Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Yaktan wrote:
Yeah, a broadside bomb seems rather workable. Getting enough markerlights might be a little tricky, though if you have a fireblade, darkstrider, a marksman, a squad of pathfinders, and a skyray, it should be doable. Maybe bring markerlights/marker drones with your firewarriors?

On coldstars, fusion is not the only way to run them. There was a high-performing list recently that ran 2-3 coldstars with the stock guns, plus a burst cannon and ATS. It made sense to me when you realize they probably were worried about hordes, and a team of broadsides will delete tanks just fine.

This is why I took your guys advice and am magnetizing everything

So taunar is a battle suit but stormsurge isn’t.... so are arms the requirements for being a battle suit

gendoikari87 wrote:
So taunar is a battle suit but stormsurge isn’t.... so are arms the requirements for being a battle suit

I think it's technically a lore thing, Suits are usually(Tunar lore isn't something I have come across in detail) controlled by a single Tau and sometimes AI assistance.
Where as a storm surge is actually crewed more like a hammerhead with pilot, commander and gunner.

The bigger point is probably that GW simply doesn't want drones to be able to protect a Stormsurge while FW just does whatever it feels like.

Ice_can wrote:

gendoikari87 wrote:
So taunar is a battle suit but stormsurge isn’t.... so are arms the requirements for being a battle suit

I think it's technically a lore thing, Suits are usually(Tunar lore isn't something I have come across in detail) controlled by a single Tau and sometimes AI assistance.
Where as a storm surge is actually crewed more like a hammerhead with pilot, commander and gunner.

I mean, my stormsurge has arms

So all battlesuit armies. Can one be made viable

gendoikari87 wrote:
So all battlesuit armies. Can one be made viable

Biggest problem I can see is not many screening units. I’ve been toying wit a few squads of crisis suits, stealth suits backed up by ghostkeel with missilesides, Riptide’s, and a stormsurge with 2 commanders list also. I just feel it would get killed so easily. With crisis suits, for instance, I like units of 4. Tthe shas’vre with 2 flamers and a shield generator and the other 3 with 3 flamers giving one of them with iridium armor. Of course this kind of loadout is what I’d do with whatever weapon I feel. It allows you to use the 2+ save first to try and tank as many wounds as possible, or the shield generator for a similar effect

gendoikari87 wrote:
So all battlesuit armies. Can one be made viable

I dont think so. They're just not tough enough for that... But it would be fun. i did try it for a short bit.

Here is my list for Flying Monkey. Any tips on ITC format?

BN
Shadow Sun, command link drone
Cadre Fire Blade
Dark Strider
3x5 fire warriors

Outrider
Enforcer, 3x missile pod, ATS
Ethereal on hover drone
2x10 shield drones
2x 5 path finders, 2x shield drone, grav inhibitor, recon drone

Vanguard
Enforcer, 3x missile pod, ATS
2x Riptide with HBC, ATS, TL
1 Riptide with Ion, TL, VT
1 Ghostkeel with Ion, 2x fusion, shield generator, TL

I was reviewing the FAQs earlier, and came across this gem:

Q: Some units have an ability that says that the models in the unit must be deployed at the same time, but thereafter each model is treated as a separate unit (e.g. Vehicle Squadron, Drone Support, etc.). For the purposes of missions that have the First Blood victory condition, if a unit has such an ability, does every model in it need to be destroyed for the opponent to claim First Blood, or just a single model?A: The models in such units are each treated as individual units after they have deployed, so destroying a single one of them satisfies the First Blood victory condition.

Does this mean that the following 4 things must be true?
1. Each drone taken as drone support becomes its own unit and therefore there is no need to take an Ethereal for the leadership buff if used en masse?
2. Since each is its own unit, the loss of one wouldn't cause the rest to take a Morale check?
3. Each drone killed gives a KP?
4. Each individual drone would need to be targeted to be shot?
I was going to take a full unit of Marker Drones in a list, but with the above revelation, I may just break them up among the rest of my force.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I was looking at this article:
http://advancedtautactica.com/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=29695

I was wondering something. If a Commander declares a Kauyon within range of an aircraft, can the aircraft be 'held in place' without crashing? (which I cannot actually find anywhere in 8th, though in 7th I believe that they crashed if they couldn't move)

If so, does anyone know what size base a Tiger Shark is supposed to be using? I have been using normal flier bases, but if I can get away with using a larger base... it would mean some more T1\T2 charge denial. And the thought of the BS2 Tiger Sharks being unable to move, and get full use of their full Ballistic Skills fills me with all kinds of bubbling joy!

 carldooley wrote:
I was reviewing the FAQs earlier, and came across this gem:

Q: Some units have an ability that says that the models in the unit must be deployed at the same time, but thereafter each model is treated as a separate unit (e.g. Vehicle Squadron, Drone Support, etc.). For the purposes of missions that have the First Blood victory condition, if a unit has such an ability, does every model in it need to be destroyed for the opponent to claim First Blood, or just a single model?A: The models in such units are each treated as individual units after they have deployed, so destroying a single one of them satisfies the First Blood victory condition.

Does this mean that the following 4 things must be true?
1. Each drone taken as drone support becomes its own unit and therefore there is no need to take an Ethereal for the leadership buff if used en masse?
2. Since each is its own unit, the loss of one wouldn't cause the rest to take a Morale check?
3. Each drone killed gives a KP?
4. Each individual drone would need to be targeted to be shot?
I was going to take a full unit of Marker Drones in a list, but with the above revelation, I may just break them up among the rest of my force.

If you give a Firewarrior unit 2 drones they will form a unit of 2, not 2 units of 1.

Assuming your giving a unit only a single drone. Yes to all your questions.

Note that in ITC tournaments this can be a MASSIVE disadvantage which is why you don't often see it. In GW style missions where KP's are often not a thing and Kill More does not exist yes this is a very valid tactic.

 carldooley wrote:
I was reviewing the FAQs earlier, and came across this gem:

Q: Some units have an ability that says that the models in the unit must be deployed at the same time, but thereafter each model is treated as a separate unit (e.g. Vehicle Squadron, Drone Support, etc.). For the purposes of missions that have the First Blood victory condition, if a unit has such an ability, does every model in it need to be destroyed for the opponent to claim First Blood, or just a single model?A: The models in such units are each treated as individual units after they have deployed, so destroying a single one of them satisfies the First Blood victory condition.

Does this mean that the following 4 things must be true?
1. Each drone taken as drone support becomes its own unit and therefore there is no need to take an Ethereal for the leadership buff if used en masse?
2. Since each is its own unit, the loss of one wouldn't cause the rest to take a Morale check?
3. Each drone killed gives a KP?
4. Each individual drone would need to be targeted to be shot?
I was going to take a full unit of Marker Drones in a list, but with the above revelation, I may just break them up among the rest of my force.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I was looking at this article:
http://advancedtautactica.com/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=29695

I was wondering something. If a Commander declares a Kauyon within range of an aircraft, can the aircraft be 'held in place' without crashing? (which I cannot actually find anywhere in 8th, though in 7th I believe that they crashed if they couldn't move)

If so, does anyone know what size base a Tiger Shark is supposed to be using? I have been using normal flier bases, but if I can get away with using a larger base... it would mean some more T1\T2 charge denial. And the thought of the BS2 Tiger Sharks being unable to move, and get full use of their full Ballistic Skills fills me with all kinds of bubbling joy!

There is a page in the codex where it says that the drones units that are taken as other units wargear count as a 0PL unit. So if you are playing a GW mission that uses PL values to tally points, detached units of drones do not count as anything. In ITC drones units do give kill points though.

Also since they FAQ'd the units to be able to move over flyer bases. Can you really still use the tigershark to block charges reliably?

If there isn't enough space between the flyer's base and the desired assault target for the enemy to be placed, don't the current rules of not placing one model's base over another's take precedent?

Move over, yes. But place over?

 carldooley wrote:
If there isn't enough space between the flyer's base and the desired assault target for the enemy to be placed, don't the current rules of not placing one model's base over another's take precedent?

Move over, yes. But place over?

You are correct. but with a flyer having a minimum move distance what are the odds you can really use that strategy more than once? It's basically a turn 1 defense and that's it.

balmong7 wrote:


You are correct. but with a flyer having a minimum move distance what are the odds you can really use that strategy more than once? It's basically a turn 1 defense and that's it.

It's considerably easier to pull off with flyers that can double pivot.

Sterling191 wrote:

balmong7 wrote:


You are correct. but with a flyer having a minimum move distance what are the odds you can really use that strategy more than once? It's basically a turn 1 defense and that's it.

It's considerably easier to pull off with flyers that can double pivot.

Sorry, what is a double pivot?

 carldooley wrote:

Sterling191 wrote:

balmong7 wrote:


You are correct. but with a flyer having a minimum move distance what are the odds you can really use that strategy more than once? It's basically a turn 1 defense and that's it.

It's considerably easier to pull off with flyers that can double pivot.

Sorry, what is a double pivot?

It’s when certain flyers are able to turn up to 90degrees at both the start of their move and the end of their move.
So – turn 90 -> move 30” -> turn 90.

 Ordana wrote:

 carldooley wrote:
I was reviewing the FAQs earlier, and came across this gem:

Q: Some units have an ability that says that the models in the unit must be deployed at the same time, but thereafter each model is treated as a separate unit (e.g. Vehicle Squadron, Drone Support, etc.). For the purposes of missions that have the First Blood victory condition, if a unit has such an ability, does every model in it need to be destroyed for the opponent to claim First Blood, or just a single model?A: The models in such units are each treated as individual units after they have deployed, so destroying a single one of them satisfies the First Blood victory condition.

Does this mean that the following 4 things must be true?
1. Each drone taken as drone support becomes its own unit and therefore there is no need to take an Ethereal for the leadership buff if used en masse?
2. Since each is its own unit, the loss of one wouldn't cause the rest to take a Morale check?
3. Each drone killed gives a KP?
4. Each individual drone would need to be targeted to be shot?
I was going to take a full unit of Marker Drones in a list, but with the above revelation, I may just break them up among the rest of my force.

If you give a Firewarrior unit 2 drones they will form a unit of 2, not 2 units of 1.

Assuming your giving a unit only a single drone. Yes to all your questions.

Note that in ITC tournaments this can be a MASSIVE disadvantage which is why you don't often see it. In GW style missions where KP's are often not a thing and Kill More does not exist yes this is a very valid tactic.

Are you positive that the "attached" drone would be in a single unit? i've been going back and forth many times on the wording of the drone support rule and with that answer in the FAQ i'm more for treating each drone as its own unit.

VladimirHerzog wrote:

 Ordana wrote:

 carldooley wrote:
I was reviewing the FAQs earlier, and came across this gem:

Q: Some units have an ability that says that the models in the unit must be deployed at the same time, but thereafter each model is treated as a separate unit (e.g. Vehicle Squadron, Drone Support, etc.). For the purposes of missions that have the First Blood victory condition, if a unit has such an ability, does every model in it need to be destroyed for the opponent to claim First Blood, or just a single model?A: The models in such units are each treated as individual units after they have deployed, so destroying a single one of them satisfies the First Blood victory condition.

Does this mean that the following 4 things must be true?
1. Each drone taken as drone support becomes its own unit and therefore there is no need to take an Ethereal for the leadership buff if used en masse?
2. Since each is its own unit, the loss of one wouldn't cause the rest to take a Morale check?
3. Each drone killed gives a KP?
4. Each individual drone would need to be targeted to be shot?
I was going to take a full unit of Marker Drones in a list, but with the above revelation, I may just break them up among the rest of my force.

If you give a Firewarrior unit 2 drones they will form a unit of 2, not 2 units of 1.

Assuming your giving a unit only a single drone. Yes to all your questions.

Note that in ITC tournaments this can be a MASSIVE disadvantage which is why you don't often see it. In GW style missions where KP's are often not a thing and Kill More does not exist yes this is a very valid tactic.

Are you positive that the "attached" drone would be in a single unit? i've been going back and forth many times on the wording of the drone support rule and with that answer in the FAQ i'm more for treating each drone as its own unit.

We are positive. You’re reading to much into it my friend, which is a dark thing to do in 40k rules sets

VladimirHerzog wrote:

 Ordana wrote:

 carldooley wrote:
I was reviewing the FAQs earlier, and came across this gem:

Q: Some units have an ability that says that the models in the unit must be deployed at the same time, but thereafter each model is treated as a separate unit (e.g. Vehicle Squadron, Drone Support, etc.). For the purposes of missions that have the First Blood victory condition, if a unit has such an ability, does every model in it need to be destroyed for the opponent to claim First Blood, or just a single model?A: The models in such units are each treated as individual units after they have deployed, so destroying a single one of them satisfies the First Blood victory condition.

Does this mean that the following 4 things must be true?
1. Each drone taken as drone support becomes its own unit and therefore there is no need to take an Ethereal for the leadership buff if used en masse?
2. Since each is its own unit, the loss of one wouldn't cause the rest to take a Morale check?
3. Each drone killed gives a KP?
4. Each individual drone would need to be targeted to be shot?
I was going to take a full unit of Marker Drones in a list, but with the above revelation, I may just break them up among the rest of my force.

If you give a Firewarrior unit 2 drones they will form a unit of 2, not 2 units of 1.

Assuming your giving a unit only a single drone. Yes to all your questions.

Note that in ITC tournaments this can be a MASSIVE disadvantage which is why you don't often see it. In GW style missions where KP's are often not a thing and Kill More does not exist yes this is a very valid tactic.

Are you positive that the "attached" drone would be in a single unit? i've been going back and forth many times on the wording of the drone support rule and with that answer in the FAQ i'm more for treating each drone as its own unit.

the Drones are treated as a separate unit.

The DroneS (multiple) form a Unit (singular). Not UnitS

SO... i just read a line that has me wondering if it is legit. That since the Remora's have the drone keyword, and the devilfish can transport up to 12 drones, you could fill a devilfish with 12 remoras, that are fly, hard to hit, 8 s5 ap- shots at 36", clearly sub-tournament optimal, but do you think it is actually eligible RAW?

 pumaman1 wrote:
SO... i just read a line that has me wondering if it is legit. That since the Remora's have the drone keyword, and the devilfish can transport up to 12 drones, you could fill a devilfish with 12 remoras, that are fly, hard to hit, 8 s5 ap- shots at 36", clearly sub-tournament optimal, but do you think it is actually eligible RAW?

To make it more ridiculous, take 12 one model units and make sure to keep it surrounded so that when your opponent kills it, they all get removed as casualities.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I was wondering, what non FW models\units\wargear require the Index to be played?

There is an FAQ saying Remora cannot be transported in a Devilfish.

Hey guys, I would like to build a full battlesuit/drones army and make it as competitive as possible :

++ Vanguard Detachment +1CP (T'au Empire) [55 PL, 1,040pts] ++

T'au Empire Sept Choice: T'au Sept

+ HQ +

Commander in XV8 Crisis Battlesuit [7 PL, 154pts]: 4x Cyclic ion blaster, XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit

+ Elites +

XV104 Riptide Battlesuit [14 PL, 280pts]: 2x Smart missile system, Advanced targeting system, Heavy burst cannon, Target lock

XV104 Riptide Battlesuit [14 PL, 280pts]: 2x Smart missile system, Advanced targeting system, Heavy burst cannon, Target lock

XV25 Stealth Battlesuits [6 PL, 84pts]
. Stealth Shas'ui: Burst cannon
. Stealth Shas'ui: Burst cannon
. Stealth Shas'vre: Burst cannon

+ Heavy Support +

XV88 Broadside Battlesuits [14 PL, 242pts]
. Broadside Shas'ui: 2x High-yield missile pod, 2x Smart missile system, Advanced targeting system
. Broadside Shas'vre: 2x High-yield missile pod, 2x Smart missile system, Advanced targeting system

++ Outrider Detachment +1CP (T'au Empire) [21 PL, 352pts] ++

T'au Empire Sept Choice: T'au Sept

+ HQ +

Commander in XV8 Crisis Battlesuit [7 PL, 132pts]: Drone controller, 3x Missile pod, XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit
. Puretide engram neurochip

+ Fast Attack +

Tactical Drones [6 PL, 120pts]
. 12x MV7 Marker Drone

Tactical Drones [4 PL, 50pts]
. 5x MV4 Shield Drone

Tactical Drones [4 PL, 50pts]
. 5x MV4 Shield Drone

++ Vanguard Detachment +1CP (T'au Empire) [39 PL, 604pts] ++

T'au Empire Sept Choice: Vior'la Sept

+ HQ +

Commander in XV8 Crisis Battlesuit [7 PL, 154pts]: Academy Luminary (Vior'la Sept), 4x Cyclic ion blaster, Warlord, XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit

+ Elites +

XV25 Stealth Battlesuits [6 PL, 84pts]
. Stealth Shas'ui: Burst cannon
. Stealth Shas'ui: Burst cannon
. Stealth Shas'vre: Burst cannon

XV8 Crisis Battlesuits [13 PL, 183pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui: 3x Plasma rifle, XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit
. Crisis Shas'ui: 3x Plasma rifle
. Crisis Shas'vre: 3x Plasma rifle
. 2x MV4 Shield Drone

XV8 Crisis Battlesuits [13 PL, 183pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui: 3x Plasma rifle, XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit
. Crisis Shas'ui: 3x Plasma rifle
. Crisis Shas'vre: 3x Plasma rifle
. 2x MV4 Shield Drone

++ Total: [115 PL, 1,996pts] ++

What do you think?

New to Tau and armed with my vanguard boxed set, I assume that it's best to arm all the battlesuits in a squad with the same loadout to do a specific thing rather than a toolbox mix? As for loadouts my current idea are burst canons and flamers for mobile infantry clearance and fusion blasters and a missile pod for big thing hunting.

Volkmair wrote:
New to Tau and armed with my vanguard boxed set, I assume that it's best to arm all the battlesuits in a squad with the same loadout to do a specific thing rather than a toolbox mix? As for loadouts my current idea are burst canons and flamers for mobile infantry clearance and fusion blasters and a missile pod for big thing hunting.

Generally it's better to give them all the same weapon so that the unit has one specific kind of target that it's optimized against. Magnets are your friends when it comes to building battlesuits, especially Crisis. They are super easy to do.

Volkmair wrote:
New to Tau and armed with my vanguard boxed set, I assume that it's best to arm all the battlesuits in a squad with the same loadout to do a specific thing rather than a toolbox mix? As for loadouts my current idea are burst canons and flamers for mobile infantry clearance and fusion blasters and a missile pod for big thing hunting.

Seriously. We cannot stress the need to put magnets on crisis suits enough. The "meta" for crisis suit weapons can change pretty quickly. In 7th it was best to equip two weapons, and a support system most of the time. They even had nicknames for the different weapon combos you could do. Then in 8th it became all about spamming 1 weapon 3 times on each suit. At first only cyclic ion blasters were competitive. Now they are still the best choice, but flamers and missile pods are viable as well.

You will be switching the weapons on your suits around pretty much every time the points get updated. use magnets.

Righto, magnetising the suits doesn't seem too bad.

Or if you're like me and are just too lazy to magnetize all the things, use blu tack.

Is there a viable reason nowadays to pick up the Index? Are vehicle squadrons still a thing?