut). Aliens, my all-time favorite movie, is a really tough act to follow; not only because it is so wonderful in itself but also because people definitely wanted more. What they got instead was a moody, darkly weird picture with a sad ending. But putting aside the jarring misalignment between what the market expected and what Fox delivered, Alien 3 is actually probably more relevant than any action-packed riff on Aliens could have been simply because it convincingly ties out the story of Ripley.

As much as I love Aliens, the truth is that Cameron really "used up" the xenomorph - which is why he needed to invent the queen in the first place. One theme of Aliens is, however terrifying the xenomorphs might be, human beings are ultimately scarier and tougher. Along that theme, but also subverting it, most of the characters in Alien 3 are thieves, rapists, murderers, and child molesters. But they are also imprisoned and unarmed. Note also that the xenomorph is less anthropomorphic than Big Chap or even the homind-cum-insectoid warriors of Aliens. The so-called "Dragon" of Alien 3 is more bestial: a personification of the sins of its prey.

Ripley joins these sinners in hell - or brings judgment on them? Or salvation?

 Manchu wrote:
I really like Alien 3 (the Assembly Cut). Aliens, my all-time favorite movie, is a really tough act to follow; not only because it is so wonderful in itself but also because people definitely wanted more. What they got instead was a moody, darkly weird picture with a sad ending. But putting aside the jarring misalignment between what the market expected and what Fox delivered, Alien 3 is actually probably more relevant than any action-packed riff on Aliens could have been simply because it convincingly ties out the story of Ripley.

As much as I love Aliens, the truth is that Cameron really "used up" the xenomorph - which is why he needed to invent the queen in the first place. One theme of Aliens is, however terrifying the xenomorphs might be, human beings are ultimately scarier and tougher. Along that theme, but also subverting it, most of the characters in Alien 3 are thieves, rapists, murderers, and child molesters. But they are also imprisoned and unarmed. Note also that the xenomorph is less anthropomorphic than Big Chap or even the homind-cum-insectoid warriors of Aliens. The so-called "Dragon" of Alien 3 is more bestial: a personification of the sins of its prey.

Ripley joins these sinners in hell - or brings judgment on them? Or salvation?

That was...deep.

Looks like we have our first real Trailer here.

Certainly looks interesting... I wonder if the ID badge is from the Covenant crew, or if that ship is the one that old David hijacked with Shaw at the end of Prometheus???

Yes I wonder if it would have to be..

Certainly looks promising! Always strikes me as silly why they arrive on these planets without completely enclosed space suits, they're kind of asking for it!

I think I briefly saw the Wayland Yutani logo on the ID badge.

It could be good I guess, then again (I enjoyed Prometheus) so what do I know?

Fingers crossed for a good Alien film, been decades...

...

... meh.



TBH looks like yet another rehash, almost like a "greatest hits" from the previous films.

 welshhoppo wrote:
I think I briefly saw the Wayland Yutani logo on the ID badge.

It could be good I guess, then again (I enjoyed Prometheus) so what do I know?

I thought the company was just Weyland in Prometheus, that the merger happened sometime closer to Alien/Aliens....

I also enjoyed Prometheus, and not to drag the thread off topic, I think part of it is that I listened to the directors and understood the movie on their terms: a movie that happens before the events of LV 426, but is not a direct prequel to them, while still happening in the same universe... Like, the strain of Xenomorph we see on LV 426 is one that was actually used, it was rarely used (which is why we see the xenomorph elsewhere in the universe), and the people who created it, the Engineers, had their stockpile that was discovered by Prometheus. Which partially explains to me why the xenomorph transition in Prometheus is different from what it is in Alien(s)/Alien 3 and Resurrection, AVP and all the other films/media they appear in.

God I hope it's watchable. Is it sad that AvP 2 was more watchable than Prometheus?

 Hulksmash wrote:
God I hope it's watchable. Is it sad that AvP 2 was more watchable than Prometheus?

I disagree, I believe AvP2 is the most unwatchable film I've ever had to deal with. It felt like it was written by a bunch of edgelords who thought putting in over the top horrible stuff and explicitly showing it, rather than even just implying it happened, would make the film better somehow. I stopped watching after the maternity ward part and never finished the film since.

New trailer looks good. Looking forward to more alienses. Not expecting anything ground breaking or profound. It's just gonna be a movie about aliens killing people, luckily I don't have any problem turning my brain off to enjoy the action.. in fact, my GF will tell you it's always off by default.

 reds8n wrote:
TBH looks like yet another rehash, almost like a "greatest hits" from the previous films.

Yeah, the vibe I am getting is ... Sir Ridley taking another, more commercial crack at Prometheus. Hope to be wrong on this one.

 Hulksmash wrote:
Is it sad that AvP 2 was more watchable than Prometheus?

Controversial statement! AvP2 is a a lot, lot dumber than Prometheus. But Prometheus is ultimately more irritating.

Gosh ... am I really on the verge of defending Prometheus?

 KommissarKiln wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
God I hope it's watchable. Is it sad that AvP 2 was more watchable than Prometheus?

I disagree, I believe AvP2 is the most unwatchable film I've ever had to deal with. It felt like it was written by a bunch of edgelords who thought putting in over the top horrible stuff and explicitly showing it, rather than even just implying it happened, would make the film better somehow. I stopped watching after the maternity ward part and never finished the film since.

Yup, Prometheus is much more watchable than AvP2 imho. That film is the least watchable besides possibly Alien: Resurrection.

wow that alien actually looks bloody amazing, and... well alien

I think Resurrection is pretty fun. It's stylish without being pretentious. It sort of reminds me of a Paul Verhoeven film. Conversely, Prometheus is stylish but extremely pretentious. I give Prometheus credit for trying to do something interesting but it never delivers on that promise, and ends up annoying more than entertaining the audience.

Requiem is just a poorly conceived exploitation film. It's closest parallel in the franchises is probably Predator 2. That movie, however, has a weird charm that Requiem totally lacks. The pitch for Requiem is one word ("predalien") and it really shows.

Speaking of predaliens ...

I hate this bogus idea that the xenomorph takes on the traits of its host. It seems to me, this was dreamed up by an executive at Kenner to sell "mantis aliens" and "bull aliens." So in other words, it was at the perfect intellectual level for whoever thought up the predalien.

 Nostromodamus wrote:

 KommissarKiln wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
God I hope it's watchable. Is it sad that AvP 2 was more watchable than Prometheus?

I disagree, I believe AvP2 is the most unwatchable film I've ever had to deal with. It felt like it was written by a bunch of edgelords who thought putting in over the top horrible stuff and explicitly showing it, rather than even just implying it happened, would make the film better somehow. I stopped watching after the maternity ward part and never finished the film since.

Yup, Prometheus is much more watchable than AvP2 imho. That film is the least watchable besides possibly Alien: Resurrection.

See for me I can turn my brain off for an action movie and just kinda enjoy it for what it is. Most Alien and Predator movies fall into this category. Prometheus tried to be something more than an action movie which kept my brain on and made it impossible for me to watch because I just started to loathe the characters and the non-sensical plot. So for me AvP2 is far more watchable.

Exactly - Prometheus asks to be taken seriously but then can't hold up it's end of that bargain.

 Manchu wrote:
I hate this bogus idea that the xenomorph takes on the traits of its host. It seems to me, this was dreamed up by an executive at Kenner to sell "mantis aliens" and "bull aliens." So in other words, it was at the perfect intellectual level for whoever thought up the predalien.

Why is it a "bogus" idea?

The Xenomorphs in Alien and Aliens have human traits, but the one in Alien 3 has a more animalistic posture due to it being implanted into a dog/bull (whichever cut you prefer).

This notion was in the movies before the toy line ran with the idea.

It's bogus because it is dumb and transparently exploitative.

Big Chap looks pretty different from the drones in Aliens, despite both being born out of human hosts. As you said, the "runner" in Alien 3 was born out of a dog or a bull - the ambivalence of its origin indicates that its morphology is not really contingent upon that of its host. So in reality, the movies do not account for the notion that a given xenomorph takes on host traits ... I don't know who originated that idea, but it's not presented to us on screen. It was the explicit basis of the 1990s Kenner toyline.

The changing shape of the alien can be explained in more convincing terms. For example, an individual's morphology depends on the circumstances of its inception. Big Chap was "born" alone - it needed to be bigger and tougher. The drones were born in a hive environment where the imperative was to build and protect the nest rather than survive alone. The runner was conceived parallel to a queen; perhaps it is a "harbinger" morph, evolved to clear the way for the nascent queen.

I first remember it being brought forth in the Aliens books from the 90's. I remember seeing those before they did the toys but I could be wrong. I could have sworn the books were before the toys that came with comics but meh.

Well the novels published by Dark Horse were based on the comics published by the same and those certainly began before the toy line. But I don't recall "mantis aliens" or the like in any of those. Nor do host-based morphs appear in the new continuity published by Titan. The predalien first appeared several years after the toy line, in a 1995 AvP comic series.

 Pacific wrote:
Always strikes me as silly why they arrive on these planets without completely enclosed space suits, they're kind of asking for it!

I imagine the planet was scanned and considered quite a bit before they landed. I can't imagine colonists just randomly picking a planet without knowing about it. Things changed when the other ship landed it seems. Hopefully.

And yet they did not know about the wheat until landing ....

 Manchu wrote:
And yet they did not know about the wheat until landing ....

If you dropped probes onto a handful of points on earth, you’d get a pretty good idea on the atmosphere and climate, but plants/animals in one local might not be in another. And from orbit, it might just look like a field of some grass analog. But walking through it, it’s distinctly wheat.

If the scans can't tell wheat from grass, seems like you'd be SOL on microflora and fauna - which gets us back to Pacific's point.

The planet looked like...Canada.

What if the secret twist is that the aliens are...Canadian?

 Manchu wrote:
And yet they did not know about the wheat until landing ....

As I said the crashed ship may have caused unexpected changes in the environment.