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yep. If that's the case, I wouldn'e even mind the fact that it's only old minis, and would definitively buy this game. Don't think it would be the case though. since GW seems now to only do minimalist game. Which is a shame since I think that ST and GOC are really good foundations for a ruleset, but they are incredibly shallow when compared to the game of old.

So I have now seen three retailers confirming that the game is coming this weekend, but none can agree on the contents. One says what we have seen, one says the same but with an added slaughter priest and 4 more dice. The third says 10 blight kings but no slaughter priest. US price is $150 (that retailer ministomp is selling it for $105)

The lead times for new minis used to be 2 years. Sure, it is probably less now wit CAD design and stuff, but I am still perplexed that so many people really expected all new minis for this game when GW explicitly stated that it is a direct answer to Silver Tower's success.

Besides, having existing full kits included instead of special easy to assemble minis means more modelling opportunities.

If they wouldn't release this there would probably be a lot of people moaning that there is no support for Warhammer Quest

Ragnar69 wrote:
The lead times for new minis used to be 2 years. Sure, it is probably less now wit CAD design and stuff, but I am still perplexed that so many people really expected all new minis for this game when GW explicitly stated that it is a direct answer to Silver Tower's success.

Besides, having existing full kits included instead of special easy to assemble minis means more modelling opportunities.

If they wouldn't release this there would probably be a lot of people moaning that there is no support for Warhammer Quest

I think that is not a problem, but why not complely different mini's like skeleton's of orks.

The miniature list is a little lacking in that it would have been nice to see a big guy in there. Like a troll or minator although I know that the way the sprites are cut it might not be possible as the are using existing miniatures.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 privateer4hire wrote:
Silver Tower has a campaign, if I understand your question correctly. Your heroes can gain skills and treasures that carry over from one scenario to another.

It has a campaign in the loosest sense of the word. You roll to see if you keep your skills/equipment between missions, but beyond that there is no progression. Warhammer Quest of old it is certainly not. I'm hoping this new one adds a bit more depth to it, because the actual dungeon grinding in Quest was only half the game.

If you haven't been to a dungeon, jobbing three Bloodthirsters, only to be horribly murdered in the Tavern bogs whilst having a wee, did you even Quest?.

FitzChevalric wrote:

Ragnar69 wrote:
The lead times for new minis used to be 2 years. Sure, it is probably less now wit CAD design and stuff, but I am still perplexed that so many people really expected all new minis for this game when GW explicitly stated that it is a direct answer to Silver Tower's success.

Besides, having existing full kits included instead of special easy to assemble minis means more modelling opportunities.

If they wouldn't release this there would probably be a lot of people moaning that there is no support for Warhammer Quest

I think that is not a problem, but why not complely different mini's like skeleton's of orks.

Because the story ties in to the latest AoS releases about Chaos cults rinsing in the cities orf Order.

If the scenario should play in the catacombs of a city and the minis should be existing AoS minis, I think you don't have much of a choice. IIRC no goblins, skaven or skeletons have been released for AoS (not playing it, so not sure) and Orruks or Beastclaws wouldn't really fit there. I think that leaves only Chaos and Flesheater Courts

Heck, if the boards are a little more dungeony I'd buy this. Nearly pulled the trigger on ST, but the boards put me off. If it's got some uber campaignability, bonus. I own no AoS miniatures so 'old kits' doesn't worry me, as these all look petty enough to collect and paint. Only annoying thing with existing kit games is having to build them all before playing. Push-fit does rather have the clip-out-and-play advantage.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
If you haven't been to a dungeon, jobbing three Bloodthirsters, only to be horribly murdered in the Tavern bogs whilst having a wee, did you even Quest?.

Exactly. In Quest we weren't afraid of the monsters - those pesky critters? Nah! - we were afraid of the Spike trap event, the Elves in our own party (who always set fire to half our stuff), and the murderous little old ladies who kept pushing us in front of carts whilst at town.

Quest was unfair. It was really unfair, and that's what made it fantastic. Roll badly in a city with your Bretonnian Knight and you could just straight up DIE. You could spend months trying to get back to town with all the crap that could happen. It's not like Necromunda where high = good and low = bad, it was just anything = death.

Silver Tower doesn't have that. It's a shame.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 privateer4hire wrote:
Silver Tower has a campaign, if I understand your question correctly. Your heroes can gain skills and treasures that carry over from one scenario to another.

It has a campaign in the loosest sense of the word. You roll to see if you keep your skills/equipment between missions, but beyond that there is no progression. Warhammer Quest of old it is certainly not. I'm hoping this new one adds a bit more depth to it, because the actual dungeon grinding in Quest was only half the game.

Indeed, I'm hoping the same as well.

This would be a better place for more depth as it's an actual city with defenders and civilians instead of a chunk of chaos and madness resembling a tower.

Also hoping the GM approach means GW are focusing again on the narrative side of AoS. The lack of scenario lore in the Tzeentch battletome had me worried.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
And yes, I am bitter that I just bought a Cogsmith for the express purpose of using him in Silver Tower, and I personally hate owning duplicate unique minis.

Maybe paint one red and the other green and call them the super cog brothers? (extra points for putting Bullet Bills on their guns)


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
If you haven't been to a dungeon, jobbing three Bloodthirsters, only to be horribly murdered in the Tavern bogs whilst having a wee, did you even Quest?.

Exactly. In Quest we weren't afraid of the monsters - those pesky critters? Nah! - we were afraid of the Spike trap event, the Elves in our own party (who always set fire to half our stuff), and the murderous little old ladies who kept pushing us in front of carts whilst at town.

Quest was unfair. It was really unfair, and that's what made it fantastic. Roll badly in a city with your Bretonnian Knight and you could just straight up DIE. You could spend months trying to get back to town with all the crap that could happen. It's not like Necromunda where high = good and low = bad, it was just anything = death.

Silver Tower doesn't have that. It's a shame.

I love how that sounds.

Did you have any real control over the events or were you at the mercy of pure chance?

If Hammerhal is suitable for it this could be a great opportunity for the fandom to create those events to enhance the experience. The GM could even fit in to it as the force behind the random events.

The events were largely an optional extra if you did the whole Roleplay element.

Everyone I knew embraced them though, usually because as HBMC said, everyone loves psychotic old ladies with a cart/body interface fetish.

As I said earlier, whilst I'd infinitely prefer it all being in the box, I'd be happy enough if a Roleplay Book and a Bestiary Book were released separately. I'd still buy 'em!

And the current range is absolutely crying out for that.

See, back in the deep dark past, I didn't have a decent job. I was a kid. I had school and that. And this was before the full advent of plastic. Sure, I could pick up Skellingtons and Zombies in plastic - but the snackier Undead stuff? I just couldn't justify buying it just for Quest.

But now? Okay, my somewhat improved circumstances are no doubt colouring this, but plastics have made it easier. I mean, if you wanted to go clear out a Ghoul Court? The Start Collecting set gives me a decent start on that, including King Gribbly The Gribbleiser as the Dungeon boss, with his pet, Stinky The Enormous Dead Bat Thing.

The Malignants box would offer a very different Dungeon, with the threat of Hexwraith Cavalry running in and out of walls, attempting ride-by decapitations.

And that's just using existing Start Collecting Sets. Imagine similarly priced 'Dungeon Denizens' sets specifically for Quest? I'm no expert, but I reckon they'd sell pretty well. Give each a theme (and said theme could be quite loose - so perhaps 10 Orcs, 10 Bonesplitter Boyz, 5 Brutes and maybe some 'Ardboyz or Gobbos for Greenskins) and you're laughing.

I've never been a Warhammer player, but in the past 2 years I've bought tons of fantasy stuff just for Quest. Hell, I've started buying the odd AoS thing just for Quest (got some Ironjaw Brutes and a Megaboss the other day!). I have enough blank event cards to make 'em work too. I'm at the point now where I can start doing themed event decks (Undead, Orcs, Chaos, Beastmen, Skaven).

Now if GW's nuQuest had a bestiary section for the things that are out so far, then this would be amazing.

I did ask about that when Silver Tower came out, and seemed at least open to the suggestion.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And frankly, they'd be mental not to do it.

Old World had it's dungeons, sure.

But The Mortal Realms? Thousands of years have passed since they came into existence/Sigmar found them/whichever.

We've had the Age of Myth, and the Age of Chaos.

That must've left a near infinite amount of deadly dungeons out there in the wilds - the remains of whole cities once overrun by Chaos, but now driven back, ripe for plunder by a group of ne'er do wells looking to make a quick buck.

And who knows what might populate them? Yes, Order and Death are broadly aligned in purpose - defy and driving back Chaos. But, there's more Magic floating about in the Mortal Realms than there was the Old World. The Vampire/Necromancer might let you leave his lands alive - but if he's snuffed it, his guardian automata might be on very simple, very dangerous magic programming.

So much they could do with this!

I'm with Mad Doc and HBMC, etc. I'm a long-time Warhammer Quest player, but never took a genuine look at the new one. While I'm sure it's a fun game in its own right, it had almost none of the attributes which made me enjoy the first game (which was clunky as all hell, but fun despite this). The big things which made the original WHQ a success were:

1) It was the successor to Hero Quest and Advanced Hero Quest and there wasn't a 20 year gap between them, so they were on a roll with a developing product essentially (GW had partnered with other companies for the first two and took a step to bring it all in house)
2) Generic dungeon tiles. This was pretty important and a huge knock against Silver Tower. I've no interest in poorly computer designed board tiles which limit me to a boring Tzeentch scheme. That should have been an expansion to a wider WHQ game.
3) The RPG-esque depth was arguably its strongest point. Not boosting stats or getting a piece of treasure, but a 152-page role-play book, eventually supported by Death Blow magazine (a couple of issues, each 100+ pages). There was depth, arguably too much, but more than most proper RPGs. This meant you could play for months, or years with the same party and still be doing new things, etc.
4) Tying in a bit to the RPG nature the post-game sequence was fantastic (as it was in Mordheim/Necromunda, where it provided more than half of the interest). Got drunk with some guards from the Night Watch and made a pass on the baron's daughter? Whoops...etc. They even had silly rules for buying a Castle if you become rich enough!
5) Generic fantasy. This was a strong suit which flies in the face of GW's efforts right now. Back in the earlier Old World, GW fantasy was in lock-step with the majority of other generic fantasy genres. Non-GW fans could pick up the game and immediately feel "at home". The box contents were rather benign, except perhaps Skaven (ratmen to layfolk). You didn't need to know anything about the Warhammer world to know you were playing the classic Gauntlet trope of heroes fighting the classic Tolkien-esque baddies. This approach had a much larger/easier appeal and wasn't aimed at the increasingly shrinking GW "our version" approach with AoS etc.

The silly thing was...the game mechanics were pretty "meh". It was hard. Damn hard. Hell, I normally play a Dwarf Slayer who's rules prevent him from fleeing, so if the game fails...the Trollslayer is dead. It was a damn good game though, somehow. At the time it was exciting seeing new expansion boxes and I loved the idea (if not the price...) of the hero boxes. Individual new sculpts for each hero - this meant Warhammer Fantasy players would be buying them too because they were new unique sculpts for army leaders/generals, etc.

With the new game - I'm sure it's fun, but the WHQ in the title (thus far) is just to attract sales and not deliver the same experience. The FFG WHQ card game is great fun, but also just using the name to generate sales - no real tie in at all. I've no interest in another good board game at the moment, as I have plenty. In a way though, I'm fine with the new WHQ because it provides a bit of closure for a lot of the older gamers. We've all been waiting/wondering if GW would bring it back - and they made their decision. So now I don't have to wait around anymore!

If the level up mechanics in this aren't quite right, it's always something we as a community can push for.

The people I know, and indeed others on this very thread who played the original all seem to say the same thing - it was the immersive nature that kept you playing - and barring Deathblow, most of that came straight out of the box. But, because the Roleplay book was an optional extra, the game itself didn't come across as daunting to dabblers.

I would love to have the whole shebang back. But as said before, if it's as separate expansions, I for one won't take offence

I own a retail hobby shop and I asked my GW rep. if there were any new models in this set. He said no. I told him that I ordered 60 of the Silver Tower, but because there were no new models, I was only going to order 5 of this game. I hate that GW decided to half-ass this game.

Again with this... We havnt seen anything in the box. Just because there are no new models its half-assed? Its a board game, why does it need new models to be good? If the rules suck and its only redeeming factor is the models then sure whatever. Its full of new models to me, and im sure plenty of other people. You all sound entitled like GW owes you new models in everything, Gangs of Commorragh didnt have new models and it felt like far less crying about a lack of effort for that game.

Chopxsticks wrote:
Again with this... We havnt seen anything in the box. Just because there are no new models its half-assed? Its a board game, why does it need new models to be good? If the rules suck and its only redeeming factor is the models then sure whatever. Its full of new models to me, and im sure plenty of other people. You all sound entitled like GW owes you new models in everything, Gangs of Commorragh didnt have new models and it felt like far less crying about a lack of effort for that game.

Because there are some people who the minute GW put out anything, they cry it as "half-assed" or a "money grab"

I'd just like to point out that Gorechosen didn't have any new models either, but that game was freaking awesome.

It was also tiny and cheap. This is likely to be AUD$200+. That's a massive difference.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
It was also tiny and cheap. This is likely to be AUD$200+. That's a massive difference.

Kind of expected for a game with 8 times the number of miniatures, 6 1/2 times the rules, and 18 times as many board sections.

And we can nitpick all the differences, Gorechosen only had 4 models, a 16page rulebook, 1 double sided arena.

Point is we still dont know what the quality of the contents in the new box are, so to say it was half-assed or a lack of effort is absurd.

Albino Squirrel wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
It was also tiny and cheap. This is likely to be AUD$200+. That's a massive difference.

Kind of expected for a game with 8 times the number of miniatures, 6 1/2 times the rules, and 18 times as many board sections.

I think the point is, paying for a game that is using the same minis is ok if the game doesn't cost a lot, but using the same minis when a game costs a lot is a lot harder to swallow paying so much for a game and not getting new miniatures.

Davor wrote:

Albino Squirrel wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
It was also tiny and cheap. This is likely to be AUD$200+. That's a massive difference.

Kind of expected for a game with 8 times the number of miniatures, 6 1/2 times the rules, and 18 times as many board sections.

I think the point is, paying for a game that is using the same minis is ok if the game doesn't cost a lot, but using the same minis when a game costs a lot is a lot harder to swallow paying so much for a game and not getting new miniatures.

My point is that despite already owning some of the minis in this new game, I would gladly pay for them again if the attached game is worth the money

Davor wrote:

Albino Squirrel wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
It was also tiny and cheap. This is likely to be AUD$200+. That's a massive difference.

Kind of expected for a game with 8 times the number of miniatures, 6 1/2 times the rules, and 18 times as many board sections.

I think the point is, paying for a game that is using the same minis is ok if the game doesn't cost a lot, but using the same minis when a game costs a lot is a lot harder to swallow paying so much for a game and not getting new miniatures.

They are multi-part though.

And wasn`t it mentioned in this thread, that it`s a direct responce to good sales of Silwer Tower - hence the cycle of making this boxed game was very short, which equals to no new minis?

This does look less appealing, than ST, I agree. THey should`ve done at least 10 pound difference with the ST, IMHO..

Although it`s a big box, so it costs a lot in Australia, NOTHING NEW HERE.

I haven`t played a single game with the use of dungeon masters, so I`m quite surprised, that people look down upon this mechanic. I think I`d like to be DM..

What is the closest to Heroquest of Old, BTW?? I do like the sound of the phase inbetween the battles (the town phase?)!
That`s why Mordheim is in my top 3..

I really hope that that this new WQ has some extended rules a la original WQ. TherE's a lot of WHFB minis that I like, but I,ll never buy them cause I loathe AOS. If I could use them in WQ, it would give me a good enough reason to buy them.

I'll admit that the lack of new models was a slight let down at first, but really, this is the drawback of quick turns on new specialist games boxes. The lead time on new models is 18 months minimum, so I'm ok with this release, especially being a more generic dungeon setting.

I do hope the rumored Death themed Quest release does still happen though. Until then, I'm cool with this release.

I'd be happy if they released the DLC cards in a physical pack you can buy.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I'd be happy if they released the DLC cards in a physical pack you can buy.

Do you mean like this?
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-AU/Silver-Tower-Hero-Cards-ENG

I wish all the guys who posted on here about how it wasn't half-assed to charge $150 bucks for old models lived in my area, then maybe I could sell a few. As it is most people won't buy a game with old minis unless they are minis they need and buying the box is cheaper than buying the individual minis. Otherwise you are getting some dungeon tiles and a "make your own adventure"book and that's it for new stuff.