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Hmm, most people pegging it as above Warlord size. I'd be thrilled if this were the case but my inner pessimist is telling me this is going to be closer to Reaver (the original artwork has an Adept for scale and it puts the Titan somewhere in the Reaver range).

JWBS wrote:
Hmm, most people pegging it as above Warlord size. I'd be thrilled if this were the case but my inner pessimist is telling me this is going to be closer to Reaver (the original artwork has an Adept for scale and it puts the Titan somewhere in the Reaver range).

Well, that art is over 30 years old and would probably put them roughly at the same size as a knight!

One element that also makes me think it might be big is what seems to be a laser pointer on the big gun (as seen in the picture on the left).

But until it is fully revealed or leaked, it will remain conjectures.

Yeah. They could definitely re-size it, they've done this in the past for various stuff.

Well the scale in the old AT was nothing if not inconsistent. Especially in the early artwork.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/08/21/21st-aug-adeptus-titanicus-part-9-a-trip-down-memory-lanegw-homepage-post-4fw-homepage-post-1/

Check out the single crewed Warlord in the cross section

Trim for the trim god. I dig it, more variety to the legion as it grows ever larger. Good motivation to get painting, if there's some new shinies already waiting to join the queue

Sketch looks like a match to me. Obviously sans the daemonically possessed thighs.

I really need to get some paint on my current Titans...

 ImAGeek wrote:
I really need to get some paint on my current Titans...

Today has provided motivation to finish building a few that were still on the sprue for me. Agreed on the paint.

GoatboyBeta wrote:
Well the scale in the old AT was nothing if not inconsistent. Especially in the early artwork.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/08/21/21st-aug-adeptus-titanicus-part-9-a-trip-down-memory-lanegw-homepage-post-4fw-homepage-post-1/

Check out the single crewed Warlord in the cross section

The crosssection in your link shows three crew in the head if you look closely, as well as gunners or servitors in the shoulders.

*squints*
Well damn That would probably put it close to the Warhound in size. Which is kind of spooky as the old plastic Warlord model is just a touch shorter than the current AT Warhound.

JWBS wrote:
Hmm, most people pegging it as above Warlord size. I'd be thrilled if this were the case but my inner pessimist is telling me this is going to be closer to Reaver (the original artwork has an Adept for scale and it puts the Titan somewhere in the Reaver range).

With the small yet crisp detail present in the model, I expect it will be closer to the Warbringer Titan in size. The in-between size seems like a perfect niche for GW to produce the lesser known variants without overshadowing the main product line.

Well, well, well. This is a surprise. (A pleasant one to be sure)

Looking at the scale of the snapshots, using the rivets as an approximate reference, I'd place this between Reaver and Warlord.

While there seem to be some design similarities to the Warbringer, it looks like a new class to me.

Not really much to go on right now, but this makes me a happy Princeps!

Based on nothing, I was going to guess half way between warlord and imperator, but I suppose the reaver region is quite likely too.

Honestly I'd rather see more small-medium sized titans. I feel that the Warlords are as big as they should go for anything other than special scenarios.

 Albertorius wrote:
Honestly I'd rather see more small-medium sized titans. I feel that the Warlords are as big as they should go for anything other than special scenarios.

I agree, as cool as a big model is, it's the small to mid range stuff that'd be more interesting to see. The warlords are already pretty cumbersome, hoping this thing isn't much bigger, Don't want every scenario to be kill the big 1000pt thing.

 Crablezworth wrote:

 Albertorius wrote:
Honestly I'd rather see more small-medium sized titans. I feel that the Warlords are as big as they should go for anything other than special scenarios.

I agree, as cool as a big model is, it's the small to mid range stuff that'd be more interesting to see. The warlords are already pretty cumbersome, hoping this thing isn't much bigger, Don't want every scenario to be kill the big 1000pt thing.

Don't they make the biggest super things a bit overcosted to avoid this type of stuff though? Like, to stop everyone just going straight for the mega deathstar, make it a little weaker than it should be, so that the cool factor has a cost and people are less likely to default it (I dunno, maybe they don't, I'm not a player but I seem to remember they mostly do this. Same for computer strategy games etc).

JWBS wrote:

 Crablezworth wrote:

 Albertorius wrote:
Honestly I'd rather see more small-medium sized titans. I feel that the Warlords are as big as they should go for anything other than special scenarios.

I agree, as cool as a big model is, it's the small to mid range stuff that'd be more interesting to see. The warlords are already pretty cumbersome, hoping this thing isn't much bigger, Don't want every scenario to be kill the big 1000pt thing.

Don't they make the biggest super things a bit overcosted to avoid this type of stuff though? Like, to stop everyone just going straight for the mega deathstar, make it a little weaker than it should be, so that the cool factor has a cost and people are less likely to default it (I dunno, maybe they don't, I'm not a player but I seem to remember they mostly do this. Same for computer strategy games etc).

Yeah I guess my concern is AT isn't really apoc, it's activation based. I already have friends that think the game will work 2v2 and every game of AT should be high point level and model count. When I point out it's the opposite and games from about 1000-2000 are sorta the limit of the system given space and time limits, can only play for so long and fit so many terminals. When AT launched the starter was a bit silly just because it was the two extremes of the scale, warlords and knights. Game only felt fleshed out when warhounds/reavers came out. I don't mind people collecting a big AT model I just don't want it to change the game in the wrong direction. Even the main designer of AT when asked about a model as big as the imperator kinda shrugged it off, the game was really conceived as like 3-5 big robots a side duke it out, even the knight stuff feels like its straining things and sortof a sideshow. I'm stoked on new titans if they make sense and flesh things out scale wise, if this new titan isn't as big as we think and more just a different scale 9-10 titan, like some have suspected more on the command or support side, it'd be better for the game than some monstrous scale 14 thing that everyone wants jammed into every game.

Cards on the table, in my end of things it was all the massive models like baneblades and knights that ruined 40k. Scale creep and culture of everyone getting their way just lead to a race to the bottom. What used to be a combined arms tactical turn based game became having a super heavy and skyshield in every game ever. AT needs fresh blood but it needs people to play the game for what it is, not enter it on false pretenses. The player that only want to play with their 3 warlords every game, so to speak. I've got a pretty fleshed out battlegroup, I'd say im comfortable anywhere between about 1000-2000, outside that on the low end or high I'm just not that interested. But I can be flexible and make battlegroups work in that framework, I've also magnetized everything weaponry for flexibility.

But I'm optimistic it won't be some massive model, I think it will actually be scale 10 like a warlord, just hoping we don't get another porphyrion moment.

Part of me wishes they would do an Imperator, just to get the damn thing out of the way so everyone can move on.

But the rest of me agrees that its fine if the Warlord stays as the biggest boy on the table, and there is plenty of space for expanding the range without going bigger.

Going by the teaser vid I could see an engine that's maybe between the Warbringer and Warlord in size. But more heavily armoured and without carapace guns, as its arm weapons are so power hungry.

GoatboyBeta wrote:
Part of me wishes they would do an Imperator, just to get the damn thing out of the way so everyone can move on.

But the rest of me agrees that its fine if the Warlord stays as the biggest boy on the table, and there is plenty of space for expanding the range without going bigger.

Going by the teaser vid I could see an engine that's maybe between the Warbringer and Warlord in size. But more heavily armoured and without carapace guns, as its arm weapons are so power hungry.

Ya if it's effectively a faster warlord without carapace weapons that could be really cool. The biggest problem with the warlord's cc prowess is it's just too damn slow to be scary on the offense like a reaver, so if this thing can give cc reavers a moment of pause it could be good for the game.

But surely you don't think its a warhound of battle titan size? Why, that would be super-scary!

The game does work 2v2, even well above, Crablez. I enjoyed the 5k per side megabattle we had with 3v2, though it surely benefits from altering the activation sequence a bit at those levels so all participants get to contribute more effectively.

Still, those are the odd special events and the game is at its tightest around the 1750 points mark. Here's hoping the new fella will find a place in that frame

 Crablezworth wrote:
Cards on the table, in my end of things it was all the massive models like baneblades and knights that ruined 40k. Scale creep and culture of everyone getting their way just lead to a race to the bottom. What used to be a combined arms tactical turn based game became having a super heavy and skyshield in every game ever. AT needs fresh blood but it needs people to play the game for what it is, not enter it on false pretenses. The player that only want to play with their 3 warlords every game, so to speak. I've got a pretty fleshed out battlegroup, I'd say im comfortable anywhere between about 1000-2000, outside that on the low end or high I'm just not that interested. But I can be flexible and make battlegroups work in that framework, I've also magnetized everything weaponry for flexibility.

But I'm optimistic it won't be some massive model, I think it will actually be scale 10 like a warlord, just hoping we don't get another porphyrion moment.

I've been wondering why I hated Knights and other Super-Heavies in 6th-8th edition, and probably 9th if I tried, was that they're all a big chunk of points all balled up into an uninteresting lump - something that Epic Space Marine did well, in my opinion at least, was chopping Titans up into tank or infantry-squad-sized chunks, so you could shoot off weapons or shields or whatever (the problem being it was always better to decapitate the enemy Titan, or blow its reactor...). Having a massive model that combines the advantages of 2+ other models while not retaining any interesting limits would be bad, but I get the impression the new AT at least as the machinery to overcome that.

If its a new titan then its sure to have a book to go with it for maniples. Wonder what that will cover.

A non-Nemesis Warbringer that takes elements from that old concept sketch would make me a very happy chappie. A bigger-than-a-Warlord-but-not-an-Imperator would be less welcome, since I'd have to rewrite the fluff for my Legio to allow it and I quite like the fluff as-is.

Interested to see more anyway, so the teaser has done its job.

EDIT: And TBH I wish they'd hurry up and do some Build Your Own Maniple rules like they did with Legios. I don't even care if the bonuses they let you pick aren't very good, I just want efficient ways to include exactly the engines I want in my force, which is difficult if you want an a-typical mixture.

 Yodhrin wrote:
A non-Nemesis Warbringer that takes elements from that old concept sketch would make me a very happy chappie. A bigger-than-a-Warlord-but-not-an-Imperator would be less welcome, since I'd have to rewrite the fluff for my Legio to allow it and I quite like the fluff as-is.

Interested to see more anyway, so the teaser has done its job.

EDIT: And TBH I wish they'd hurry up and do some Build Your Own Maniple rules like they did with Legios. I don't even care if the bonuses they let you pick aren't very good, I just want efficient ways to include exactly the engines I want in my force, which is difficult if you want an a-typical mixture.

You could include it as a support titan from another Legio...

And definitely yes to custom maniples.

 Yodhrin wrote:
A bigger-than-a-Warlord-but-not-an-Imperator would be less welcome, since I'd have to rewrite the fluff for my Legio to allow it and I quite like the fluff as-is.

Don't forget the bigger-than-a-Warlord price tag that would come with it.

 Yodhrin wrote:
EDIT: And TBH I wish they'd hurry up and do some Build Your Own Maniple rules like they did with Legios. I don't even care if the bonuses they let you pick aren't very good, I just want efficient ways to include exactly the engines I want in my force, which is difficult if you want an a-typical mixture.

Excellent point here, and one I hadn't really considered before.

Yes, "Make Your Own Maniple" would be a good addition, though I don't really see them doing it till there are a couple more Titan classes out there.

Until then, there's just too much incentive to continue doing 3-4 more Maniples per book.

That hip armour/crotch plate pic is a dead giveaway that it's going to be bigger than a warlord.
1. The warlord crotch-plate is similar in design but with only two separate layers; the warbringer also has this but it's second plate is much smaller.
2. The knee armour plates on reaver, warbringer and warlord represent a progression of that ablative armour panel with it getting bigger and nearer the hip as the size increases: this 'hip armour' preview would fit onto the end of that series.
3. Both the warbringer and the warlord titans have motive units on either side of the 'waist' extraneous to the ablative armour panels and in this we can see this same design feature, but integrated into and within an ablative armour layer.

i don't see them intentionally bucking design themes like these

 SirDonlad wrote:
That hip armour/crotch plate pic is a dead giveaway that it's going to be bigger than a warlord.
1. The warlord crotch-plate is similar in design but with only two separate layers; the warbringer also has this but it's second plate is much smaller.
2. The knee armour plates on reaver, warbringer and warlord represent a progression of that ablative armour panel with it getting bigger and nearer the hip as the size increases: this 'hip armour' preview would fit onto the end of that series.
3. Both the warbringer and the warlord titans have motive units on either side of the 'waist' extraneous to the ablative armour panels and in this we can see this same design feature, but integrated into and within an ablative armour layer.

i don't see them intentionally bucking design themes like these

The vibe i get is it has a rather squat torso, like more in line with warhound/reaver's my head is in my stomach design than wargbringer or warlord's more robust shoulder build out. The best visual evidence I feel for it being bigger than warlord is the weapons and weapon arms seem "big" or thicker than a warlord at least where it meets the arm/shoulder.