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Made in gb
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus







I've been asked to play a game in two weeks time against an ex-GW staffer who in his words... "be warned - i'm going to be bringing the filthiest dirt i can conceive"

All i know is the points limit, that ominous warning and the assumption that i'll be fighting spehss muhreens on 'European Extreme' mode.

My problem is that i'm primarily a fluff player and i don't really do 40k - Here are the forces available to me...



I don't have the missile pods etc for the paladin/errant but the opponent is cool wih proxying.
I can't get either of my Styrix ready in time sadly.


So i ask - What is the most pungent fromage i can create with said knights, dakka?

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in us
Auspicious Daemonic Herald





Just take 5 knights. It doesn't matter which ones you bring because you winning or losing will soley be based on if you opponent can handle 5 knights or not.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




One of each Knight? I like your style. And your paint jobs.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in gb
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus







Thanks!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in us
Fate-Controlling Farseer





Fort Campbell

Artopos, Castigator, Paladin, Errant, and Acheron.

AP3 for days and days and days, then the Atropos and Errant to deal with his Armor.

Full Frontal Nerdity 
   
Made in gb
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus







Okay, cool - will they fit into one of those formations you get in 40k?

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in us
Fate-Controlling Farseer





Fort Campbell

No clue. I don't play 40K anymore. I'd suggest trying to build a Quistoris list out of these. I think you'd be limited to 4 guys at 1850 though.

Full Frontal Nerdity 
   
Made in gb
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus







Hmm. Gonna have to get hold of a IK codex for comparison. Tomorrow. Bed first.

Cheers!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in au
Infiltrating Broodlord





Basically the formation bonus is.. Your warlord can buy a relic and has +1 WS, BS and can reroll to hit in Challenges 0_o

Also all units get Objective Secured

   
Made in us
Auspicious Daemonic Herald





GodDamUser wrote:
Basically the formation bonus is.. Your warlord can buy a relic and has +1 WS, BS and can reroll to hit in Challenges 0_o

Also all units get Objective Secured


That's not a formation, that's the IK detachment
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

 CrownAxe wrote:
Just take 5 knights. It doesn't matter which ones you bring because you winning or losing will soley be based on if you opponent can handle 5 knights or not.

Seconded. Five IK's is the way to go. Here more than ever, the Lanchester square law comes in.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in gb
Stealthy Kroot Stalker





There is a formation where if knights are close to each other they get +1 to their Ion shield I believe. Its a 5 knight Baronial court I think.
   
Made in au
Unrelenting Rubric Terminator of Tzeentch





 rawne2510 wrote:
There is a formation where if knights are close to each other they get +1 to their Ion shield I believe. Its a 5 knight Baronial court I think.


There's also AdLance where you get to re-roll your save if you're within 3" of another knight, though it's Paladin/Errant only. ObSec Knights are for winners though. You can fit 5 Errants in 1850, but unless you've got a Gallant hanging around that I missed in the picture, you're going to be "stuck" with only 4 and a bunch of upgrades.

If you DO have a Gallant to get 5 IK's, then an Acheron is a must as not only does it ruin marines (especially ones who rely on cover), it's also got a large enough template and enough movement to easily "accidentally" cover a large portion of an invisible unit by targeting other things that are conviniently just on the edge of the helstorm range if they think they're going to be cute and get out of getting wrecked that way. At least 1 Crusader/Errant for a thermal cannon is nice to deal with 2+ saves (though IIRC, you won't fit a crusader into 1850 if you only have 1 Gallant). Against marines I'd probably be taking the Warden over the Paladin, but both will be useful. There's probably not enough high value targets for the Atropos to be worth the extra points over a Errant, but if you expect to see Girlyman, then his D-Beam could be useful. The Castigator is great for clearing out tarpits (and marines are annoyingly good at tarpitting knights since they're relatively cheap and get their save against stomps) and the bolt cannon will do serious work against marines too.

Overall, if you're only able to take 4 knights, you have a lot more options with all the spare points, but IMHO, it's the Stormspear missile pod or nothing - You don't need a whirlwind missile and the autocannon is a trap against anything but the lightest of fliers (AV10/11 2HP).

 Peregrine wrote:
What, you don't like rolling dice to see how many dice you roll? Why are you such an anti-dice bigot?
 
   
Made in gb
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus







Cheers for the input! I could probably get away proxying a Magaera as a Galant - i'll feel unclean, but i can shower afterwards.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in fi
Water-Caste Negotiator





Does your opponent know you're bringing knights?

-Heresy grows from idleness- 
   
Made in us
Devestating Grey Knight Dreadknight




If you can bring that Warhound it's worth about twice it's points in Knights, and a must have. The best way to "cheese" knights is take them in conjunction with psykers for buffs, but seeing as you lack those then I would take the warhound and 3 knights. Since the warhound can be taken as a LOW for any imperial army, he should be able to be taken as part of the household detachment and count as objective secured. Your knights should actually do well against space marines UNLESS he's taking a thunderwolf star, in which case you're screwed (but not entirely). Gladius lists (free transports) really have no way to shift Obsec knights. I would definitely take either the warden or castigator and the lancer, the rest is up to you but if you have the points the acheron will do nasty things to all the 3+ armor.

Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment. 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





Lols! This guy is a baller! Thats like at least $1000 b4 the warhound titan.

Can you bring the warhound titan under the point limit?

In the Grimdark future of DerpHammer40k, there are only dank memes! 
   
Made in gb
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus







Oooh, thats evil!

He said he wanted to "have a game against a knight list" and technically the warhound could be part of that list....

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in au
Unrelenting Rubric Terminator of Tzeentch





If he knows you're bringing knights and he has any concept of how to build a list, you're screwed.

 Peregrine wrote:
What, you don't like rolling dice to see how many dice you roll? Why are you such an anti-dice bigot?
 
   
Made in es
Swift Swooping Hawk





Expect or heavily consider some Psy power with invisibility fishing that just negates heavily most of your shooting.

Quick example a T-wolf cavalry with invis can ruin your knights in a single turn of melee due massive Str 10 attacks.

I have a friend that likes to field 4 knights and 1x support assasin, this way the knights can be more properly armed and the Assasin can counter expected tricks (culexus mostly as example)
   
Made in us
Mekboy on Kustom Deth Kopta






how to cheese with imperial knights... bring 5 imperial knights.

but as said if he is ready for you to bring knights then you have no chance. that real issue is people can't deal with high armor in volume. space marines can deal with it and if he brings a tailored list it will at least be over quick

10000 points 7000
6000
5000
5000
2000
 
   
Made in gb
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus







Right - invisible units of libarians on bikes, please don't bypass the language filter like this. Reds8n , apothecaries on bikes, ironclad dreadnought in a drop pod and command squad on bikes was basicly the list i saw him playing against a tau force while i was chatting this idea through with him - so i'm thinking of adding assasins, more specifically - culexs assassins - there's a formation for them isn't there, does anyone know the skinny?




edit: i found out there's no formations for just culexus assassins, so i'll 'just' be using the assassin detachment and four knights by the looks of things: 280 points of culexus assassin should screw up any invisibility shenanigans.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/04/03 15:14:02


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in au
Unrelenting Rubric Terminator of Tzeentch





You take an assassin of your choice as a detatchment. Job done. You can also take all 4 and get a bonus VP if one of them kills the enemy warlord, but why bother?

 Peregrine wrote:
What, you don't like rolling dice to see how many dice you roll? Why are you such an anti-dice bigot?
 
   
Made in us
Devestating Grey Knight Dreadknight




You can stomp invisible units, you don't need the assassin. Only T-wolves can actually threaten a knight with any reliability, and even then you'll still get your stomps at I1 plus a large explosion that doesn't care about invisibility. Just make sure to place your stomp over the HQ units that provide buffs. If you're using ITC rules, templates just count as BS1 so any blast weapons will still wreck his deathstar (even without that, you should still take the warhound with dual turbo-lasers).

Don't take any carapace weapons, they are generally a waste of points: if you have 35 extra points sitting around just take a more expensive knight variant (like the acheron or atrapos). If you've maxed out those options then and only then consider a missile launcher. If you take 5 knights at 1850 you won't have the points for those upgrades anyway.

Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment. 
   
Made in gb
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus







Hmm, my thinking behined the assassins was to infiltrate and nullify any psychic gubbins and that the psyk-out grenade in the shooting phase can cause perils on a psyker that cant be 'saved'

I was considering a vindicare for some sweet ignores cover ap1-ness to deal with rerollable 2+ 3++ characters - is that worth doing? Bit of a shame the sheild-breaker ammo got altered, that would have been dead handy.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in us
Devestating Grey Knight Dreadknight




The culexus nullifies powers just fine, but even with his pseudo-invisibility it takes 54 BS4 boltgun shots to kill him, or 27 marines rapid-firing (assuming no re-rolls). That kind of shooting can't hurt your knights, so it'll all be going straight into your assassin. You may get one turn of psychic nullification, but after that he'll be dead and the deathstar will be at full strength. The best thing to do is charge your knights into the deathstar (again assuming you can't shoot it with D-weapons) and hope for 6's on the stomp table (the average number of stomp 6's for 1 knight per combat round is 0.33). If it's just the chapter master put every stomp template on him+any librarians and you'll eventually roll that magic "bye-bye". If he's not invisible, then you have your normal D-weapon attacks as well for more save-ignoring damage at I4. If it's just the chapter master, I would actually seek out combat with him...throw 3+ knights at his unit (the Lancer is a character and can challenge too) and end it in a single assault phase. For thunderwolves you usually want to feed the star one knight at a time, but it depends on how big the unit is.
If you're set on using the culexus, I would keep him behind/near your knights so you can de-buff the star as your knights charge it.

Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment. 
   
Made in gb
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus







Thats sound advice that i will heed. (as well as the rest of the replys - the feedback has been great, proper food for thought!)

I found out today that he's going to get to roll his warlord trait from the one in 'escalation' - is this bad?

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in us
Auspicious Daemonic Herald





He can't do that. GW released an errata for the escalation book making it so that the warlord table and special rules are only used when playing a mission from the escalation book. If you don't do that then your opponent can't roll on the its warlord table and won't get a free victory point for every 3 hull points he removes from a knight
   
Made in au
Lady of the Lake






 SirDonlad wrote:
Oooh, thats evil!

He said he wanted to "have a game against a knight list" and technically the warhound could be part of that list....


So he knows you're bringing rock cause he said he wants to play against rock, so we know he's bringing a whole ream of paper.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 SirDonlad wrote:
Thats sound advice that i will heed. (as well as the rest of the replys - the feedback has been great, proper food for thought!)

I found out today that he's going to get to roll his warlord trait from the one in 'escalation' - is this bad?


Make that two reams of paper with ambiguous rules smudged on them.


I'm guessing there will be flyers but it feels like the best way to go with this would be to ask him what he's going to use and, probably not play him if he refuses as it sounds like he'll be tailoring hard and it'd probably likely just be for his enjoyment, try to shore up your weaknesses a bit. If you see deep striking melta stuff then it's going to be decided on who gets turn one and how you deploy unfortunately.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/04/01 01:26:27


   
Made in us
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon





Anoka County, MN

 greyknight12 wrote:
The culexus nullifies powers just fine, but even with his pseudo-invisibility it takes 54 BS4 boltgun shots to kill him, or 27 marines rapid-firing (assuming no re-rolls). That kind of shooting can't hurt your knights, so it'll all be going straight into your assassin. You may get one turn of psychic nullification, but after that he'll be dead and the deathstar will be at full strength. The best thing to do is charge your knights into the deathstar (again assuming you can't shoot it with D-weapons) and hope for 6's on the stomp table (the average number of stomp 6's for 1 knight per combat round is 0.33). If it's just the chapter master put every stomp template on him+any librarians and you'll eventually roll that magic "bye-bye". If he's not invisible, then you have your normal D-weapon attacks as well for more save-ignoring damage at I4. If it's just the chapter master, I would actually seek out combat with him...throw 3+ knights at his unit (the Lancer is a character and can challenge too) and end it in a single assault phase. For thunderwolves you usually want to feed the star one knight at a time, but it depends on how big the unit is.
If you're set on using the culexus, I would keep him behind/near your knights so you can de-buff the star as your knights charge it.


Can an IC LoS a 6 when stomped?

Fighting crime in a future time! 
   
 
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