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gmaleron wrote: Hey guys!, looking at jumping back into Tau with the Army focused around tanks. Idea is the field and armored company of sorts and take as many Hammerheads as possible which includes their FW variants. However when it comes to the Fire Support Hammerheads I am somewhat at a loss as to what to equip them with. Has anyone here had experience running them and what advice would you give as to how to equip them? I appreciate your feedback and thank you!
I would be wary of the support tanks as they are Out of Production and have been for I think a long time.
GW is supposed to be producing new imperial armour books, however as they have been moved to main 40k studio, I expect them to be hit with no model =No rules.
Longstrike 3 hammerheads and 3 skyrays should allow you to field your armoured force though.
He doesn't, however converting up OOP and hencey likely to be removed from match play rules units is not a smart move in my opinion.
The poster wants to play an armour focused list, his options are rather limited for vehicals in Tau, what's your suggestion?
Yeah, there was a Tau list built around vehicles that was doing well at tournaments a little while back. Longstrike and hammerheads were the core, but it did include a couple of skyrays, and if I remember correctly also a couple of Sunshark Bombers.
All the hammerheads took seeker missiles, and I am pretty sure it went ham on the alpha strike, since the bombers get seeker missiles as well. It was when Knights were super common, if I remember correctly, so if you go first you can alpha down a castelin pretty reliably, and then mop up.
Yaktan wrote: Yeah, there was a Tau list built around vehicles that was doing well at tournaments a little while back. Longstrike and hammerheads were the core, but it did include a couple of skyrays, and if I remember correctly also a couple of Sunshark Bombers.
All the hammerheads took seeker missiles, and I am pretty sure it went ham on the alpha strike, since the bombers get seeker missiles as well. It was when Knights were super common, if I remember correctly, so if you go first you can alpha down a castelin pretty reliably, and then mop up.
And uphill fight against battlesuit tau, and almost guaranteed loss if you went second.
Hi everyone, sorry for asking this but I can't find the strat I was '"assured existed" by my tau oppnent friday, which gave whole unit of nine crisis suits a feel no pain roll of 5+++ (for 2 PC, so faire stuff I mean it doesn't seem OP or anything, just - very - good) for the turn.
Can you guys please confirm existence of this strat, and where it comes from ? Perhaps it is a FE thing (he was playing full FE, which was really cool BTW)
Thanks again !
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/05/18 16:19:12
Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh
addnid wrote: Hi everyone, sorry for asking this but I can't find the strat I was '"assured existed" by my tau oppnent friday, which gave whole unit of nine crisis suits a feel no pain roll of 5+++ (for 2 PC, so faire stuff I mean it doesn't seem OP or anything, just - very - good) for the turn.
Can you guys please confirm existence of this strat, and where it comes from ? Perhaps it is a FE thing (he was playing full FE, which was really cool BTW)
Thanks again !
Defense in Numbers. May only be used on FSE Crisis Suits or Bodyguards. Its from The Greater Good PA supplement. It can only be played in the Shooting or Fight phases, and only lasts for that phase.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/05/18 16:30:11
addnid wrote: Hi everyone, sorry for asking this but I can't find the strat I was '"assured existed" by my tau oppnent friday, which gave whole unit of nine crisis suits a feel no pain roll of 5+++ (for 2 PC, so faire stuff I mean it doesn't seem OP or anything, just - very - good) for the turn.
Can you guys please confirm existence of this strat, and where it comes from ? Perhaps it is a FE thing (he was playing full FE, which was really cool BTW)
Thanks again !
Defense in Numbers. May only be used on FSE Crisis Suits or Bodyguards. Its from The Greater Good PA supplement. It can only be played in the Shooting or Fight phases, and only lasts for that phase.
Ah thanks Sterling. Ok just for the phase, noted !
Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh
I run Farsight Enclaves and have been able to have a nice versatile list that could mix anti vehicle/anti infantry/anti characters... well until my friend brought out this list - I've had five tries (I've gone second ever time) and am generally tabled by turn two.
Any ideas how/if I could beat this with my red boys:
2000 pts (4CP net of Chapter Master)
Outrider Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
Shield Captain
- 3 x Pallas Grav tank
1 Vanguard Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
1 Shield Captain on Jetbike
- 3 x Caladius Grav Tank
I run Farsight Enclaves and have been able to have a nice versatile list that could mix anti vehicle/anti infantry/anti characters... well until my friend brought out this list - I've had five tries (I've gone second ever time) and am generally tabled by turn two.
Any ideas how/if I could beat this with my red boys:
2000 pts (4CP net of Chapter Master)
Outrider Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
Shield Captain
- 3 x Pallas Grav tank
1 Vanguard Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
1 Shield Captain on Jetbike
- 3 x Caladius Grav Tank
It's an entire army of 80+ hitting on 2s re rolling failed hits with -2+ AP, made up of 30 S6 shots and 50+ S8 shots.
I completely flummoxed - your thoughts would be appreciated.
Something doesn't add up about that
Custodes don't have S8 shooting vehicals.
They have S7 in volume or S9 at like 6 shots, the only S8 is avarage of 12 shots from the whirlwinds.
Shounds like you playing against some wonky interpretation of custodes rules is the primary issue, HBC shoukd pick up Pallus tanks easy enough, the Caladius tanks are a pain to kill
But the Whirlwinds, a fussion mander should do well enough at charging in and mwlting the chaptor master/LT or a Hyperios if needed. Also drones should more than ensure that atleast 1 round of shooting can be tanked okay.
Something doesn't add up about that
Custodes don't have S8 shooting vehicals.
They have S7 in volume or S9 at like 6 shots, the only S8 is avarage of 12 shots from the whirlwinds.
If memory serves, they used to. This looks suspiciously like a pre-final FW codex list for the golden lads. I recall that a lot of the shooting characteristics were altered.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/05/19 13:28:44
Something doesn't add up about that
Custodes don't have S8 shooting vehicals.
They have S7 in volume or S9 at like 6 shots, the only S8 is avarage of 12 shots from the whirlwinds.
If memory serves, they used to. This looks suspiciously like a pre-final FW codex list for the golden lads. I recall that a lot of the shooting characteristics were altered.
The beta Custodes rules were changed mosy have been close to a year ago now though.
I run Farsight Enclaves and have been able to have a nice versatile list that could mix anti vehicle/anti infantry/anti characters... well until my friend brought out this list - I've had five tries (I've gone second ever time) and am generally tabled by turn two.
Any ideas how/if I could beat this with my red boys:
2000 pts (4CP net of Chapter Master)
Outrider Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
Shield Captain
- 3 x Pallas Grav tank
1 Vanguard Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
1 Shield Captain on Jetbike
- 3 x Caladius Grav Tank
It's an entire army of 80+ hitting on 2s re rolling failed hits with -2+ AP, made up of 30 S6 shots and 50+ S8 shots.
I completely flummoxed - your thoughts would be appreciated.
Something doesn't add up about that
Custodes don't have S8 shooting vehicals.
They have S7 in volume or S9 at like 6 shots, the only S8 is avarage of 12 shots from the whirlwinds.
Shounds like you playing against some wonky interpretation of custodes rules is the primary issue, HBC shoukd pick up Pallus tanks easy enough, the Caladius tanks are a pain to kill
But the Whirlwinds, a fussion mander should do well enough at charging in and mwlting the chaptor master/LT or a Hyperios if needed. Also drones should more than ensure that atleast 1 round of shooting can be tanked okay.
My mistake between with the S9 - they're S7. It doesn't half feel like S9 though when pretty much every shot wounds on 3. His Caladiuses always have the range on my markerlights so my 3 man Broadsides' 6 shots with their Magna rifle are comparatively inefficient.
My list was:
Farsight Enclaves Air wing detachment (+1 CP)
1 x Razorshark w/Burst Cannon
2 x Remora Drones (2 units of 1)
1 5 man Pathfinder with Rail Rifles (Pulse Accelerator Drone & Grav Inhibitor Drone
1 5 man Pathfinder with Ion Rifles (2 Shield Drones)
1 5 man Pathfinder with Ion Rifles
1 5 man Vespid team.
Obviously it's too frail and needs more drones but its just I'm wayyyy off, I can't get to the Hyperioses and any attempt to do so I'm just dissolved by the Custodes' tanks - that's if I have anything left that hasn't been wiped by the Stormtallons and the customary Orbital bombardment.
I run Farsight Enclaves and have been able to have a nice versatile list that could mix anti vehicle/anti infantry/anti characters... well until my friend brought out this list - I've had five tries (I've gone second ever time) and am generally tabled by turn two.
Any ideas how/if I could beat this with my red boys:
2000 pts (4CP net of Chapter Master)
Outrider Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
Shield Captain
- 3 x Pallas Grav tank
1 Vanguard Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
1 Shield Captain on Jetbike
- 3 x Caladius Grav Tank
It's an entire army of 80+ hitting on 2s re rolling failed hits with -2+ AP, made up of 30 S6 shots and 50+ S8 shots.
I completely flummoxed - your thoughts would be appreciated.
Something doesn't add up about that
Custodes don't have S8 shooting vehicals.
They have S7 in volume or S9 at like 6 shots, the only S8 is avarage of 12 shots from the whirlwinds.
Shounds like you playing against some wonky interpretation of custodes rules is the primary issue, HBC shoukd pick up Pallus tanks easy enough, the Caladius tanks are a pain to kill
But the Whirlwinds, a fussion mander should do well enough at charging in and mwlting the chaptor master/LT or a Hyperios if needed. Also drones should more than ensure that atleast 1 round of shooting can be tanked okay.
My mistake between with the S9 - they're S7. It doesn't half feel like S9 though when pretty much every shot wounds on 3. His Caladiuses always have the range on my markerlights so my 3 man Broadsides' 6 shots with their Magna rifle are comparatively inefficient.
My list was:
Farsight Enclaves Air wing detachment (+1 CP)Remove 1 x Razorshark w/Burst CannonRemove 2 x Remora Drones (2 units of 1)Remove
1 5 man Pathfinder with Rail Rifles (Pulse Accelerator Drone & Grav Inhibitor DroneRemove 1 5 man Pathfinder with Ion Rifles (2 Shield Drones)Remove1 5 man Pathfinder with Ion RiflesRemove 1 5 man Vespid team.Remove
Obviously it's too frail and needs more drones but its just I'm wayyyy off, I can't get to the Hyperioses and any attempt to do so I'm just dissolved by the Custodes' tanks - that's if I have anything left that hasn't been wiped by the Stormtallons and the customary Orbital bombardment.
I'm out manoeuvred, out ranged and outgunned.
The broadsides should have Velocity Tracker and be in a custom sept detachment to gain the Move and shoot without penalty and hardened warheads buffs, along with the Riptide, I would also advise for another HBC riptide, Velocity Trackers all round, see how his caladious like being hit on 3+, 4+ if he brings the banner of -1.
Also why are your coldstars taking flamers? Go all in on fusion the weapon they excel with.
And why does your vetren crisis suit team have more support systems than weapons just no, take a shield on the guy with iridium armour maybe and then use drones, strategum stacking can have them hitting on 1+ with reroll ones.
More commanders would also help as his tanks can not target charictors.
Is this list just for against you or is this just his take all comers list? As it has some hard counters.
But it also depends on mission set and terrain tules your using ad his list seems built to abuse things and you list is well not exactly likely to loose you friends in a casual meta.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2020/05/19 22:33:32
Chenko_chenko wrote: Obviously it's too frail and needs more drones but its just I'm wayyyy off, I can't get to the Hyperioses and any attempt to do so I'm just dissolved by the Custodes' tanks - that's if I have anything left that hasn't been wiped by the Stormtallons and the customary Orbital bombardment.
I'm out manoeuvred, out ranged and outgunned.
There are several choices here that aren't making much sense:
You're not really playing to the FSE rules which let you take more high-BS units and promote being close.
Commanders with Flamers - you're wasting that BS2+ here. I'm not super against a shield on them with 3 guns, but no flamers.
Broadsides - I love the Heavy Rail Rifle and Magna upgrade, even if they aren't the most efficient. But take the SMS on them not Plasma Rifles, it's just better incidental shooting. Matches range.
Same on the Riptide. I love the prototype ion gun but the SMS will plink at stuff better than the plasma rifles. An ion tide needs to stay away from stuff.
Your vet Crisis should probably be taking 3xmissile pods or whichever guns.
I feel like the Ghostkeel just isn't going to work great against Custodes, even if I like it generally. The custards are just too accurate.
Speaking of prototype weapons. I'm not sure that bringing 3 is a great use of your CP.
I'd drop a fireblade, no need for 3 of them.
Bring more shield drones
Toooooo many pathfinders. FSE, by virtue of their buffs, rely on MLs less than other Tau (and special weapons pathfinders are just very squishy and not points-efficient to protect with Shield Drones either.
There are several markerlight strategems that you can use to get your re-roll ones and the saved points will go to Commander upgrades, shield drones.
Things to think about:
One of FSE's biggest boons is that they can take more commanders. You should.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/05/19 23:02:35
Chenko_chenko wrote: Obviously it's too frail and needs more drones but its just I'm wayyyy off, I can't get to the Hyperioses and any attempt to do so I'm just dissolved by the Custodes' tanks - that's if I have anything left that hasn't been wiped by the Stormtallons and the customary Orbital bombardment.
I'm out manoeuvred, out ranged and outgunned.
There are several choices here that aren't making much sense:
You're not really playing to the FSE rules which let you take more high-BS units and promote being close.
Commanders with Flamers - you're wasting that BS2+ here. I'm not super against a shield on them with 3 guns, but no flamers.
Broadsides - I love the Heavy Rail Rifle and Magna upgrade, even if they aren't the most efficient. But take the SMS on them not Plasma Rifles, it's just better incidental shooting. Matches range.
Same on the Riptide. I love the prototype ion gun but the SMS will plink at stuff better than the plasma rifles. An ion tide needs to stay away from stuff.
Your vet Crisis should probably be taking 3xmissile pods or whichever guns.
I feel like the Ghostkeel just isn't going to work great against Custodes, even if I like it generally. The custards are just too accurate.
Speaking of prototype weapons. I'm not sure that bringing 3 is a great use of your CP.
I'd drop a fireblade, no need for 3 of them.
Bring more shield drones
Toooooo many pathfinders. FSE, by virtue of their buffs, rely on MLs less than other Tau (and special weapons pathfinders are just very squishy and not points-efficient to protect with Shield Drones either.
There are several markerlight strategems that you can use to get your re-roll ones and the saved points will go to Commander upgrades, shield drones.
Things to think about:
One of FSE's biggest boons is that they can take more commanders. You should.
Oof, so I got close today, he modified his list, 3 Stormhawk Interceptors, 2 Calladius, 2 Pallas, 3 Hyperos (Chapter master + Lieutenant) Talemon Heavy Dreadnought & an Allarus Shield Captain.
I brought 3 ghostkeels with with Cyclic Ion Rakers/2 fusions + velocity tracker, 3 6 man stealth teams with 2 fusions (with velocity trackers), 1 Sky Ray, 1 Riptide with Amplified Ion Accelerator (I rolled 7 ones in Turn 1 on his saves) and 3 coldstars with 3 fusions and one with fusion blades.
I killed everything but those damn Hyperios - hitting on 2s/3s, rerolling 1s/2s, wounding on 2s/3s, rerolling 1s, drones/battlesuits and 5+ FNP - they're my damn kryptonite, I don't suppose you've got any ideas how to deal with them?
EDIT: Just realised he wasn't playing under the February Space Marine FAQ so was in Devastator Doctrine for the who game.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/05/21 13:03:30
Hi guys! Had a game today, and it was a real revelation for me. I made some 5 man movement trays for my breachers and used them for the first time, it was a real game changer. The movement phase got a lot faster, moving a unit in the time I usually use to move one model. In addition to that I used a chess clock for the first time. My opponents and I usually finish round 3, sometimes round 4, in the 3 hours we need to play one game. This is rarely enough for me to make enough to get the points I need for a victory. Using the clock my opponent was playing a lot faster than expected, the intensity and excitement level was higher and it was just a lot more fun. We needed to think and act fast, we made some mistakes, but that just made it more fun.
We played itc mission “what’s yours is mine”, vanguard strike. Alpha legion vs FSE, 2000 pts. It ended i my favour 35 - 32. Had we played one round less, it would be his victory. Very fun game, just wanted to share this experience with you. My list below if anyone’s interested.
Spoiler:
Triple FSE batallion
3 x 3 cib’s and ats enforcers
3 x 3 MP’s and ats Coldstars
7 x 5 breacher squads with 1 guardian drone and shield drone
1 x 9 breachers
1 x 5 strike team with markerlight
3 x 4 shield drones
1 x 7 xv8 bodyguards - 6 with 2 cib’s and ats, and 1 with ABF, reactive countermeasures and iridium with 5 shield drones.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/05/26 21:30:47
Just breaking in to Tau. I was wondering if there is a good resource that gives a breakdown of the units with good positives and negatives and the weapon options.
Just breaking in to Tau. I was wondering if there is a good resource that gives a breakdown of the units with good positives and negatives and the weapon options.
Thanks!
The Codex?
Oh wait, you wanted a GOOD resource. Sorry, no idea.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/05/24 17:51:56
'No plan survives contact with the enemy. Who are we?'
'THE ENEMY!!!'
I run a version of Sieglers FSE list, i think he runs mostly AFP on his bydyguards now, but anyways.. My list has 3x3 cib enforcers, 3x4 MP coldstars, 45 breachers, ~37 drones and 7 xv8 bodyguards. I had My first tournament with the list this weekend and it feel like it playing really slow. The game usually ends after round 3. This is a problem for me since the list really shines after round 3. One of the elements to the problem is the time I use to saviour protocols,moving and take saves on the 14 drone units and 9 breacher units. The other element is the time my opponent uses, which varies greatly. We didn’t use a chess clock, but I’m honestly not sure if I’d benefit from it considering all the time I use on saves and manoeuvring my small units. Any tips?
Just breaking in to Tau. I was wondering if there is a good resource that gives a breakdown of the units with good positives and negatives and the weapon options.
Thanks!
The Start Competing series on Goonhammer is generally pretty good. Their Tau article is here, although it hasn't been updated for Psychic Awakening yet.
killerpenguin wrote: I run a version of Sieglers FSE list, i think he runs mostly AFP on his bydyguards now, but anyways.. My list has 3x3 cib enforcers, 3x4 MP coldstars, 45 breachers, ~37 drones and 7 xv8 bodyguards. I had My first tournament with the list this weekend and it feel like it playing really slow. The game usually ends after round 3. This is a problem for me since the list really shines after round 3. One of the elements to the problem is the time I use to saviour protocols,moving and take saves on the 14 drone units and 9 breacher units. The other element is the time my opponent uses, which varies greatly. We didn’t use a chess clock, but I’m honestly not sure if I’d benefit from it considering all the time I use on saves and manoeuvring my small units. Any tips?
I have similar issues with things taking forever with my army. Only 6 breacher squads, but I also have 20 strikers and my big stealth blob. I find that not worrying about exact placement makes things go much faster, though if you are being competetive and relying on drones, that could backfire. (I played vs. another tau who had that issue--he did not deploy quite right so I was able to kill stuff with drones still around, just out of range).
For me, it seems like rolling all my shooting is what really takes forever. Maybe I just need to learn to roll faster? The breachers are not too bad, 10 shots a squad, but the 30 shots from a striker squad is harder.
killerpenguin wrote: I run a version of Sieglers FSE list, i think he runs mostly AFP on his bydyguards now, but anyways.. My list has 3x3 cib enforcers, 3x4 MP coldstars, 45 breachers, ~37 drones and 7 xv8 bodyguards. I had My first tournament with the list this weekend and it feel like it playing really slow. The game usually ends after round 3. This is a problem for me since the list really shines after round 3. One of the elements to the problem is the time I use to saviour protocols,moving and take saves on the 14 drone units and 9 breacher units. The other element is the time my opponent uses, which varies greatly. We didn’t use a chess clock, but I’m honestly not sure if I’d benefit from it considering all the time I use on saves and manoeuvring my small units. Any tips?
I have similar issues with things taking forever with my army. Only 6 breacher squads, but I also have 20 strikers and my big stealth blob. I find that not worrying about exact placement makes things go much faster, though if you are being competetive and relying on drones, that could backfire. (I played vs. another tau who had that issue--he did not deploy quite right so I was able to kill stuff with drones still around, just out of range).
For me, it seems like rolling all my shooting is what really takes forever. Maybe I just need to learn to roll faster? The breachers are not too bad, 10 shots a squad, but the 30 shots from a striker squad is harder.
Another issue is measuring which breacher models are within 5”, 10”, and 15” and Rolling them separately.
Just breaking in to Tau. I was wondering if there is a good resource that gives a breakdown of the units with good positives and negatives and the weapon options.
Thanks!
The Start Competing series on Goonhammer is generally pretty good. Their Tau article is here, although it hasn't been updated for Psychic Awakening yet.
It appears to be up to date, insofar as anything can be that released just before COVID shut everything down.
3 x six man Stealth team, 4 x burst Cannons, 2 x Fusion Blasters, 6 x Shield Generator
1 x nine man veteran Crisis Team, 3 x Iridium armour, 9 x Missile Pods, 9 x Cyclic Ion Blasters, 6 x Fusions Blasters, 3 x Airbursting Fragmentation Projectors (Reactive Countermeasures)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/05/26 00:50:23
Hi guys! Had a game today, and it was a real revelation for me. I made some 5 man movement trays for my breachers and used them for the first time, it was a real game changer. The movement phase got a lot faster, moving a unit in the time I usually use to move one model. In addition to that I used a chess clock for the first time. My opponents and I usually finish round 3, sometimes round 4, in the 3 hours we need to play one game. This is rarely enough for me to make enough to get the points I need for a victory. Using the clock my opponent was playing a lot faster than expected, the intensity and excitement level was higher and it was just a lot more fun. We needed to think and act fast, we made some mistakes, but that just made it more fun.
We played itc mission “what’s yours is mine”, vanguard strike. Alpha legion vs FSE, 2000 pts. It ended i my favour 35 - 32. Had we played one round less, it would be his victory. Very fun game, just wanted to share this experience with you. My list below if anyone’s interested.
Spoiler:
Triple FSE batallion
3 x 3 cib’s and ats enforcers
3 x 3 MP’s and ats Coldstars
7 x 5 breacher squads with 1 guardian drone and shield drone
1 x 9 breachers
1 x 5 strike team with markerlight
3 x 4 shield drones
1 x 7 xv8 bodyguards - 6 with 2 cib’s and ats, and 1 with ABF, reactive countermeasures and iridium with 5 shield drones.
So what's everyone's thoughts Tau wise on how your going to be structuring your lists?
So far it's certainly looking like putting everything into one battalion is achievable, Howevrr with the commander limit it does seem like FSE will be the way to play IMHO unless it gets Errata'd.
