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Yea, I had first turn. He was playing pure knights, turn 1 I nuked two of his non-warlord Knights since they were easier targets, his turn 1 he crippled my Shadowsword, and I returned fire with my tanks and blew through his 3++ with the Tank Commanders. But yea, that relies heavily on BS3 from Fields of Fire and re-rolling 1's and re-rolling all dice for number of shots.

One other solution I've seen people talk about is Manticore Batteries... 150 points each, each one has four missiles, each missile is D6 attacks, STR 9 AP-3 D6 Damage. They don't have the "fire one per turn" rule that regular manticores do, so you could just unload all of them in a single alpha strike. 3 Manticore Batteries look like they'd be able to on average kill a 3++ Castellan if they have Old Grudges and Harker nearby to let them re-roll 1's to hit and re-roll wounds, so that's 450 points to kill 600.

 Horst wrote:
Yea, I had first turn. He was playing pure knights, turn 1 I nuked two of his non-warlord Knights since they were easier targets, his turn 1 he crippled my Shadowsword, and I returned fire with my tanks and blew through his 3++ with the Tank Commanders. But yea, that relies heavily on BS3 from Fields of Fire and re-rolling 1's and re-rolling all dice for number of shots.

One other solution I've seen people talk about is Manticore Batteries... 150 points each, each one has four missiles, each missile is D6 attacks, STR 9 AP-3 D6 Damage. They don't have the "fire one per turn" rule that regular manticores do, so you could just unload all of them in a single alpha strike. 3 Manticore Batteries look like they'd be able to on average kill a 3++ Castellan if they have Old Grudges and Harker nearby to let them re-roll 1's to hit and re-roll wounds, so that's 450 points to kill 600.

That's freaking hilarious. Be a real pain to convert up three Manticore platforms using the old dimensions though.

 Horst wrote:


One other solution I've seen people talk about is Manticore Batteries... 150 points each, each one has four missiles, each missile is D6 attacks, STR 9 AP-3 D6 Damage. They don't have the "fire one per turn" rule that regular manticores do, so you could just unload all of them in a single alpha strike. 3 Manticore Batteries look like they'd be able to on average kill a 3++ Castellan if they have Old Grudges and Harker nearby to let them re-roll 1's to hit and re-roll wounds, so that's 450 points to kill 600.

I think Chapter approved made them 110 points each, and yes its weird that they chose to write it as one use per rocket, but not 'one rocket per turn'. So yes, you could fire all 4 rockets at once, or 1, 2 or 3 at once depending on how many are left.




If only the regular Manticore could be 'squadroned' to have 3 in a single choice. :(

 Kcalehc wrote:

 Horst wrote:


One other solution I've seen people talk about is Manticore Batteries... 150 points each, each one has four missiles, each missile is D6 attacks, STR 9 AP-3 D6 Damage. They don't have the "fire one per turn" rule that regular manticores do, so you could just unload all of them in a single alpha strike. 3 Manticore Batteries look like they'd be able to on average kill a 3++ Castellan if they have Old Grudges and Harker nearby to let them re-roll 1's to hit and re-roll wounds, so that's 450 points to kill 600.

I think Chapter approved made them 110 points each, and yes its weird that they chose to write it as one use per rocket, but not 'one rocket per turn'. So yes, you could fire all 4 rockets at once, or 1, 2 or 3 at once depending on how many are left.




If only the regular Manticore could be 'squadroned' to have 3 in a single choice. :(

Still 150 points because the rockets cost 10 each.

T7 W7 4+ save. An opponent should shoot them first.

Sloppy forge world writing forget to say 1 per turn, but they also forgot to mention it can ignore LOS. It's fragile and needs direct LOS.

Anyone had any games against orks. I play both guard and orks and the orks ability to da jump t1 can cause a guard gunline problems. I currently run 2x scount sentinels and their initial move is vital for pushing the anti deepstrike bubble up but being honest a 3rd is required to have a 48" wide bubble (9+18+18+9 (this doesnt include the bases)) This is kind of a moot point if youre not playing a mission where you set up on the short board edge (hammer and anvil and kind of spearhead assault). Basically what im saying is that its highly likely the orks are going to be in your lines t1 bypassing the sentinel shield line.

My ork list runs 2 x 30 orks. I da jump 1 t1 and deepstrike the other t2. If 1 of those units ends their movement phase with less than half i just green tide them and boom wave 3 "ambushing" from the side. Im trying to figure out how to combat this.

CaptainO wrote:
Anyone had any games against orks. I play both guard and orks and the orks ability to da jump t1 can cause a guard gunline problems. I currently run 2x scount sentinels and their initial move is vital for pushing the anti deepstrike bubble up but being honest a 3rd is required to have a 48" wide bubble (9+18+18+9 (this doesnt include the bases)) This is kind of a moot point if youre not playing a mission where you set up on the short board edge (hammer and anvil and kind of spearhead assault). Basically what im saying is that its highly likely the orks are going to be in your lines t1 bypassing the sentinel shield line.

My ork list runs 2 x 30 orks. I da jump 1 t1 and deepstrike the other t2. If 1 of those units ends their movement phase with less than half i just green tide them and boom wave 3 "ambushing" from the side. Im trying to figure out how to combat this.

I think I can counter things like that by adding a Knight Gallant and some Hellhounds to my list. The Gallant (house Terryn) can get 30 stomps in a single turn, hitting on 2+ killing on 2+ if I use the "fight twice" stratagem, and the hellhounds should be able to roast at least 15-20 boyz by themselves. I'll need to sacrifice a bunch of Guardsman to keep you back T1, but even if you kill 40 of them turn 1 I'll be fine.

I participated at a 140 person tournament on the weekend in Australia. Some guard stats:

8 Lists with AM as the main detachment. 4 of those were mono.

Mono Ranked 97th, 110th, 112th and 126th (2 or 3 wins from 8)
Soup Ranked 29th, 34th, 51st and 69th. (4 or 5 wins from 8)

All the soup lists took a Castellan.

29th double battalion - 7 bullgryn, pask, 2 bassies
34th brigade/spearhead- bassie, 2 manticores, 2 wyverns
51st brigade - 3 tank commanders
69th brigade - 9 bullgryn, 3 bassies

 Horst wrote:

CaptainO wrote:
Anyone had any games against orks. I play both guard and orks and the orks ability to da jump t1 can cause a guard gunline problems. I currently run 2x scount sentinels and their initial move is vital for pushing the anti deepstrike bubble up but being honest a 3rd is required to have a 48" wide bubble (9+18+18+9 (this doesnt include the bases)) This is kind of a moot point if youre not playing a mission where you set up on the short board edge (hammer and anvil and kind of spearhead assault). Basically what im saying is that its highly likely the orks are going to be in your lines t1 bypassing the sentinel shield line.

My ork list runs 2 x 30 orks. I da jump 1 t1 and deepstrike the other t2. If 1 of those units ends their movement phase with less than half i just green tide them and boom wave 3 "ambushing" from the side. Im trying to figure out how to combat this.

I think I can counter things like that by adding a Knight Gallant and some Hellhounds to my list. The Gallant (house Terryn) can get 30 stomps in a single turn, hitting on 2+ killing on 2+ if I use the "fight twice" stratagem, and the hellhounds should be able to roast at least 15-20 boyz by themselves. I'll need to sacrifice a bunch of Guardsman to keep you back T1, but even if you kill 40 of them turn 1 I'll be fine.

Currently my third Fast attack is a hellhound. The best counter would be to try and funnel/tempt the orks to charge the hellhound using the scout sentinels. That 2d6 could do damage. I'm trying to figure out how best to deploy to force this. A nice big arrow pointin to the barrel of the hellhound perhaps

A knight could be an option. Its a pity the guard don't have anything that could handle it on their own. Even then the 30 x evil sun shoota boys that will "probably" (75%ish chance) manage the charge only cost 210 points. After some rough mathhammer they'd average approx 7 wounds on the knight before he got to attack. Bear in mind the orks also have the fight twice strat and as they'd have charged they'd get to fight again before the Gallant who would be down to their second tier. This is assuming the boyz were on their own and not supported by either a wartrike or a warboss on a bike, both of whom have a ridiculous threat range and if the boyz ate the overwatch could easily take down a knight (either with fight twice or fight after death)

When my bother played my Guard and I played the orks it just struck me how hard the orks hit T1 and how they don't let up. They have so many deep striking options (teleportas, stormboyz and kommandos) that guard bubble wrapping has to be on point.

 Smirrors wrote:
I participated at a 140 person tournament on the weekend in Australia. Some guard stats:

8 Lists with AM as the main detachment. 4 of those were mono.

Mono Ranked 97th, 110th, 112th and 126th (2 or 3 wins from 8)
Soup Ranked 29th, 34th, 51st and 69th. (4 or 5 wins from 8)

All the soup lists took a Castellan.

29th double battalion - 7 bullgryn, pask, 2 bassies
34th brigade/spearhead- bassie, 2 manticores, 2 wyverns
51st brigade - 3 tank commanders
69th brigade - 9 bullgryn, 3 bassies

Wow! That is not a lot of guard players....and very bad placings by mono guard AND soup guard...meanwhile, people keep talking about how guard is the best army overall...thanks to the guys like almostprogaming on YouTube and others...

Statistical data has consistenly shown mono guard to not be strong.

Personally i find its the bad player thing of whineing because they dont like allies and its directed primarily at the 32+ or - mortars

When your only occupying 2-300pts really performance is about the rest of the list not the guard itself and thats the bit the weak players don't take into account. Guard has only been good as a battery what matters is the engine

Guys whats the logic behind two commanders in a loyal 32 (no other IG in it).
Surely two psykers would be better for some psychic defense/offense as the orders to the 30 guardsmen are going to be pretty tame?
Am I missing a trick?

 Ratius wrote:
Guys whats the logic behind two commanders in a loyal 32 (no other IG in it).
Surely two psykers would be better for some psychic defense/offense as the orders to the 30 guardsmen are going to be pretty tame?
Am I missing a trick?

Well, the entire point of the Loyal 32 is to be as cheap as possible while making it a battery for CP. Of course there are good options in the Guard codex you could take, but then it's no longer the cheapest option, and you might need the room for other things in your list. Like, I'd argue you should always take 2-3 Mortar HWS if you're running the Loyal 32 as well, since those are very good for their points costs. Eventually though, you keep adding in "good, cheap Guard units", and you're playing a mostly Astra Militarum army, lol.

Aye but Im thinking here of loyal 32 and some knights and arms/helvs. 2 psykers better then?

I don't know, the orders are very good. Move Move Move can help you secure a far off objective if you need it, and FRFSRF makes them decent at anti-horde. If you need anti-psyker, I'd consider taking the normal Loyal 32, and tossing in a pair of Astropaths. It would be 20 points more expensive than your Loyal 32 with Primaris Psykers, but that 20 points buys you orders, which I think are totally worth it.

Cool, thx!

One 26pt astropath with psychic maelstrom is an auto include for me. It's a rare game that he doesn't get his points back in mortal wounds, and his denials can be game changing.

My take on it is usually 1 commander, one primaris psyker, 1 astropath, 3 infantry squads, 3 mortar squads (and add in more infantry squads and orders if points allow)

Yes he was an auto include before the pts reduction

My issue with Psychic Maelstrom is that it's a 50/50 casting chance with Warp Charge 7, and then has a 16% chance of doing nothing after it succeeds. So it isn't exactly reliable.

Yes but at 26 points it makes its points back in 2 mortal wounds vs a lot of armies and its not casting just once a game. Its also really useful because it doesn't require line of sight. The astropath also gives you a deny.

U02dah4 wrote:
Yes but at 26 points it makes its points back in 2 mortal wounds vs a lot of armies and its not casting just once a game. Its also really useful because it doesn't require line of sight. The astropath also gives you a deny.

Oh they're definitely good, I already have 2 of them for Nightshroud and Barrier to try to keep my tank commanders alive longer... I don't think I could find the points for a third in my list.

Hey guys!

Just got two start collecting Tempestus Scions before the price gike.

Was wondering if anyone can help me with how to equip the Taurox or Taurox Primes?

I run Black Templars so dont mind them as a firebase or as a push forward as i do both.

I suck with magnets too.

Incognito15 wrote:
Hey guys!

Just got two start collecting Tempestus Scions before the price gike.

Was wondering if anyone can help me with how to equip the Taurox or Taurox Primes?

I run Black Templars so dont mind them as a firebase or as a push forward as i do both.

I suck with magnets too.

I'd probably run them cheap, just regular Tauroxes, with the normal twin autocannons. Taurox prime is interesting, but it's just too many points for too little firepower. It's nearly doubling the cost for 2 krak missile shots.

Good call. I like that idea. Can they transport bullgryns? Or just melta vets?

Also struggling with finding a place with my scions and wondered how people ran them.

Sure i can deep strike plasma and shoot but i can never be in rapid fire with the hot shot las.

Thoughts?

Yea, normally you're just not going to get to rapid fire those hotshot lasguns.

Actually taurox is kinda easy to magnetize.

Also, taurox prime with gatling is two volley guns is damn fun to run. Even more if you put it in batallion for storm troopers discipline . There will be always some sixes in 28 shots

Incognito15 wrote:
Hey guys!

Just got two start collecting Tempestus Scions before the price gike.

Was wondering if anyone can help me with how to equip the Taurox or Taurox Primes?

I run Black Templars so dont mind them as a firebase or as a push forward as i do both.

I suck with magnets too.

You can run Taurox Primes with Scions in lots of ways. Gatling Cannon with Storm Bolter and Hot-Shot Volley Guns cuts chaff, throw in Scions with rifles or four hot-shot volleyguns, you will have great chaff killers or objective holders.

Run with Battle Cannon, autocannons, and heavy stubber, you have a long to medium range medium/light armor shooter.

The Scions themselves can be dropped into objectives, perform suicide plasma strikes, etc. Just don’t ever mix the weapons in a squad. It’s either all plasma, melta, or hot-shot volley guns, never mix. Scions are only good in extremes like that.

IF you want to double tap with HSL you'll have to drop Scions from Valkyries or Vendettas. Those were apparently overpriced before the CA point adjustements, I don't know if they still are.

117 points with base loadout now, I believe.

152 points is most efficient loadout...

Btw. The dakka Taurox prime is not bad, but the range is kinda killing it. In my games there were very few turns when i did not need to move...so the BS was -1...which means lower firepower and no chance to exploding sixes...

Hmm I have been testing Tread-head Mono guard fielding 10+ Lemans Russes. I had been using Vostroyan Conquerors but with the Price Drop on Executioners I now find them the superior option as Cadian.

Honestly it might just be that I play mostly only the people at my club and on TTS but I have had great success with the Armor heavy list but hear so many seem to think the LR isn't worth it. So I'm curious as to what I'm not running into that seems to to be busting the tanks chops so much.