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pff, that starweaver is better in melee than the harlequins themselves :V

16 inch movement is pretty high, but considering it's part of the army that's all about mobility and speed, that seems like a low max (outside of flyers, I'm sure they're much faster).

Edit: oh Gork and Mork, chaos vehicle could be as crazy in melee as their passengers!

Now just need to know if a transport being in combat prevents passengers from disembarking.

 Latro_ wrote:
Charging from a transport is in!

omg KHORNE IS HAPPY


edit: ah they get out before it moves! bloody had to keep reading didnt i

Well if the Rhino has say 10" and can 'advance' we should be able to make turn 2 charges.

Models in a wrecked transport only die on a 1, not 1,2,3.

 Latro_ wrote:
to be honest its an amazing change, thinking about all the times i'v had a transport popped and then the unit inside is limited to not charging always felt so ugh.

bones a lot of transports and armies over a bit like landraiders for one
ork truks, raiders etc... no 6" move, 6" get out then 2d6 charge anymore... effectively all those transports have lost 6" off the charge...

not if there base move is 10-12" as seems likely

 mrhappyface wrote:

 Latro_ wrote:
Charging from a transport is in!

omg KHORNE IS HAPPY


edit: ah they get out before it moves! bloody had to keep reading didnt i

Well if the Rhino has say 10" and can 'advance' we should be able to make turn 2 charges.

you can also drive it backwards now (assuming access points are a thing still) XD

 JohnU wrote:
Now just need to know if a transport being in combat prevents passengers from disembarking.

I highly doubt it, from this statement it seems like transports are now for soaking up overwatch and have the unit inside disembark and charge in the next turn

they are generally pretty durable and can soak up the firepower of enemy units in overwatch before their potentially more fragile passengers make it in.

I wonder how dirge casters are going to work?

open topped still firing normally is good news for orks

truk with burna boyz likely 14-16" move plough forwards 12d6 s4 shots split over any targets you like within 8" XD

 Gordon Shumway wrote:
I wonder how dirge casters are going to work?

Currently they negate Overwatch, but I could see them changing to having something to do with Battleshock.

FunJohn wrote:

 JohnU wrote:
Now just need to know if a transport being in combat prevents passengers from disembarking.

I highly doubt it, from this statement it seems like transports are now for soaking up overwatch and have the unit inside disembark and charge in the next turn

they are generally pretty durable and can soak up the firepower of enemy units in overwatch before their potentially more fragile passengers make it in.

I think that refers to the fact that a tranport can charge the same unit as the disembarked passengers do, meaning that the transport eats the overwatch, engages the unit and then the passengers can charge in risk-free.
Especially with the wording they use:

they are generally pretty durable and can soak up the firepower of enemy units in overwatch before their potentially more fragile passengers make it in.

 Luke_Prowler wrote:
pff, that starweaver is better in melee than the harlequins themselves :V

You know the 8th Edition stats, special rules and point costs for Harlequins already?

The new transport rules look good to me. Would this mean then that it's possible to disembark your unit, charge with their transport (letting that take the overwatch attacks) before charging with the passengers too? You stop using overwatch once you're engaged in close combat right?

 Ragnar Blackmane wrote:

FunJohn wrote:

 JohnU wrote:
Now just need to know if a transport being in combat prevents passengers from disembarking.

I highly doubt it, from this statement it seems like transports are now for soaking up overwatch and have the unit inside disembark and charge in the next turn

they are generally pretty durable and can soak up the firepower of enemy units in overwatch before their potentially more fragile passengers make it in.

I think that refers to the fact that a tranport can charge the same unit as the disembarked passengers do, meaning that the transport eats the overwatch, engages them and then the passengers can charge in risk-free.
Especially with the wording they use:

they are generally pretty durable and can soak up the firepower of enemy units in overwatch before their potentially more fragile passengers make it in.

Yeah I actually re-read it after I posted and came to the same conclusion, I think you are right.

 Future War Cultist wrote:
The new transport rules look good to me. Would this mean then that it's possible to disembark your unit, charge with their transport (letting that take the overwatch attacks) before charging with the passengers too? You stop using overwatch once you're engaged in close combat right?

yep 100%

also works for shooty units vs shooty units, jump out with your meltas etc shoot up a unit then plough the transport into combat to stop the survivors shooting you next turn.

 Future War Cultist wrote:
The new transport rules look good to me. Would this mean then that it's possible to disembark your unit, charge with their transport (letting that take the overwatch attacks) before charging with the passengers too? You stop using overwatch once you're engaged in close combat right?

As long as the vehicle makes it I think you are right.

 Ragnar Blackmane wrote:

 Luke_Prowler wrote:
pff, that starweaver is better in melee than the harlequins themselves :V

You know the 8th Edition stats, special rules and point costs for Harlequins already?

They look better than their CURRENT stats, wiseacre.

For something more constructive: I wonder if having to disembark before moving the vehicle applies to open top. moving then disembarking (and charging) is one of their advantages, and that seems like an odd thing to omit.

 Luke_Prowler wrote:

 Ragnar Blackmane wrote:

 Luke_Prowler wrote:
pff, that starweaver is better in melee than the harlequins themselves :V

You know the 8th Edition stats, special rules and point costs for Harlequins already?

They look better than their CURRENT stats, wiseacre.

For something more constructive: I wonder if having to disembark before moving the vehicle applies to open top. moving then disembarking (and charging) is one of their advantages, and that seems like an odd thing to omit.

Sounds liek open toped advantage is now for missile weapons - there might be a Assault vehicle thing that allows this but no mention yet.

I wonder if I can take melee weapon upgrades for my Starweaver to make it even killier.

That would be surreal.

Latro_ wrote:Charging from a transport is in!

omg KHORNE IS HAPPY


edit: ah they get out before it moves! bloody had to keep reading didnt i

Can't have the too easy button now. I like this, you have to think a bit more than just move transport and then unload.

That said, I never did like the charge mechanic. How come a unit can only move more than they actually can? Say a unit can only move 6" but if it charges it could move 18"? How can it triple it's movement because it rolled a 12, but it's so much slower if it doesn't charge? Units should never get free movement for charging but being slow if it doesn't charge. I wished that mechanic went a way. That would be like saying having a race and you can move faster because you beat up the guy who was in front of you but the guy in front of you isn't as fast as you because he didn't want to go back to beat you up. So you are technically faster and getting free movement.

That said, I now I can see a transport even faster, move their 16" (or what ever) assault a spore mine or something simple to get extra free movement and then either unload passengers next turn or move even further. I guess it does add a new dynamic to a game but makes Nids slower or a mechanic they can't really use since they have no "vehciles" that actually move or move really fast.

 Luke_Prowler wrote:
I wonder if having to disembark before moving the vehicle applies to open top. moving then disembarking (and charging) is one of their advantages, and that seems like an odd thing to omit.

It sound like now the advantage of open-topped is being able to shoot while embarked, and likely also more options on where to disembark (you'll need a much shorter charge distance when leaving a DE Raider compared to a Wave Serpent).

I'm kinda curious where this leaves drop pods. If units have to disembark before the transport moves, does that means they have to sit inside it for a full turn?

 xttz wrote:

I'm kinda curious where this leaves drop pods. If units have to disembark before the transport moves, does that means they have to sit inside it for a full turn?

I am sure drop pods/Tyranid spore pod will have rules on the dataslate saying they can disembark the turn they arrive.

Yeah, I think that will be the crack with drop pods and the drawback been the unit can't disembark and THEN move, then shoot, then charge, like other units seem to be able to do with transports, they will just shoot and charge.

Front disembarking durable transports like the land raider are going to be seen a lot more in this version of the game I think.

Rhino rush will be about positioning movement and positioning the turn before I think. Especially if they are charging other units to hold them up for the squad to finish their first target and go onto their next.

I also wonder if jump pack troopers can ride in transports, then still move and charge the same amount as usual? 5 vanguard vets in a rhino, or 8 in a crusader. Sang guard even with jump packs in a crusader actually... BIG threat range if they can move and charge as usual straight out.

White scars vang vets with jump packs in a land raider that has scout moved even.

Honestly I'm more concerned that drop flamers seem unviable now.

That's probably about as fragile as vehicles are going to get, too. A light vehicle with 10AV on all sides and 3HP translates to T5 and 6 wounds. Good to know.

Pods probably work similar to deep-striking, if we use the Trygon as a base:
pod must be more than 9" away from an enemy.
all models wholly withing 3" of the Pod (or simply within due to the base sizing for some Nid gribblies), but still more than 9" away from an enemy
unit can't move but can shoot/charge/dance as it sees fit.

I imagine the assault ramp on a landraider will allowe shenanigans regarding WHEN in the phase the unit can disembark.

I'm really liking this, DE Raider rush incoming.

 BroodSpawn wrote:
Pods probably work similar to deep-striking, if we use the Trygon as a base:
pod must be more than 9" away from an enemy.
all models wholly withing 3" of the Pod (or simply within due to the base sizing for some Nid gribblies), but still more than 9" away from an enemy
unit can't move but can shoot/charge/dance as it sees fit.

Seems logical.

Any reason we can see why vehicles with turret weapons like a Razorback or Immolator won't reverse into battle to unload troops from the back ?

 BroodSpawn wrote:
Pods probably work similar to deep-striking, if we use the Trygon as a base:
pod must be more than 9" away from an enemy.
all models wholly withing 3" of the Pod (or simply within due to the base sizing for some Nid gribblies), but still more than 9" away from an enemy
unit can't move but can shoot/charge/dance as it sees fit.

That. See, if you have to be 9 inches away, you're out of flamer range.

Completely removing drop flamers would be disappointing.

 Robin5t wrote:
That's probably about as fragile as vehicles are going to get, too. A light vehicle with 10AV on all sides and 3HP translates to T5 and 6 wounds. Good to know.

The Starweaver has 2HP at present not 3 which is a threefold increase to 6 wounds, so I'm expecting Raiders to have 8 or 9 wounds.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Mr Morden wrote:

 BroodSpawn wrote:
Pods probably work similar to deep-striking, if we use the Trygon as a base:
pod must be more than 9" away from an enemy.
all models wholly withing 3" of the Pod (or simply within due to the base sizing for some Nid gribblies), but still more than 9" away from an enemy
unit can't move but can shoot/charge/dance as it sees fit.

Seems logical.

Any reason we can see why vehicles with turret weapons like a Razorback or Immolator won't reverse into battle to unload troops from the back ?

It puts the troops up front so the Razorback either cant go through them or has to go the long way around. Personally I'm considering having my DE Raiders go for a turn 1 charge with their 16"+ move (with the Starweaver having 16 the Raider could match it but given how DE are always billed as the fastest army out there I could see it getting up to 18) then 2D6 charge which could prove particularly damaging if Shock Prows and Chain Snares give close combat bonuses, then have all the Wyches/Incubi/Grotesques jump out for a mass charge turn 2.